Imagine if we had a "far left" president and a "far left" congress doing "far left" things.

[Stinky The Clown]

Imagine that we're watching the last few score thousand troops packing up their shit in the middle east.

Imagine that we've just signed a big climate change treaty.

Imagine that we put in place laws that level the international trading for goods and services and create a climate of fair trade.

Imagine that we pass universal single payer health care.

Imagine that we fund education that agrees with the views of actual educators.

Imagine that we stand shoulder to shoulder with those who were formerly our "second class" citizens and are now, legally, the equal of the majority in all respects, including marriage.

What would we carp about then?

What would YOU oppose in such a world?

Yes, I realize that world exists only behind my rose color glasses.

But what of that is NOT possible? What of that should NOT work toward? What of that is NOT possible?




Yes, I realize much of that "far left" agenda is pretty mainstream in the rest of the world.

[FiveGoodMen]

1. If only the right (including Democrats) hadn't taught Americans to hate the "far left"

[krabigirl]

16. They didn't teach all of us this :)

[Individualist]

17. The right AND their DLC pals hate the left.

[Echo In Light]

25. "The modern susceptibility to conformity and obedience to authority indicates that the truth....

... endorsed by authority is likely to be accepted as such by a majority of people, who are innately obedient to authority. This obedience-truth will then become a consensus-truth accepted by many individuals unable to stand alone against the majority. In this way, the truth promulgated by the propaganda system - however irrational - stands a good chance of becoming the consensus, and may come to seem self-evident common sense." ~ David Edwards, author of Burning All Illusions

[kctim]

41. It's actually

just the "far lefts" policies that Americans hate and it is due to values and beliefs, not teachings. The sooner the "far left" acknowledges that fact, the sooner they can stop "imagining" what their own little fantasy land would be like and start working with the majority of us Democrats and the majority of Americans.

[kenfrequed]

42. The Irony is...

That Rahm and his tacticians somehow believe that they win by conceding power to the right wing.

But it doesn't matter, the right wing will Never stop calling you commie, pinko, gay-loving, athist, pagan, environuts. So why bother giving into them like this? To satisfy the republican base that will never, ever, ever vote for you?

It is Zeno's paradox. The Center will always move. No matter how far you walk towards it, it will always be halfway between you and the reich-wing.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

47. The DLC hate "the far left" (i.e. the European mainstream) more than they hate the Republicans

or so it seems.

[mix]

2. far out

excellent points all...we'll prevail in the end.

:thumbsup:

[dflprincess]

3. If only legislation that benefited the middle and working classes

was not considered "far left".

(P.S. I do consider myself to be "far left".)

[fascisthunter]

4. I'm sure the over-arrogant corpo-bots

will have an answer for you soon.


"We aren't making enough money... they are taking away our freedoms to screw people in order to enrich ourselves."

[Blue_In_AK]

5. John Lennon had the right idea. n/t

[Blue State Blues]

6. Maybe a "far left" president

and a "far left" congress could manage to pass a "robust public option" which, according to nearly all of the polling data, has a higher approval rating than the Congress or the President.

Granted, head lice often have a higher approval rating than Congress, but Obama's numbers have been pretty good.

[glitch]

7. If only the stimulus had been used to build a new green infrastructure.

If only the Justice Department was tasked with investigating war crimes.

[AndrewP]

8. I love it

[Greyhound]

9. "Some look at the world and ask why? I dream of things and ask why not?"

Whatever happened to why not? It's been almost three generations since any American has dared to look up.

[sabrina 1]

11. I remember what happened it to over the past decade.

Every time we asked for something, which seemed logical, like 'investigate the Bush Administration' after it was proven they had lied us into war, we were told 'we can't do that now, we have better things to do, wait til we have a majority'.

And when we wanted to stop funding for the war we were told 'if Democrats do that they could lose the next election, let's wait until we have a majority'. And so, we waited while people died. Think of any major issue, and as soon as we began to make demands, the silencers were sent out to talk us out of it 'until we have a majority'.

We didn't like it but Bush was so bad, we went along. Now however, those who argued that we needed a majority, are moving the goal posts again. 'We don't have the votes' ~ and no, we can't pressure our members the way Republicans do get our agenda passed'.

So, for me, it's kind of a relief to not worry about 'a majority' anymore and to just try to pick the right people to support and to put pressure them no matter what anyone says. But in our defense, we did need to see a majority in action before giving up all hope.

