Cinco de Mayo: What is everybody celebrating?

[Xipe Totec]

5 de mayo - Who? Where? Why?



Ask about the history behind these celebrations, and a few may be able to tell you that the Mexicans defeated an invading French army on that date in 1862. Beyond that - except maybe in Puebla - general knowledge of the circumstances becomes sketchy. Why were the French there? What happened next? Did the French just go away? Many teachers in the U.S. still tell their classes that May fifth is Mexican Independence Day, which is dead wrong. (Independence Day in Mexico is September 16th.)
France's emperor sees an opportunity

Even though the United States had issued the "Monroe Doctrine" warning European countries not to grab territory in the western hemisphere, Emperor Napoleon III of France decided to do just that. He ordered his generals to take over Mexico, and then - using Mexico as a "base" - help the Confederates win the Civil War against the United States.

What if they had succeeded?

The United States would never become the significant world power that it is today. Another country would occupy the territory where the southern U.S. states now stand, and the nation we know as Mexico would probably still be dominated by France. Instead, the Mexicans not only took their country back, but enforced the Monroe Doctrine and influenced the outcome of the American Civil War.


http://www.mexconnect.com/en/articles/3407-cinco-de-mayo-what-is-everybody-celebrating

[AllieB]

1. Trying to get home from a biz trip to have margaritas w/friends

may not happen due to weather tomorrow.

[Bill McBlueState]

2. "Mexican Independence Day"

It seems Americans have room in their heads for about three words when it comes to understanding an element of a different culture.

Similarly, I bet a lot of people would describe Hanukkah as "Jewish Christmas."

[Papagoose]

29. my daughter's 2nd grade teacher did that

and told the class that it takes place over "4 or five nights to celebrate the miracle of the north star". I kid you not.

[rateyes]

3. Makes me wonder if it was a good thing that Mexico won that battle.

:eyes:

[HopeHoops]

4. This year, I think it needs a new theme!

In-home parties with surgical masks! WHOO HOO! Pig pinata for bonus points!

[Sequoia]

5. i don't know much about cinco de mayo

i'm never sure what it's all about
but i say i want you, and you don't believe me
you say you want me, but i've got my doubts

oh baby, i was bound for mexico
oh baby, i was bound to let you go

http://www.sing365.com/music/lyric.nsf/Mexico-lyrics-Cake/A572D736C5608410482568A8000EE1B4

[Kali]

6. good pastries in Mexico from the French!

oh what? Aren't holidays/celebrations all about the food? :P I'm thinking of doing this great grill marinade for chicken that has tomatillos, green chiles, garlic, and a touch of cinnamon :9

[Xipe Totec]

20. And bolillos (hard crust rolls) - also from the French

and Mariachi music (Mariachi = Marriage; a wedding music band).

A lot of good food and music cultural influences were left behind.

:hi:

[Kali]

32. oh yeah bolillos!

mmmmm

I thought Mariachi was German influenced?

[Xipe Totec]

39. No, the Polkas are German/Polish/Czeck influence

The Mariachi music is Mexican, but the concept of the mariachi band is French.

[Kali]

40. cool, did not know that

[AlphaCentauri]

33. just remember about La Guerra De Los Pasteles (The Pastry War )

In 1838 a French pastry cook, Monsieur Remontel, claimed his shop in the Tacubaya district of Mexico City had been ruined by looting Mexican officers in 1828. He appealed to France's King Louis-Philippe (1773–1850). Coming to its citizen's aid, France demanded 600,000 pesos in damages. This amount was extremely high when compared to an average workman's daily pay, which was about one peso. In addition to this amount, Mexico had defaulted on millions of dollars worth of loans from France. Diplomat Baron Deffaudis gave Mexico an ultimatum to pay, or the French would demand satisfaction. When the payment was not forthcoming from president Anastasio Bustamante (1780–1853), the king sent a fleet under Rear Admiral Charles Baudin to declare a blockade of all Mexican ports from Yucatán to the Rio Grande, to bombard the Mexican fortress of San Juan de Ulúa, and to seize the port of Veracruz. Virtually the entire Mexican Navy was captured at Veracruz by December 1838. Mexico declared war on France.

