Grassley: The president said to me that he would rather have a health plan with .......

[Stinky The Clown]

..... bi partisan support, even if he has to give up some of what he wants, than one that wins on a party line vote.

Discuss .....








(Context: Gramps just said this to Mrs Greenspan on her daily early afternoon stint as noozer)

edit to fix typos

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

1. That's really bad. The end product is what we will live with, not who voted

for or against it. It's also too bad that President Obama is still invested in being bi-partisan with people who are saying the most vile and insane things about him and his agenda. This is poor judgment, in my opinion and less than what I would have expected from him.

[HowHasItComeToThis]

5. REPUBS ARE ALL SNAKES

[Oregone]

26. To be fair, they aren't the ones controlling executive/legislative branch, and denying single-payer

Oh, they used to be...now its another party.

[orleans]

61. this bipartianship is killing us. and we don't deserve it. we've suffered

enuf these past 15 years!

[Ilsa]

2. He needs to do the right thing, not just appease some GOPers on their way out. nt

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

Sadly, it looks like the health insurance companies

are the ones who will come out winners. The Democrats refuse to listen to single payer advocates. What will happen, I fear, is that we will all be forced to buy insurance from for-profit companies, and that nothing else will change. The insurance companies will simply use the GOP Congressmen to make their burden even lighter--like allowing them to charge way too much for way too little.

[Fumesucker]

3. Ever noticed how in America, the more "bipartisan" some program is..

The more of a disaster it is?

Right offhand I can't think of anything more "bipartisan" than the drug war, an unmitigated disaster.

[Echo In Light]

18. George Carlin: "Bipartisan = a larger than usual deception is being carried out against the public."

[Fumesucker]

54. I hadn't heard that one.. Thanks.. n/t

[eleny]

4. I don't find this incompatible with his campaign promises

I hoped for better. But like Naomi Klein said to Charlie Rose on his program yesterday, Obama's skill is to find the center - it's up to progressives to move the center to the left.

This is going to be a long haul.

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

6. I don't appreciate the substance of a literally life and death issue

being bargained away for the sake of collegiality. I feel almost sickened by this quote.:cry:

[eleny]

12. I'm disgusted that the public option is off the table...

Even though about 20% of Americans want it.

[kristopher]

21. The public option is not "off the table"

There is a "public option" and a "single payer" plan. The single payer plan would enroll all people in a government administered health plan. The public option would give people the option to enroll in a government plan OR continue to use private insurance.

Single payer is, for all intent and purposes, being rejected; but a public option is very much still part of the package.

[eleny]

28. The public option is dead

Obama announced the insurance industry proposal because he's backing it. The public option is history, imo, because people would flock to it and put insurance companies out of business. Time to write the obituary for the public option. Obama has spoken.

[Oregone]

32. The "public option", as it is shaping out, sucks anyway.

You have a link to where it is "dead"?

As far as I was aware, the insurance industries concessions went hand in hand supporting this "public option". They are making "cuts" to have a seat at the bargaining table to shape and cripple it from the start. You sure you aren't confused?

[eleny]

34. I could link you to Obama's announcement of the insurance industry proposal

The proposal to cut costs. That told me what I needed to know. Obama has chosen who and what he supports.

I disagree with your assertion that "they are making cuts". I believe that this is a stalling tactic. If any cuts were to be made anywhere, then we'll see increases elsewhere in co-pays and deductibles. I will never trust these mega corporations. Never.

[Oregone]

39. I'm aware of his announcement

But I perceive it as just a PR ploy part of the the sale of the "public option" to the entire population.

Clearly, I know they aren't making real cuts (its a supposed cut in the growth of premiums, so its an increase no matter how you look at it).

I really do not think the "public option" is dead at all. I think yesterday's announcement was about building momentum for it and shaping public opinion. I guess we will see.

[eleny]

41. We're definitely in the realm of "beliefs"

At this point I don't trust the insurance companies nor their point man, Obama.

I'll trust him when I see a strong public medical plan front and center. Right now the only thing front and center is private insurance.

[Oregone]

44. Yeah, and I don't trust anyone either

I just believe you are going to get a public option and it will be a piece of shit to shut people up and not endanger private providers.

[eleny]

49. "The audacity of bupkus"

[Juche]

47. 73% want it, far more than 20%. Even 63% of republicans think we need a public option

http://theplumline.whorunsgov.com/health-care/dem-poll-public-overwhelmingly-supports-public-health-insurance-plan/

While recent polling has shown consistent broad support for comprehensive health care reform, this poll specifically addressed whether people want a choice of a public health insurance plan. 73% of voters want a choice of a private or public health insurance plan, including Democrats (77%), Independents (79%), and Republicans (63%).


I have seen other figures as high as 80% of the public thinking we should have a choice of public or private plans.

[eleny]

50. And what do we get in return for this huge voice? "The audacity of bupkus"

Thanks for this clarification, it's much appreciated.

[LisaM]

7. Yes - this is how he campaigned

I've never found him to be very liberal. His main attraction was his vast superiority to the alternative.

[eleny]

14. I had hopes he could be moved to the left at least to allow a public option at the table

His dumb decision is going to cost him politically. Voters aren't fickle when it comes to less serious issues. But this one could be deal breaker opening the door for a third party challenger. Perot and Nader didn't happen out of thin air.

[Oregone]

24. Uh, they want a "public option" (code: not single-payer)

According to Schumer, its a public-owned, *unfunded*, anemic insurance company that will not negotiate at medicare rates and will not force doctors to accept it.

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

27. Schumers goal is to strangle the program in the cradle.

I am DISGUSTED with him.

[Oregone]

30. Yeah, it would go bankrupt pretty quickly

Losses would shift from private insurance companies to the "public option" as they shed high-risk customers (hence they would reap higher profits). And guess who gets to bail out the "public option"? :)

Same ol song and dance.

[eleny]

31. Obama announced his choice yesterday

He's going with what the insurance industry with try to do over the next 10 years. The public option, which would put insurance companies out of business, is doa.

[Oregone]

33. "This commitment to cost-cutting is a good-faith gesture by the healthcare industry, but it does not

mitigate the need for a public plan option in the upcoming reform bill," said Senator Charles Schumer, a member of the Senate Finance Committee that's writing a health reform bill.

http://www.boston.com/news/nation/washington/articles/2009/05/12/obama_praises_healthcare_industry_on_cuts/



Methinks you are confused. The concessions are merely part of the sales pitch for the "public option". It just allows the health insurance industry to hamstring to "public option" because of their "good-faith" gesture. There will still be a public option. It will suck.

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

35. Schumer is defining public option as something that will be doomed

to a quick and early death. He is not acting in good faith with the American electorate as far as I am concerned. Number one, it will not be a government funded program, it will be funded solely with premiums. Since it will immediately pick up all the people currently refused by private plans, it will be guaranteed to run big deficits right away. He also will not mandate acceptance of the program by providers.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/05/health/policy/05health.html

[eleny]

38. Mark my words - no public option will survive

Any public option that will suck, as you say, would be meaningless. We lose.

At that point I believe that a third party candidate will emerge. I heard a discussion yesterday where it was brought out that 39% of voters don't identify as either Repubs or Dems. That's a huge number. I have no doubt that third parties are chomping at the bit to make their own case for viability. And we all know Ross Perot tipped the election back in 1992 even though he botched his bid with dropping out and jumping back in.

[Oregone]

40. Third parties simply are not viable BTW

Not going to happen past a cycle or two. First past the post, winner-take-all doesn't leave much room for an *effective* third party movement.

[KGodel]

8. That may be what he told Grassley, but...

the question is what he'd be willing to give up. "Some of what he wants" doesn't tell us much.

I wish I didn't feel Obama is so wedded to financial capitalists (not that being wedded to industrial capitalist would be better (and yes, it really sucks that those seem to be the only viable options)).

I wish I could be optimistic about all this. Where is the hope? I want my hope! (Isn't that what I voted for?)

[pnwmom]

11. Welcome to DU, KGodel! n/t

[KGodel]

25. Thanks

I'm a long time lurker. Haven't been able to afford to be a paying member, but finally decided to sign up as a welfare bum.

You know how us democrats are: none of us have jobs, we just go to protests (because ACORN pays us to show up).

At any rate, now that I'm becoming physically able (thanks to a medical system that took two years to perform the simple, and indeed the most common, surgery today) I hope things will improve. Might even buy myself a star some day. Just you wait.

I have prospects, and now that I can see a bit, something might come of them. Here's hoping.

[pnwmom]

9. I think the reason is

the fear that if there isn't bipartisan support now, then a future administration is more likely to overturn it.

Still, I'm not thrilled by the idea either. I'm afraid the Rethugs will suck the life out of any public option -- or eliminate it entirely.

[LisaM]

23. If a good single-payer system worked, no future administration would be able to overturn it

I just don't see that as a worry.

And solving the health care problem would ensure THIS administration of a long series of successive, like-minded administrations.

[Stinky The Clown]

37. Overturn it?

Oh please. NO PRESIDENT could ever take back single payer universal health care once it was given. It would be easier to take back social security.

[pnwmom]

51. We're not talking about single payer, we're talking about a government run option.

And the Rethugs COULD decide to eliminate it, telling everyone that they could join a private plan instead.

[jsamuel]

10. I thought he had already learned his lesson with the stimulus package... guess not :(

[90-percent]

13. Barack

Just do whats best for the suffering American people that still want to pursue that old "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness" promise our Founding Fathers bequeathed to us.

The Repubs just seem to want to go fuck themselves and Obama should just let them!

I want the best crafted and uncompromised plan possible!

I'm an American. All American's should be in a position to take good health care for granted and not have to worry about financial ruin if they suffer horrible illness and injury.

-90% Jimmy

[Oregone]

20. "Just do whats best..."

But thats not bipartisan.

If Obama wasn't being bipartisan, he would be compromising his ideals of being bipartisan. Then, that would be a compromised plan to him.