[RaleighNCDUer]

24. Might have something to do with the fact that the guy who asked 'Why not?'

got shot.

[Greyhound]

34. Yeah, I think Bill Hicks had it cold, too. n/t

[chimpymustgo]

40. Great post, Greyhound.

"Whatever happened to why not? It's been almost three generations since any American has dared to look up."

[PeaknikB]

10. We'd be totally bankrupt

The .gov would implode on itself... If you were to pull out of Iraq today, their oil exports would totally cease within a short period of time, Iran would probably have to be attacked due to nuclear developments, and then there goes that oil too. The economy would shut down.

Too many of these social programs are nothing more than longterm ponzi schemes that will inevitably go bust, they are reliant on perpetual growth.

[tkmorris]

12. LOL, it's like a talking caricature of Ronald Reagan

You should get a grumpy looking old guy puppet and learn to throw your voice. It would be hilarious.

[krabigirl]

14. Um, what are you smoking?

And the .gov would implode? Which .gov sites exactly?lmao

[d_b]

18. lol fuck

[fascisthunter]

21. this country has gotten into more debt than ever, while lurching to the right

So your point is BS...

[Name removed]

28. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[krabigirl]

13. I'd love it here if we did. We need to organize and make it so.

This is where the right beats us, every time.

[LAGC]

15. Would we all suddenly become conservatives?

After all, if all the change we ever wanted in society was accomplished, would we then not want the status quo from then on out?

Kind of makes you realize how even most conservatives today were liberals back in their day. Think: racial equality, women suffrage, etc. Most conservatives today are for equal rights in those regards, now that its the new status quo. Once LGBT rights become the new status quo, even most conservatives will stand behind it in due time. Something to think about... liberals in their day make the changes in society, then conservatives eventually enforce it.

[Jamastiene]

31. WAIT! WHAT?????

No no no no no no no.

I think your current assessment is waaaaay off.

Conservatives STILL to this day have the shittiest attitude toward African Americans and women that you can possibly imagine: "You got YOUR RIGHTS. What are you griping about?" That's their attitude. No matter what. That is how they are.

I don't get where you seem to think they are for equal rights today and ESPECIALLY the myth that they enforce any laws protecting equal rights. They erode equal rights every chance they get and DO NOT enforce those laws.

Perhaps you should talk to some social conservatives about what their real feelings are toward equal rights for women. Hint: Come to where I live in NC and ask them for their real opinion. Democrat or Republican, doesn't matter. Conservatives of both major political parties feel the same way and it's very nasty and hateful toward equal rights for women.

As an added educational experience, ask them what they really think of equal rights for African Americans. You'll get a reaaaal eye opener.

I would have to say I disagree with your conclusion totally. :wow:

[Octafish]

19. Many of those raised on Raygun have no idea what you're writing about.

To them, Liberal means evil and progress is code for communist.

[madokie]

20. I think we need to quit bitching about our present President

and spend our time figuring out how to get more dems in both houses especially the senate. Obama is fine, we just don't have enough real democrats and thats where we need to concentrate our efforts, IMHO

I like my pony and I brush him every single day :-)

[StarfarerBill]

22. Sigh...you're right: Up With Capitalism!

You may say you're a dreamer...but you're not the only one. :)

[Brickbat]

23. Then we'd end up with Obama acting more like FDR, like FDR did when he was trying to appease the

communists and socialists, and we ended up with the New Deal.

[Orsino]

26. It would take a far-left nation to elect those far-left representatives.

Imagine a world where all those hard-right shouters weren't given daily and nightly forums to indoctrinate us.

[TheWraith]

27. Imagine that I had unicorns flying out of my ass.

And we're imagining all of this because the public did not elect a sufficiently far left House and Senate.

[Stinky The Clown]

32. If you had unicorns flying out of your ass .....

.... I bet you sphincter would eventually incur some serious trauma ..... what with that horn and all .....

[Odin2005]

29. Imagine that we are buiding an interstate high-speed rail system.

:cry:

[bvar22]

30. We could do stuff like THIS:

In our day these economic truths have become accepted as self-evident. We have accepted, so to speak, a second Bill of Rights under which a new basis of security and prosperity can be established for all—regardless of station, race, or creed.

