The Purell is flying off the shelves

[NightWatcher]

For shits and giggle when I went to Target to pick up some more sunscreen, I stuck my head down the aisle with hand santizer. Not only was there an end cap that was half empty, but most of the regular supplies were gone. (reminded me of the freakout when they thought rice was being bought out-last year)

Sure people, be sure to lather up with the Purell. Weaken your immune system by getting it used to never seeing dirt. Then wonder why when a real problem comes around you start dropping like flies.

The silly-stupid sheeple are freaking out about the swine flu that has one case in the state, a few in the neighboring state and how many deaths? one?

Ok, flame me for not taking serious this Super Flu that has wreaked such havoc on the globe. Hell, more people have leprosy than the Flu-that-wasnt. According to official reports received during 2008 from 118 countries and territories, the global registered prevalence of leprosy at the beginning of 2008 stood at 212,802 cases, while the number of new cases detected during 2007 was 254,525 (excluding the small number of cases in Europe). The number of new cases detected globally has fallen by 11,100 cases (a 4% decrease) during 2007 compared with 2006. http://www.who.int/lep/en/

[Tangerine LaBamba]

1. The late, great George Carlin

did a great routine about people and their obsession with germs. Hand sanitizers, anti-bacterial everything, and the fear that someone's child might end up playing in dirt.

He was hilarious, and, of course, he was right. No wonder Superbugs are developing so easily - we keep trying to protect ourselves from stuff that's perfectly normal, and we're crippling our immune systems by never giving them a chance to work out.

Ah, well, Darwinism will take care of all of that, I have no doubt ...................

[Quantess]

9. "...a chance to work out..."

It has been said that antibacterial soaps and sprays are like a work-out at the gym for germs.

I would love to hear/see the Carlin standup about germs. He was genius.

[NightWatcher]

10. dont forget the masses who pop antibiotics every time they get a sniffle

they're creating the Super Flu and they dont even know it.

[Quantess]

14. And now we have MRSA. Staphylococcus that is resistant to antibiotics

because too many people took their antibiotics improperly.

My friend was hospitalized for it earlier this year. Many others have died from MRSA.

[NightWatcher]

15. that MRSA is nasty stuff. I drove a BLS ambulance and had to transport many people

who had contracted it from hospitals or nursing homes. I'm WAY more scared about a Super MRSA or staph. The whole time I drove a bus, not so much as a sniffle. Every other driver went down within a month of starting driving.

[surrealAmerican]

73. ... and it's not only people who are taking antibiotics improperly.

We're giving then to livestock. They're getting into our food supply and our water supply.

[nadinbrzezinski]

53. Well given the flu is a virus and the antibiotics work for BACTERIA and BACTERIA only

no, they are not creating the super flu

Also antibiotics are by prescription and thankfully in the US that is actually enforced


Just a little basic biology

[Sigh Sister]

80. I'm a nurse and my co-workers take antibiotics for every sniffle

and they should know better. And so should the doctors who prescribe it for them. It really angers me. I haven't been on an antibiotic for 20 years or so and what do you know. I recover just fine from the sniffles.

[pnwmom]

26. Purell isn't an antibacterial. It's mostly alcohol, which doesn't cause

the problem of resistant bacteria that an anti-bacterial might.

[XOKCowboy]

30. "I exercise my immune system. If I drop something on the floor I EAT IT!"

"When I was a kid I swam in the East River. I swam in RAW SEWAGE and never got a cold". It was hilarious and as always spot on.

I agree wholeheartedly with your post.

[MADem]

2. Just wash your hands every so often. That's easy enough.

What do they say, sing two verses of HAPPY BIRTHDAY and your hands are clean.

[rwheeler31]

3. My grandson is convinced he has "swain" flu and is

washing constantly. It is nice to see him clean,but he doesn't smell like sunshine.

[dixiegrrrrl]

4. I ask myself...who benefits from the swine flu panic?

I think we all know, right?

[NightWatcher]

5. $Rumsfeld$ and anyone who was getting uncomfortable with all the "torture investigation" talk.

Funny how we dont see torture on the news anymore. Maybe the photos that the Pent has will renew the discussion and call for investigation

[Tangerine LaBamba]

18. Consider this ..........

3,000 people a day die from malaria.

There is no money in developing a vaccine for malaria.

OK?

[alarimer]

43. It's a plot cooked up by the makers of Purell.

:sarcasm:

[nadinbrzezinski]

54. I know I know

this was created in an CDC lab, put into piggies by the CIA, loaded into FAM planes and dropped into La Gloria to distract us

Problem with this is... I have yet to hear the talk of torture stop in the media

Or many other stories

And I guess the WHO also had to be bought

Oh wait, the Freepers have a cousin to this theory... does not involve rummy by the way

The forward agent for Secretary Chu was infected on purpose to start this whole thing to distract us from the bad economy

Ah when left and right are the same....

:evilgrin:

[1]

6. "Weaken your immune system by getting it used to never seeing dirt."

exactly.

which is the reason i never wash my hands after using the bathroom.

ever.

oh! and i am the dude that cooks your food down at your favorite restaurant.

i'm just doing this for you. to toughen you up...

[NightWatcher]

7. self delete

[Quantess]

11. Nobody is suggesting you don't need to wash hands with soap and water.

The issue is with antibacterials that only strengthen the bacteria.

[1]

16. no. the issue is that you use something like purell when soap and hot water are not available...

like after you push the shopping cart at the grocery store.

a squirt of purell and its as if you did the soap and water thing.

are y'all really that ignorant about basic hygiene?

tell me that's not the case...

[Quantess]

21. Please tell me if I'm misunderstanding you.

Are you saying that you use purell after you use the restroom, and then go back to work preparing food?

At first I thought you were being sarcastic, but now I'm not sure.

[1]

22. yes, i was being as sarcastic as someone suggesting that purell was a bad idea...

when you can wash your hands with soap and hot water you should do so. always. not only in times of crisis.

when you cannot, a bottle of purell (or some other brand) is a great idea. like when you push a shopping cart or handle other "public" items.

this has nothing to do with attempting to "antibacterial" your life. its just basic hygiene.



and you would never want me to prepare your food. not for any bacterial reasons. i am just a horrible cook.

:)

[Quantess]

38. Ah, gotcha. That's a relief!

Next I was going to ask "what restaurant?" so I would be sure not to eat there. :D

BTW, when I worked in public schools, I regularly sprayed and wiped down the tables and chairs with a disinfectant spray.

[pnwmom]

33. Doctors use hand sanitizers in hospitals. n/t

[Quantess]

40. Instead of washing hands after they go to the bathroom?

:silly: I sure hope not.

[pnwmom]

41. The studies have concerned cleansing between patients, which is

just as critical in a hospital setting.

http://209.85.173.132/search?q=cache:R1KGbqUwwksJ:www.kcprofessional.com/us/download/news/UCSDrelease041201.pdf+physician+hospital+hand-sanitizer&cd=10&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us

ROSWELL, Ga. (April 12, 2001) — A study published in the March issue of the American Journal of Nursing finds that healthcare workers were more likely to sanitize their hands when an alcohol-based hand sanitizing gel was available as an alternative to soap and water. Handwashing or “hand antisepsis” rates increased by nearly 44 percent when the healthcare workers studied had access to the hand sanitizer. Overall, the hand sanitizer was used in approximately 60 percent of the episodes of hand antisepsis.

SNIP

[pnwmom]

24. Purell isn't an anti-bacterial. It's like wiping yourself with alcohol. n/t

[Donnachaidh]

68. tell me honestly - do you spit in the food as well? n/t

[DeschutesRiver]

72. How about anotherr Black Plague to toughen up the 60% of those who are left

after 40% die from it. You know, if back then they'd just killed all the pigs, oops, I mean rats instead, then the poor santiation, poor hygiene, and generally filthy living conditions could have continued on unabated to keep strengthing humanity. Yeah, instead that poor hygiene accelerated the bubonic plague's spread and scope until it took outa little under half of the population.

Suppose the good news this time around is that we won't need to do nearly as many bailouts or mortgage remodifications as we'd originally thought might be necessary. I say we need an immediate ban on Purell!

Europeans were particularly vulnerable to Bubonic Plague, due to their crowded living conditions, and poor hygiene and sanitation. Imagine so many people with fever and chills, vomiting blood, aching all over, and grotesquely deformed by horrid sores and swollen lymph glands. Thank goodness the Bubonic Plague often brought a relatively quick death!

http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/1132992/bubonic_plague_could_the_black_death.html

Some people need to google the bubonic plague.

[and-justice-for-all]

8. the psyschosimatic effect will be worse than the actual bug...nt

[Donnachaidh]

69. "psyschosimatic" -- QUE?

:rofl:

[Catherine Vincent]

12. I don't think people are being sheeple

People were probably out shopping and wanted to pick up a bottle or two and since the authorities are telling everyone not to panic, what's wrong with buying a bottle to keep in your car or in your purse? You may have people buying it that have never bought it before but everyone still prefers soap and water.

[NightWatcher]

13. I think it's way more than the normal amount sold everyday

I have a bottle in my car when I get into something real nasty or cant wash my hands, but the tv is advocating carrying it in your pocket all day long.

[Missy Vixen]

23. It's in my purse

We spend some time at the local park. There's no soap and water in the Porta-Potty, and I prefer to have clean hands.

[pnwmom]

31. When the health people talk about a pandemic, they're talking about a flu

that reaches 1/3 of the population.

I'd rather do everything we can to avoid that, including using a hand sanitizer when hot water and soap isn't available.

[Catherine Vincent]

32. I keep a bottle in the car to use when I come in from the store

or from shopping. I also keep a small convenient size bottle in my purse just in case I need it. I guess I use it every now and then but there are some people that never use it because they prefer soap and water. I do too but when soap and water isn't available, the hand sanitizer will work.

[Dappleganger]

17. The girls and I stopped by Walgreens this evening

to pick up a couple of things, and I noticed that there was plenty of Purell, Germ-X and Walgreen's version hand sanitizer on the shelves. The soap did look a bit scare, however. Since we use hand sanitizer occasionally (and we're out), I picked up a small bottle. We have plenty of antibacterial soap around here already.

[Tangerine LaBamba]

19. Please correct me if I'm wrong,

but isn't soap, almost by definition, "anti-bacterial"?

Isn't "anti-bacterial" just an advertising gimmick invented to make something - soap - sound jazzier than it actually is?

[uppityperson]

25. No. Soap is lye to cut grease and fat to put it back on

A lot of what happens when you wash is friction rubbing stuff loose and water rinsing it away. Anti-bacterial soap has more stuff in it to more actively kill many bacterium

[ourbluenation]

71. as a saponifier i can tell you with some authority that you are wrong.

in terms of the roles of those ingredients in soap. if you're interested i can explain. at any rate, carry on. In terms of anti-bacterial you are correct. soap,in and off itself is not anti-bacterial. purell type things are alcohol based. it's what you want to have when no soap and water are available.

[uppityperson]

81. I was trying to grossly simplify but yes. I am always interested

in finding out things. I thought the lye was to (sorry, have been dejargonizing for people for too many yrs) chemically hook onto fat so it unhooks off of us. Tell me more, seriously, I loved biochem when I took though. The other students in the class got annoyed because the instructor and I would get into detailed discussions about hows and whys of the real world where they mostly wanted to know enough to pass the test.

[ourbluenation]

82. well...

i'm no scientist but...when the lye, or back in the day, ash, mixes with an oil, or back in the day animal fat, it ceases to be itself anymore and the two mutate into a separate entity all together. Lye is not put into soap to kill germs. Just as oil is not put into soap to soften skin. Soap would not exist without either though. Like I said I'm no scientist, but I've made a gagillion bars of soap. YOu might be interested to know that soap was invited back in ancient rome or some such place when the fat left over from animal sacrifices would drip down and mix with ash from fires. It must have been the shittiest soap ever, but soap all the same.

[RC]

27. Nope.

Anti-bacterial soap has a germicide in it. The problem is germs can and do become resistant to it. Regular soap cleans by making water wetter, thereby suspending the germs in the soapy water and then flushing the germs away when you rinse the soap off.

[Tangerine LaBamba]

34. See? I learn something every day ..............

It seems to me, then, that regular soap would be - and has been - a much better thing to use when washing hands then using something with germicide, which just makes those bugs stronger.

Correct? Or am I missing something?

And, by the way, thank you. I never knew how soap worked.............

[Dappleganger]

70. Thanks for the info

I had no idea how that stuff worked. :D

[pnwmom]

35. Anti-bacterials in soaps refers to specific bacteria-killing ingredients, beyond

the effect of hot water and surfactant. Unfortunately, organisms can develop resistance to these anti-bacterials. So it's recommended that we not overuse these products -- that for most people plain soap and water is best.

HOWEVER, Purell is NOT an anti-bacterial. It's mostly alcohol -- it's like wiping down with alcohol. If you don't have access to hot water and soap, an alcohol based sanitizer is the next best.

[Tangerine LaBamba]

37. Yep,

a bit earlier than you, RC explained it all for me.

Thanks.

[pnwmom]

39. You're welcome. I just don't want anyone discouraged from

using an alcohol based cleaner, because there are plenty of times they can be useful, especially if we find ourselves in an epidemic.

We don't always have easy access to hot water and soap, unfortunately. And alcohol based cleaners don't have the drawbacks of anti-bacterials.

[Avalux]

20. Well now, here's the pickle.

There are a lot of unknowns with this new flu, so maybe it's not such a bad idea to pick up some Purell. You've expressed a lot of disdain in your post - I understand that, but we really don't know how this flu will turn out. I hope it fizzles but it may not.

[merh]

28. Wash your hands with soap and water. The anti bacterial hand

cleaners can do more harm than good.

Triclosan and triclocarbon are the two most commonly used antibacterial agents. Numerous studies have found that triclosan promotes the emergence of bacteria that are resistant to antibiotics - known as super bugs.
http://www.environmentalhealth.ca/antibacterial.htm

[pnwmom]

36. Purell is not an anti-bacterial. It's mostly alcohol -- it's like swabbing

down with alcohol, although it has ingredients to keep it from drying the skin as much as plain alcohol would.

[merh]

45. How many times are you going to post that in this thread?

Purell is 65% Ethyl Alcohol and even its website says that washing with soap and water is the preferred method.

[pnwmom]

51. You're assuming everyone reads every reply in a long thread. I'm not.

I think people frequently don't come back to read further postings in a thread in which they've previously posted UNLESS someone replies to them. So I did.

Yes, Purell is largely alcohol. That's what I'm saying. It doesn't contain the kind of anti-bacterial ingredients that can cause resistance. If you don't always have ready access to hot water and soap -- and who does -- then a hand sanitizer which is above 60% alcohol is the best alternative.

[merh]

52. No, you are assuming I don't read every reply in a thread.

I do, so your assumption is wrong as is your post to me. I never referred to Purell, I simply stated that washing with soap and water is the best way to clean one's hands and that anti-bacterial agents are not beneficial and may be harmful.

You can stop repeating yourself, it is not necessary.

[pnwmom]

56. You were replying to a thread about Purell flying off the shelves,

so the logical conclusion was that you were referring to Purell when you mentioned anti-bacterial cleaners. Even if you weren't confusing the two types of products, your post could have led others to do so.

P.S. You can stop reading my posts whenever you want.

[merh]

60. Hey, if you want to continue to come off as a limited thinker

with a very narrow focus and the inability to comprehend others, then keep posting about Purell. No skin off my nose, it just makes you look rather small.