With trade cut off, the Mexicans began smuggling imports into Corpus Christi, Texas, and then into Mexico. Fearing that France would blockade Texan ports as well, a battalion of men of the Republic of Texas force began patrolling Corpus Christi Bay to stop Mexican smugglers. One smuggling party abandoned their cargo of about a hundred barrels of flour on the beach at the mouth of the bay, thus giving Flour Bluff its name. The United States, ever watchful of its relations with Mexico, sent the schooner Woodbury to help the French in their blockade. Talks between the Kingdom of France and the Texan nation occurred and France agreed not to offend the soil or waters of the Republic of Texas.

The battle celebrated as Cinco de Mayo has occasionally been mistaken as taking place in this war. It did not. It was connected with a later (1862) invasion of Mexico orchestrated by Napoleon III.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pastry_War

[petronius]

7. Thanks - that's a nice concise little account

I think I'll ask my class tomorrow what they think they day is all about...

:)

[lame54]

8. it's national tequila drinking day

[sinkingfeeling]

9. My granddaughter's 3rd. birthday. We're having a Dora the Explorer cake.

[Lady Effingbroke]

11. Sounds wonderful!

Happy birthday to your granddaughter! :party:

[Winterblues]

10. Day of the Worm

:bounce: :bounce: :bounce: who gets the worm? :bounce: :bounce: :bounce:

[JonLP24]

12. Damn teachers in grade school taught me the same thing

Cinco De Mayo is like July 4th in this country, Independence Day for Mexico. Thanks for the info. I learned something today.

[ieoeja]

13. And when people complain about all the Mexican flags, remember to ask...

"Were you this angry about all the Irish flags on St Patty's Day just 7 weeks ago?"

[-..__...]

34. Were they complaining in Gaelic or English?

[GreatCaesarsGhost]

14. Cinco de Mayo, but May the 4th be with you!

[AlphaCentauri]

15. It could be one of Mexico's most tragic days

remember that Mexico did lost half of it's territory 14 years before the French invasion, so good for us too bad for the Mexicans who lost their change to recover their lost territories in the Mexican war. Any how Mexicans have contributed to this country more than they have been credit for.

[Xipe Totec]

23. I think the real Montezuma's Revenge

was the US Civil war, which was precipitated by the division of the territory acquired from Mexico between the slave states and the free states.

Also, the Mexican American War was the training ground for the generals on both sides of the Civil War.

Food for thought.

[AlphaCentauri]

31. Mexico contributed with a territory where slavery was prohibited

and that was the issue that sparked the Mexican war, slave trafficking in Texas.
So looks like Mexico contributed more to end slavery than it's been previously thought

[Romulox]

16. A nationalistic Mexican holliday is kind of hard to swallow, given Mexico's current government. nt

[Xipe Totec]

21. While Cinco de Mayo has limited significance nationwide in Mexico,

the date is observed in the United States and other locations around the world as a celebration of Mexican heritage and pride.

You need to find a better excuse to dis Mexico.

[Romulox]

25. You just said it was a nationalistic celebration of a war victory.

"a celebration of Mexican heritage and pride"

That's not what you described in the OP. :shrug:

"You need to find a better excuse to dis Mexico."

Mexico does a fine job of dissing itself. No need for my help! :hi:

[L0oniX]

17. Beer

[ozu]

26. Tequila

nt

[L0oniX]

28. Modelo

[Initech]

35. Dos Equis

[AlphaCentauri]

37. Pulque

[Initech]

38. 1800 Reserva

[AlphaCentauri]

41. Rompope

[Xipe Totec]

43. Santa Clara

The only rompope worth having...

[Initech]

47. Tres Generaciones

[Xipe Totec]

49. Excellent choice!

But that's not rompope.



Rompope Santa Clara is the only eggnog I know, that's classified by US Customs as a hard liquor.

[AlphaCentauri]

54. Mezcal Con Gusano Rojo

Hey! I'm not talking about republicans with mezcal :evilgrin:



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mezcal

[Bolo Boffin]

18. "We need a holiday here to drive consumption."

