CNN floating rumors of ongoing coup in Pakistan.

[VanW]

No link. The White House correspondent says there is "something" going on.

Confusing info relating to Pakistani Supreme Court ruling.

Defense Minister prevented from leaving country.

Blitzer earlier asked Pakistani Ambassador to the US if there are signs of a coup, Ambassador said "I hope not."


Now Wolf is just going on with his scheduled show like there's nothing happening. I assume they will return to the subject soon!


Nic Robertson: his source says the Supreme Court is acting under the influence of the military.

That's it for now (at CNN).

6:45 EST -- Wolf backtracks: "We have no evidence of a coup"
6:47 EST -- Arwa Damon in Islamabad is describing the (legal) detaining of various ministers and politicians. No mention of a coup.
7:00 EST -- Wolf - "No coup"



Thanks a lot, CNN. :eyes:

This was not done by accident. The Pakistani Ambassador was clearly setting something off by saying "I hope not" to the question of a coup.

[Poll_Blind]

1. Oh shit, that would not be good. UK/US nuke recovery teams brewing a fresh pot of coffee.

I guarantee it.

PB

[TwilightGardener]

2. I was just about to finally log off the internetz for today. Dammit.

[David Zephyr]

3. And just in time as Obama's numbers are tanking.

.

[dave29]

13. really? It's already a conspiracy?

Nice

[glitch]

37. This particular conspiracy started decades ago.

Read The Grand Chessboard by Zbigniew Brzezinski for details.

[TornadoTN]

4. Hearing rumblings through Twitter and a few other places

Somethings going on, but no one is sure what it is.

I'd say if its true, the US/UK/Allies are preparing to get the nukes that they can.

This is bad, bad news if true. Further proof of our meddling in the region has only destabilized it further.

[clear eye]

25. Yeah. n/t

[nadinbrzezinski]

5. Damn it, now i need to log on to the BBC to get

real news.

And yes there is what nightmares are made from.

Oh and welcome to DU

:hi:

[Swamp Rat]

6. Welcome to DU!

:hi:

[VanW]

9. Thank you

[Dennis Donovan]

7. I just did a google news search - nothing on the wires yet...

:shrug:

[TornadoTN]

15. It's been out there since Dec. 8, when Petraus was asked

But the spike today in people talking about it and the speculation is a bit unsettling, since it had somewhat died down since 12/8.

[Fumesucker]

8. Having a major conflict, just over, on and within your borders is sooo stabilizing..

:sarcasm:

Is anyone at all surprised by this news?

[cowcommander]

10. Time to invade Pakistan now?

[leveymg]

11. Meet the new coup, same as the old coup.

We'll be fighting in the streets
With our children at our feet
And the morals that they worship will be gone
And the men who spurred us on
Sit in judgment of all wrong
They decide and the shotgun sings the song

I'll tip my hat to the new constitution
Take a bow for the new revolution
Smile and grin at the change all around me
Pick up my guitar and play
Just like yesterday
And I'll get on my knees and pray
We don't get fooled again
Don't get fooled again

Change it had to come
We knew it all along
We were liberated from the fall that's all
But the world looks just the same
And history ain't changed
'Cause the banners, they all flown in the last war

I'll tip my hat to the new constitution
Take a bow for the new revolution
Smile and grin at the change all around me
Pick up my guitar and play
Just like yesterday
And I'll get on my knees and pray
We don't get fooled again
Don't get fooled again
No, no!

I'll move myself and my family aside
If we happen to be left half alive
I'll get all my papers and smile at the sky
For I know that the hypnotized never lie

Do ya?


There's nothing in the street
Looks any different to me
And the slogans are replaced, by-the-bye
And the parting on the left
Is now the parting on the right
And the beards have all grown longer overnight

I'll tip my hat to the new constitution
Take a bow for the new revolution
Smile and grin at the change all around me
Pick up my guitar and play
Just like yesterday
Then I'll get on my knees and pray
We don't get fooled again
Don't get fooled again
No, no!

YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!

Meet the new boss
Same as the old boss

[NNN0LHI]

12. I thought all those high tech drones of ours were killing all the bad guys in Pakistan

Must not be killing them fast enough. Or something.

Don

[malaise]

28. Where is Cheney? n/t

[tularetom]

14. They shouldn't be floating rumors - their job is to report actual news

But it's CNN - what more can you expect?

[drm604]

16. Pakistan minister falls foul of amnesty ruling

Pakistan minister falls foul of amnesty ruling

Pakistan’s defence minister was the first politician to be prevented from leaving the country on Thursday night, following a supreme court ruling to abolish an amnesty that protected President Asif Ali Zardari and others from prosecution.

Ahmed Mukhtar, who faces the resumption of an earlier corruption-related case, was stopped by the immigration authorities when he tried to go on an official visit to China.

The future of Pakistan’s government looked more uncertain on Thursday as the immigration authorities added the names of up to 248 people including high-profile politicians from the ruling Pakistan People’s party (PPP) such as Mr Mukhtar on their exit control list. All those named on the list are barred from leaving the country until the cases against them are settled in Pakistani courts.

A senior leader of the PPP said cabinet resignations were expected to follow the court’s decision.

[VanW]

18. This seems to be the crux of the matter

I haven't seen any evidence of something that would look like an actual military coup.

[TornadoTN]

17. Here's an article from 12/14 discussing the possible formation of the coup:

It's from a New Zealand source:

http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/WO0912/S00302.htm

It's actually a pretty well written article.

[Poll_Blind]

23. Interesting catch- thansk for posting it. n/t

PB

[clear eye]

35. Thanks. Excellent and disturbing article.

I wish our intelligence was as good as New Zealand's.

[dysfunctional press]

19. we might be escalating even more and even sooner in vietghanistan...

or not- doesn't the bulk of the really heavy equipment travel to pipelineistan via pakistan...?

[nadinbrzezinski]

20. Two day old story on Patreaus saying he does not expect it

http://www.newkerala.com/news/fullnews-11780.html

US commander dismisses fears of Pakistan military coup

Islamabad, Dec 15 : US General David Petraeus dismissed fears that the Pakistani military might stage a coup amid brewing political turmoil, media reports said Tuesday.

The chief of the US Central Command, whose area of responsibility extends over Central Asia and the Middle East, made the remarks to a select group of reporters in Islamabad Monday after briefing Pakistani political and military leaders about Washington's new Afghan strategy.


++++++++++++

So if CNN is floating it now, well, guess David Patreaus was wrong... or that was a signal.

The tangled webs we weave...

[bananas]

21. Rule of thumb: an official denial means it's true. nt

[nadinbrzezinski]

22. And an offiical denial can be a signal

as in a green light.

[gimama]

24. this, combined with report that US drones

were "'hacked' by Iran" (!) are troubling to me.
PEACE on Earth, Ya'll..

[clear eye]

30. What, is our gov't planning on taking on the whole Muslim world?

This is not good at all.

[VanW]

26. Now they are covering the drone story

Actually two stories: the hacking story and a new drone strike in western Pakistan. Somehow they are managing not to mention anything else.

[FarCenter]

27. NRO beneficiaries on Exit Control List

ISLAMABAD: The interior ministry, in compliance with the NAB’s directives, has issued arrest warrants against 252 beneficiaries of the National Reconciliation Ordinance (NRO). The names of the 252 have been placed on the Exit Control List.

The bank accounts of many of the beneficiaries have been frozen and their properties seized. — DawnNews

http://www.dawn.com/wps/wcm/connect/dawn-content-library/dawn/news/pakistan/04-nro-beneficiaries-ecl-qs-05

[FarCenter]

31. It's an ideal time for a coup, with all the world leaders distracted by Copenhagen

[VanW]

38. More from DAWN:

"ISLAMABAD: As the apparently helpless government watched in discreet silence, the National Accountability Bureau on Thursday acted on the orders of the Supreme Court and banned 247 people, a number of ministers among them, from leaving the country as they once again stand accused in cases of corruption and graft under the NAB law following the annulment of the controversial National Reconciliation Ordinance.

The people whose names had been put on the exit control list included the department’s top boss and Interior Minister Rehman Malik.

The names of a host of politicians, bureaucrats and businessmen are on the ECL because under the instructions of the Supreme Court, they require to clear their names through an anti-corruption process.

...

Joint teams of NAB officials and police were being formed to arrest the wanted people, it added.

Banks and other departments concerned have been asked to freeze bank accounts and property of the accused.

‘There is a possibility that most of the accused have managed to get their assets unfrozen, but the NAB has a complete record of their bank accounts and properties and they will be asked again to hand over their assets to the NAB or pay an equivalent amount of the money,’ the order said.

It has been learnt that the NAB has been given a free hand by the Supreme Court to take any other action required on a case-to-case basis against the NRO beneficiaries.

The bureau, which had become toothless after the government decided to replace it with an accountability commission, appears to have been revived after the Supreme Court verdict. "

http://www.dawn.com/wps/wcm/connect/dawn-content-library/dawn/news/pakistan/04-nro-beneficiaries-ecl-qs-05

[spanone]

29. they got the nukes, could change the entire middle east....hope it's not so

[VanW]

32. "Does USA want civil war in Pakistan?"

A blog post I came across.

http://redioactive.blogspot.com/2009/12/does-usa-want-civil-war-in-pakistan.html


"This alone has stretched the US-Pakistan alliance but with the US attempt to meddle with the military/civilian balance of forces in Pakistan, popular hatred and official suspicion of US intentions has become intense. Earlier this year, the US passed an aid bill, the Kerry-Lugar Bill, to provide $7.5 billion over five years to Pakistan, though this was predicated on the military accepting a subordinate role in Pakistani political life. The military was less than happy with this and has since been carrying out a campaign to undermine Pakistan's president Zardari - with the latest phase being the elimination of the amnesty granted to politicians charged with corruption. Meanwhile, a few months ago when Secretary of State Clinton was in Pakistan on an official visit, she was taken aside by the military and it was explained to her which side the bread is buttered on in that country. She came away suggesting that she would use her power to water down the provisions relating to civilian rule in the bill. Military supremacy is clearly the price the US is paying to maintain the allegiance of the Pakistan Army."

"If the Americans go ahead an unilaterally begin operations in Quetta, or expand operations elsewhere, this low level conflict could begin to break into the open. The two drone attacks that killed up to 20 people in North Waziristan on Thursday indicate that Obama - who has dramatically increased such attacks since being elected - intends to move forward with this strategy. With a decent possibility that President Zardari will be gone in the near future, from the president's office it not from the country itself, and with another 8,000 politicians facing corruption charges, there is also the possibility that the shift in balance towards open military rule could also open up fractures, as elements see this shift as an opportunity to exert more independence from American demands.
Into this volatile mixture must also be placed the difficult situation of the Pakistani economy, which has had to take an $11 billion IMF loan this year and which has seen foreign investment drop by almost 26 percent - foreign direct investment fell by 52 percent. The country is mired in stagnant growth at a time of civil war in South Waziristan - leading to the largest population displacements since Partition - with intense bombing campaigns in the cities, an unpopular government and rising anti-US sentiment. With all these elements in place for an explosion, one can only wonder if the White House wants Pakistan to fracture or if they are utterly stupid."

Interesting analysis.

[clear eye]

39. Clearly the author is very well-informed.

Knows the amount of the IMF loan and the % of foreign investment decline, as well as recent interactions between the U.S. gov't and the Pakistani military, and what's going on in the hostilities in South Waziristan.

There has been no reporting in the U.S. MSM of the intensity of the campaign the Pakistani military has been waging there ("intense bombing campaigns in the cities"). All I ever read was that they weren't doing enough.

I wonder though if the danger is not so much a civil war, as an outright alliance between the soon completely autonomous military, and the radical Islamists. Or maybe the author meant that if such a thing happened, the newly allied powers in South Waziristan might threaten or even attack the rest of Pakistan.

Oh brother. I think all we can do is write a few letters and hope that our gov't is seeing things in perspective, not taking orders to get that pipeline no matter the catastrophic fallout--like a giant, modern-day Pork Chop Hill.

I hope the author gets this info into an NYT op-ed, or somewhere equally influential.

And VanW, thank you very much for posting this, and a warm welcome to DU.

On edit: If the author holds a sensitive position that keeps him/her from writing an op-ed, perhaps a sympathetic professor of Asian studies at a prominent university would be willing to put his/her name to it in order to get it published.