Among these are:

The right to a useful and remunerative job in the industries or shops or farms or mines of the nation;

The right to earn enough to provide adequate food and clothing and recreation;

The right of every farmer to raise and sell his products at a return which will give him and his family a decent living;

The right of every businessman, large and small, to trade in an atmosphere of freedom from unfair competition and domination by monopolies at home or abroad;

The right of every family to a decent home;

The right to adequate medical care and the opportunity to achieve and enjoy good health;

The right to adequate protection from the economic fears of old age, sickness, accident, and unemployment;

The right to a good education.

All of these rights spell security. And after this war is won we must be prepared to move forward, in the implementation of these rights, to new goals of human happiness and well-being.

America’s own rightful place in the world depends in large part upon how fully these and similar rights have been carried into practice for our citizens. ---FDR's Economic Bill of Rights

Of course, that was the OLD Democratic Party,
which bears no resemblance to the DLC's "New Democrats" of today.
:cry:

[Shagbark Hickory]

33. I beg ur pardon but THAT STUFF AINT FAR LEFT!!. That's barely left of center.

[pipi_k]

44. Wow, that's weird...

I posted my reply below before even reading through this thread. Anyway, I said the same thing. That I don't consider any of those things to be "far left" concepts.

[jgraz]

50. Exactly. Here's some far-left policies for ya

+ Nationalize all oil, coal and gas companies

+ Outlaw derivative trading and implement a 1% transaction tax on stock trades

+ Skip Single-Payer and go to a fully socialized healthcare system like the V.A.

+ Double the pay of all American troops and eliminate 90% of new weapons programs

+ Unilaterally reduce our nuclear weapons stockpile to a few hundred missiles

+ Immediately end all aid to Israel.

+ Dissolve Blackwater, Halliburton and all mercenary contractors. Draft their employees into the US Military.

+ Liquidate the CIA.

+ Impeach Clarence Thomas, John Roberts and Samuel Alito for lying during their confirmation hearings

+ Increase the size of the Supreme Court to 15 and appoint 6 true progressives to fill the spots.

+ Prosecute all Bush war criminals, Bush DOJ criminals and Bush wiretap criminals

+ Rescind every Bush executive order as the work of an unelected, illegitimate President.

+ Raise the minimum wage to 150% of the poverty line

+ Implement a maximum wage and a 100% inheritance tax

+ Fully fund education, including free tuition to any American university. Pay for it with a wealth surcharge on the richest 5%.

+ Eliminate faith-base initiatives, national prayer breakfasts and ... TAX EXEMPTION FOR RELIGIOUS ORGANIZATIONS


I'm sure there's more, but that's a good start.

[lonestarnot]

35. What is carping? Do we have a smiley for dat?

[pleah]

37. Carping=griping/bitching. n/t

[Faryn Balyncd]

36. These goals are actually pretty mainstream here in America (outside of lobbyist controlled pols)

[pleah]

38. One can only dream. Sigh.

k&r #50

[piratefish08]

39. FAR left? I'd settle for 'slightly' left at this point.

Okay - back to the corporate handouts...........

[pipi_k]

43. Just my opinion, but...

I don't consider any of those possibilities to be "far left".

Hell, I would like to see them, and I don't consider myself to be "far left" at all. More like just left of the center.


So I think it's a bit unfair to characterize those things as purely "far left" concepts, and treat them like they're the sole property of the "far left".


One thing I can say is that I wouldn't want to see a far right OR far left president.

Does anyone really believe the far right isn't sitting around wishing the same thing? "Imagine if we had a 'far right' president and a 'far right' congress..." I don't like either extreme. And each side thinks it's got all the answers. Naturally, people think the side they believe in is the correct side, and some of them would even willingly die for their beliefs.

Sometimes I'm not even sure what's "right". :shrug:

[boston bean]

45. I didn't have to imagine a far right president and congress

so all this bs purity crapola people spew is ridiculous.

Bush won 2 elections ramming his shit through and making people think it was great.

Why can't the dems do that, you might ask?

Simple-- they do not want to!

[Dinger]

46. K & R

[LWolf]

48. I think we'd see a decline

in bullying, in anti-intellectualism, in polarizing hate-filled groups....

I think we'd all be happier, less stressed, healthier, and therefore more prosperous.

In THAT world, I don't know if I'd "carp." I'd be focused on the issues of overpopulation and environmental destruction. On the economic health of all, hoping to eradicate poverty from the nation.

[Xenotime]

49. I see a world where there is equal pay for all and no war.