May I suggest you just save yourself time and post "see post #" - it looks better than the copy and paste job you are doing.

[pnwmom]

61. This is a thread about Purell flying off the shelves. Maybe you got lost? n/t

[merh]

64. Not lost at all

I can think outside the box - I can tell you can't.

[pnwmom]

29. Good. If you don't have access to soap and hot water after using the bathroom

or before eating, an alcohol-based cleanser is the best alternative.

Purell isn't an anti-bacterial, by the way, which seems to be a misconception on this thread.

[nadinbrzezinski]

42. CDC guidelines say

wash hands, wash them some more

IF YOU DO NOT have soap, use hand sanitizer

I take the CDC more seriously than this pontification that is full of ignorant stuff

I guess CDC has stock in Purell? :sarcasm: and I am sure some folks will actually say that

[EFerrari]

44. You must know this. If you can't get store bought, isn't there a solution with bleach

and water that you can make at home?

[nadinbrzezinski]

46. Yes, in fact the mexican papers had it on yesterday, let me see if I can find

it

On that how's your spanish? This is from DOD... I guess for base personnel

http://www.ndu.edu/CTNSP/life_sci/TheBirdFlu&You8.5x11.SP.pdf

You could just use straight medical alcohol... if you cannot find purell,

I guess the only thing I'd do is add a little glycerin

And if you use strainght alcohol, which now that I think about it we did when we ran out of water (don't ask, long story) hands do chafe

[EFerrari]

48. Spanish is good especially key verbs.

lol

:hi:

[nadinbrzezinski]

49. Good to know

[pnwmom]

55. The key is having an alcohol content above 60% and to use enough product.

Some of the Internet recipes result in a much lower concentration, and even some of the "store bought" versions don't have enough alcohol.

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/03/21/health/21cons.html

SNIP

"What this should say to the consumer is that they need to look carefully at the label before they buy any of these products," said Elaine Larson, professor of pharmaceutical and therapeutic research at Columbia's nursing school. "Check the bottle for active ingredients. It might say ethyl alcohol, ethanol, isopropanol or some other variation, and those are all fine. But make sure that whichever of those alcohols is listed, its concentration is between 60 and 95 percent. Less than that isn't enough."

Scott Reynolds, a specialist in infection control . . . had the students place their hands on agar plates of growth medium before and after one of several experimental conditions: rubbing their hands briskly under tap water; sudsing with hospital-grade soap and then rinsing with water; or rubbing their hands with a dollop of one of two types of alcohol-based hand sanitizer. The sanitizers used were a foam version from the hospital that contained 62 percent ethanol, and a gel version Mr. Reynolds's wife bought at a local discount store.

The next day, much to Mr. Reynolds's surprise, the culture plates from hands doused and rubbed with the store-bought gel were covered with clumps of bacteria that had, in some cases, formed a visible outline of the student's handprint on the plate.

Only when he flipped the bottle around to read the label on the back did Mr. Reynolds see that the gel's active ingredient was "40 percent ethyl alcohol."

SNIP

In a more formal follow-up study, Mr. Reynolds and two colleagues replicated the results, and confirmed that the lack of sufficient alcohol was to blame. If anything, he said, the faulty gel seemed to mobilize the bacteria, spreading them around the hand instead of killing them.

SNIP

[EFerrari]

57. Thanks! I was just thinking people don't have to freak out over

empty shelves if they have the makings at home. I used to use a bleach solution when I was fostering sick kittens but don't remember the proportions.

[pnwmom]

58. Something tells me the hand-sanitizer companies will find a way to ramp up

production!

I'm sure there must be some good recipes online -- as long as people know what to look for.

