Response if someone said this to you?

[goodboy]

" The fact of the matter is the poor have health care! It's the working class who choose not to pay for health insurance who don't have it"

AND

"If you are poor and working go to Health Right! It will cost you nothing!

Can't afford it? I bet they have cell phones, and nice flat screen tv's. And computers with high speed Internet! And drive decent cars! Give up luxuries if you want insurance!

There are many options for people who don't have insurance"


What would your responses be to this asshole, DU?

[el_bryanto]

1. Probably nod politely and bugger off. Lifes to short to argue with someone like that

Their world view is so warped that it's unlikely you would get through.

If I felt the obligation to argue, I would find examples of people who "work hard and play by the rules" who have been ruined by healthcare and present those to the person. Preferably white people (just an assumption - he probably wouldn't empathize with blacks, Latinos or any other non-white ethnicities). See what he thinks about those.

Bryant

[Deep13]

2. "That's the single most ignorant thing I have ever heard....

...and considering that someone once told me that Jesus lived with dinosaurs, that says a lot."

[Hello_Kitty]

3. Actually, I've had some of these things said to me by DUers.

Even here there are people who think the uninsured are irresponsible Welfare Queens. The thing is, most people who have expensive gadgets and drive nice cars also have health insurance.

[laughingliberal]

6. Sure. Whenever someone complains of being poor there is someone there to

point out they have internet connection and castigate them for having TV. I remember the most vile racists in the South during the civil rights battles loved to say ""they' all have televisions in their house."

[Jamastiene]

8. I've seen that too. n/t

[M155Y_A1CH]

13. Take them with a grain of salt

The freepers and trolls who come to this board to argue their stupid positions, wish to paint our ideals and ideas as the cause of all trouble.
They are just too f**king stupid to understand their stupidity.
Don't mistake them for DUers.
I find the ignore feature indispensable for bettering my enjoyment of DU.

[Hello_Kitty]

17. These aren't freepers and trolls. These are long-time DUers and progressive on most issues.

But in order to justify making people buy health insurance, they have to demonize people without it.

[M155Y_A1CH]

27. Progressives don't demonize the poor

Don't be fooled by high post counts and stars. Some of them have been with us for many years.
Sometimes you have to wait to see their true colors. Sooner or later they forget their role and become reactionary. Trust me on this, I've been here awhile.

[laughingliberal]

4. I doubt I would waste my time. It's "welfare queen" redux

The current picture being painted of hordes of people who could afford health insurance but choose to go without is just a new spin on the old welfare queen message. Notice how the demonization of groups is moving up the socio-economic ladder. Soon, only the top 1% will be considered 'worthy' of government assistance.

[Hello_Kitty]

20. Oh yeah. Now that hardly anyone qualifies for welfare.

The disdain has turned to the working poor. Sure, they may bust their asses all day at dead end jobs, but they don't deserve a living wage or any assistance because it's their own fault they haven't pulled themselves up the economic ladder. This argument is used a lot against raising the minimum wage.

[blondeatlast]

22. "welfare queen redux." Exactly. nt

[elocs]

5. There really is no requirement to need to respond to every asshole out there.

Ultimately, what's the point?

[murray hill farm]

25. yep..choose your battles!

Responding to these folks will just be a waste of your time and breath.

[Fumesucker]

7. Even a big flat screen TV is only about a month's worth of health insurance

Two or three months at the most..

Most people don't buy a big TV every month or three.

Health insurance is stunningly expensive if you don't get it through your employer.

[Warpy]

9. First tell him he'd lose that bet

When people fall into poverty, subscription services like cell phones and cable are the first things to go. Those things can add up to a hundred or so a month.

Health insurance for anyone over 40 starts at about $800/month, and I'm talking about the healthy people who can still get it. Throw in something chronic like diabetes or high blood pressure, and you can pretty much forget about having insurance even if you hit the lottery.

Most working class people who are thrown into the private insurance market soon find they have to choose between health insurance and shelter. That's how expensive it is. 70% of the people who look for a private policy don't get one, usually because of the cost.

Health care is not free anywhere if you have a job, a home, savings, or anything else. They will garnish your wages, put liens on your house and car, grab your savings and do anything else they have to, but they will get paid unless you are destitute, owning nothing, unemployed and can then qualify for Medicaid.

However, this asshole has his belief system and it makes him feel warm, safe and superior. I wouldn't bet anything would penetrate his cement lined bubble until he, himself falls into the category of uninsured working person.

