I don't mean to be an asshole here but can we quit speculating

[walldude]

on whether Rove is gay or not?

I have seen a number of threads about Rove's divorce and there seem to be many comments saying he's going to come out. But these posts are inadvertently looking homophobic.

Maybe us heteros ought to just deal with the fact that Rove is an asshole instead of trying to dump him into the gay community.

When I post on DU I do my best not to say "do this or do that" but I'll make an exception with this one. STOP CALLING TURD BLOSSOM GAY. It insults the GLBT community.

[Skink]

1. I thought he ate his young.

[electropop]

81. No, he ate everybody else's young.

[Captain Hilts]

2. It's stupid, isn't it? nt

[Brickbat]

3. Totally agree. Well said.

[babylonsister]

4. I agree. And I feel sorry for his wife and son, regardless of how I feel

about him. A family is being torn apart, and Dana Perino :wtf: announced it. :crazy:

[tinrobot]

11. Perhaps his wife is happy to be free of that jerk.

[babylonsister]

13. And maybe she's not. It's none of my business. nt

[tinrobot]

18. Then don't post about it.

[babylonsister]

20. I didn't post about it; I expressed my compassion for his family. Sorry

if you've got a problem with that.

[WhiteTara]

103. shame on you for your human side

:rofl: :sarcasm:

[omega minimo]

55. HE SPAWNED?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

:wow: :evilfrown:

[Betty Karlson]

62. Take comfort in knowing that even the son of Martin Bormann

turned out a fine, healthy, social, and conscientious man.

[Leftist Agitator]

82. Fuck his wife and son.

If they had any conscience at all, they'd have poisoned him or smothered him in his sleep before he enabled the ruining of the entire goddamned planet.

[nadinbrzezinski]

5. I could care less if he is or not

but your points are well taken...

And truth be told personal sexual life is NONE OF MY BIDNESS, no matter who does what!!!!

Problem is that he's done a career of the politics of personal destruction, so to a point this is to be expected.

[walldude]

8. If only more of DU was more like you...

I understand your point about it being expected, him being such a hypocrite but some of the posts today... man, you'd think we were back in the 50's.

[nadinbrzezinski]

21. Well we as a society need to grow up

one reason they work is that sex is salacious... especially when the other does it...

And in our puritan society it is just tasty.

[wtmusic]

6. +1 nt

[cliffordu]

7. I don't give a hoot about his sexual orientation.

I am disgusted that he gets lumped into category "human" with me, though.

[Nikki Stone1]

9. Thank you.

While Rove is the most despicable of creatures and should be heartily verbally flogged, it is entirely unfair to saddle the gay community with this piece of trash.

[artfan]

96. True

but if there is some actual proof that he is gay I can not help but marvel over the ongoing hypocrisy of the Republican party. I also sort of feel it is only fair that he be labeled as being gay for awhile after all we heterosexuals are disproportionately saddled with the vast majority of bigots.

[blondeatlast]

10. Agreed, but I steadfastly reserve the privilege of equating him to

fly droppings.

[blogslut]

12. Hear hear

Mr. Rove is a despicable human being who has done despicable things. I find it hypocritical when those who claim to support the LGBT community use LGBT as slam.

[Canuckistanian]

14. Agreed

Being gay is not a fault. Period.

[11 Bravo]

15. Agreed. I despise Rove because he is a soulless, hypocritical, shitstain.

I could give a flying fuck about who or what he porks.

[Canuckistanian]

17. Couldn't have said it better. n/t

[JohnnyLib2]

16. Agreed.

[valerief]

19. Ick! Rove. Ugh, ugh. nt

[tomg]

22. Great post. nt

[smalll]

23. I agree with you. Even if people don't do this out of conscious homophobia, such speculation --

is, to my mind, the PRIMARY animating cause for continuing homophobia at large, as well as for the continued warping of men, and relations between the sexes in general.

It's not just about Karl Rove -- it goes on in schools, in the workplace, amongst children and adults: men who are unliked, or outsiders, or otherwise disrespected, men who don't measure up to particular imagined "norms" of masculinity are routintely suspected of or accused of being gay.

The vast majority of people are straight. But when boys and men have to fear being accused of being gay - which, as it generally operates, is the ultimate insult - they naturally react by despising gayness, and by working hard to not "seem gay."

