The Senate and its rules are the problem but it's the President's fault?

[moondust]

How does that work?

[MineralMan]

1. Well, you see, you're making sense, but that's not proper

when people are incensed and ready to blame individuals. And which individual is the President? Why, it's Obama. Therefore, whatever happens, in whatever branch of government, even if it is equal to the Executive Branch and separate from it, is Obama's fault.

Making sense is not the answer. Blind rage will win every time.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

2. Bunch of white guys screw up...

blame the black guy.

[racaulk]

4. Yeah, that must be it.

:eyes:

[cali]

12. yes, yes. any criticism of Obama is racist at the root.

pathetic.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

13. I didn't say any.

Just saying Postman was the tip of the iceberg.

Interesting how you got defensive though.

[AllentownJake]

3. Make them filibuster nt.

[iceman66]

5. HARRY REID is the problem.

The republicans are abusing the Senate rules by fillibustering everything. That is not how the system was designed to work.

Reid could respond in kind by threatening to go to reconciliation, but he's too much of a wimp.

[DailyGrind51]

15. "Reconciliation" can only apply to budgetary stuff, they could still hack apart protections against

rescission, denying coverage for pre-existing conditions, discriminatory billing practices, etc. Dropping the age of Medicare is the only aspect of the bill that could really be passed through reconciliation.

[tekisui]

6. He is the leader of the majority party, and he has not led.

And, he does take ownership of every law he signs, as all Presidents do. You can't have it both ways.

[moondust]

7. What exactly constitutes "leadership" on this?

Twisting arms? Carrots and sticks? Something else that Harry Reid cannot do in his capacity as majority leader?

[tekisui]

9. Yes, yes and yes.

Knock heads and break knuckles. Starting with Reid. Make him shape up. Make him threaten and follow through. Take away chairmenships, withhold support on pet projects. Reid does what Obama and Rahm ask him to do. He plays it how he is told by the Party leader.

[moondust]

11. See #10.

[tekisui]

14. For one the the Senate is closer to the WH.

And, the House did a fine job, give him credit for it. He will take the credit on any final bill anyway. He has a role in the Senate, though. I don't buy the helpless White House excuse. Not for a minute.

[niyad]

8. lack of leadership is the problem--and that includes the president, especially with his avowed

determination to have "bipartisanship" no matter what the cost to the citizens for whom he is supposed to lead.

[moondust]

10. The House bill is pretty good.

Why isn't the President getting credit for "great leadership?"

You can't have it both ways.

[dionysus]

16. i think no matter what obama does, lieberdouche and baucus would still do whatever they want.

remember these are "democrats" we're trying to get to vote for this, not republicans. all republicans are already going to vote no.