The "Edwards House" Debate Has Opened Old Wounds of Rich vs. Poor; Materialism; Excess

[The Cleaner]

This is why i believe the issue of Edward's massive (MASSIVE) new house is so controversial here on DU. It's not just about how large his house is. It encapsulates today's wealth vs. poverty and the total excess we see here in America where bigger is better and "I've got mine, the hell with everyone else."

If you had the money, would YOU build such a big house? Or in your wealth where you could get anything you want, would you opt for a more modest 3000 square foot home? It is an interesting question.

Perhaps we Americans need a reality check.

[chimpymustgo]

1. NO. It's opened the door for people to bash Edwards and generally be assholes.

nt

[dogday]

38. I will second this statement

From what I can see, you are right on time with your description.

[rubberducky]

2. Can`t we just please leave this alone??

[Egalitariat]

8. Should hypocrisy be off the table as in issue on both sides? Or just ours?***

nm

[rubberducky]

14. Sorry, didn`t know that we have housing police.

[Egalitariat]

16. OTOH, if he houses about 100 Katrina refugees there (which he could) then

I'll change my opinion.

[rubberducky]

19. Seems like your vitriol would be better spewed at

republicans. IMHO If you are looking for "Mr. Smith (goes to Wash.)" , then I would think that you are going to have a hell of a time finding a candidate that meets your requirements.Just my oppinion.

[treestar]

28. So who are you for, because do you require that the candidate

do that if he/she can?

That would do nothing for systemic change either. Jimmy Carter builds houses for poor people, but in this system, that alone won't do it. Kerry and Edwards and Hillary and the rest could all join them, but they won't make a dent.

It's a matter of who is working for the systemic change.

Besides, the Chimp family should have helped those same refugees privately. They don't for different reasons.

[mondo joe]

31. How many Katrina refugees are you housing? If you take just one you'd be

helping.

[Egalitariat]

33. I'm not the one out trying to capitalize on the photo ops***

nm

[mondo joe]

35. I'll take that to mean you haven't done shit to help any Katrina evacuees.

Thanks.

[Egalitariat]

36. You can take it however you want to take it. But I'm not saying one thing

and doing another. On national TV, at that.

[mondo joe]

37. Neither is Edwards.

Thanks! :-)

[Egalitariat]

39. OK

nm

[originalpckelly]

3. I don't care about the house, I care about how he went about getting the money to build it.

He was a trial lawyer after all, that means he represented people who won settlements for some reason. They needed help, and while he did provide it, he made sure he was himself helped. Enough so that he can go out and built such an outrageously large house.

At least, however, he wasn't born into wealth, so he at least understands what it's like to be a normal person.

The American dream should include being successful, but it should never include success which harms other Americans so profoundly, it should never include exploitative success.

[Traveling_Home]

11. I have questions how he made his money

He'd helped(?) a lot of (worthwhile?) cases for disabled folks. But in doing so (it appears) he did the standard lawyer practice of taking 1/3 of all the money that the disabled folks would have had for all their lives for all their care. Committing them to a second class citizen while getting himself rich.....

I'd love to see some details on his helping folks (disabled) rather then see him like an ambulance chaser.

IF he seems more serious of a candidate I hope some one will do a review how he won those cases and his financial benefit compared to his clients take.

I have a knowledgible prejudice against most lawyers involved in didability fights - whether they work for SSA and an Insurance company - or if they work for us as they love to tell us.

I couldn't support him until I understand his financial relationships with the disablity community

[Manifestor_of_Light]

24. Do you have any idea of the expenses involved in a PI case?

The plaintiff's lawyer only takes a case he thinks is valid and that there is a chance of winning, because he has to pay the pre trial and trial expenses out of his own pocket. He or she gambles that he will get the money back as part of the award.

I was a court reporter for almost 20 years. Do you have any idea how much depositions cost? And how many have to be taken? Do you have any idea how much expert witnesses, like doctors, accident reconstructors, engineers, and so forth, cost per hour? And that's not counting the deposition cost. Or even the filing fees? Document fees? Notary fees?

A lawyer who takes "dog" cases (bad cases with vague and ill-defined injuries and pre-existing conditions blamed on the incident) will soon find himself out of business. Lawyers take that one third of the settlement because they have overhead. Rent to pay, paralegals and secretaries to pay, and all the factors mentioned above.

So you don't think anybody who is disabled should be on disability? They paid into social security when they were working, or maybe they are minors and cannot work, and were born disabled? Do you believe they should starve? Or that if they are injured by the negligence of a person or company, that they should not be justly compensated for their medical expenses, medical care, etc?

Your statement about "I couldn't support him until I understand his financial relationships with the disability community" makes NO sense.

[Traveling_Home]

40. Yes I do have ....

I'm an old guy (56) and have been involved in litigation both in private suits and in SSDI suits and I have info and experience regarding PI cases. I was disabled 53 years ago. YOUR making excuses for Edwards supporting a system that takes 1/3 of all the money a person with a serious disability will EVER see makes him unsupportable by me and my friends and makes you an idiot.

Got any more excuses for an ambulance chaser?