"Hey, the Mexicans have one they aren't using too much! Cinco De Mayo! Fiesta! Lotsa Mexican decorations to sell! Lotsa tequila to move! Hola, profit!"

[Xipe Totec]

22. Any excuse for a party is good n/t

[mshasta]

19. funny...USA party on 5 de mayo

but so much hate against Mexicans specially now with the virus..."close the borders...mexicans are infected, run for you live"!!...but before that give some coronas with chips and salsa..:yoiks:

[hfojvt]

24. because it is a very special birthday

duh

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karl_Marx

[guitar man]

27. The Sinking of The Titanic

Most people don't know that back in 1912, Hellmann's mayonnaise was manufactured in England. In fact, the Titanic was carrying 12,000 jars of the condiment scheduled for delivery in Vera Cruz, Mexico, which was to be the next port of call for the great ship after its stop in New York.

This would have been the largest single shipment of mayonnaise ever delivered to Mexico. But as we know, the great ship did not make it to New York. The ship hit an iceberg and sank, and the cargo was forever lost.

The people of Mexico, who were crazy about mayonnaise, and were eagerly awaiting its delivery, were disconsolate at the loss. Their anguish was so great, that they declared a National Day of Mourning, which they still observe to this day.

The National Day of Mourning occurs each year on May 5th and is known, of course, as Sinko de Mayo.

:hide:

:yoiks:

:rofl:

[Xipe Totec]

30. I think you're full of mayonnaise!

Everybody knows it was Miracle Whip.

:rofl:

[Chisox08]

48. This day is celebrated by tossing Mayo in the Ocean

and watching it Sinko. :rofl:
Happy Cinco de Mayo to all! :toast: :beer:

[nadinbrzezinski]

36. La victoria at Puebla

oh wait, I knew that from Mexican History and having grown up down there

Down there it is a solemn ocassion and the day recruits for the Mandatory National Military Service take their oath to the flag and to defend the nation.

Suspended until further notice on account of FLU by the way

[davsand]

42. Thank you for this! I'm taking it into a classroom this afternoon.

We do one party per year for my daughter's class, the teachers get to choose which holiday it is. The ONLY requirement we set is that it has to be a holiday that is not "usually" celebrated locally. Some of the teachers have chosen fun holidays like Mardi Gras and Chinese New Year, some have been pretty lame with St Patrick's Day. Every year we take in music and foods/flavors from the place that holiday is celebrated.

Chinese New Year we did a Dragon Dance in the halls of the school and tasted candied Ginger. The kids got red Hong Bao envelopes and earned how to use chopsticks. Mardi Gras had us all doing the Mardi Gras Mambo and talking about the Krewes and the parades. The kids loved Clifton Chenier and thought the King Cake was a hoot. St Patrick's day last year we tasted Irish Cheeses and had soda bread with Irish Butter and Orange and Lemon Marmalade and biscuits. They even danced Irish Jigs.

We live in an area that is rural and fairly homogenized. One thing that we wanted to do for our kid--and for her class--was to expose them to stuff OTHER than what they see and taste every day, thus we try and take one day a year to celebrate something a little bit outside their mainstream with them.

This year the teacher chose Cinco De Mayo and we are taking in four flavors of Mexican produced soda pop for a "soda tasting" (kind of like a wine tasting...) along with Mariachi Music and a couple of different cookies imported from Mexico. We are gonna raffle off a collection of food products imported from Mexico (Including the Mexican version of Koolaid!) for the kids to take home and try out with their families.

I had wanted something that explained Cinco De Mayo and why it is celebrated. This does an excellent job of doing that without being condescending and without making it a big reason to drink Tequila all day.

Well done!


Laura

[Xipe Totec]

45. Thank you!

You made my day!

Happy Cinco de Mayo!