If people were willing to accept others as what they claim to be, if America was able to drop it's witch-hunt (or fairy-hunt, as it were) attitude, men would be a lot more free to be who they are, straight or gay. Gayness would no longer seem like such a big "threat" to straight people.

[mindwalker_i]

24. I wonder if he has sex

with other used tires.

[sharesunited]

25. Roy Cohn was gay. I didn't hold that against him.

[JackBeck]

33. He most certainly was not Gay.

He was a hypocritical, red-baiting conservative man that had sex with men.

Understand this now...just because a person has a sexual interaction with a person of the same gender, that does not mean they are Gay.

[pnwmom]

37. Of course he was. He was a gay man in denial.

He never married and he died of AIDS.

Just because he was in the closet doesn't mean he wasn't gay.

[JackBeck]

40. God help us all if you were ever a case manager.

Or if you ever chose to pursue that line of work in the future.

He didn't identify as a gay man, therefore, he wasn't.

Being Gay isn't just about where one sticks their cock.

Please find another forum to come to terms with your daddy issues.

You are the last person I would advise anyone to ever turn to when it comes to LGBT issues.

[pnwmom]

47. How do you know that Roy Cohn, in his own mind, didn't consider himself to be gay?

Just because he didn't acknowledge it to the rest of the world doesn't mean he didn't realize he was gay.

If someone exclusively has sex with people of the same gender, that person is gay, whether he acknowledges it or not. Show me a sex researcher or M.D. who agrees with your position and I'll reconsider. Otherwise, I'll go by the dictionary definition, not yours.

[JackBeck]

49. MSM

God that was easy.

[omega minimo]

56. "Being Gay isn't just about where one sticks their cock."

[pnwmom]

69. No, it isn't. But sexual behavior isn't irrelevant either.

And to say no one is gay unless and until they're out of the closet doesn't make sense. No one could ever be "outed" then because no one in the closet would be gay.

I agree with Barney Frank on the Frank rule by the way -- that it may be justified to out gay people who are actively working against gay causes.

[omega minimo]

77. The person isn't making sense.

[JackBeck]

41. If you are in the closet....YOU ARE NOT GAY!

What the fuck is it going to take for some of you to understand that GAY people don't live in the closet?

[pnwmom]

45. I disagree. That is YOUR definition of being gay, but many others agree with me.

My father was the same person when he was in the closet as he was when he was out. He was gay his whole life, not just after he came out.

[JackBeck]

52. You are delusional if you think openly gay people live in the closet.

You are not GAY if you are in the closet.

[pnwmom]

54. Where did I say that? But I don't think you have to be openly gay -- in all spheres

of your life, including the professional sphere -- to be gay, and to know you are gay. Was Barney Frank straight until he came out to the Congress and to the media? I doubt that he'd agree with you.

[omega minimo]

57. you are saying "gay" = "openly gay"

[Behind the Aegis]

59. Yes, someone in the closet can be gay or bisexual.

MANY gay/bisexual people live in the closet. It is sad, but true. Being gay is not determined by one's openness or lack thereof, anymore than it is determined by simply having sex with someone of the same sex. Your implication is that being gay is a choice. If one is not "out," s/he is not gay (inclusive). When s/he chooses to come out (or is outed) then s/he is 'suddenly' gay. Whether someone is in the closet or "out, loud, and proud," doesn't change their being gay.

[Jamastiene]

63. You mean I wasn't a lesbian when I had to dig around in my closet to

get my magazines with nekked women in them out of storage? I could have sworn that was the whole purpose for going in there in the first place. :tinfoilhat:

[crispini]

73. LOL. nt

[onpatrol98]

101. Too Funny

That was too funny.

:bounce:

[grantcart]

80. your projecting a personal definition of "gay"

the standard, widely used definition, is simply being a homosexual.


http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/gay

[sharesunited]

38. I can understand someone not wanting to claim Roy Cohn as their own.

Or have him heaped upon them.

He is not an admirable character.

But his sexual orientation was not his flaw.

[pnwmom]

48. I agree with all your points. n/t

[onpatrol98]

99. that does not mean they're gay

It doesn't?

:popcorn:

[Warren Stupidity]

26. my google says most of the speculating is about the FLAMING HYPOCRISY

of the 'pro fambly values' repugnicant assholes who are out defending the GOD GIVEN SACRED RITES OF MARRIAGE (for man/woman couples only) while divorcing for the nth time.

