I stand with Keith O. I will not...actually cannot afford to...

[YvonneCa]

...purchase health insurance if mandated by this bill. I am really glad to hear him say he will not buy it. Once again, he speaks for 'we who have no voice'.

Thank you, Keith!

[Mari333]

1. yes he spoke eloquently tonight!

and stood his ground.

Loved it and thank god someone spoke for us.

[YvonneCa]

8. ...

:hug:

[Raine]

2. Me too ... 100% behind KO & Dean nt

[leftstreet]

3. K&R

[Subdivisions]

4. I will not pay for it either. I cannot afford it. n/t

[YvonneCa]

13. THAT is a point that must be made. What do people do if...

...they really can't afford it? That saying, "You can't get blood from a turnip," applies. :7

[ljm2002]

32. Re: "You can't get blood from a turnip"...

...a few years ago, I was unemployed (for the first and only time in my adult life) for 15 months. I was living off savings, and soon enough those also became depleted. Eventually it was down to paying for rent, food and utilities and shining on the credit cards, insurance and car payments.

So I get yet another call from one of the credit card companies -- or one of those collections agencies they hire, I don't really remember. But anyway, the guy starts trying to pressure me, and I tell him "You know what, I don't have the money. I just don't have it. You can't squeeze blood from a turnip." And he replies, "Ma'am, you are not a vegetable."

Honestly, I had to laugh. It was just so bizarre, so surreal, so un-fucking-believable to be having that conversation with some little twerp half my age who felt fine about pressuring me to cough up money I did not have, I had to laugh so I wouldn't cry.

Anyway, as far as your question goes, I know there will be folks here who say "But those people will be subsidized." Well, no, not always. Some of those people will be "above the poverty level" by enough that they won't get any subsidies. Usually it's the people right on the dividing line who get hit the worst with mandates like this: they make too much for the subsidies, but don't really have extra money for things like health insurance. Especially when the premiums will take up to 15%, maybe even 17% of their income. That is a hefty chunk of change, and that is just to have a policy. If they want actual health care, there are still deductibles and co-pays to shell out.

It's a crying shame that we have a bottomless pit of money for the endless wars we engage in, but we don't have money for services to our own citizens -- ourselves. The powers that be have succeeded in dividing us against ourselves, and we don't even see it.

It's class warfare, folks. The more the stooges at the top complain that we on the bottom are engaging in "class warfare", the more you know that is exactly what they are doing. Because they always, a.l.w.a.y.s accuse us of the very thing that they are doing.

[asdjrocky]

5. Jail ain't nothing to me.

Hell, I'll get some health care there.

[Nite Owl]

10. See, there is a

public option!

Sad state of affairs we got. So much for all that hope.

[OneGrassRoot]

16. LOL! There's an ad in there somewhere.....

Jail being the public option.

Sad as it is...

:(

[notadmblnd]

6. I've been wondering

What's to stop employers from dropping their employer provided health care and forcing people into the new program/giveaway to health insurance companies?

[LooseWilly]

19. Employers were dropping employees anyway... this will just make it easier on the conscience.

And, depending on the pay... they may well not (probably won't) qualify for a subsidy...

[stray cat]

7. Those who will get it free or heavily subsidized will be much better off than currently

However, it could be difficult for those who get no subsidies. For those who are excluded from coverage or those who purchase it out of pocket without a group would also likely be much better off.

[county worker]

15. The subsidies will not last forever. At some point a Congress will take them away.

Remember Clinton and welfare reform? Don't even give them the chance, turn this bill down!

[LooseWilly]

18. I look forward to learning the ins and outs of the paperwork required for receipt of subsidies.

I look forward to the bureaucratic interface.

I am all aflutter wondering if the subsidies will be in the form of direct payments that I don't have to hassle over, or if they will take the form of my being responsible for paying, and then filling out a form each month and waiting for a reimbursement check.

I look forward to finding out how many extra copies I need of my tax forms in order to submit them to another government agency in order to prove my qualifications (or disqualifications) for a subsidy.

I look forward to wondering each year whether or not "Health Care Subsidy Reform" (a la Welfare Reform) will be the next big issue for the Congress to tackle.

I look forward to watching the race between rising Private Health Insurance Rates, and Cost of Living increases for subsidies.

I look forward to seeing if the subsidies cover extra fees, deductibles... and hearing stories about ceilings beyond coverage.

I look forward to hearing about the Federal Government passing laws limiting how overweight citizens can be, like helmet laws, and seatbelt laws, in order to cover the costs of subsidies (not to mention protect insurance industry profits).

I look forward to looking forward in vain to refund checks from the insurance industry when, at the end of the year, they haven't used all of the reputed 90 cents on the dollar that is supposed to be spent on actual health care.

Ohh... these rumored subsidies are gonna be exciting...

[county worker]

9. We are in good company. My guess is that DU will turn against this bill.

I only makes sense. Listen to rational thinking. Politicians supporting the Senate bill do not have our best interests at heart.

It is better we do nothing than to pass this bill. If people can't understand that, well they can't understand it. Forcing us to buy go into the belly of the whale is not heath care reform!

[LooseWilly]

11. Alas, no cable means I gotta wait for the internets posting... (But I'm not purchasing...)

I wonder if it even crosses politicians minds that the tax penalties (well, assuming my income reaches taxable levels) are pretty much gonna burn through monies I might otherwise have used for political contributions.

Hope no other splendiferous candidates in the future are banking on internet contributions from the grass roots to fuel outsider campaigns...

[Warpy]

12. It is a faulty product

and I will be a scofflaw, too, especially since I'm old and will have my premiums jacked up to the stratosphere while they refuse to pay a dime for any medical condition they can pretend has something to do with my pre existing one, which is most of them.

I won't pay one dime to fatten the insurance industry. There, I've said it.

Without significant reform, they simply don't deserve to stay in business and they will stand in the way of any health care I might need.

I'd be dead right now if I'd had to spend an hour on the phone last summer, haggling with some bean counter over an ER trip when I was clearly going into shock.

That's the bottom line with me. The insurance industry wants me dead. I'm not ready to comply.

[girl gone mad]

14. I didn't see Keith's program tonight, but

I have always said that I will refuse to purchase mandated private health insurance, on moral grounds. I would prefer to spend my money on lawyers to fight it. All the way to the SC, if necessary.

[Adj_of_Denver]

17. I will stand with KO, even if I would qualify for a poverty subsidy

Even if I am in the area where I would get a government subsidy to buy health insurance, I will not buy it. Not with the bill as it stands today.

Ultimately, 700 bucks in fines is probably cheaper than what I could get health insurance for, even without copays.

[YvonneCa]

22. Welcome to DU. n/t

[StarfarerBill]

20. Ditto,

As I said in another thread, a year or two of insurance isn't going to do me much good if I'm bankrupted afterward.

[jennyjuniper]

21. Yes! I stand with Keith too!

... and with Howard Dean. They are speaking for us. Let's let them know we will stand with them. I will drop my insurance if this bill goes through.

[tomm2thumbs]

23. Rachel was right, it was no doubt hard to do that, but he was passionately on spot!

It's like Davy Crockett used to say ' Be sure you're right, then go ahead'

He's right, and he has that on his side.

[YvonneCa]

24. Keith has integrity. And he calls on it...

...at critical moments....critical moments for us. He has my greatest respect.

[anigbrowl]

25. He doesn't have to, his employer provides it.

Besides, Keith Olberman can probably afford the out-of-pocket costs without really blinking. I am also against a mandated insurance bill, but the guy is a talking head on TV FFS, he doesn't give a warm one whether you stand with him or not.

[YvonneCa]

26. We disagree. n/t

[Tracer]

31. Keith said that he is a "Self Pay".

I take this to mean that he doesn't have any health insurance, but pays the bills by himself. He's plenty rich enough to do so.

Also, plenty rich enough to pay whatever fine comes attached to NOT purchasing health insurance.

This is a stand that not many people could take.

[jtrockville]

27. First do no harm.

[TheWebHead]

28. could you have afforded a public plan insurance premium?

and if not, did you make a peep about it before tonight?

[eridani]

29. I could afford the $125/month single payer cost n/t

[YvonneCa]

30. I don't know. The details of an actual bill continue...

...to be vague...and shift daily. As to the timing of my concern :), it has only recently become clear there will be little competition (PO or buy in) to make premiums go down. To afford health care, I need premiums to go DOWN.