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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:00 PM Original message |
Cash for clunkers a bad deal, hurts the poor, and some other notes. |
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RUMMYisFROSTED (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:03 PM Response to Original message |
1. lol |
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babylonsister (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:05 PM Response to Original message |
2. Oi vey. |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:15 PM Response to Reply #2 |
13. huh? |
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orleans (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 04:36 PM Response to Reply #13 |
95. no. because i think there are so many fucking cars this is hardly |
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mkultra (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 04:53 PM Response to Reply #13 |
97. not if demand also decreases |
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mkultra (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 04:55 PM Response to Reply #97 |
98. This represents .2% of cars on the road |
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MNDemNY (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:07 PM Response to Original message |
3. Where is your bridge located? Must I answer 3 questions to cross it? |
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Ignis (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:19 PM Response to Reply #3 |
20. "What is your favorite color?" |
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Hutzpa (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:32 PM Response to Reply #20 |
36. dupe - delete wrong reply n/t |
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Hutzpa (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:33 PM Response to Reply #3 |
38. Would you like the BLUE pill or the RED pill??? |
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Enrique (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:08 PM Response to Original message |
4. a "disaster", eh? |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:16 PM Response to Reply #4 |
17. oh come on.. |
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orleans (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 04:37 PM Response to Reply #17 |
96. there are plenty of used cars around for the "poor" n/t |
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aquart (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:09 PM Response to Original message |
5. I have ant bait. I have roach traps. |
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wininboy (111 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:10 PM Response to Original message |
6. You need to study economics a bit more |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:18 PM Response to Reply #6 |
19. no you do.. |
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wininboy (111 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:24 PM Response to Reply #19 |
25. The old car is being replaced with one that has a greater value |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:28 PM Response to Reply #25 |
31. not neccessarily.. |
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wininboy (111 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:38 PM Response to Reply #31 |
41. Yes. Necesarily |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:18 PM Response to Reply #41 |
55. not flip-flopping at all.. |
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musette_sf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:38 PM Response to Reply #55 |
73. we have a "Chicago School" economics preacher here |
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wininboy (111 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 04:23 PM Response to Reply #55 |
91. Sure you are |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 07:10 PM Response to Reply #91 |
110. It's pretty straight-forward really. |
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armyowalgreens (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 05:11 PM Response to Reply #55 |
103. I don't think you know what "wealth" is in the first place. |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 07:08 PM Response to Reply #103 |
109. Fascinating.. |
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armyowalgreens (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 05:09 PM Response to Reply #25 |
102. This person doesn't sound like they like intervention in markets... |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 07:13 PM Response to Reply #102 |
111. somewhat true. |
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armyowalgreens (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-06-09 12:24 AM Response to Reply #111 |
118. Please stop using the phrase "welfare state"... |
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FrenchieCat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:11 PM Response to Original message |
7. Poor people breathe too! This Cash for Clunkers is not simply about |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:22 PM Response to Reply #7 |
21. OK.. |
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PA Democrat (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 04:08 PM Response to Reply #21 |
87. You cannot look at just one program in isolation. |
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armyowalgreens (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 05:18 PM Response to Reply #21 |
104. Yes, money is being taken from the rich and given to the middle and lower class... |
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dysfunctional press (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-06-09 01:19 PM Response to Reply #21 |
123. "But, there are much, much more efficient ways to boost the economy than this." |
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scheming daemons (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:11 PM Response to Original message |
8. "I don't post here much".... |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:24 PM Response to Reply #8 |
24. yeah well.. |
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hfojvt (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:27 PM Response to Reply #24 |
29. and it is probably silly to expect the average OK Democrat |
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Bill McBlueState (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:11 PM Response to Original message |
9. your points 1-3 might be interesting to discuss |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:25 PM Response to Reply #9 |
26. good point.. |
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AndyA (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:12 PM Response to Original message |
10. The clunker program is a bit short sighted. |
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BluePup (35 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:16 PM Response to Reply #10 |
16. Yep |
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SammyWinstonJack (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:23 PM Response to Reply #10 |
22. +1 |
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snooper2 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:47 PM Response to Reply #10 |
46. It sounds like you are "sad" for the clunkers |
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AndyA (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 04:20 PM Response to Reply #46 |