[muriel_volestrangler]

44. Is this a common interpretation of Napoleon III's actions?

I ask because other historians (eg from the State Department) don't mention the aim of supporting the Confederacy - just that if the Union did intervene, Framce might support the South:

In response to these actions, Secretary of State Seward issued statements of disapproval, but the U.S. Government was unable to intervene directly because of the American Civil War. Moreover, both Seward and U.S. President Abraham Lincoln did not want to further antagonize Napoleon III, and risk his intervention on the side of the Confederacy. The U.S. Government also rejected overtures from other Latin American countries for a pan-American solution to the conflict. However, the Mexican Minister to the United States, Matías Romero, worked carefully to build American support for Mexico. Seward soon began to show increased support for Juarez's government.

http://www.state.gov/r/pa/ho/time/cw/106955.htm

Or the Concise Encyclopedia of Mexico, which talks about the French Intervention in Mexico for page swithout once mentioning a desire to support the Confederacy; it describes it as at attempt by Napoleon III to increase French profits and power in Latin America - as does the Encyclopedia Britannica. They all seem to think that he was just taking advantage of the American Civil War as a time when the US would be unable to stop him.

[Xipe Totec]

46. Do they mention that is was England, Spain, and France

that came to Mexico demanding restitution, but England and Spain agreed to wait for repayment?

Only France remained steadfast and invaded Mexico anyway.

And what better way to consolidate French power in the Americas, than to support the Confederacy and divide the Union.

[muriel_volestrangler]

50. Yes, they do

along the lines of "Britain and Spain saw that France wanted to take Mexico over, so they made their own agreement about the debt, and left".

I'm not trying to excuse Napoleon's actions - it was a colonial powergrab - but the idea that he did it to help the Confederacy, rather than himself, doesn't seem a common one. And, after all, they did take Mexico City the next year, and eventually installed Maximillian as 'Emperor' for 3 years, but never got round to sending help to the Confederacy.

I just wonder if this historian is making it more about the US than it really was. The Mexicans certainly didn't fight to help the USA - they were just fighting an invader.

[Xipe Totec]

51. It's the other way around...

He helped the Confederacy to help himself.

To create a buffer zone, and to weaken the Union.

Divide and Conquer.

Nothing Altruistic about his motives.

And I'm sure that taking back the Louisiana Purchase was not too far from his mind either...

Grand Scheme for the Americas:

Napoleon III envisioned a "Grand Scheme for the Americas," which would consist of three general points. The first involved recognition of the Confederate States of America and a military alliance with them. The second involved reintroducing monarchical rule to Latin America, such as Maximillian I in Mexico, and increasing French trade throughout Latin America. The third and final point involved control over Mexico with the creation of a large buffer state from the Rio Grande to the Californian Baja.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Napoleon_III

[TheCentepedeShoes]

52. Mr 'pede and I

Flew from Tampa to Austin in 1998 for a sort of family reunion, my aunt's 90th birthday
He had been in TX while in the Army at Ft Sam but had never been to the state capitol and we had some time to kill before checking into reunion HQ out on Lake Travis
So we had some lunch and visited the capitol where we encountered a tour group just starting from the rotunda
Tour Guide was giving out a bit of history, I was not listening much, but then she said Cinco de Mayo is Mexican Independence Day to which I said to Mr 'pede "no it's not."
'Course everyone looked at me (TG with daggers and asking sarcastically if *I* wanted to conduct the tour) so I gave a brief explanation of the real reason for C of M
I mumbled something about the Mexican govt defaulting on foreign debt, Napoleon (no, not THAT one), Maximilian & Carlotta, Puebla and 1863 (got the year wrong) the Monroe Doctrine bumping up against the American Civil War
Probably a little vague and disjointed sounding since I hadn't had a history class that covered that stuff in around 30 years
Did perhaps ok, especially after the two pre-flight Bloody's and the most excellent Margarita at Serrano's

[Xipe Totec]

53. That's funny!

by the way, I've been to the TX State Capitol and read the Texas Declaration of Independence.

It's the Texas, Coahuila, and Nuevo Leon declaration of Independence.

Coahuila and Nuevo Leon didn't make it, so they're still part of the Republic of Mexico, along with the sister republic of Yucatan, which also didn't make it.

[TheCentepedeShoes]

55. We did see the

Declaration. but I didn't quite note the wording. Tejas wasn't the only area revolting against Gen Antonio Lopez de Santa Ana in 1836
By that time I wanted to go to the B&B, meet up with the rest of the people (most of whom I hadn't seen since the 60's) and have a nap (or a screwdriver which cousin Patty delivered to our room)