[nadinbrzezinski]

59. At the height of the AIDs "scare" we used 100 % bleach to clean

ambulance surfaces

It is very effective, and much cheaper than the commercial solutions sold at the time (that had a hight content of the stuff anyway)

I relied on ... the WHO and CDC for recommendations

Only problem... the damn smell

:rlol:

So leave the doors opened until the bell rang and HOPE to god the smell cleared

(and it could be dangerous)

[EFerrari]

62. Yeah, the smell is not pleasing,

I used to get kittens with upper res infections, mange, everything. And sometimes would have as many as three litters with a mom plus assorted hand feeding orphans -- all sick as hell. Couldn't be passing all the cooties back and forth. And a lot of times there were guys with wounds that needed irrigation, guys that needed hydrating. Introducing cr@p into their systems would have gotten me voted off the island immediately. :)

The smell of the bleach wasn't really the first thing that came to mind. I don't know how cat ladies do that for years and years. After five, I was more than ready to retire. And so was the skin on my hands. lol

[nadinbrzezinski]

63. Ah the skin, why I always did that with ahem gloves on

:-)

And I used "scare" in quotation marks since some folks think that was a scare too

[EFerrari]

65. Gloves?! We had no budget for gloves!

We had spies at all the shelters watching for litters that needed bailing out and more at all the Von's waiting for sales on food and litter. Gloves?! Are you mad?! lol

Seriously, the rescue people in the L.A. area are amazing. Much better organized than up here, much more collegial and much more resourceful. They get along on a shoe string when they have to and they're always looking out for resources which they turn around and share.

Now, if we put L.A. cat ladies in charge of this flu, *they* would figure out how to manage it in a heartbeat AND how to get a year's worth of fundraisers out of it. :)

[nadinbrzezinski]

66. When the guidelines came for gloves

to start IVs for example, we had no money for that ahem luxury

Disposable gloves my boss screamed, are YOU FUCKING NUTS? Just in spanish

So I took my full paycheck for a month (worked flipping burgers) and went to Dyna-Med, since closed bought whatever

Explained the situation, and they sold me oh something like forty cases for ahem bellow cost

That was the first set of gloves they got... and got them in the habit... but fighting the nuns was fun, NOT

I could do that since I was still living at home

After that I bought my gloves ... what they could get were mediums and they were too big for me... small as in real small hands... so I got xsmall

Hell I use the damn things for chicken these days, for food prep

[EFerrari]

67. Fighting the nuns?!

:rofl:

:toast:

[Occam Bandage]

47. The only thing that makes the word "sheeple" remotely tolerable

is the satisfaction of knowing that everyone who uses it does so in emulation of someone else they saw using it.

[LisaL]

50. And so?

I got some purell too.

[tpsbmam]

74. I regularly wipe off with Purell when I get in my car after shopping.......

I keep a small container of it in my purse & one in the car. I have multiple sclerosis & kidney disease -- I don't need your flu/cold germs giving me something. I also wash my hands thoroughly when I get home -- it's the first thing I do when I get home, before I even pat the dogs that are inevitably trying to get my attention when I come home. If you want to giggle, go ahead but do me a favor....when you get that cold or flu, stay home & don't spread your germs.......you'll be passing your illness along to someone else like you who laughs at those of us who do what we can to protect ourselves.

[tammywammy]

75. I'm almost out of Purell, I'll probably pick some up today

It's handy when you don't have access to soap & water. Also, I keep a bottle on my desk at work. I recommend the kind with aloe in it, it's less drying on the hands.

[lse7581011]

76. I Just Went to 4 Stores-

all empty shelves where the Purell and other brands would be!

[tammywammy]

77. And considering I'm in the DFW area

And they're closing schools left and right, I'll probably have the same problem.

[laundry_queen]

78. I was in a few stores yesterday.

Tons and tons of purell.
We're not in a 'hot spot' though.

[lse7581011]

79. I didn't realize

we were either!

[spinbaby]

83. I've been traveling these last three days

About passed out from hand-sanitizer fumes a couple of times. The stuff reeks.

[dropkickpa]

84. I'm allergic to the fragrance added to purell

My hands break out in a rash. Nothing like broken skin to get a nice infection going! I'm a big fan of soap and water myself.