You guys are just going to LOVE the Nelson compromise.

[lapfog_1]

:sarcasm: (need to add that)

states can "opt out" of allowing insurance to pay for abortions.

If your state doesn't opt out, any money that you pay for abortion coverage has to come from a separate payment or deposit.

[Danger Mouse]

1. Are you fucking serious? Are they really going to do this?

:puke:

[lapfog_1]

2. Listening to them read in on the floor of the Senate right now. - n/t

[Danger Mouse]

6. Ugh. Fuck this.

:banghead:

[cali]

3. oh that's just fucking great.

so is that asshole on board yet?

[pleah]

4. Jesus.

:banghead:

[no_hypocrisy]

5. I don't know if I'd prefer the filibuster at this point.

[Mass]

7. You miss the part where Nebraska gets more money for Medicaid.\nt

[Vinca]

8. Save the embryos, allow the babies to die. Tis the season.

[Mari333]

9. Ladies Ladies Ladies

Trust me with your uterus.

[G_j]

10. I'm gonna be sick

:puke:

[Jamastiene]

11. Goodbye civil rights.

It's like open warfare on women and gays with this bunch.

[cornermouse]

12. Question.

If you have the money for a separate payment or deposit will that be a signal that you're either not paying enough for insurance or if you're in the assistance program that you don't qualify for the insurance assistance or if the insurance company is one of the more "favorable" states (the across the state line thing the republicans love so much) and that state has opted out can you be covered or vice versa?

[lapfog_1]

16. The means test is income, so I don't think writing two checks will

be a deterrent to getting a subsidy.

But I'm bumf**ked if I know the answer to the question "I'm a woman in a state that has opted out, but I want abortion coverage in my insurance and I want to pay for it, what happens now?"


Mostly, The two check thing is going to stop insurance paid abortion services. Nobody, but nobody, thinks they are going to get pregnant and need an abortion, so therefore they won't get the rider and pay for it with a separate check every month.

It's like you are buying car insurance, and when you actually get into a 4 car pileup, the insurance company will say... "sorry, you didn't buy the 4-car pile up insurance, you aren't covered".

[HughMoran]

13. Always looking to denigrate women living in the "creepy" states

This country really sucks at times.

[KharmaTrain]

14. How Many Clincs Are There In Ruby Red States?

I know that there's only one left in Kansas and not sure how many, if any, are in Nebraska. Many states that would opt out already have draconian state laws on the books to restrict reproductive services. Just more salt in the wound, but would this close down that many clinics or make it more difficult for a woman to get an abortion now than she already confronts? Just askin'...

[lapfog_1]

18. Uh, it's not "opt out for providing abortions" in some state.

It's opt out for ALLOWING insurance for abortions in some state.

So if you are a woman living in red state 'merica, and your state opts out, you can't PURCHASE abortion insurance with your own money. Sure, you can still travel to another state and have your abortion, but your mandated insurance policy won't have even the "optional rider that has to be paid with a separate check or deposit".

So cough up the whole procedure amount yourself... and hope nothing goes wrong and you have to pay for ER room and hospitalization as a result of having an abortion. Because, as I heard this amendment, insurance won't be ALLOWED to cover it (in the opt out states).

[debbierlus]

20. Thank you for the clarification

[lamp_shade]

15. I'm anxious to hear Boxer's response.

[liberalmuse]

17. I feel for the women in the fucking red states.

Good Lord, the Taliban is alive and well.

[Kansas Wyatt]

19. Where are all the "FOOT IN THE DOOR" people again?

:shrug:

Just a 'few' minor adjustments to make later, huh?

:rofl:

This SHIT (alleged HCR) Bill needed to die when it became a GIVEAWAY to the Insurance Industry!

Where are you damn Insurance Industry Pom Pom Whores, now that EVERYONE is being tossed under the bus?

Jesus Fucking Christ... In the end, the Republicans are going to get the HCR they've always wanted.

[GreenPartyVoter]

34. They're slamming the door on our feet, I think.

[Kansas Wyatt]

35. The door was being slammed shut months ago...

When the concession was being made on Public Option. The ONLY thing it was at that point was a GIVEAWAY to the Insurance Industry at the expense of the American People.

Nothing good will come from this, with the exception of 40 million (uh huh) people, who will first have to undergo a rectal exam with a microscope from the IRS to make sure they qualify for government help, as long as they do everything the Corporate Government Store tells them to do. They will use it to deny people help, by making them jump through all the hoops to get there and they are going to look for any reason to deny help.

[piratefish08]

21. Is there anyone left that still thinks that the finished product will result in anything

REMOTELY resembling reform?

