Loyal Democrats check in!

[LoZoccolo]

:patriot:

[Forkboy]

1. LOL

[WeDidIt]

2. Kick

:kick:

[goclark]

32. Loyal Democrat kicking In nt

[Richardo]

3. Define your terms

I'm always leery of the word 'loyalty'.

[LoZoccolo]

5. No splinterism. n/t

[Richardo]

7. You're talking about a religious concept

I don't consider a political party something to be 'loyal' to.

[LoZoccolo]

16. Thanks for the kick. n/t

[David Zephyr]

135. Precisely.

It's cultish. It's intellectualy dishonest. It's creepy.

It is a "religious concept".

[Forkboy]

8. Then you don't even fit your own requirements, as all you do is try to divide DU.

[LoZoccolo]

14. What would your idea of a "non-divisive" call to loyalty look like? n/t

[Richardo]

21. There's no such thing

Loyalty tests are of themselves divisive.

[LoZoccolo]

50. This is Democratic Underground. n/t

[Richardo]

61. Nothing gets past you, does it?

[Forkboy]

24. Your call to loyalty is really a call to anyone who agrees with you.

You're as transparent as Saran Wrap. Try again.

You're one of the biggest splinterists on DU, as you consistently start threads trying to play one faction of DU against the other. In all your years here I've yet to see yous post anything that's actually constructive. Nothing. Yet you lecture others on what they should be doing to help the Party?

Funny stuff. :thumbsup:

[LoZoccolo]

37. You can think what you like.

but I doubt you've ever seen me tell people not to vote Democratic. And yes, I've criticized Kucinich for having no constructive reason to run but still doing it.

[Forkboy]

38. No, you just go out of your way to drive them off, then bitch when they do.

:crazy:

[sabrina 1]

56. Kucinich is a Democrat.

Maybe you should check out of this thread. You don't sound like a Democrat to me, let alone a loyal one.

[LoZoccolo]

78. And people in his district should vote for him.

What I don't tolerate is him trashing other Democrats. This is consistent with my stances on party loyalty.

[Forkboy]

80. But you trash other Dems, why can't he?

You've mocked DK repeatedly here. Hypocrisy...you should look the word up.

[LoZoccolo]

89. I've already addressed that in the message you responded to.

If one Dem trashes eight or nine others a la the presidential debate, then performing little chemo on the cancer is better than letting it do more damage. You think it's hypocrisy on my part because you are disregarding the complexity of the situation. You're looking for little pieces of it to take out of context and accuse me of something. If Kucinich was as progressive as he could be without damaging the others I'd be fine with it. But as it is, he berates everybody else's position while espousing one that he knows will not be tested any time soon, and thus he will not be held accountable for.

[Forkboy]

93. Sounds like you're describing yourself.

If one Dem trashes eight or nine others a la the presidential debate..

What if they're right? What if you trashed 8 or 9 Dems but were correct? Should you be treated like a cancer? Face it, you just don't like the guy and pay no attention to what he actually says. It's obvious every single time you talk about him.

You think it's hypocrisy on my part because you are disregarding the complexity of the situation.

No, you just want there to be complexity to hide your own hypocrisy behind. But there isn't any. You trash a Dem and they say you hate people trashing Dems. End of story, dude.

You're looking for little pieces of it to take out of context and accuse me of something.

You mean like taking little pieces by starting threads about UFO's while ignoring his record? Again, your hypocrisy rears it's ugly head.

If Kucinich was as progressive as he could be without damaging the others I'd be fine with it.

And if you could post shit that wasn't out to divide the Dems I'd be fine with it too, but you're not. You're a splinterist, the very thing you claim to be against. People such as yourself are doing more damage to the party than he is.

But as it is, he berates everybody else's position while espousing one that he knows will not be tested any time soon, and thus he will not be held accountable for.

No, not everybody else's, just the few he thinks are wrong. It's called politics, and if you had your way we could just create a new breed of human with the ability to do nothing but agree with what YOU think is right.

You are what you hate, LoZo. Always have been, always will be.

[LoZoccolo]

100. Maybe tomorrow; I'm going to bed.

You're making the same mistake of pointing out a superficial irony though. And I wouldn't tell people not to vote for Kucinch, whereas my opponents are telling people to stay home on election day.

[Forkboy]

104. You're so full of shit your eyes are brown.

Sleep tight, don't let the Nader bugs bite.

[LoZoccolo]

114. Suffice to say that I say little about Kucinich's positions and much about his tactics.

People on here then use his "courageous" stances as justification for trashing everyone else. As I said, stopping the cancer to save more Democrats is a loyal move. You can think what you want, whatever. I'm not even saying he should be unelected, just that he should cut it out and/or people should realize what he's up to before they compare everyone else to him. He's not the best standard.

And I have suggested people to do things that I disagree with for the overall strength of the party. I agreed more with Lamont than Lieberman but still thought that it was futile to oust him in a state where he was enjoying a big approval rating and still overwhelmingly voted with the party on issues where the parties disagree. Now you can see that he's doing things like trashing this health care bill in an attempt to get votes from another base, reneging on positions that it's been documented that he held before. You can't accuse me of trying to impose my positions under the guise of party loyalty when I clearly and explicitly separated positions and strategy on that one. You can go back and see that I preferred Lamont despite what I thought it would be wiser to do strategically in the primary.

[sabrina 1]

108. When did Kucinich ever 'trash' personally other Democrats?

I have seen him disagree with them on issues and he's usually right. In fact more than most of them, his positions on the issues are exactly what a real Democrat's positions ought to be. Voting for Bush's war was not a Democratic position. Voting for every supplemental, was not a Democratic position. He voted like a Democrat.

Disagreeing with your Democratic colleagues when they take Republican positions on important issues, is not trashing them, it is doing your job AS A DEMOCRAT.

I want Democrats who support the issues that made me become a Democrat, to point out to their Democratic colleagues when they are acting more like Republicans. If we had more Democrats doing that, this Party would not look like Republican lite right now and it would not be losing its base. If you actually are a Democrat you should be grateful for those, like Kucinich, who are trying to drag the Party back from the brink of Republicanism.

But it is simply untruthful to say he has 'trashed Democrats'. He is always respectful to those he disagrees with. Too bad he has to disagree so often, which is proof of how far to the right this party has moved.

[msongs]

4. everyone who disagrees with you is a disloyal democrat. yeah right nt

[laughingliberal]

29. of course. name this quote: "You're either for us or you're against us." nt

[elocs]

6. LoZoccolo, he remains: King of the UnRec.

:shrug: Why might that be?

[LoZoccolo]

10. You've already seen the explanation.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x6905466

[elocs]

20. Cute, but I missed that one. So how much older are you than 9 or 10 now?

:rofl:

[LoZoccolo]

33. So you responded to it without reading it?

And the lesson still holds: sometimes people will laugh at you even if you are right. I think itwas Ghandi who said "first the ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they unrecommend you, then you win."

[elocs]

46. Then you are the primo #1 DU winner. DU should salute you

in your world where UnRec is affirmation. Yes, I am sure that Ghandi said that. He knew you were coming.

[Moochy]

9. Sign me up!

:patriot:
I'll vote for Obama in 2012, because I'm sure the alternative will be regressive!

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

11. Oh, Joy! A Loyalty Oath from the Joe McCarthy of DU.

[LoZoccolo]

13. No one is being forced to post in this thread. n/t

[noamnety]

12. loyal to what?

the party platform?
the incumbents?

[Oregone]

18. The extremist centrists who have abandoned the Democratic principles

I want your loyalty oath now!

[Liberal Veteran]

25. I'm giving my loyalty oath with a trigger option.

[Oregone]

34. lol

[PurityOfEssence]

47. Har

thanks.

[Warren Stupidity]

51. They are not centrists. Corporate shills are rightwing.

Both major parties are center-right, and that center has been shifting ever rightward since 1968.

[phasma ex machina]

134. +1, (Caveat: Wilson and Roosevelt actually started the rightward shift.) nt

[oxymoron]

15. Loyal Dem here...

I just wish the Dems I voted for were loyal as well...

[valerief]

17. Big D or small d? nt

[Bluebear]

19. And Flamethrowers, unite!

[LoZoccolo]

35. Not sure how this is flamebait.

You are not permitted to use this message board to work for the defeat of the Democratic Party nominee for any political office. If you wish to work for the defeat of any Democratic candidate in any General Election, then you are welcome to use someone else's bandwidth on some other website.

Democratic Underground may not be used for political, partisan, or advocacy activity by supporters of any political party or candidate other than the Democratic Party or Democratic candidates. Supporters of certain other political parties may use Democratic Underground for limited partisan activities in political races where there is no Democratic Party candidate.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/forums/rules_detailed.html

[Bluebear]

36. never mind

[La Lioness Priyanka]

22. Why dont you do an idiots unite? you'd fit in better

[LoZoccolo]

27. I don't think I've ever personally attacked you. n/t

[La Lioness Priyanka]

40. i dont think i have posted 100 thread in GD about the same subject

i think if i did, you would

[Toasterlad]

88. I Love You, Lioness

:loveya:

[David Zephyr]

136. I love her, too.

And hell, you, too.

[Toasterlad]

137. Aw!

:blush:

[LoZoccolo]

90. There's some else out there that posts about the same handful of things over and over.

I don't go calling her names because I know I'd just get in trouble for it, for one.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

91. maybe i dont think i will get into trouble. maybe i dont care. we have different priorities

yours are different from mine

[Liberal Veteran]

23. Are we talking Dennis Kucinich loyal or Zell Miller loyal?

[LoZoccolo]

26. Zell Miller was himself disloyal. n/t

[HughMoran]

28. I'm a DUer

...and DUers support Democrats - which I will always do over the psychopaths on the other side.

[tbyg52]

30. Do I have to sign anything?

As has been said upthread, a) define your term and b) loyalty oaths give me hives.

[spanone]

31. k&r

[Walk away]

39. I'm trying really hard to keep with the party. nt

[NRaleighLiberal]

41. I am a thinking American. I am loyal to my family and my values.

[Terra Alta]

42. I am a loyal progressive Democrat.

I am loyal to my party, but I feel they have not been loyal to me. It seems every day I am finding the Democratic party keeps distancing itself from true, progressive, beliefs.

[Zenlitened]

43. EPIC FLAIL

[Bluebear]

45. FLAIL! I like it!

[Zenlitened]

55. .

:hi:

It's the frantic, almost frenzied, desperation that OPs like this one exhibit that I find so amazing. And depressing. ;)

[blondeatlast]

118. I lol'ed! Unfortunatyely, I kicked this thread while doing so, but still... nt

[IndianaGreen]

44. Ingsoc reporting

IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH

There is no dissent to war.

There has never been any dissent to war.

[LoZoccolo]

49. You have the name of a political party in your DU name. n/t

[IndianaGreen]

52. Al Gore is Green

as is Nick Clegg of the Liberal-Democrat Party in the UK.

Then there is GreenPeace, to which I donate money every year.

[Warren Stupidity]

76. Al Green is a Love Machine!

This is perhaps the most inane OP of the year.

[Warren Stupidity]

53. You have loco zoo in your name.

[Bluebear]

72. --

:spray:

[rug]

133. You have an anagram of loco in your name.

[tigereye]

48. it's a big tent - room for all with no "loyalty" oath required

[sabrina 1]

54. Is there an oath involved? An enemies list maybe?

'My party right or wrong'?

[walldude]

57. Oh I'm here... Now try to fucking find me one in DC will ya...

[scarletwoman]

63. +1,000!

:applause: :toast: :yourock:

[Bluebear]

66. *****FTW!*****

[scarletwoman]

58. You're way too coy. You should be calling for purges.

Come on, you know you want to.

[Warren Stupidity]

60. Purge the Splinterists!

I CAN'T WAIT.

[scarletwoman]

64. Okay, but I hope you're from the Judean Peoples Liberation Front,

and not one of those Peoples Liberation Front of Judea bastards! :grr:

[Toasterlad]

86. Fucking Splinter!

[walldude]

62. Oooh we could have a committee.. maybe call it

The House Committee on Un-American Activities.... :rofl:

[scarletwoman]

65. HUAC a mole!

:D

[walldude]

82. ROFL...

:spray:

[Renew Deal]

59. lol

:rofl:

[Marr]

67. Politics as teenage fan club. n/t

[The Gunslinger]

68. Does that mean those loyal to what the Democratic Party is supposed to stand for,

Or those who blindly follow corporatists with a D in front of their name?

[LastNaturalist]

69. Fuck. Yes. Loyal Democrat all the way!

[TiberiusGracchus]

70. Do you think Tip O'Neill, Pat Moynihan or Paul Simon would even RECOGNIZE these democrats today?

Shame on these callow, thoughtless invertebrates who couldn't even stand up to fucking Joe Lieberman. The democratic giants who struggled tooth and nail to make the Great Society and Civil Rights a reality would have nothing but abject contempt for a president who betrays his most dedicated supporters, who throws a man like Dr. Dean under the bus and who would rather DO ANYTHING to please big PhRMA and the insurance industry than to demand real reform for millions of suffering Americans.

Loyal democrats have an OBLIGATION to demand our leaders to recover their testicles and KILL THIS BILL.

[lunatica]

71. Define loyal and disloyal

???

[Forkboy]

73. Loyal=liking the same Dems the OP does.

Disloyal=Liking DK or any Dem to the left of Baucus.

[LastNaturalist]

74. I hate Dean and Kucinich.

Sorry, but I do.

[Forkboy]

75. I never would have guessed.

[Moochy]

130. Low post count socks tend to hate the left here

[MilesColtrane]

77. Here

[RetroLounge]

79. Keep it up, Oasis boy...

You can join Deja Q soon I hope.

RL

[Bluebear]

81. Oh, is that finally gone?

[jonnyblitz]

97. yes, he posted a picture of Obama with an oreo cookie

covering his face!

[RetroLounge]

109. Yeah, and it took too damn long, IMHO

That garbage should have been shown the door years ago...

RL

[walldude]

87. Q finally get the stone?

[LoZoccolo]

92. For what?

For upholding the stated purpose of Democratic Underground? All the purge or surge nonsense is against the rules, not this thread. If supporting the Democratic Party is getting people tombstoned then I'll leave myself.

[Forkboy]

94. How many threads have you gotten locked in just the last month?

[LoZoccolo]

95. A lot of them are locked hours later when other people can't behave in them.

Have a look at the reasons they get locked. I don't think I'll comment on them because I could make somebody angry, but often times there's not a clear rule broken.

[Forkboy]

103. Ok, I will take a look at the reasons. Care to join me?

Seems to me that there most surely are clear rules being broken....

Locking

As the replies to this clearly indicate, this is divisive and inflammatory. Please do not start threads to call out and attack members with whom you disagree.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=7267695#7273032

Locking.

Flamebait.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=7267799

Locking

Things are pretty hot here right now, and inflammatory posts that appear to have the goal of causing even more division just are not helpful.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=7256042#7256324

locking

Since the OP is lacking any real substance this isn't GD material.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=7250198#7250385

locking

If you think someone is a freeper/disruptor/troll, please hit alert.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=7244942#7250464

locking

Don't start a new thread to callout a DU member or continue an argument from another thread.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=post&forum=389&topic_id=7283477&mesg_id=7286246

Ah, paranoia.

Locking.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=7180356#7180434

Locking

High grade flamebait.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=389&topic_id=7169620#7173275

And one of my favorites, in response to you saying this, "There's a reason I won't even apply to be a moderator: my opinions are too controversial."

Locking...

and then the Mod included a smilie saying "I agree" :rofl:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=433&topic_id=47638#47768

Nine locks, all recently, none because of anyone but yourself. You know, LoZo, Repubs always try to blame others for their own fuckups as well. And note that twice you were accused of causing division. Splinterist, heal thyself.

[LoZoccolo]

105. Ambiguous criteria are being applied in a lot of those cases.

For instance, it is still unclear why those get locked when people can post about how the Democratic Party can go to hell or bolting to third parties and it stays and/or makes it to the top thread. Keeping the majority satisfied seems to have crept in as a factor in whether or not a thread gets locked. I have other ideas which I will not state here.

[Forkboy]

106. LOL...uh huh.

it is still unclear why those get locked when people

No, it's very clear, and the reasons were given....you broke the rules. Be a man and own up to your own mistakes and stop trying to fob your fuckups off on others.

I have other ideas which I will not state here.

Coward.

[LoZoccolo]

113. Maybe you can give me unambiguous and objective criteria for what is flamebait.

Maybe you can present to me why my posts meet the criteria and why posts declaring secession from the Democratic Party evade them.

As far as being a coward, I don't really care what you think, but I'm not about to become an hero. Nice try. But fail.

[Forkboy]

119. Ask the mods. They're the ones locking your threads for being that way.

but I'm not about to become an hero.

Don't worry, no one would ever expect you to anyways.

[LoZoccolo]

120. Right, so don't accuse me of "breaking the rules" that even you don't understand. n/t

[Forkboy]

123. LOL...you did break the rules. The mods explained what rules in their locks.

Fucking duh! :crazy:

[LoZoccolo]

124. lol all you want, I think most people reading this can understand things like

"legal" definitions if terms and the lack thereof, and can critically asses them, rather than accepting the actions of authority figures as absolutely right.

[Forkboy]

126. I think most people reading this are laughing their asses off at you.

rather than accepting the actions of authority figures as absolutely right.

