I've said it more than once, and I'll say it again.....

[crimsonblue]

The effectiveness of torture is absolutely inconsequential. According to United States and International law, torture is universally prohibited without exception. I saw today on CNN that Dick Cheney's request to release memos demonstrating the effectiveness of torture was denied. What the MSM fails to grasp is that TORTURE IS ILLEGAL. PERIOD. It does not matter if torture works. It is illegal. It does not matter if torture prevents a ticking time bomb scenario. It is illegal. It does not matter if torturing somebody will cause me to win a brazillion dollars and go on a date with a supermodel, it is illegal. For fuck sakes, why are we so eager to give up our humanity? Why are we so willing to destroy society in order to secure its safety? God, I need another beer.

[QueenOfCalifornia]

1. Pass me a drink

too.

I am so with you on this.

:toast:

[Javaman]

17. it's so hard sometimes not to become an alcoholic these days. nt

[jobycom]

2. D'ja see Wanda Sykes comments on that?

She said if she robbed a bank, the court wouldn't forgive her just because she said "Yeah, I robbed it, but look at all these bills I paid off."

[unblock]

8. exactly -- robbery "works," too. it's a motive, not a justification.

but if you're a sociopath like cheney, you don't understand the difference.

[jobycom]

12. "A motive, not a justification."

:applause:

[livefreest]

14. that is so good

[NanceGreggs]

3. Well said! K/R

[stillcool]

4. I'm not sure anymore..

what is real. Are Americans really okay with torture, or is that perception management? I can not imagine that anyone will be able to hold back the flood of revelations that is sure to come. Yet I can imagine the American people being desensitized, mesmerized and manipulated by their tv screens. After all, nothing is new in all of this.
 

[Hepburn]

5. Precisely!

Because it is alleged to be effective, that does NOT make it legal...nor should it's alleged effectiveness excuse or justify a free pass to those who allowed, ordered or did it!

K&R

[Quantess]

19. Alleged to be effective?

I thought the general consensus is that torture is ineffective, because the suspects/victims say whatever the "interrogator" wants to hear.

[marauding liberal]

6. so true

[frebrd]

7. K&R! Absolutely! n/t

[HereSince1628]

9. Everytime a person says torture, or water boarding or humiliation etc

They need to preface it with ILLEGAL. Look how well the phrase ILLEGAL Immigrant has done with the rightwing R's.

There is absolutely no reason why with a bit of repetition the fundie rightwing can't be made to think ILLEGAL TORTURE, Illegal waterboarding, illegal humiliation, illegal stress postions, etc.

[sellitman]

10. Early afternoon beer drinking?

And I wasn't invited?

Now that is real torture!

:beer:

[crimsonblue]

15. i just finished up with my finals...

and a beer (or 6) was definitely in order. ;)

[spanone]

11. yep, it doesn't matter if 99% of americans think it's swell, it's agin the law

[iwillalwayswonderwhy]

13. I keep getting confused by the paradox

It's not torture, besides it works.

[livefreest]

16. well said. however the MSM are always happy to jump on the GOP-lies band-wagon

[rrneck]

18. It's illegal because it's wrong. K&R nt