[madrchsod]

15. we have been sold down the river by the democrats....

forget about single pay or god forbid medicare for all...durbin is right--the banks own the senate.

[dysfunctional press]

16. if that's true, then FUCK HIM.

it doesn't sound like he wants to have 'party line' support in 2012.

[TimesSquareCowboy]

17. I suppose it all depends on what he has to give up.

[Oregone]

19. Centrism for the sole sake of centrism is damn worthless

[Oregone]

22. Paraphrase: The President would rather cave in to the right-wing than do what is right

Aint "bipartisanship" a riot?

[snooper2]

29. Suprised you didn't get attacked for ageism "yet" for using gramps...

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[aquart]

36. He's wrong.

[KGodel]

42. The real problem...

is that single payer means nationalizing the health insurance business (I wanted to say "industry" but it's not an industry, it's a business).

Now, it's worth noting that personal insurance is largely a 20th century invention, and it's one that financial (as opposed to industrial) capital is heavily dependent upon. Think about how much you pay your bank compared to how much you pay your insurance company. The real money is in insurance. So financial capital is going to kick and scream about any incursions on their turf.

Having a president whose campaign was largely financed by these very interests doesn't bode well for the prospect that he might turn around and put them out of business.

I think the best we can hope for is a "public option". It could eventually put the private insurers out of business, if it isn't poisoned from within. It seems it's kind of working in Canada.

What's required is eternal citizen vigilance. (That doesn't mean neighborhood gangs beating up immigrants, it means informed groups analyzing what the insurance companies and a presumed "public option" provider are doing.)

[KGodel]

43. Dupe

[Juche]

45. Pathetic

If so he has learned nothing from the stimulus.

Obama has amazing social intelligence, he can't be this dumb. Is he up to something? If so, what?

[WeDidIt]

46. Then there will be no change in our healthcare system

We will still have 42 million people uninsured. People will go to the ER for primary care. And people will die because they are afraid of how much healthcare will cost.

[RagAss]

58. True...only we don't have a healthcare system now.

[Dr Fate]

48. "Bipartisan" in "centrist" speak means: "We have to do what the Republicans want."

"Bipartisan" never means: "The Republicans are going to have to do what DEMS, moderates or the majority of the public wants."

At least that is what it meant from 2000-2008.

I hope the definition has changed, but on this issue, I'm not so sure anymore.

[shadowknows69]

52. I want this put on my tombstone (real one not a DU one)

"He was killed by bi-partisanship"

[Vinca]

53. Grassley also said he is against a public option because

people would gravitate toward it and hurt big insurance. (To be fair, he said big insurance would have to raise premiums on its remaining few policyholders in order to make a profit.) Boo fucking hoo. I wonder how much loot Grassley takes in from them every year.

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

55. Well, there you have it. More concerned about the industry

than the citizens. Surprising he would be so open about his concern for their profit. So why do his constituents vote for him?

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

56. late night kick!

[ColbertWatcher]

57. I would rather have a fair system like single-payer than ...

... to have a system held hostage to corporate ideologues.

[DatManFromNawlins]

59. This is simple to explain

A party-line vote on healthcare is going to mobilize each and every conservative and neo-con who skipped the polls last time and/or voted for Obama instead of McCain. It will also sway a lot of people from the "Obama is swell" camp to the "fuck Obama" camp.

Don't believe me? Watch and see. The three biggest issues in national races are the economy, healthcare, and national security. Sometimes you can get a pass on the economy if national security seems to be an issue, but mess with healthcare while leaving a significant minority without a voice and there will be hell to pay if the economy is still in the dumps... and no sane person can honestly say that Obama is doing a great job with economic issues right now. The situation he was put in is not his fault, but who he chose to fix the mess IS.

Watch how the Republicans use the word "autocrat" to describe Obama over the next few years. The more he uses the supermajority in the Senate to pass legislation he wants with impunity, the more it will become a self-fulfilling term (I'm not saying he's done it yet, but it's inevitable that it will come to pass).

[readmoreoften]

60. When your political aim is to include reactionaries at every turn, you are a reactionary.

If you choose killing working class Americans in order to buddy up to fascists and death profiteers, you are not a friend of the people.

[Hekate]

62. Obama plays rope-a-dope with his opponents...

Obama seems to get most of what he wants by giving some of it up, I've noticed.

He plays rope-a-dope with his foes, according to Andrew Sullivan. It seems to be working on Dick Cheney...

http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/the_daily_dish/2009/05/the-ropeadope-again.html
and the original
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnists/andrew_sullivan/article4925049.ece

Howard Dean seems to think Obama will not fail us regarding health care. No bills have been written, no votes cast yet.

Keep calling and writing your congresscritters -- that's the part we can do.

Hekate

[Waiting For Everyman]

63. I think Grassley's floating a lie, and bluffing that O won't call him on it.

I think that's Grassley publicly attributing to Obama the position Grassley's trying to push him into by doing it. That's just how it comes off to me - phoney.