[Traveling_Home]

41. Legal Expenses come off the top.......

Edwards/Lawyers take 1/3 of whst is left after their expenses. THey take 1/3 of all the money of perosn with a head injury, paralysis, metal illness...... HE TAKES THE ONLY MONEY THEY WILLEVER HAVE.

If he gives his money back to the disabled folks to he took it from then maybe.

For any lawyer getting rich telling me he does it for the gimps don't sit well. LIAR

[treestar]

27. It is the market value of the work

Most trial lawyers are liberal, so don't diss them too hard. Talk about eating your own.

By that standard, some people who aren't wealthy could be questioned. People are making money selling others things they don't need all the time. Or doing things that no one needs done in an ideal world.

[lostnotforgotten]

4. I Think It Is A Valid Question - Edwards Has Just Been Exposed As A Hypocrite

eom

[BelleCarolinaPeridot]

5. I think some people just don't like Edwards and that's ok ...

some people just need more reasons.

[donco6]

7. Why? Did he speak out about big houses sometime?

I don't recall that . . .

[mondo joe]

29. Edwards is about everyone having the opportunity to make good. Nothing hypocritical

there.

[Ezlivin]

6. Sooner or later we're all going to have to realize...

...that people that run for President are substantially different from you or I, regardless of their background.

Yes, I know that Edwards grew up "poor." But that, like Bill Clinton's "trailer" experience, is in the distant past.

Money changes you. Lots of money changes you a lot.

[Clark2008]

10. Um - Edwards did NOT grow up poor.

He grew up upper middle class. His father was a mill MANAGER and later a CONSULTANT. His mother worked for the post office. They were solidly upper middle class. The were, in fact, Republicans.

"The Edwardses were solidly middle class” when Johnny was growing up, according to a four-part profile of the North Carolina senator in his home state’s most prestigious daily, the Raleigh News and Observer. It’s true that for a few years as a young man Edwards’ father worked on the floor of a Roger Milliken textile mill. But Edwards père (a lifelong Republican, like his reactionary boss) quickly climbed upward, becoming a monitor of worker productivity as a “time-study” man — which any labor organizer in the South will tell you is a polite term for a stoolie who spies on the proletarian mill hands to get them to speed up production for the same low wages. Daddy Edwards’ grassing got him promoted to supervisor, then to plant manager — and he finally resigned to start his own business as a consultant to the textile industry. As a Boston Globe profile of Edwards put it last year, the senator never “notes that his father was part of management . . . ‘John was more middle class than most of us,’” says Bill Garner, a high school friend and college roommate.

http://www.laweekly.com/news/news/a-populist-make-over/2034/

Now... Clinton, Clark and Kucinich grew up poor. Probably some other fine Dems did, too, but Edwards did not. I'm sorry he's allowed to perpetuate this belief.

P.S. There's also nothing wrong with growing up middle class - nothing. It's just I'm bothered by Edwards' failures to point this out. He'd rather us believe he came from nothing, which is not entirely true.

[Ezlivin]

23. Good info

Thanks!

[Old and In the Way]

9. Well, we could all live in McDoublewides.....

seriously, I probably wouldn't want the headaches of dealing with that size house, but it bothers me not in the least if the Edwards choose to build the house they can afford. It's really none of my business how they decide to spend their money. I really hope we don't start evaluating our political leadership on the basis of their bank account. I'd prefer that we base our decisions on what they've accomplished and what their vision for this country is. When less is better, a lot less will be best and we'll get the leadership we deserve.

As a Kerry supporter, I'm in no hurry to make my mind up on who I'll suopport in the primary. If I decide against Edwards, it won't be on the basis of his floor plan, though.

[cornermouse]

12. Look Its a fact that he's wealthy.

He and Elizabeth worked hard to get there. I think we all understand that and most of us are old enough to understand that they can afford help to care for their children and the possibility (horror of horrors) that they might even need to have live in help. In their position, I'm sure they've been threatened. I would absolutely have bodyguards and a driver for the kids and probably the adults as well. I don't know why you're all getting so worked up over it. Fact is, if you had their money I doubt you'd settle for a 3000 square foot home either.

[Pathwalker]

13. The Edawrd's house story originated on DRUDGE.

Just saying.

[Bluerthanblue]

15. Personally I'm against these mega mansions no matter WHO

lives in them-

To give Edwards a "pass" simply because he's "a Dem" or "a candidate" or "he DESERVESit - is 'two faced' and hypocritical.

I don't like grandiose excessive wealth in anyones hands- I wish America was STILL a place where someone like a joe/jane shmoe ordinary had a ghost of a chance of actually becoming our leader- sadly it is NOT- and hasn't been for a long time-

Money rules this country- like it or not- it is money that shows us what is "News"- makes or breaks potential candidates- and controls our lives in ways most of us cannot begin to understand.

The 'value' of a person should not be measured by their pocketbook- their looks- or their popularity in opinion.

We all have things about us that others will find disagreeable, and disappointing. If we don't we are either liars, hypocrites, or dead. (or any combination of these)

And speaking out about the things we dislike in the world is not only our 'right'- it is our obligation. If we are silent about the things that matter to us, then they don't matter very much-

When we are challenged about our perspectives, we are being called to examine the ground on which we stand- giving us the chance to firm up our foundation, or step into a new position rather than falling into the abyss.