90. The damage done to the environment when these engines seize up and smoke and spew out pollutants |
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armyowalgreens (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 05:22 PM Response to Reply #90 |
107. BS. The entire cars are being crushed and recycled. |
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BobRossi (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:14 PM Response to Original message |
11. Yes, creating jobs bad, keeping the poor poor good. |
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sandnsea (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:14 PM Response to Original message |
12. You're right, but you're wrong |
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musette_sf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:15 PM Response to Original message |
14. this is a libertarian/repube meme: |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:32 PM Response to Reply #14 |
34. So you disagree with the point? |
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musette_sf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:40 PM Response to Reply #34 |
43. no, i think you're not a Democrat, |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:21 PM Response to Reply #43 |
56. well.. |
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musette_sf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:25 PM Response to Reply #56 |
58. your post is a classic example of tortured libertarian "logic" |
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Name removed (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:26 PM Response to Reply #58 |
60. Deleted message |
musette_sf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:30 PM Response to Reply #60 |
62. ah, running away, |
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Raineyb (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:42 PM Response to Reply #34 |
76. I think you reveal your bias when you discuss this in terms of the supply |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:47 PM Response to Reply #76 |
80. huh? |
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Raineyb (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 04:25 PM Response to Reply #80 |
92. You have it backwards. The price doesn't go up because there's a decrease in supply. |
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JuniperLea (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:15 PM Response to Original message |
15. Hahaha! |
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Minimus (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:18 PM Response to Original message |
18. "Now, not all people with high FICO scores are wealthy, but on balance they are." |
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wininboy (111 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:27 PM Response to Reply #18 |
30. My FICO is over 700 and I haven't worked in 5 years. |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:33 PM Response to Reply #18 |
37. that's a good point.. |
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hfojvt (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:23 PM Response to Original message |
23. too many notes |
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musette_sf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:25 PM Response to Original message |
27. THIS IS A RON PAUL MEME |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:35 PM Response to Reply #27 |
39. I wasn't aware of that.. |
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musette_sf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:41 PM Response to Reply #39 |
45. i call BS |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:22 PM Response to Reply #45 |
57. Do you have ESP? |
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musette_sf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:28 PM Response to Reply #57 |
61. keep squirming Paulbot |
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Ikonoklast (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:14 PM Original message |
Ron Paul also likes to eat, breathe, and drink water. |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:25 PM Response to Original message |
59. huh? |
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musette_sf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:37 PM Response to Reply #59 |
71. the Von Mises Fan Club |
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musette_sf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:40 PM Response to Original message |
75. + 1 and thank you for your post. |
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Freddie Stubbs (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:57 PM Response to Reply #27 |
49. So was opposition to the war in Iraq |
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musette_sf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:00 PM Response to Reply #49 |
50. Ron Paul did not start or own opposition to the Iraq War |
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Freddie Stubbs (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:07 PM Response to Reply #50 |
53. So perhaps he is right about the Cash for Clunkers program also |
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musette_sf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:31 PM Response to Reply #53 |
63. i don't think so |
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rhett o rick (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Aug-07-09 01:59 PM Response to Reply #53 |
125. Do you support the Cash for Clunkers? Or do you just like to disrupt? Go to any town hall meetings |
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musette_sf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:00 PM Response to Reply #49 |
51. Ron Paul did not start or own opposition to the Iraq War |
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reflection (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:27 PM Response to Original message |
28. Are the clunkers actually being "destroyed"? |
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MNDemNY (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:30 PM Response to Reply #28 |
32. Engines are disabled. parts other than engine and drivetrain may be recycled. |
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reflection (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:32 PM Response to Reply #32 |
35. Thanks. |
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lumberjack_jeff (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 05:20 PM Response to Reply #32 |
106. Everything that is not sold within 30 days must be crushed. n/t |
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kcass1954 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-06-09 12:34 AM Response to Reply #28 |
119. The dealers in South Florida are sitting on them for now. |
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Greyhound (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:31 PM Response to Original message |
33. You might like to read this. |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:36 PM Response to Reply #33 |
40. thanks.. I agree.. |
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hugo_from_TN (895 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:38 PM Response to Original message |
42. It's not even good for the environment |
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letmebefrank (14 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:43 PM Response to Reply #42 |
