Can I get help finding the stat for PBAs done on "healthy" infants?

[flying_monkeys]

I need to write a LTTE to refute a ridiculous claim that the majority are performed on healthy fetuses....


(I am SO disappointed in that columnist! She is usually a bit more *true* with her words....)


Thanks!

[dorktv]

1. what is a PBA?

[uppityperson]

3. partial birth abortions. Kick because I 'd like to see too.

[dorktv]

6. Oh, well there was a good article a while back in the New Yorker

that explained that when it was created it was because this was doctors trying to let the moms have a last chance with a baby they wanted desperately but for whatever reason were unable to have.

[Dogmudgeon]

4. Partial Birth Abortion

So-called.

Medically, an "intact dilation and extraction". Very rarely done -- and now illegal.

--p!

[T Wolf]

5. Professional Bowlers Association is the only thing I can think of -

though, the OP might be thinking of the late-term pregnancy medical procedure that the Christists have managed to get outlawed. They like to refer to it as a partial birth abortion because that pushes their own psychotic button and is good for raising money from the Handmaid's Tale wannabes.

Do not aid them by adopting their language.

[dorktv]

7. yes, that is stupid...and lame of them.

[Dogmudgeon]

2. Don't "refute" it ...

... simply demand to know where she got her "facts".

If a journalist can't back his/her opinions up with evidence, that usually is bad news -- bad career nows.

A concise LTTE accusing her of journalistic fraud would be an excellent blow against this sort of lying.

--p!

[Breeze54]

8. Do you mean -- Intact dilation and extraction ?

PBA is a NON-Medical term!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intact_dilation_and_extraction

Intact dilation and extraction (IDX or Intact D&X), is a surgical abortion wherein an
intact fetus is removed from the womb via the cervix. The procedure may also be used
to remove a deceased fetus (due to a miscarriage) that is developed enough to require
dilation of the cervix for its extraction.

Though the procedure has a low rate of usage, representing 0.17% of all abortions in the US in 2000
according to voluntary responses to an Alan Guttmacher Institute survey it has developed into
a focal point of the abortion debate.

Partial-birth abortion (PBA) is a non-medical term used to refer to some late-term abortion procedures.

[sandnsea]

9. Please add

Now that the D&X has been outlawed, doctors will be forced to perform D&E's which is tantamount to fetal dismemberment.

[flying_monkeys]

13. You betcha I will :)

I am also going to suggest that, since the USSC and the Administration are now BETTER THAN DOCTORS for determining health care issues, that we should all consult them for ALL of our health needs in the future since they, apparently, know best :)



"Excuse me, Justice Scalia? I have this bad cough and I was wondering, what should I take for it?"

[flying_monkeys]

10. *I* know the term is made-up, but it is what she used.

She also stated they are performed on "majority healthy fetuses".


Come on, feed me a study so I can bury her - - please!!!!

[uppityperson]

11. guttmacher has statistics

http://www.guttmacher.org/sections/abortion.php?scope=U.S.%20specific

Try googling abortion incidence.

[mzteris]

12. info links

http://www.guttmacher.org/statecenter/spibs/spib_BPBA.pdf

http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/ib13.html

http://www.guttmacher.org/pubs/tgr/01/6/gr010606.html

http://www.kff.org/womenshealth/upload/Abortion-in-the-U-S-Fact-Sheet.pdf

[uppityperson]

14. 2003 from CDC

http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/ss5511a1.htm?s_cid=ss5511a1_e

Results: A total of 848,163 legal induced abortions were reported to CDC for 2003 from 49 reporting areas, representing a 0.7% decline from the 854,122 legal induced abortions reported by 49 reporting areas for 2002. The abortion ratio, defined as the number of abortions per 1,000 live births, was 241 in 2003, a decrease from the 246 in 2002. The abortion rate was 16 per 1,000 women aged 15--44 years for 2003, the same as for 2002. For the same 47 reporting areas, the abortion rate remained relatively constant during 1998--2003. During 2001--2002 (the most recent years for which data are available), 15 women died as a result of complications from known legal induced abortion. One death was associated with known illegal abortion.

The highest percentages of reported abortions were for women who were unmarried (82%), white (55%), and aged <25 years (51%). Of all abortions for which gestational age was reported, 61% were performed at <8 weeks' gestation and 88% at <13 weeks. From 1992 (when detailed data regarding early abortions were first collected) through 2002, steady increases have occurred in the percentage of abortions performed at <6 weeks' gestation, with a slight decline in 2003. A limited number of abortions were obtained at >15 weeks' gestation, including 4.2% at 16--20 weeks and 1.4% at >21 weeks. A total of 36 reporting areas submitted data documenting that they performed and enumerated medical (nonsurgical) procedures, making up 8.0% of all known reported procedures from the 45 areas with adequate reporting on type of procedure.

(clip)
The type of abortion procedure was categorized as curettage (including suction and/or sharp curettage at any gestational age and reported separately for <12 weeks and >12 weeks), intrauterine instillation, medical (nonsurgical) abortion (methotrexate and misoprostol, or mifepristone and misoprostol were reported for abortions performed at <8 weeks' gestation; vaginal prostaglandins were primarily reported for abortions performed at later weeks of gestation), and procedures described as other (including hysterectomy and hysterotomy) (more clipping)

There is a chart down the page that gives #s and types. Won't let me copy it. Tables 1 and 18. 18 gives means, curettage, instillation, medical, other (including hysterectomy) But they still don't say if D&X or D&E.

[Breeze54]

17. I heard on the news it was

2500 total a year PBA...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intact_dilation_and_extraction

Late-term abortions (abortions at 21 weeks or later) account for 1.4% of all abortions in the USA.

Intact D&X procedures are used in approximately 15% of late-term abortion cases.

This calculates to between 2,500 and 3,000 per year, using data from the Alan Guttmacher Institute for the year 2000.

They are typically performed between the twentieth and twenty-fourth week of gestation

[Igel]

15. If you find the stats, I'd like to see them, too.

Nobody above actually answered you; I looked at the Guttmacher pages till my eyes crossed (not a difficult thing to achieve) but they don't make the distinction between fetuses that would be viable and fairly normal and those that would either die almost at once or otherwise have some debilitating condition. The distinction they draw are between different types of abortion.

I've heard everything from "none are done on healthy fetus" to the "majority are done on healthy fetuses", from the Guttmacher's reported number (what, about 3k?) to extrapolations based on some advocate's reading of the details in Guttmacher's report (well over 30k).

[flying_monkeys]

16. Vet this LTTE, please?

"Irresponsible Journalism"


"Kathleen Parker's column suggesting that most abortions using Intact Dilation and Extraction involve "healthy babies" is completely erroneous. Most of the fetuses aborted are very much WANTED fetuses that have horrible issues incompatible with life that aren't discovered until after the midway point. Late term abortions are less than 1% of *all* abortions performed in the US - - and they usually involve tragic conditions, like fetuses who's heads are expanded BEYOND an adult head's circumference, or brains that never developed and have partially finished skulls without the top and will die upon delivery, or fetuses with things like Trisomy 3 that would render them dead in a day. These are NOT "healthy babies" being aborted!


Thanks to the recent decision by the Supreme Court, these fetuses can now be aborted by being dismembered instead (causing great risk to the Mother, in terms of retained tissue causing infection) or delivered via C-section (also a great risk to the Mother) - - but these fetuses will *STILL* be aborted anyway, just in a less safe way.


I guess the Mother's safety isn't an issue, so long as we protect that (unhealthy) fetus, eh?


And the HUGE majority of those fetuses are very much unhealthy."

[flying_monkeys]

18. Kicking for ideas....

Thanks!

[uppityperson]

19. Good letter, minor typo corrections

"Irresponsible Journalism"


"Kathleen Parker's column suggesting that most abortions using Intact Dilation and Extraction involve "healthy babies" is completely erroneous. Most of the fetuses aborted are very much WANTED fetuses that have horrible issues incompatible with life that aren't discovered until after the midway point. Late term abortions are less than 1% of *all* abortions performed in the US - - and they usually involve tragic conditions, like fetuses who'swhose heads are expanded BEYOND an adult head's circumference, or brains that never developed and have partially finished skulls without the top and will die upon delivery, or fetuses with things like Trisomy 3 that would render them dead in a day. These are NOT "healthy babies" being aborted!


Thanks to the recent decision by the Supreme Court, these fetuses can now be aborted by being dismembered instead (causing great risk to the Mother, in terms of retained tissue causing infection) or delivered via C-section (also a great risk to the Mother) - - but these fetuses will *STILL* be aborted anyway, just in a less safe way.


I guess the Mother's safety isn't an issue, so long as we protect that (unhealthy) fetus, eh?


And the HUGE majority of those fetuses are very much unhealthy."
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

1 word change (who's to whose) and delete the last line, leave it at "(unhealthy) fetus, eh?" You were civil, better than I do. Perhaps her opinion of "healthy" is different than mine. Good job.