I don't demand lock-step conformity from anyone- what would be gained by that???

[Bridget Burke]

42. When was America a place where "Someone like joe/jane shmoe"...

Could become President? Abraham Lincoln was surely born poor--but he was a prosperous lawyer when he entered politics.

And we haven't had a Jane Shmoe or a Jane Rich-chick become president yet.

[hfojvt]

17. I cannot consider a 3000 square foot home to really be 'modest'

But neither does a big (not a huge) home with a walkway to a refurbished barn seem like the ultimate in luxury living either. And if I was a Senator, I am not sure if I would feel safe letting my kids goto a public pool.

If I had the money would I be dedicated to helping the poor, and would I run for office and expose myself and my wife and my kids to a bunch of mean-spirited cheap shots?

Edwards seems to be the leading candidate standing up for the poor. As such, I think I should have his back and encourage him to continue. I feel sure that he bought the place, and refurbished it. No sensible person would design something like that from scratch. Maybe it was a bigger house than he wanted, but the best that was on the market. I am wearing a pair of glasses that make me look like Larry King. I could not find a middle size, it was either huge or tiny, and I hate the tiny ones.

I also note how the 'muckraking' article wants to make very ordinary things seem sinister. Edwards' house is 'shielded from view'. By gosh, how evil of him not to get a glass house in plain view of an interstate like the rest of America's rural houses. "'No trespassing' signs discourage visitors". In other words, something that is standard to rural property, and probably necessary for liability purposes somehow makes John Edwards an evil hypocrite.

[earth mom]

18. I have been very vocal against rich rethuglicans...

because they are at the helm of the class war this country is in. If you want to talk greedy and ruthless and exploitative, look no further than the * cabal and it's followers. :puke:

I don't see Edwards as having done anything to harm or exploit anyone nor has he hurt the environment. This entire debate is simply an ugly and nasty rethuglican meme designed solely to smear Edwards.

We all would do well to remember this is just the beginning of what will undoubtedly be a massive non stop smear job put on by the rethugs the likes we've never seen before because they are running scared. They have not one candidate worth a damn and they know it!

[omega minimo]

20. It's another Weapon of Mass Distraction

:thumbsdown:

[tanyev]

21. Anyone who is troubled by Edwards and his house should just not vote for him in the primary.

That is all.

[stray cat]

22. Right wing talking point of hitting candidates where they are strongest

Edwards is a populist so the right wing makes an issue of his wealth. Kerry was a war hero so they swiftboated him on his strongest issue. In other words - here we go again helping the right wing pundits dis candiates at their strongest points.

[bobbolink]

25. And the poor folk always lose!! Edwards is the only one speaking for us poor,

so DU will trash him.

Fuck it.... If the Dems don't want us poor folk, then they needed count on us anymore!!

:mad:

[treestar]

26. I agree there is a bigger issue but that we can't expect to

insist on all Democratic Candidates living some sort of idealized life that only those way out ahead of their time could. Such persons live on the fringes anyway, and would get torn apart as Presidential candidates.

They're all going to get criticized for anything they do but whoever is for some other candidate.

[mondo joe]

30. Edwards building this house didn't make anyone else poor.

And he could have gotten a much smaller property for a lot more money in some cities.

If I had his money I wouldn't build that large a house, but I might easily spend as much money on a city house.

[symbolman]

32. We've got a house in Hawaii

But guess what, WE GET TO PAY FOR IT.

We have to work our asses off, and let me tell you, there are plenty in our family that are Jealous as hell about it. If we sold this one, we might be able to buy four houses in the midwest or florida, etc.. and that's THEIR problem, it's not like we have this place to SPITE them or anything, my wife did well during the Web Bubble, and most of it is gone anyway from fighting the Bush Admin, but we still have to PAY for it, earn the money.

But we are willing to WORK for this because we LIKE living HERE. Plus I've got some health issues and it makes a big difference if I live in a warm, humid place.

Isn't this the land of the FREE? Where you work towards the american dream? You can have a big house and also do public works for the good of all men.

And to be honest about it, it's really a dump in a lot of ways, if I saw this house in Chicago or Alabama I'd walk the other way :)

Who's next, Barbara Streisand?

THIS is a DIVIDE AND CONQUER TACTIC, don't fall for it. They are pushing your Buttons.

Bush is in a Big House too, OUR WHITE HOUSE. Let's evict HIM.

[KoKo]

34. I wouldn't...but that doesn't mean that MY Choice should be Edwards Family

Except that there's an Hypocracy FACTOR with the Edwards that this whole thing has brought out.

Should we expect our Elected Officials to be Purer than WE ARE...or at least to be as PURE as the least of us who WOULD NOT BUILD SUCH A HOUSE..which seems based on "Presidential Expectations."

:shrug: I think it's a good thing to DISCUSS ..unlike many of my fellow Partisan DU'ers.

But...then...I'm not at this point...PARTISAN...so I will give them a break in that they feel they are defending against "FREEPERS." :shrug: