'Old South' frat targeted over Confederate event

[bluestateguy]

For those of you who are not familiar, all of the Southern chapters of the Kappa Alpha frat have this event very year. The boys dress up in confederate officer uniforms, while their dates (usually sorority girls) wear traditional Southern hoop dresses. The event is often held on a plantation manor. It's also a very subtle way to suggest that blacks are not welcome in the white fraternity system.

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20090513/D985H2P02.html

BIRMINGHAM, Ala. (AP) - A white fraternity that traces its roots to the Civil War and Confederate Gen. Robert E. Lee is again facing complaints over its antebellum-themed events.

This time, University of Alabama alumnae are upset after Kappa Alpha Order members wearing Confederate uniforms and carrying battle flags paraded past a historically black sorority as the women celebrated the group's 35th anniversary.

The fraternity has been forced to halt its "Old South" festivities on some campuses because of claims of racial insensitivity, and Alabama members have apologized for pausing in front of Alpha Kappa Alpha's sorority house during this year's parade.

Alpha Kappa Alpha members said there was no confrontation or taunting, but they were shocked to see fraternity members in rebel uniforms and white women from another sorority in hoop skirts.

"I don't believe these young folks were in any way trying to be racist," said Joyce Stallworth, an Alpha Kappa Alpha alumna who saw the April 29 parade in Tuscaloosa and is an associate education dean at Alabama. "But they were being insensitive. I don't think they understood the broader implications of what they were doing."

more

and some pictures...

[Maru Kitteh]

1. White as an Alpine winter, one and all - but they had "no idea." Mmmkay.

[XemaSab]

3. The thing that's super depressing:

they really might not have had any idea.

Miss South Carolina couldn't explain why so many US Americans couldn't find their own country on a world map; who's to say the KA understanding of the Old South has nothing to do with race relations whatsoever? :shrug:

[nadinbrzezinski]

4. You are correct

[bluestateguy]

7. Indeed

If you are talking about a bunch of privileged white kids in the South, in the deepest of the Deep South, then they may have been deliberately and unintentionally kept away from blacks their whole lives. They likely grew up in all white neighborhoods, meaning all white schools (possibly in private "academies" that became so popular down South after integration), and all white friends. Some of their parents may have belonged to all white country clubs. As a consequence, such cluelessness becomes more understandable.

[Oregone]

2. At least KA wasn't caught tasing eachother's genitals again

[lapfog_1]

5. When I see "targeted" in the title...

this is the image that comes to mind -



Of course, given that they are wearing the uniforms of a rebel traitor army, one that killed 100s of thousands of US citizens, perhaps my imagery is one that should come to mind.

[democracy1st]

6. darn they're still worried about black folks,no wonder we can't get anywhere on immigration reform!

[SoCalDem]

8. These poor young people..

They just cannot have ANY fun these days.. someone's always tryin' to tell them that celebrating their "heritage" is somehow wrong....Land o cotton is now somewhere in China....lookaway, lookaway ..Dixie is now a drinking cup..get used to it..your side lost :rofl:

[pnutbutr]

26. heritage

If one is not allowed to celebrate their heritage because it upsets another then nobody in the world would be able to do it. I respect their right to do this and as a southerner who appreciates and understands the heritage of his family I would probably enjoy participating in an event like that as long as there was no racial motivation. Most probably have none but all it takes is one idiot to ruin it for everyone.

[Are_grits_groceries]

27. Oh please.

Have you ever been around any of these people? There are plenty of idiots to choose from. That isn't heritage they are celebrating. It is their fervent wish for the future. When you dress up people in a way that brings to mind plantations, you are being as overtly racist as possible.

I can match any of them with Confederate ancestors. I will remember them, but I am not going to romanticize them. I am going to move forward.

[pnutbutr]

29. :rofl:

fervent wish for the future by dressing up in the past? We might as well all forget our ancestors then because as you say we should just forget them. Lets forget the founders of the country, the people who fought the revolution, both side of the civil war. Hell, lets just say fuck it to history altogether, it's the past, lets move forward.

[Are_grits_groceries]

32. Oh piffle!

I have heard people in this organization wish as much.
I also didn't say to forget history. I specifically said I'd remember them.
And ROFL all you want. I don't find that kind of thing funny.

To mods: We need a "piffle" smiley.

[AllieB]

39. I love your 'Meh' kitty.

We need a 'Feh' one too. :rofl:

[Are_grits_groceries]

41. She says thx.

She has got the Cheney snurl downpat. I will look for a "feh" one.