[FarCenter]

33. Post court blow, calls for Zardari to go

Omer Farooq Khan, TNN 18 December 2009, 01:04am

ISLAMABAD: Pakistan supreme court’s decision to strike down an amnesty, that protected the increasingly unpopular president, Asif Ali Zardari, from graft charges has further weakened his shaky hold and sharpened political tensions.

The court ruling on Wednesday would allow his opponents to challenge his eligibility to hold office, despite the immunity he enjoys from prosecution. Graft cases were pending against him when the amnesty was adopted and the court ruled that it was unconstitutional, paving the way for the criminal cases to be revived. Zardari benefited from the amnesty along with several of his aides, including interior minister Rehman Malik. Experts say Malik’s arrest is imminent.

The court singled out an investigation in a Swiss court into allegations of money laundering against Zardari in 2006 and ordered the government to ask authorities there to reopen the case. The Swiss authorities had unblocked $60 million that were frozen after Pakistani authorities said they weren’t pursuing the case.

The upheaval comes as Pakistan is embroiled in a surge in retaliatory attacks in the aftermath of an offensive against the Taliban in their stronghold of South Waziristan.

In a sign of what was in store, Pakistan’s anti-graft agency issued arrest warrants against some of the amnesty beneficiaries and also got their assets frozen. “About 248 people had also been barred from leaving the country,” said agency spokesman Ghazni Khan. Former president Pervez Musharraf introduced the amnesty as part of a power-sharing deal with Benazir Bhutto. Zardari’s spokesperson rejected calls for his ouster and maintained that charges against him were motivated. “He was never convicted and there’s no reason for him to step down,” the spokesperson said.

PM Yousaf Raza Gilani said the government was awaiting a detailed judgment, but would respect the order. “The government has started consulting the legal experts for its implementation,” he said.

Zardari’s archrival Nawaz Sharif-led Pakistan Muslim League was quick to call for his resignation, saying that he was morally obligated to do so, at least while the court heard any challenges to his rule.

<SNIP>http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/world/pakistan/Post-court-blow-calls-for-Zardari-to-go/articleshow/5349636.cms

[Fleshdancer]

34. background info from Times of India:

I assumed India would be keeping a close eye on the situation for obvious reasons. Haven't seen any "breaking" news from the region though.

http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/world/pakistan/Post-court-blow-calls-for-Zardari-to-go/articleshow/5349636.cms

ISLAMABAD: Pakistan supreme court’s decision to strike down an amnesty, that protected the increasingly unpopular president, Asif Ali Zardari, from graft charges has further weakened his shaky hold and sharpened political tensions.

The court ruling on Wednesday would allow his opponents to challenge his eligibility to hold office, despite the immunity he enjoys from prosecution. Graft cases were pending against him when the amnesty was adopted and the court ruled that it was unconstitutional, paving the way for the criminal cases to be revived. Zardari benefited from the amnesty along with several of his aides, including interior minister Rehman Malik. Experts say Malik’s arrest is imminent.

The court singled out an investigation in a Swiss court into allegations of money laundering against Zardari in 2006 and ordered the government to ask authorities there to reopen the case. The Swiss authorities had unblocked $60 million that were frozen after Pakistani authorities said they weren’t pursuing the case.

The upheaval comes as Pakistan is embroiled in a surge in retaliatory attacks in the aftermath of an offensive against the Taliban in their stronghold of South Waziristan.

In a sign of what was in store, Pakistan’s anti-graft agency issued arrest warrants against some of the amnesty beneficiaries and also got their assets frozen. “About 248 people had also been barred from leaving the country,” said agency spokesman Ghazni Khan. Former president Pervez Musharraf introduced the amnesty as part of a power-sharing deal with Benazir Bhutto. Zardari’s spokesperson rejected calls for his ouster and maintained that charges against him were motivated. “He was never convicted and there’s no reason for him to step down,” the spokesperson said.

[clear eye]

36. If we can't supply the war via Pakistan, perhaps our gov't is

actually considering trying to militarily overthrow Iran to gain access.

It was this sort of stumbling around, throwing good resources after bad w/o regard for real world consequences beyond each gov't trying to one-up the other, that started WW I.

I hope, w/ all my being, that Obama & advisors have retained some real world perspective, and aren't becoming so tunnel-visioned that they precipitate a worldwide conflagration. I'm glad Obama has an intelligent wife and young children.