[johnaries]

27. I always thought of him as Asexual. At least, I hope he is.

He should not be allowed to reproduce.

Hmmm, now that I think about it, he must be Pansexual since he fucked ALL of us!

[pnwmom]

28. Could the speculation have to do with the hypocrisy that would be revealed

if he were to turn out to be gay?

[mitchtv]

29. basically it has to do with Homophobia

conscious or not. until we hear otherwise, I'll go with that. Republican is a synonym for hypocrisy

[JackBeck]

30. Why isn't the hypocrisy of his divorce enough? n/t

[704wipes]

31. the hypocrisy of his SECOND divorce that is

According to Jacob Weisberg in 'The Bush Tragedy' pg. 117> Rove was married to Valerie Wainwright in 1976. She was the daughter of a prominent Houston family with ties to the Bushes. Rove worked for Bush Sr in the 1980 primaries but did not return to the general campaign after Sr. was named the running mate. Stories as to why differ. Weisberg says there was tension between the country club republicans around Sr. (Jennifer Fitzgerald, a woman named Margaret Tutwiler, and James Baker) and the country bumpkin Rove. Rove says he did not return in order to work on his faltering marriage, which ended in divorce soon after. <per Weisberg..

Link to the Weisberg book:
http://www.amazon.com/Bush-Tragedy-Jacob-Weisberg/dp/1400066786

[JackBeck]

53. Rove's failure to commit himself to marriage should be proof that he doesn't respect the institution

[Tailormyst]

65. That's never it: The whole point is to use "gay" as a slur against him

It's like kids in the playground calling each other "faggot". It's not meant to be nice. It's has no deeper meaning. It is simply a juvenile behavior that many never grew out of.

Yes: To good many people, including those in our own party Gay still means BAD.

[backscatter712]

32. Doesn't Rove reproduce through mitosis? n/t

[elshiva]

34. AH-FUCKING-MEN!

Tired of DUers calling repukes gay as an insult. Also, I hate threads that say that Orly Taitz and Ann Coulter are really men or transexuals. It gives more credence to the evil stereotype of transpeople as "ugly weirdos."

TRANS POWER!

[Love Bug]

35. Thank you! It's no different than speculating whether or not Anne Coulter is a man

I don't get why it's ok to insult someone by questioning their sexuality. To do so is to imply they are not hetero, which apparently to some is the standard by which we all should live. Yet we use terms here like "pink-tutu democrats" to point out weak dems. There are plenty of other ways to insult these folks that are true, so can we leave gender or orientation-bashing out of it?

Thanks for bringing this up, walldude. We don't sound very "big tent" when we do this.

[omega minimo]

58. "...so can we leave gender or orientation-bashing out of it?"

Not as long as gender bashing of women is accepted. Common cause there?

[Malikshah]

36. His orientation is irrelevant. His lack of humanity is what is at issue.

This individual is well-nigh sociopathic in his fixation on winning political games.

He is the "poster-child" of lies that lead to the deaths of thousands all for political gain.

He is owed no respect.

He is owed no adulation.

He should be sent away to forever be ignored in his impotence. (This, by the way, is the most merciful of punishments; others I have in mind involve being publicly shamed and flogged by every person who has been made to suffer for his games)

[donheld]

39. Stop speculating whether Rove is gay and start

speculating whether he's human.

[omega minimo]

42. People probably can't imagine any woman marrying that.

[Luminous Animal]

44. Thus gay men are all about that?

[Maru Kitteh]

46. So why would they imagine any man doing it in their stead?

[omega minimo]

51. Not at all.Only "first reaction" No, I don't know what people are saying or why they would say that.

[Tailormyst]

66. So he must be gay? because they can imagine a gay man marrying him?

:crazy:

[omega minimo]

78. As stated to the previous two replies, no, I did not say that.

:crazy:

[JAbuchan08]

86. and yet one did...

:eyes:

on edit: Why is it so difficult to believe women would marry corrupt and venal men, after all they do it all the time.

[Maru Kitteh]

43. Happy to rec this post and even happier Rove is miserable. That makes me feel all warm inside.

I don't even care why. A nice staph infection would have sufficed but this is even better because divorce for people like Rove is EXPENSIVE. He deserves this and oh, so much more.