[AllieB]

30. Always on the wrong side of an argument, aren't you?

;-)

[Are_grits_groceries]

34. Heh!

I try to be! I've done a good job down here so far. :hi:

[pnutbutr]

35. seems that way

In this case it's just a history buff who happens to enjoy southern traditions and heritage. I don't however agree with any of the racial actions taken by the group as they stopped in front of the sorority.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

51. You seem to enjoy euphemisms too. "Heritage" my ass. -nt

[Arugula Latte]

69. Oh, those wonderful southern traditions evoked by a plantation -- like slave labor

and lynchings and "states' rights." Oh, right -- I forgot -- the Civil War was about "economics" not slavery. Yeeeah, the economics OF slavery, and how getting people to work for free actually helps your bottom line! Who knew?

Oh, my stars, I need a mint julep. *fans self*

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

83. Always

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

53. Wow. Linux kernel mailing list posts have less code than this one. -nt

[mitchum]

54. Why aren't they flying the white flag of surrender to honor their heritage?

losers

[alarimer]

61. They really shouldn't be celebrating treason either.

Because that's what secession is. They were traitors and normally they used to hang people for that offense.

[Feron]

65. I guess you don't celebrate the 4th of July then..

The first Americans seceded from Britain. The only difference being is that the Americans won.

If the people in an area want to leave the U.S., then they should be free to do so. Otherwise it is tyranny.

[Arugula Latte]

70. So, under your logic, if the Confederacy were alive today complete with slavery

that would be just dandy because that's what The South wanted?

Wow.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

57. They're allowed to dress any way they want.

And we're allowed to point out their a bunch of dumbass racists.

[bobburgster]

9. Maybe it's just me.....

but my warning system tends to go on high alert reading sentences like this:

"This time, University of Alabama alumnae are upset after Kappa Alpha Order members wearing Confederate uniforms and carrying battle flags paraded past a historically black sorority as the women celebrated the group's 35th anniversary."

[tnlefty]

66. Now, now, I'm sure that was just a coinkey-dink, and it

meant nothing, heritage and all. :sarcasm: (if really necessary)

[Are_grits_groceries]

10. I knew it was KA before I even read the thread.

They have always been awful. They've been doing this shit forever. They've managed to work in even more disgusting ways to to annoy people.
I remember one time when they were brooding about seceding. I laughed at one of them in class. I told him that we'd lost the first time. If I even wanted to secede why would I follow a bunch of drunken louts who couldn't beat an army of Muppets.
He said if he wasn't a Southern gentleman he would have a lot more to say to me. I flipped him off and told him to have at it because he was about as much a Southern gentleman as I was a Southern lady.

[aikoaiko]

22. Its true, my wife tells me that KA and SAE host the Old South and Magnolia festivities every year.

Where the men pick up their dates in costume all over town and campus. Unless they changed their route or planned on the stop in front of AKA, it may have been a thoughtless accident. But if you're going to dress up as Old South, AKA might not have been a priority.

[PassingFair]

28. Damn, I wish there were MORE Of YOU in the south!!

We wouldn't have to live
with the DINOS and BlueDogs screwing
the general populace from DC!!

Keep speaking up (like you COULD stop!)
and you encourage others to demand
better!

Smooch to you!

:hug:

[Are_grits_groceries]

31. LOL! I WON'T stop.

There are a lot more of us down here than you know about. If I go to family gatherings, I manage to get into at least one "discussion."

[Sheltiemama]

60. With an attitude like that

... I don't think you'd have done well in sorority rush at a Southeastern Conference school. :P

I was in a sorority. One of my best friends in the chapter and I had a class together that had a member of a fraternity we referred to as "The Nazi."

[Are_grits_groceries]

62. I know I wouldn't.

I didn't even want to at my SC school. Some of those KAs could be real bozos. So could I when I tried.
My Mama went to Winthrop moons ago when it was an all girls school. This was before WWII. They were called "Fairest Flowers of the Southland." I used to hoot at her about that.
:hi:

[Sheltiemama]

73. I want to be a Fairest Flower of the Southland, too!

That's hilarious.

[tnlefty]

67. I must say that I've always cracked up over your username...

it reminds me of a time when someone that I know went to the doctor and the doctor told him, "gravy is not a beverage." Read your posts even if I don't respond to them. Lovin' the last line in your post. :hi:

[Are_grits_groceries]

74. It's a variation of a phrase

I have heard forever. "If that ain't right, then grits ain't groceries.":hi:

[ColbertWatcher]

11. I am not familair with this "tradition" and I have a question ...

... do the girls belong to the same "order" as the boys? If not (I assume not) so which sorority do they belong?