Right or not, it's the sites rules, which you broke. This isn't a court of law.

Jesus, dude, fucking be a man and own up to your mistakes and move on. Get a little self respect, will ya?

[LoZoccolo]

131. If they are, it reminds me of a story from my youth.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x6905466

[Zenlitened]

132. .

[jonnyblitz]

98. see my post #97 for what

[LoZoccolo]

96. Dream on; Deja Q got tombstoned for a swipe at the president.

Score one for Obama.

[libertyvalence]

83. Only tea baggers know who they're mad at

I'd like to let myself get pissed off but it is not clear who to get pissed off at.Obama got in, he played the political game. I thought that the rhetoric of change was more important than the equivocating statements he made for example; on Afghanistan. How horrible has that turned out? I thought he would seek support from his base, uh uh. He went to the power brokers for a safe (for now) place to hide.
I hope he's a fast learner. What the hell is he going to say to us in 2012? "I'm going to dump Hillary, Bill Gates, Geitner and Rahm"? That would get my attention, depending on his new picks. That would tell the story if he is ready to govern and to lead. We can fulminate all we want but none of us can predict the future and it is important for progressives to learn how to wait, see realty (even if it looks like shit) and choose your battles and alliances as they present themselves, There is more at stake than health care. This bill is a pile of crap but the progressive movement is real and we can't let that become a pile of crap.
When dad let me use the car, there were strings attached. It's the same now with Obama. He is cautious and careful, even timid by nature, just like dad. That doesn't make him a conservative. Almost everybody is the same way, Republicans want people to believe that it means people are conservative politically. Not so.
Obama made deals behind our backs. Just like dad. Obama is winging it. Just like dad, but we thought he knew what he was doing. Well, we're on to him. It's not like we don't know what to look for. This is a slow game, you're not going to spot the rope-a-dope right away. If he has gone over to the dark side, then he's in the right place but if he hasn't gone over, he in a dangerous place. That's not politics, that's a war with the conservatives who have been itching for a fight since the end of reconstruction.
You have to be smart with these assholes. I trust you to figure this out as it is happening. Right now, the fight for social justice is being played out in mock politics but you ain't seen nasty yet.
That's my take.

[Toasterlad]

84. Jawhol!

Ich bin ein Obamabot!

[UTUSN]

85. K&R to attempt to undo the UnReKKK, but to no avail n/t

[Enrique]

99. to anyone who hasn't checked in

don't think we're not keeping score, brother.

[Skittles]

101. I suspect loyalty to you means kissing Obama butt

[thatsrightimirish]

102. this is one of the funnier threads on DU

!

[TexasObserver]

107. I think you can hang a banner on this one: Clusterfuck Accomplished!

There's loyalty to DU's rules and standards.

There's loyalty to democratic ideals.

There's loyalty to progressive ideals.

There's loyalty to the Democratic party.

There's loyalty to specific Democrats.

When there is disagreement among Democrats as to what the proper course of the party is - for war, for health care, for other issues - it's not disloyal to speak for those in the party who disagree with others in the party. Disagreeing with the president is the job of any Democrat who thinks the president is abandoning democratic or progressive ideals.

Your threads are not helpful. You seek to inflame. I am a loyal Democrat of long standing, and I can assure you that most good Democrats can't stand hackish behavior in the name of the party.

[RetroLounge]

110. Wow, still negative recs?

Either there are no loyal Dems here or everyone knows this thread is just more bullshit.

:shrug:

RL

[blondeatlast]

121. Ummm... Lemme guess; I vote for option 2. nt

[Bluebear]

122. i can recommend that!

[WI_DEM]

111. check in. Obama is doing a good job. Better than any other first year prez since FDR

what did JFK do in his first year? Peace Corp and Bay of Pigs.

I take it back LBJ had a great first year too with the Civil Rights Act.

[mmonk]

112. I support Howard Dean, Dennis Kucinich, Barbara Lee, and a few others.

Does that count?

[upi402]

115. Me too!

And we've been told, on TV, that we don't count. So count me out. I'm a 3rd party supporter now. Done

[ddeclue]

116. Unrecced for lockstep mentality.

:P

[old mark]

117. I am a loyal Democrat, the ones in Congress are the ones in the wrong. nt.

[Name removed]

125. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[blondeatlast]

127. I like anchovies--and I love your usaername, very subtle. nt

[dionysus]

128. the members of Oasis should douse themselves in petrol and strike a match

[TK421]

129. oops....wrong thread, sorry!