The way things are going, he will.

[Lydia Leftcoast]

31. Also, a lot of these people are so out of touch that they think that all cell phones

are expensive (I have a prepaid phone that I can keep for as little as $10 a month) and that DVD players are still as expensive as they were when they (the conservative) bought them as an early adopter.

The $10 cell phone may be the person's ONLY phone.

[fl_dem]

10. I would tell him that those points are moot

people without health insurance NO MATTER WHY, go to ER's, tally up a huge bill they cannot nor will pay and the costs are passed down to those of us who have insurance, as we all know our rates are higher to cover the costs of the non insured. IF EVERYONE had insurance, the ER's would be used for true emergencies and eventually the costs will decrease, as staffing etc..would decrease. But I like the first commenter realize that you cannot reason with the unreasonable, use logic with the illlogical...

[liberal N proud]

11. You can't explain to the stupid about circumstance

[Soylent Brice]

12. my response: "so, what's it like in Bizzaroworld?" or

"you're a fucking idiot"

or

"does it hurt when you think?"

or

"i have a bridge in Brooklyn i'd like to sell you..."

or

just laugh.

[L0oniX]

14. Yea ...let's all live out on the street so we can get free shit ...pffft

[Gman2]

15. I would look them straight in the eye, and ask, Are you saying that

my heart failure, caused by Bushes allowing chemical mfgs to not divulge risks for 6 years, and my subsequent inability to get Health ins, at any cost, is MY FAULT? And if they answered wrong, I might run their ass for fear of death.

[hileeopnyn8d]

16. Well,

I've seen that exact phrasing from right-wingers on the internet for over 10 years now, so my response would depend on how patient I was feeling and how many others may potentially see/hear that meme and believe it.

It comes up often on a non-political message board I belong to, lately I don't have the energy for the argument anymore, so I don't respond. Thankfully others have taken up the slack for me.

[Union Yes]

18. What if I have heart disease, cancer, or another serious illness and require surgery/hospitilization

Free clinics are great for treating minor illnesses but are almost helpless when it comes to treating serious illness. Free clinics almost never offer hospitilization or serious surgical procedures.

Proper health care, and affordable access to HC can return a person to health and enable them to gain employment and become self sufficient and get off of any welfare assistance they were recieving.

Ask that person why under our current system, do 44000+ Americans die annually.

Why can't Health Right stop 44000 from dieing? They aren't capable.

[wryter2000]

19. Tell him, "Prove it."

Prove that they have good cars and flat screen TVs. As for cell phones, mine costs $40 to $45 per month. What kind of health care could I get for that?

[wryter2000]

21. Also

Ask him how much lunch costs? $10? We generally work 20 days per month. Give up lunches and you get a total of $200. What kind of health insurance can you get for that?

[blondeatlast]

23. "Talking points are neat and easy. Truth is messy and hard--but I prefer it." nt

[lunatica]

24. He's made up his mind so don't confuse him further with facts

[Orsino]

26. "Dumbass." n/t

[devilgrrl]

28. I would tell that person that they're completely full shit!

Because they are.

I live in LA and poor people don't have nicer cars and probably don't have cable - if so, it is likely to be basic cable. High speed internet? What?

Where do people get this shit?

[madokie]

29. Sometimes people are so far out there that nothing can be said

its kind of like someone that has a 10 dollar item they want to start the bidding off at 100 dollars, the gap is just too wide the wrong way. I had to just trun my back on an aquaintenance last evening as my neighbor and I was working on a project he pops up some shit about how in some cases torture was alright, I just flatly said no it never is anytime and thats that, he left. I wasn't going to spend the rest of my time arguing with him as he is already lost. I think you may be in the same situation with this person.

:hi:
Hope the world is treating you good

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

30. The poor are only hungry because they stubbornly refuse to buy caviar.

[dajoki]

32. I wouldn't say much...

because it would be a waste of time. I would give him/her a look and walk away.

[jotsy]

33. Beyond the big ass 'bite me'? Well on the inside, anyway.

I see from these comments, you've met my in laws.

From there, I lead a pretty sheltered existence and don't get into conversations with folks in any kind of 'enthusiastic debate' settings. If I did, I'd be inclined to ask why it makes sense to keep paying so much to the people who have the least to do with the actual process. Follow up with the introduction to the Declaration of Independence and ask what promoting the general welfare of the public means to them. Lastly, I might suggest that the citizenry shouldn't be the bride at a shot gun wedding or betrothed to serial mass murderers for money.