We Must Counter This Rightist "Argument"

[Cary]

We cannot get complacent. A potential weakness that I see rightists trying to exploit is what they refer to as "values." We are allfamiliar with the Bill Bennett ploy of cloaking oneself in self proclaimed virtures. It is an attempt to claim moral high ground in order to evade logic and reason, since even they know they cannot rightfully lay claim to logic and reason. They want to lay claim to logic and reason and they will never admit their failure, but deep down they know that they have failed on that particular front.

The pinnacle of their self proclaimed virtue ploy was, of course, the Terri Schiavo crisis. Obviously this one was a bridge too far. This one failed even among many fire eating rightists. But the right is not deterred. As we sit here, kicking their asses, they insideously persist in trying to stake out their high ground. At the top of their "values" is their position on abortion and this is an easy one to put out there. They frame the issue as "killing babies." It is amoral to kill babies, period.

Well, is it moral to increase our population when it is clear that we are destroying our environment? Is it moral to bring unwanted children into the world, as they want to do, and then tell them tough shit for you if you can't overcome the poverty and abuse that you were born into?

Who has the "moral superiority" here? I don't think they do but they clearly have the easier argument and as we all know this can be their spearhead for other alleged values.

Specifically, taxes. To them taxes are anathema to freedom and as we all know they have done tremendous damage under the banner of "cutting taxes and preserving freedom."

Then they have this pernicious anti-government "value," and there's just enough truth in this "value" to make it convincing. Again, they have the easier "argument." It's easy to hate the IRS. It's easy to hate taxes. And now with the spending increases, well, this could be a potential problem and we need to counter their "supply side" bullshit better than we have done in the past.

I am a big, big Paul Krugman fan but I'm not sure whether he's being particularly helpful. Nor am I sure whether he's not. After all, allowing debate is something we have on the dead ender Republicans. However listening to Pat Buchanan this morning did shake me up a little and prompted me to raise this issue here. I am not surprised that Buchanan's strategy would be to stake out this "superior" position regarding their alleged fiscal conservatism in order to capitalize on that if Obama failed. I was, however, a little rattled about how brazenly he articulated this.

We all know what's going to happen. Any way it turns out they, the self-proclaimed morally superior crowd, will claim that Obama failed. Either way we will be reduced because we will have to call them what they are: filthy, disgusting liars.

We have time to prepare and we have strategic advantages. I believe we will prevail but best to be prepared. What can we do now in preparation?

[Locrian]

1. I think you are right

quote = Specifically, taxes. To them taxes are anathema to freedom and as we all know they have done tremendous damage under the banner of "cutting taxes and preserving freedom."

THAT is the most dangerous thing - that we are "separate" and not connected to society. The TAXES and GOVERNMENT thing is a divide and conquer meme. Think big business doesnt get their share of gov "help"?

Somebody (Al Gore??? cant remember) said the biggest challenge we see, and the next big movement HAS to be the realization that we are all connected in some way. To each other, to the planet etc. Otherwise we as a civilization will not make it with the challenges we will see with regards to limited resources (climate, energy, etc).


There are two choices:

A) work together and try to figure out the problems, and actually HAVE a future, or
B) "hunker down" gimme mine, no taxes, no government, screw everybody else and live in a nightmare

[Cary]

2. Spot on.

"THAT is the most dangerous thing - that we are "separate" and not connected to society. The TAXES and GOVERNMENT thing is a divide and conquer meme. Think big business doesnt get their share of gov "help"?"

How best to counter this divide and conquer?

[OHdem10]

3. You are correct, but an even more important issue which they are

working feverishly at this very moment--- Democrats(Obama)
are weak on foreign policy and defense of the country.

The GOP have managed to convince a whole lot of people they and
they alone are strong on defense and the Democrats are weak-kneed
appeasers.

This is an are also where the Dems need to make some serious moves
to change opinion.

Your points are very well taken.

[Echo In Light]

4. And one "attack," be it legit or self-inflicted (false flag) could easily cement that view

...just as that angle was used to the nth degree w/9/11

[Cary]

6. I'm not so sure a false flag would be such a great move.

Of course I'm not privy to how things work but it seems the right doesn't have a lot of clout to run cover for such a thing. Things do get leaked. I'm not so sure they could pull off a stunt like this, but then I tend to disbelieve black helicopter stuff.

[Echo In Light]

8. No firm beliefs here on it - just food for thought. And w/so much international light on us...

...I tend to agree w/you. If something like that did occur, by one means or another, I'd suspect something of a much smaller scale than the usual larger scale 'terror' attacks that inexplicably only happen such a scale in the U.S.

[Cary]

5. Indeed, and it's all related.

However I do think they've overdone the fear mongering. If we are attacked again, and I hope we aren't, I think Obama is skillful enough to work such a crisis in his favor, the way George Bush should have done it.

We rallied around Bush. We can certainly rally around Obama.

But you raise an excellent point, and their fear mongering is exactly why we have to counter their nonsense.

[salguine]

7. One of my favorite comments on the whole "moral" attitude is attributed to

Oscar Wilde: "I have never met anyone in whom the moral sense was superior who was not heartless, cruel, vindictive, log-stupid and utterly lacking in the smallest sense of humanity."

[TheKentuckian]

9. I don't see how they can make a simultaneous case for Anarchy by starving government

and yet want an authoritarian government that dictates individual personal behavior. There has to be a fault line in there somewhere. The Republicans are supporting several varieties of incompatible and often conflicting conservatism. These conflicts need to be be beaten into their heads.

The obstacle is that the ones with brains refuse to peel away from the various nut jobs because they know they would have no voting block to work with. With this in mind, we will need to continue to foster frames that cause the base to reject the money changers.

[Cary]

10. There is definitely an incongruity here.

But you're still using logic and reason. Will that work against them?

I don't know. I'm just asking.