Comparison of actual health care stories-US/Europe by BBC-link:

[old mark]

Several personal stories here from the US and several European countries. I find them all interesting, but the 2 women who had breast cancer - one from the US who went bankrupt with bills of over $190,000, the other from the UK who was covered completely - stand out to me. My wife and I went through 2 medical bill bankruptcies. For the second one, the judge said," Medical bills? OK."
That was the entire hearing, and we got it immediately.

Link: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/8426663.stm


Look, I know we are all angered to some degree at this bill, but it sets a precedent for government control and regulation of insurers that we have needed for about 100 years, and it's not over yet.

mark

[Jamastiene]

1. I'll recommend just because you weren't hateful and nasty in what you said.

Off to read the article now.

[old mark]

3. I was hateful and nasty yesterday. Today's my day off.

Merry christmas, J!


mark

[Jamastiene]

10. Merry Christmas to you too.

:hi: :hug:

[old mark]

11. Maybe Santa will bring you a new guitar.........nt

[DFW]

2. I know about this first hand

My wife is a German citizen, so when she got breast cancer, and needed nine months of care, she got it, no sweat whatsoever,
and her job was waiting for her (as mandated by law here in Germany) when she recovered.

She got: two operations, the second one requiring a three week stay in the hospital, six weeks of chemo, five weeks
of radiation, and a month's stay at a rehab/wellness spa for breast/thyroid cancer patients who had completed their
chemo and radiation. Her insurance even paid for her train trip down to the Black Forest, where her rehab clinic was,
and back up here to the Rheinland. In Germany, they have rehab spas for all different kinds of drastic illness, and
medical insurance covers them as part of treatment.

It cost us zero. Zip. Nada. In the States, I'd hate to think of what the bills would have been, and the kind of rehab
spa she enjoyed, if such a thing does exist in the States, would hardly been covered by insurance.

I don't know if she would have been better off under the new bill, but at least she couldn't be worse off, and the
not denying insurance due to pre-existing conditions is a giant step, no matter what else is lacking (unfortunately,
that is so far a lot).

[old mark]

7. My wife has Crohn's disease, has had 8 major surgeries and more

hospitalizations than I care to think about. One problem here is that we have never had a real "system" - we have a patchwork, and it's very easy to get lost in it. I had no health insurance at all for most of my life, and I'm very fortunate that I actually did have decent insurance when I really needed it - 2 heart attacks, 5 way bypass, all covered.
Many of my old friends - several who own their own businesses- have NO insurance because it is not affordable. Their options are to stay healthy or die.


mark

[DFW]

8. Like Alan Grayson said

A for-profit insurance company is by definition there to only pay out as little as they absolutely have to.
State Farm is NOT like a good neighbor, and you are NOT in good hands with Allstate. Germany is sort of a
patchwork, as well, but one which is designed not to let people go completely without insurance. Actually,
it is theoretically possible to be without health insurance in Germany, but you'd REALLY have to work at it.
A combination of laziness, illiteracy, and an IQ in single digits MIGHT get you there, with a little luck.

[malaise]

4. Good post

Happy Holidays old mark. :hi:

[old mark]

6. And you, Mal! Have a wonderful christmas

and great New Year.

:fistbump:

mark

[Prophet 451]

5. We love the NHS

I think a lot of Americans get the wrong idea about the NHS because we Brits bitch about it so much. That's the basic cultural misunderstanding. We're a dour people, we bitch about everything but whenever someone proposes doing away with the NHS, we shout them down and boot them out of office. Now, the NHS is a long way from perfect and if one wants to find scandals, they can be found, but it is a hell of a lot better than triage by wallet.

[HipChick]

9. When I was 19 I found a lump..

I ignored it, being a teenager, as I thought I knew everything at that age, and I was far too young for anything like that. Then one day, while I was at the dr's for something else, they found the lump, I was in the hospital like the next day for a biopsy...and then surgery happened soon after. And yes, this was the NHS. Yes, Brits moan about everything..that's just the way they are

[area51]

12. I like the way you described the U.S. healthcare system --

triage by wallet. It's true. You can have all the healthcare you need in the U.S., only if your personal wealth is infinite. :mad: