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Catholic bishops assisting Ben Nelson in drafting abortion amendment in Senate.

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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 02:21 PM
Original message
Catholic bishops assisting Ben Nelson in drafting abortion amendment in Senate.
Nelson said he ordinarily doesn't "draw lines in the sand", but he was drawing one now over abortion. He and Orrin Hatch seem to have plenty of help drafting their bill from the committee of Catholic Bishops.

Abortion battle could derail health bill

Nelson certainly has a long history of agitating his party by withholding his vote until he wrings out every last concession from Senate leaders. But on the uncompromising issue of abortion, Democrats fear he may really be serious this time.

“There is a worry that Sen. Nelson means business,” said a senior Senate Democratic aide, who spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss strategy. “Unlike with public option, there is very little ground liberal Democrats are willing to give on this issue. Abortion, not the public option, may be the cause of our first official defection.”

The United States Conference of Catholic Bishops, which proved highly influential in the House health care debate, is assisting Nelson and Sen. Orrin Hatch (R-Utah) in drafting an anti-abortion amendment, and its representatives are meeting with senators, including Byron Dorgan (D-N.D.).

The bishops have also sent a nationwide bulletin insert to its parishes for Sunday Mass, according to a source familiar with the plans. The conference rallied parishioners in a similar way ahead of the House vote. The bishops conference didn’t return calls seeking comment.


In fact Nelson has said that the bill is not finished, that anti-choice groups need more time to review it.

To be fair, Hatch was "there" first. He offered a version of the Stupak Amendment to the evolving health reform bill in committee this past summer. It failed.

For his part, Nelson said that the amendment’s language was not finished, and that groups opposed to abortion — notably the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops — needed more time to review it.

So there we are ladies: Your lives in the hands of the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops, a small group of men who don't even represent the majority of their own faith much less the majority of Americans.

And the Senators in question are not even shy about admitting it.


Both parties openly admitted the bishops played an active role in getting the Stupak amendment passed.

Both parties credit Catholic Bishops for the inclusion of the Stupak amendment.

Both sides credited a forceful lobbying effort by Roman Catholic bishops with the success of the provision, inserted in the bill under pressure from conservative Democrats.

The provision would apply only to insurance policies purchased with the federal subsidies that the health legislation would create to help low- and middle-income people, and to policies sold by a government-run insurance plan that would be created by the legislation.

Abortion rights advocates charged Sunday that the provision threatened to deprive women of abortion coverage because insurers would drop the procedure from their plans in order to sell them in the newly expanded market of people receiving subsidies.


It would appear that the Catholic groups, the anti-choice groups, have more access to Congress than pro-choice groups do.

Our traditional pro-choice advocates such as NARAL and Planned Parenthood either were denied the same access to our Democratic majority or were caught unaware of the power of the opposition.



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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 02:39 PM
Response to Original message
1. fuckabunchabishops fuckemall
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BrklynLiberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 03:42 PM
Response to Reply #1
12. +100!!!!!!!!!
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howmad1 Donating Member (959 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 09:39 PM
Response to Reply #1
26. The only reason the bishops are against abortion........
.....is because they need more kids to sexually abuse. Plain and simple!
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TheMadMonk Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 11:32 PM
Response to Reply #26
28. Total bullshit and not even funny. The real reason is to maintain the underclasses.
In the greater scheme of medical things, abortion is cheap. But not so cheap that it is affordable to the lowest income groups. By denying them abortion it serves to keep family sizes at the lowest end of the socioeconomic ladder larger than average, which in turn serves to make it exceedingly dificult for such families to move up in the world and for parents to give their kids a better start in life than they might have had.

Denying abortion; taking funds from the worst performing schools; failing to provide decent community infrastructure; and in dozens of other ways, the whole idea is to maintain a large pool of minimum wage pesantry to exploit for maximum profit.