[tomm2thumbs]

22. asking, not suggesting... could this be overturned under equal protection?

could they end up screwing themselves in the end, and all states would have to allow it since it is a legally protected procedure and would be singling out women?

asking because sometimes you give folks like Nelson enough rope, they end up hanging themselves....

[Neecy]

23. That's what I wonder, too

This Bill puts women's health into an entirely separate category.

[tomm2thumbs]

24. recently the anti-Acorn legislation was ruled against by the courts

as being a writ of attainder I believe... again, not suggesting that there is a master plan going on here, but I am counting on a miracle that if this is truly President Obama's legacy issue, he will not leave it to rot on the vine, but needs to get it into the room first before he can start working on it. Of course in thinking this way, I am counting on him being an insightful, long-thinking masterplanner.

[lapfog_1]

26. Current federal law prohibits using federal funds for abortions.

I haven't heard of any court challenges to that statue (the so-called Hyde amendment).

If there have been any equal protection challenges, they have failed because it's still on the books.

[tomm2thumbs]

27. I am only referring to the state-to-state differerence on a Federal law

If a Federal Law can limit women of one state to one thing, and women of another state to something else

[lapfog_1]

28. Ah...

Ok, the opt out clause.

That's an interesting one... and states rights people would argue that there are many things one can do with federal money in one state but another state doesn't allow. I'll try to research that in a few minutes (or hours).

[FLDCVADem]

32. No, because insurance isn't required to cover abortions now

in many, if not most, states.

I fail to see where the Stupak amendment or this one does anything different than is already in place, i.e., federal dollars can't pay for most abortions, either directly or via insurance. Women with federal government insurance have been living under this reality for years, but people seem to just now be noticing it.

If you have insurance through your employer (not federal government) and it has abortion coverage, there is no reason whatsoever that the company can't continue to offer abortion coverage. They just have to ensure that they have an identical policy minus abortion coverage to place into the exchange, if they choose to participate in the exchange.

[tomm2thumbs]

36. but can the Federal government, itself, tell women in one state they can get

insurance for something and in another, that they cannot.

Or tell one woman she cannot get a procedure in another state which a person in THAT state is allowed to get, unless she pays for it separately. Since these are mandates, aren't they mandating an uneven state-to-state rule which adversely treats women from one state differently from women in another.

[FLDCVADem]

39. Sure

Because the federal government ISN'T telling women they can't get the insurance, the states will be. If the feds were saying "abortion coverage in these 3 states and none in these 47" then yes, that's an equal protection issue. By leaving it up to each state, the feds are washing their hands of it. It won't be the feds telling Nebraska women they can't buy the coverage, it will be the state pols in Nebraska doing so.

[tomm2thumbs]

40. but her insurance stops at the state's door, she cannot carry it

to another state where it would be allowed - the interstate issues are what I am wondering about. Mandating that a woman only has as much right in her life as the state she lives in, even when traveling to other states.

Let me try this. It would be like the Federal govt. forcing everyone to carry a gun, but one state only allows small hand guns. But that person goes to another state where they allow larger guns, but she is restricted in a Federal right, in a state she is not in, by the former state's rules.

[FLDCVADem]

41. If the feds forced a woman to buy abortion coverage

I would agree, but that isn't what's happening.

[tomm2thumbs]

42. I guess in the end, a woman would purchase insurance in a state

other than her own, in case she lives in one state and works in another. State line areas, etc.

[laughingliberal]

25. Well, yeah! The right must be appeased at all costs. Would be nice if appeasing the left ever got

any attention.

[LiberalFighter]

29. We should do like the Republicans do...

And tell everyone that the "opt-out" requires for every abortion not allow the plug for a little old lady has to be pulled.

[Lars39]

30. When in the fucking hell is a uterus going to be covered like it's actually part

of a living, breathing woman?!!!! Men's reproductive organs are covered....maybe that ought to change if this goddamed crap gets passed. :grr:

[Nikki Stone1]

31. Can't decide if Nelson is a misogynist or an insurance whore

Maybe it's a little of both.

[dana_b]

33. even if the insurance you are buying

is from a company that is in another state that allows the use of insurane for abortions??

Jeez - being a woman definitely is not in one's favor.

[ProgressIn2008]

37. Well, the perfect is the enemy of the good. Pragmatic realities, you know.

I actually typed that with a straight face. Unfortunately, not with with a strong enough stomach, though.

[omega minimo]

38. Time for a Women's Peace and Justice Party?

[dgibby]

43. Looks like we'll need to revive the Underground Railroad,

only this time it will be used to get women into states that didn't opt out.