77. Good for the environment? |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:51 PM Response to Reply #77 |
81. It's hard to quantify the price efffect |
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hugo_from_TN (895 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 05:06 PM Response to Reply #77 |
100. The point is that the 287 gallons of gas saved per year |
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armyowalgreens (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 05:30 PM Response to Reply #42 |
108. I don't think that applies across the board. |
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snooper2 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:41 PM Response to Original message |
44. wrong... |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:32 PM Response to Reply #44 |
64. was just in dallas! fun time. |
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musette_sf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:35 PM Response to Reply #64 |
67. - 1 |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:37 PM Response to Reply #67 |
72. please quote.. |
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musette_sf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:39 PM Response to Reply #72 |
74. i'm not apologizing |
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gmoney (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:53 PM Response to Original message |
47. There are PLENTY of beat up old cars in the marketplace |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:33 PM Response to Reply #47 |
65. and? |
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Raineyb (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-06-09 10:11 AM Response to Reply #65 |
120. You've got it all wrong. |
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abumbyanyothername (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 02:55 PM Response to Original message |
48. Without getting into economic theory |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:36 PM Response to Reply #48 |
70. Well ok.. |
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abumbyanyothername (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:54 PM Response to Reply #70 |
82. Because it doesn't serve their self-interest |
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jpak (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:05 PM Response to Original message |
52. what a stupid post |
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musette_sf (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:36 PM Response to Reply #52 |
69. and the OP is a card-carrying member of the Ayn Rand cult |
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armyowalgreens (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 05:20 PM Response to Reply #69 |
105. Yep. Anytime preaches about "markets", they are a closest randian... |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 07:17 PM Response to Reply #105 |
112. as opposed to what? |
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armyowalgreens (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-06-09 12:17 AM Response to Reply #112 |
117. Take a history class. It will do you good. |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-06-09 10:17 AM Response to Reply #117 |
121. I'm not sure what you mean. |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:43 PM Response to Reply #52 |
78. I'm all for stimulating the economy.. |
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jpak (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:54 PM Response to Reply #78 |
84. Clue #1 - they ARE spending stimulus money on roads and bridges. |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 04:00 PM Response to Reply #84 |
86. ??? |
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jpak (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 04:13 PM Response to Reply #86 |
88. Clue #5 - government intervention into the financial industry saved us from full economic collapse |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 07:22 PM Response to Reply #88 |
113. I disagre |
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Iggo (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:14 PM Response to Original message |
54. On second thought... |
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Spike89 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:34 PM Response to Original message |
66. Negligible effect on supply of used cars |
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Raineyb (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 07:38 PM Response to Reply #66 |
116. I made a similar point earlier. I suspect you'll be hearing a lot of crickets |
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Politicalboi (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:35 PM Response to Original message |
68. This program cash for clunkers isn't going to go on forever |
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MadHound (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:46 PM Response to Original message |
79. Actually this is fairly classical Keynsian economics |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:58 PM Response to Reply #79 |
85. a few points.. |
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MadHound (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 04:18 PM Response to Reply #85 |
89. The thing is, this money isn't being spent on holes, it's being spent on cars |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 07:25 PM Response to Reply #89 |
114. well. |
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Beaverhausen (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 03:54 PM Response to Original message |
83. I have a FICO score over 800 and I am NOT wealthy |
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mkultra (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Fri Aug-07-09 02:02 PM Response to Reply #83 |
126. income has nothing to do with your credit |
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Gidney N Cloyd (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 04:32 PM Response to Original message |
93. If the clunkers weren't traded in for new cars they'd mostly remain with the current owners |
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G_j (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 04:34 PM Response to Original message |
94. I'd like to see a clunker for clunker set up |
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proud patriot (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 04:56 PM Response to Original message |
99. I take it you don't know anyone who's job depends on car sales |
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naaman fletcher (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 07:27 PM Response to Reply #99 |
115. so? |
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armyowalgreens (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed Aug-05-09 05:07 PM Response to Original message |
101. You couldn't have picked a more successful program to hate. Good job. |
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enviralment (71 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-06-09 01:09 PM Response to Reply #101 |
122. HAHAH |
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divideandconquer (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu Aug-06-09 01:34 PM Response to Reply #122 |
124. What about tens of thousands of safer cars on the roads replacing unsafe SUV's? |
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