Anyone know?

[Are_grits_groceries]

12. I thought there was one.

I can't remember which one it was. I don't want to damn anybody by saying because I'm not sure.

[ColbertWatcher]

13. I checked their website and they don't do a very good job at taking notes. n/t

[Are_grits_groceries]

14. They don't do a vey good job at anything.

They aren't even decent gentlemen.

[ColbertWatcher]

15. While searching for info on the girls/women in the photos, I discovered their motto ...

... God and the ladies.

WTF!?

[Are_grits_groceries]

16. It should be " God and the ladies and

the alcohol." It could probably be expanded to other substances.

[AllentownJake]

19. Its their formal

They do it once a year.

I went to school in the south for 2 years. In order to join this Frat you had to prove your southern roots.

My Frat had one as well, instead of confederate uniforms we had Union uniforms because our founders were Union soldiers.

[Sheltiemama]

59. They most likely belong to different sororities.

Though couples tend to emerge from pairing such as homecoming and mixers.

[moez]

17. They look

like they're having fun.

[Dogtown]

24. Having fun

and ready for the picnic/lynching.


I'll have my fun w/o the hate, thanks.

[moez]

43. I guess I missed that....

Did the article indicate that they were involved in hateful conduct?

hmmmmm.... must've missed that little detail.

[Dogtown]

47. Yes, you did

must suck.

[deaniac21]

44. You be hatin' right now , Dog.

[Dogtown]

48. Yeah, but I don't dress up for it.

I don't parade around with my carpet bag.

[bullwinkle428]

36. Klansmen look like they're having fun at cross burnings. Your point?

[deaniac21]

49. Actually, they have hoods on so you have to be good at

body language. No wait, they have robes on too!

[AllentownJake]

18. My frat wore Union uniforms

Seriously

:shrug:

[armyowalgreens]

20. Ignorance at it's finest...

I don't want to say that every confederate waving person is racist, but the vast majority of them are, and all of them are ignorant.

Do they not know what the south stood for?


This is the equivalent of myself wearing a reverse swastika arm patch and simply claiming it's a Hindu symbol for good fortune. That's not how it works.

[geckosfeet]

21. Well isn't that just special. Dress up for racists.

[mitchum]

23. Scions of the ancestral Ford dealership

[arcadian]

25. Some of those kids don't look white enough.

Some clearly have brown eyes. :sarcasm:

[DU GrovelBot]

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[Kalyke]

37. I usually agree with your posts, Grits, my fellow Southerner

But, this is just, well, region-baiting.

More crap that a few Southerners do and probably wasn't even meant to be racist, but is. I agree with Joyce Stallworth's statement: insensitive and without broader thought.

:shrug:

Personally, I like hoop skirts. Hides a multitude of sins. :)

[Are_grits_groceries]

42. I was set off because

I know this group. I know it will be applied to all of the South by people who are misguided in their own way. That should set off another round.

The closest I ever came to a "hoop skirt" was a "hula hoop." :hi:

[Kalyke]

45. I know you meant well.

I just cringed when I saw it because of the broad-brushes with which some here paint us Southerners.

I wore a hoop skirt in a play once. First and last time I had hips. ;)

[Occulus]

77. I didn't see that on this thread, but I'm wondering....

Don't a large group of all-white college kids from a fraternity known for racial, aahhh, "insensitivity", deserve the broad brush?

They're the ones who played dress up, they're all white as a marble temple, they're wearing the uniforms of a treasonous group of states who tried to keep slavery alive, they're the archetype of the sort of person who wants to return to those days, etc.

As a matter of fact.... these people are the broad brush incarnate. We don't need to paint this frat; they're already wearing two thick coats as it is.

I wonder if any of these manly-man confederate wannabees realize that some gay guys like men in uniform. ;) Maybe if all us watch-me-faggots* start giving them come-hither looks when this event rolls around, they'll stop... Of course, we'd have to do it in packs... y'know, like wolves...

:rofl:

*RIP Dom, we'll miss you

[cherish44]

38. I made my first visit to the deep south last year

I toured an antebellum home led by a hoop-skirted Southern Belle guide. She was going on about the craftsmanship of the house and someone piped up, "Give credit where credit it due, this house was built by the skilled craftsmanship of SLAVES" She just kind of smiled and quickly moved on to the next topic. I'm surpirsed she didn't say "Oh fiddle dee dee"... I left feeling pretty pissed off that the owners of this house lived in such opulance at the expense of enslaved human beings who were forced to live in shacks.

[mitchum]

55. I kept doing the same thing when I was led on a tour of a plantation house...

in Macon, Georgia.
The guide didn't appreciate my questions like
"Where did the slaves sleep and eat?"
and
"Did they whip the slaves here or was there a commercial establishment in town that did that?"

[Kingofalldems]

40. Future repubs and Blue Dogs

[MellowDem]

46. Looks like it's harmless enough...

Their way of having fun might be seen as somewhat insensitive, but I've seen many frats and sororities dress up in ways that are not sensitive to some group or another. College is a pretty edgy place generally, but I like it that way. I won't shame them for it, but I wasn't a "frat guy" (apologies to all the good fraternities out there) so I probably would have never done any sort of "dress up" anyways.

[Mudoria]

50. Don't have any problems with the event..

[deaniac21]

52. It's pretty obvious that these young people should be charged

with a hate crime. They all should be sentenced to 20 years, at least.

[Thothmes]

58. Exacltly what felony have any of these people committed

The got dressed up in CSA uniforms and went to a dance. Hardly a hate crime. But then again there are those on this forum that do not care about the law. A knee jerk reaction to a frat party. Same type of BS that called for the the lynching of the Duke University Lacross team based on completely false accusations by a dancer.

[mamaleah]

75. I think he or she was being sarcastic

Maybe...you never know.

[KamaAina]

81. Not a hate crime. But surely a violation of the university's code of conduct

and/or that of the Panhellenic Council.

edit: header

[Monk06]

56. Shoulda put the fire hoses on them for the sake of nostalgia. Maybe a few German Shepherds too

[underpants]

63. mmmmm the one in the purple is excited to see me!!!

[mitchum]

68. The south will never rise again, but a couple of things have done so

[santamargarita]

64. This is what I was thinking...

[fishwax]

71. jerks

:puke:

[Better Believe It]

72. My favorite Civil War General

Like to see someone dressed up like him at their event.



General Sherman

He played hardball with the Confederate slavocracy.

They really didn't care for him much.

:)

[Celeborn Skywalker]

76. He was just as much as an asshole as the Confederates.

Don't kid yourself into thinking he was some noble hero out to free the slaves. He was a war criminal.

[Better Believe It]

78. He wasn't an abolitionist but he sure new how to destroy the slave owning class and their mansions

His March to the Sea led to the destruction of the Confederacy. It was a brutal and bold action that shortened the war and quickened the political/economic destruction of the slave owning class. He was a military leader of an authentic revolution .... if you owned "people" as property, it was nothing less than an economic, social and political revolution that opened the door to Radical Reconstruction .... one of the proudest and finest moments in American history.

The actions of Sherman's soldiers were certainly not any worse than those of the pro-slavery Confederate troops during Sherman's march.

War criminal?

Hardly.

Military hero of the unions successful war to overthrow the slavocracy?

Certainly!

Watch the History Channel program on the great General Sherman and learn something.

[martymar64]

79. This is like German frat kids dressing up like the Einsatzgruppen

Just celebrating their heritage.


:sarcasm: in case there is any doubt

[mitchum]

80. At least the nazis "accomplished" things...

they changed the map of Europe and developed technologies.
The confederacy? They couldn't even conquer Pennsylvania.
Confederate technology? Well, they did build a submarine...that promptly sank.
Inept losers.

[KamaAina]

82. Kappa Alpha? Shouldn't it be Kappa Kappa Kappa?

:eyes:

edit: I take this as a personal affront, because, especially in the Lounge, "KamaAina" is often abbreviated as KA!

[brendan120678]

84. Hmmm....there surely are some beautiful ladies in the south...

but of course, if my lovely north-eastern, French/Irish wife is reading this...no one holds a candle to your beauty, of course!!
:hug:

[mitchum]

87. Who knew that so many Scandinavians settled in the deep south?

Surely that must be where all that blonde hair comes from. Well, that or the drugstore :)

[chatnoir]

85. Seems in very poor taste...

But then again this *is* the Univ of Alabama we're talking about.

[rvablue]

86. This frat and all others and all sororities are LAME as they are all founded on the idea

of exclusion of others.