[phasma ex machina]

50. "When you’re a star, you’re either a tightwad or a homosexual. I’ve been accused of both.”

- Cary Grant

[JoeyT]

60. The only good way to mention Rove's divorce and gay in the same sentence would

be along the lines of "It sure is a good thing a bunch of bigoted assholes managed to stop gay people from ruining marriage."

Frankly, it's none of our business if the man is gay or not. He's still a shitheel either way.

[Betty Karlson]

61. Indeed! Hear Hear!

The man is the epitome of heterosexual insupportability. Even Larry Craig would revolt at the idea of touching Mr Rove.

[newtothegame]

64. These kind of posts are DU to a "t" though.

Making fun of Bush for holding hands with international leaders, CONSTANTLY referring to male repukes as "teabaggers," it's disgusting, but the nature of the game here I guess.

[progressoid]

72. Actually, Freepers are saying it too.

I went over there yesterday and read quite a few posts saying he's gay.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

84. yup

[tbyg52]

67. Thank you. nt

[glitch]

68. Very insulting. And anyway we all knew his wife was a beard but that was so he could pass as human.

Nothing whatsoever to do with gay/straight.

[Deep13]

70. Intense, palpable evil knows no orientation.

I think the speculation comes from wondering what inner conflict could cause anyone to be that horrible. For example, maybe he hates gays because he is gay and hates himself to the point of overcompensating. These proposed explanations come from people who are not evil and cannot understand how anyone can simply be that much of an asshole without guilt or regret or some psychological compulsion. Yet, truly evil people do exist.

[Blue Owl]

71. His political malfeasance is way more relevant

than his sexual orientation any day.

We already know they're complete and total hypocrites, so does it really matter?

[dionysus]

74. i don't give a shit if he's gay. he's still a piece of shit.

[mstinamotorcity]

75. No matter where

they try and stick Rove at, in any community, lets list some of the ones he has been rejected from.humanity,animal life,plant life,ocean life,washinton d.c. life and life in outer space if it exists.But there is one life that is waiting for him,life in prison

[dysfunctional press]

76. can we speculate on who jeff gannon 'slept' over with at the white house...?

or does your request preclude that?

[Bluenorthwest]

79. very well said and thanks

Just the fact that he is a now twice divorced atheist who promoted the idea of 'Sacred marriage' should be plenty for the hypocrisy mill. He touted religion that he sneers at in real life. Really, few things could be as cynical as that.

[liberal N proud]

83. Always figured he was asexual

But who gives a shit.

[myrna minx]

85. Thank you. K&R n/t

[Goldstein1984]

87. Agreed

The evidence that Rove is an asshole is incontrovertible.

Speculation is a waste of time.

And it has the implication that being gay is a dark secret, which it shouldn't be.

[grahamhgreen]

88. But his TURD BLOSSOM IS SO CUTE!

[bkozumplik]

89. agreed, fuck rove

And F his wife for that matter. I'm guessing anyone stupid or twisted enough to shack up with that cretin deserves ire.

I dont care to know a single detail about Rove, his personal life, or his wife. Not a thing. I'd rather they just didnt exist in the blogosphere at all. I dont care if they are married, divorced, or whatever. I don't care if he's gay.

I just don't care anything about the guy.

[Hekate]

90. Can I still speculate if he's human? Someone once referred to his "fetal pig charm" ...

... which was mind-bendingly appropriate somehow.

Hekate

[emilyg]

91. knr

[bigwillq]

92. K and R!

:bounce: :thumbsup: :hi:

[27inCali]

93. Turd Blossom does not set my radar off whatsoever

[Hepburn]

94. If Rove is gay...

...so what? :shrug:

But, if he is...that has gotta be the most natural and positive human trait the man has.

[varelse]

95. I guess I forgot to check in after recommending this thread

I agree completely.

[inna]

97. totally agree, and thank you for your post!

[Starry Messenger]

98. Or anyone other Republican we don't like, for that matter.

[David Zephyr]

100. 97th K&R.

Thank you for your wise O.P.

[WhiteTara]

102. he'll never come out

but do tell me why Guckert/Gannon spent SOOOO much time at the WH.

[Triana]

104. "STOP CALLING TURD BLOSSOM GAY. It insults the GLBT community."

I'd say.