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sorrowspath Donating Member (56 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-06-09 01:00 AM
Response to Reply #28
31. Agree 110 percent
Remember that stunt they tried to pull in DC in which they will stop their social services just because they oppose gay marriage? Using the poor as weapons.
Actually, I think this is the vision of the Catholic Church for the country



^ Banned contraceptives, restrict abortion and let the population increase uncontrolled.



^ Use the poor against the government.Blame government for poverty.With the government unable to support the whole population. That's where there "charities" come in(which is nothing but a fraction of the money they absorb).Government makes laws that are against Catholic church teachings,church threatens to stop social services.People get hungry and since government cannot provide by themselves,people who have no access to family planning blames the government for it's incompetence despite the fact that the church has a hand in making population unmanageable.

My wife is from a third world Catholic country where endorsing condoms is ex communicable.



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MNDemNY Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-06-09 11:15 AM
Response to Reply #28
33. No, i'll stick with the "kids to abuse meme."
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AllentownJake Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 02:40 PM
Response to Original message
2. Henry the VIII had the courage to confiscate their land nt.
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Smarmie Doofus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 02:41 PM
Response to Original message
3. church W A L L state: where is it? nt
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PeaceNikki Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 02:43 PM
Response to Original message
4. Thanks for posting this. We need to keep religious beliefs out of our health care reform.
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 02:59 PM
Response to Reply #4
5. They are almost writing the laws now.
It is just scary, and dangerous.
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krabigirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 08:11 PM
Response to Reply #5
20. I think they have been for quite some time.
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NC_Nurse Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 03:31 PM
Response to Original message
6. Whatever happened to separation of church and state? Can we at least TAX
them now?
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Nikki Stone1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 03:33 PM
Response to Original message
7. Another reason to trash this bill.
Sorry, but I've had it with this thing. The fact that the CATHOLIC CHURCH can have input into women's health is just stunning.
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nutshell2002 Donating Member (170 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-06-09 12:00 AM
Response to Reply #7
30. What's next?
Their input on child protection legislation.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 03:35 PM
Response to Original message
8. How many Supreme Court justices are Catholic?
You know, I never regarded it as a problem, but with the Church influencing gay rights policy and abortion policy, I am getting a little worried here.
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Nikki Stone1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 03:41 PM
Response to Reply #8
10. Scalia, Alito, Kennedy, Thomas, Sotomayor, Roberts
6?
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Odin2005 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 03:40 PM
Response to Original message
9. TAX THEM!!!
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Nikki Stone1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 03:41 PM
Response to Reply #9
11. Including their overseas accounts
.
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kenny blankenship Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 09:42 PM
Response to Reply #9
27. deport them
Since they represent the Vatican, push them out there.
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Odin2005 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-06-09 11:27 AM
Response to Reply #27
35. Good idea!
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Tierra_y_Libertad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 03:44 PM
Response to Original message
13.  "Congress shall make no law regarding the establishment of religion..."
Apparently, Ben was too busy reading the bible to read the constitution.
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Arugula Latte Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 03:46 PM
Response to Original message
14. This makes me sick.
This is not a theocracy -- at least it's not supposed to be. Get that miserable, corrupt, misogynist piece of shit church out of our government.

:grr:
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madfloridian Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 05:47 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. These are Democrats giving them power.
It makes me ill as well.
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mnhtnbb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-06-09 01:19 PM
Response to Reply #15
38. You have to understand Nebraska. Lincoln is in one of the most
right wing dioceses in the country. The town is at least 40% Catholic--and they live in
fear of their Bishop.

Ben Nelson is placating a huge portion of his constituency by catering to the Catholic Church.

Who's going to stand up to him and to the Catholic Church? None of the powers that be
have the cajones to them on. It's a damn shame.
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walldude Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 05:50 PM
Response to Original message
16. So there is a line in the sand.. on this side are pro-choicers and on the other
side are Ben Nelson, Orrin Hatch and a cabal of pedophiles and the people who protect them. Gee I think choosing sides on this one ought to be pretty easy.
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shadowknows69 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 07:05 PM
Response to Reply #16
17. One would think. Our party has been seriously infiltrated by harmful elements
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Scruffy1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-06-09 09:54 AM
Response to Reply #17
32. Our party?
The democratic leadership doesn't give a shit what we think. Ben Nelson doesn't give a shit about abortion either, he just wants some right wing votes next time around from the fundy nut cases in Nebraska. The leaders know the average voter is an uninformed idiot and will vote on one or two hot button issues like this.
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shadowknows69 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-06-09 12:48 PM
Response to Reply #32
36. Yeah, that's pretty much what I was saying.
Bad elements, as in, doesn't stand on our party principles for shit. Spineless, sell-outs, DINOs; any number of similar adjectives will do.
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liberal N proud Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 07:29 PM
Response to Original message
18. Doesn't that violate a few federal tax laws relating to separation
of church and state?

Someone needs to pursue this and revoke their tax free status with the IRS.
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spanone Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 07:32 PM
Response to Original message
19. separation of church & state?
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krabigirl Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 08:12 PM
Response to Original message
21. Fcuk the Catholic Church. Hateful, bigoted, pedophile freaks.
Tax them to death.
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laughingliberal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 08:34 PM
Response to Original message
22. yeah, welcome to theocracy nt
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placton Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 09:12 PM
Response to Original message
23. I grew up Catholic, and even spent a couple years in seminary
Edited on Sat Dec-05-09 09:13 PM by placton
but I left long ago, once it became clear that John XXIII was merely a blip on the fascist face of the Church. My God, these people still get tax free status?

On NARAL and PP? They have been in the veal pen for longer than I care to remember.
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winyanstaz Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 09:19 PM
Response to Original message
24. Take the Catholic churces tax exempt status away NOW damn it!
Helping to draft legislation? A CLEAR VIOLATION ......where the hell are officers that will uphold the law when you need one?
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KakistocracyHater Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 09:21 PM
Response to Original message
25. well they did say Pisces rules the 'feet' & back then it was slang for genitals
perhaps I heard it from Bible Geek, I don't recall. It should be obvious by now, they are obsessed. That site I put in a comment says birth control is "against God's will"-how did they come to that conclusion? A direct challenge is in order, why not begin asking them what is so evil about preventing conceptions? What is spiritual about physically giving birth, just like other mammals?
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Orrex Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Dec-05-09 11:33 PM
Response to Original message
29. Tax the church.
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still_one Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-06-09 11:26 AM
Response to Original message
34. It is way past due to take away the tax exemption for Catholic churches, or ANY denomination
that dictates policy to the U.S. government



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mnhtnbb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-06-09 01:14 PM
Response to Original message
37. Where is Henry VIII when we need him?
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vadawg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-06-09 01:20 PM
Response to Reply #37
39. you dont need a king, all you need is to put up a politician who will attack the Catholic church
and then watch as the Catholic Dems move over to the repubs enmasse, this all comes down to numbers in the end, the Catholic block is big enough to make politicians take notice of what Catholics think... Same as any other block of people in the US, if your big enough then the politicians have to think how their votes will effect your votes...
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mnhtnbb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-06-09 01:24 PM
Response to Reply #39
41. Which is why you need a King.
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vadawg Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-06-09 01:49 PM
Response to Reply #41
43. what if the king you get isnt the one you want or expect
or what if he goes along with you on everything but your right to live, then your screwed. Dont get me wrong im a royalist at heart but you have to take the good with the bad...
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Hawkeye-X Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-06-09 01:23 PM
Response to Original message
40. Ben Nelson needs to be sent to the ethics committee
and thrown out of the Senate.

He has no business dealing with the church. He's violating the separation of church and state.
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mnhtnbb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sun Dec-06-09 01:25 PM
Response to Reply #40
42. And who's going to take him to task? Harry Reid? That spineless wimp?
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