Nader's on the front page of DU.

[LoZoccolo]

And Fonzie's waterskis coast him smoothly to the shore.

[WeDidIt]

1. Yep, DU has just choked on the pretzel.

It's sad, really.

The only thing sadder is, LGF has been more pro-Obama than DU lately.

[LoZoccolo]

Maybe we should go there.

I just keep thinking...where do we go? I used to like having a place to be a Democrat. I don't really have the time to put in to starting somewhere like DU used to be. I wonder where the reasonable people went. Maybe they're smart and stay completely off the net.

[freddie mertz]

61. Here is a suggestion, just in fun!

http://jonasbrothersfan.com/Community/Forum/tabid/265/Default.aspx

:rofl: :evilgrin:

[Toasterlad]

129. Don't Let the Door Hit You.

[Ken Burch]

138. DU was never a place where what non-Dems said was attacked simply because they WEREN'T Dems

It serves no purpose for DU to reject progressive ideas just because of their origin.

What we need to do is to embrace as much of the agenda that guy stood for as possible, because Democrats are SUPPOSED to stand up to the rich.

[suzie]

187. It seems strange to some of us, that a place called "Democratic Underground"

is a place where to admit that you're a Democrat will lead to a series of attacks by a gang of so-called "progressives".

[Ken Burch]

199. Nobody gets attacked for "admittihng they're a Democrat"

What people get disagreed with about is the idea that "electing the Democratic candidate" is all that matters, even when it turns out(as has abundantly been the case in THIS Congress)that said "Democrats" had no loyalty to the party's values at all.

[EFerrari]

2. Damn democracy.

[fishwax]

3. oh noes!

[grytpype]

4. Is this still Democratic Underground?

Hard to tell these days.

[WeDidIt]

5. As of a NAder thread with over 100 recs

It is now officially GreenUnderground.com

Or openrepublicansupporters.com, which is what the above amounts to any way.

[EFerrari]

7. My reality based friend, Nader is not a Green or a Republican.

Why do you hate America and free speech?

[WeDidIt]

10. Nader most certainly IS a Republican

that's where he gets his money to try and spoil races for Democratic candidates.

And you, sir, are most certainly NOT my friend. Your political goals have demonstrated themselves to be diametrically opposed to mine and thus you are my enemy.

[EFerrari]

18. And you apparently aren't careful enough to realize I'm not a sir.

Have a nice day. :)

[WeDidIt]

30. You, madame, are NOT my friend

You are my enemy.

[hfojvt]

43. you shouldn't be so quick to make and declare enemies

Nader voters should be our friends. They are against Republicans and DLC type Democrats. We, at least they and I, agree on many issues more than we disagree. It's only when the rubber meets the road in an election that they seem to shoot us in the foot. But it's not like Bill Clinton didn't aggravate the left either.

[EFerrari]

47. I, btw, am not a "Nader voter". I'm someone who can see the name

without having a tantrum.

[hfojvt]

89. I cannot summon that kind of equanimity (apathy?) over betrayal so foul

His name might as well be Seyss-Inquart.

[EFerrari]

94. It's not apathy. It's education.

Ralph Nader did not lose us that election. The Republican-rigged Florida vote did.

And we'd better get with it because they'll try it again.

[hfojvt]

95. I keep saying. It's not about Florida.

Nader cost Democrats in Wisconsin, Minnesota, New Hampshire, Iowa, Oregon and New Mexico.

[redqueen]

104. And he continues to pollute the waters

with his "not a dime's worth of difference" bullshit.

He won't be happy until we're all suffering so his little theory can be tested. And if millions more people in other countries have to die for us to get there, then so be it.

What he's too fucking stupid to get is that the super rich will never be suffering, so he goes on helping them like the utterly selfish, egostical moron he is.

[EFerrari]

105. But it was about Florida. Florida got all the press, was the focal point

in the media, dominated the discourse. Of course it was about Florida. The Bushes had Florida rigged and that's why is was all about Florida.

[suzie]

189. The Bushes had Florida rigged, by anyone who took a look at the votes in Florida

us aware that Nader won Florida for Bush.

To continue to assert otherwise, simply indicates a shared Republican sellout mentality with Nader.

[Toasterlad]

130. And Centrism Cost Pennsylvania ME in 2000.

Maybe if Democrats practiced what they preached, all the people voting for actual progessives would vote democrat instead.

Nader whiners are like 8 members on a baseball team who struck out at every at bat, but blame the loss of the game on the guy who takes the final out.

Maybe instead of looking around for someone else to blame, people could think about why the election was close enough to be "blown" by Nader?

[LoZoccolo]

136. >progessives would vote democrat instead

>would vote democrat instead
>vote democrat instead
>democrat instead
>democrat

:wow:

[Toasterlad]

167. Wow, You Are Really Reaching.

I'd be embarrassed for you if I had any respect for you.

[stevedeshazer]

146. Newsflash: Al Gore won Oregon in 2000.

What are you talking about?

[hfojvt]

166. I have linked this a number of times

but people still cannot stop talking about Florida.

http://journals.democraticunderground.com/hfojvt/118

Just ignore Florida and look at the Nader effect in some other states. From my journal entry.

"Gore lost New Hampshire by 7,211 votes or 1.27% and Nader took 3.91%. Was New Hampshire gonna be stolen anyway (as the argument goes about Florida). Change New Hampshire into the Gore column and Bush has 267 electoral votes to 270 for Gore and disaster is averted.

Gore won Iowa by 4,144 votes or .31% where Nader took 29,374
Gore won Wisconsin by 5,708 votes or .22% where Nader took 94,070
Gore won Minnesota by 58,607 votes or 2.4% where Nader took 126,696
Gore won New Mexico by 366 votes or .06% where Nader took 21,251
Gore won Oregon by 6,765 votes or .44% where Nader took 77,357
Gore lost Tennessee by 80,229 votes where Nader took 19,781 and was not really a factor, but Gore might have campaigned there or run more ads there if he was not worried about losing Florida, Iowa, Wisconsin, Oregon, Minnesota, New Hampshire or New Mexico."

Gore won Oregon by a sliver. Without Nader in the picture Gore could have won Oregon by over 80,000 votes. Instead of winning by .44% he could have won more comfortably at 5.4%. The fact that it was so close means that the Gore campaign had to divert resources to Oregon. Time and money that could have been spent trying to win Florida or Tennessee or New Hampshire. Consider that if Nader had taken another 24,194 votes and the media would have been talking about a Bush LANDSLIDE!!! Bush would win by 305 electoral votes to 232 rather than 271 to 266.

Just give me a time machine and let me go back to 1999 and show Nader the future and convince him to drop out, and Gore wins Oregon easily. He wins New Hampshire. He wins Iowa easier and Wisconsin, Minnesota, and New Mexico by larger margins. The campaign can spend more time and money in Tennesee instead of worrying about Wisconsin and Minnesota and Iowa. Nevada becomes competetive, putting more pressure on the Bush campaign. Just let 1/3 of the morons who voted for Nader in New Hampshire come to their senses and Gore wins the electoral college by 270 to 266 and all of the bullshit down in Florida and in the Supreme Court is moot.

This whole argument of "Florida got stolen so it's not Nader's fault" is just not looking at the big picture and the impact that Nader had in many other states, from New Hampshire to Oregon to New Mexico. And yes, again, for the ten billionth time, he had every right to have that impact, but the fact is that that impact lead to the Presidency of George Bush.

[suzie]

190. The Florida argument also overlooks that fact that, despite the Bush stealing of votes, it would

have only taken 9 more votes in each county of the state to win Florida for Gore.

I live in one of the most conservative counties in the entire state and I personally can point to at least 9 people who voted for Nader--and then joined local Democrats to whine about Bush for 8 years.

[ShortnFiery]

103. Also, with respect, Al Gore ran a crappy campaign and was, let's say, less than welcoming

to liberals with his choice of a running mate. :evilgrin:

[EFerrari]

107. I can't speak to that as at the time, had both hands full.

But looking back, no sh!t! :evilgrin:

How much more in our faces do we need this to get than realizing the DLC wanted us to vote for Joe?

[suzie]

188. Just because you want to continue that fantasy, doesn't mean it's true.

Nader lost Florida.

[bertman]

198. "Ralph Nader did not lose us that election. The Republican-rigged Florida vote did."

Thank you, EFerrari. You are absolutely correct. But don't expect the Dembulbs who cannot grasp reality to comprehend that OR your last comment "And we'd better get with it because they'll try it again." Has anyone heard a peep out of our Democratic leadership about the Republican-manufactured, programmed, and "maintained" voting machines that are being used all over the U.S. nowadays??


Crickets.

[WeDidIt]

79. There';s some mutually exlusive shit there

For example, one cannot be a Nader voter and be against Republicans.

Simply can't be done.

[EFerrari]

84. You should consider taking your strawmen on the road.

Do they sing? Dance? Tell good jokes?

lol

[hfojvt]

91. sure you can

just like I was against Republican but didn't vote for Clinton in 1992 or 1996. Sometimes you have to be against Democrats who talk like Republicans.

Thing is, if Dole had won in 1996, I would not be trying to dodge responsibility for helping that to happen. I didn't want Dole to win, but the media assured me he was gonna lose anyway. The hope was that Clinton would see that some lefties in Wisconsin were not happy with him and he would be motivated to change his evil ways. At least a little.

[WeDidIt]

128. No, you can't.

You actually supported the Republicans 100% in '92 and '96, you're just not admitting it.

[H2O Man]

139. Please.

That's just too shallow. Have a little self-respect.

[WeDidIt]

142. Not shallow at all

Just the truth of the matter.

In '92 and '96 there were precisely two choices, Clinton or a Republican.

There is no other choice under our system. To choose not to support the Democrat is to choose to support the Republican.

Those are the only choices under our system. Until our system is changed, it will remain that way.

[H2O Man]

143. Add incorrect

to shallow.

[WeDidIt]

145. Failure to recognize how our system functions

happens a lot amongst the polity.

[H2O Man]

147. Yes, you fail.

I must say that, as a life-long democrat who works to bring potential support from the left to the party, I resent the type of shit that you are attempting to stir up on DU recently. There are only two possible options that I can come up with: (1) you dopn't have a clue; or (2) your ill behavior is purposeful. Either way, I think that you are full of baloney.

[WeDidIt]

148. I've watched this shit for far too long

and I call it as I see it.

If that ruffles your feathers, so be it.

[H2O Man]

149. Not at all.

You lack the ability to ruffle anyone's feathers but your own. You and your friend are the only two whining here. I'm just taking the opportunity to express my contempt.

[WeDidIt]

150. And my contempt for anybody who DARES call themself "progressive"

and supports anything from Nader's mouth knows no bounds.

[H2O Man]

151. Wonderful.

I have a low opinion of Nader. But I recognize that other people can have very different views of him. It would be foolish for me to insult people who are sincere in their views of what he stands for. Considering that the majority of progressive folks in this country are not registered democrats, and that the majority of them do vote, it makes a lot more sense for me to attempt to reason with them -- and find common ground -- than to engage in the type of unattractive tantrums that you seek to comfort yourself with.

[WeDidIt]

152. And about .000000000001% of them post on DU

If you don't get the picture, I can draw it out any more for you.

[H2O Man]

153. If you are convinced

of that, perhaps you should venture to a place where your purity isn't threatened. Clown.

[WeDidIt]

154. My purity isn't threatned

jester.

[Raineyb]

140. Your example is only mutually exclusive in bizzarro land where up is down

and black is white.

You have it exactly backwards.

[EFerrari]

45. What a pointless, pathetic declaration.

[hfojvt]

32. even the Magistrate gets that wrong sometimes, ma'am

although he probably checks profiles

[freddie mertz]

27. Nader is not a Republican, he is an independent leftist.

But you knew that.

Sigh.

[WeDidIt]

29. Words are meaningless, results are everything.

The only results NAder gets is to drive the rightwing Republican Agenda further into the mainstream

Fuck that Republican whore.

[freddie mertz]

36. Words are not meaningless, though reading some stuff here might give that impression.

You remind me of Humpty-Dumpty.

[WeDidIt]

40. George Bush thanks you for your NAder Support

I'm sure Michael Steele will, too.

[freddie mertz]

46. Funny that. I have never supported him. Don't hate him either.

Sometimes he infuriates me.

Not this time though.

[sabrina 1]

123. Why are you trying to cover up

for the Republicans treasonous theft of the 2000 election?

[girl gone mad]

172. He's a "centrist"/DLCer.

Republicans are not his true enemy. Progressives and liberals are.

[sabrina 1]

176. I kind of thought so. Not much difference between them and rightwingnuts.

They really do hate real Democrats, don't they?

[spoony]

122. "Words are meaningless" Well thanks for summing up your posting philosophy

for everyone, I know I appreciated it.

[Don Caballero]

28. Agree a thousand percent

Nader is a spoiler. He holds no real beliefs and has no real ideas for change. He is most likely a Repug operative.

[Raineyb]

65. Spoiler implies that Democrats are entitled to one's vote.

It is in contradiction with the notion that politicians are to EARN one's vote.

Once again it would appear that people are learning the WRONG lessons from 2000. In addition there seems to be a problem with logic. Blaming Nader voters while giving a pass to Dems who actually voted for BUSH is disingenuous fuckery.

[EFerrari]

66. Cliches R Us!

[Flaneur]

67. Saying Nader is a Repulican is absurd.

It's as if you think one can only be a Democrat or a Republican. Even the choked-off US political party system is bigger than that.

I suspect Nader gets the recs because he speaks for a lot of left-leaning Democrats who wish the party would ever behave like a progressive party.

[bvar22]

81. Oh good.

That means that I'm an "enemy" too.
Please add me to your "list".

In our day these economic truths have become accepted as self-evident. We have accepted, so to speak, a second Bill of Rights under which a new basis of security and prosperity can be established for all—regardless of station, race, or creed.

Among these are:

The right to a useful and remunerative job in the industries or shops or farms or mines of the nation;

The right to earn enough to provide adequate food and clothing and recreation;

The right of every farmer to raise and sell his products at a return which will give him and his family a decent living;

The right of every businessman, large and small, to trade in an atmosphere of freedom from unfair competition and domination by monopolies at home or abroad;

The right of every family to a decent home;

The right to adequate medical care and the opportunity to achieve and enjoy good health;

The right to adequate protection from the economic fears of old age, sickness, accident, and unemployment;

The right to a good education.

[LoZoccolo]

11. He's not a Republican, he just takes their money and doesn't give it back.

Why do you think we should have FReepers on this site? That's democracy too.

[EFerrari]

16. Sigh. Do me a favor and run down for yourself our president's list

of major contributors.

And as for what I think, I think you're not a good mind reader, LoZo. :)

[seeinfweggos]

120. yep

http://www.realchange.org/nader.htm

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

14. I hate liars and racists.

Nader is both.

[Soylent Brice]

55. +1

[DevonRex]

56. +2. nt

[Luminous Animal]

58. Apparently, you like some

racists. See post #4

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x6922237#6922267

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

60. Nope.

The term "Uncle Tom" is not inherently racist.

[Luminous Animal]

68. So, tell me then, what makes Nader a racist?

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

71. On being left out of the debates...

Ralph Nader quipped, "I felt like a nigger."

[Luminous Animal]

80. Wrong.

He said that in response to the legal and political machinations to deny him a place on the ballot in Southern states.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

87. Well there you go.

He and his base are racists.

[Luminous Animal]

92. I don't find making a personal analogy to a strategy that, historically (& currently)

kept one segment of the population off the ballot in certain states, racist.

The Democratic Southern white power structure fought to keep Nader, a man of Lebanese descent, off the ballot in Southern states.

I'm also not offended by Ono's "Woman is the Nigger of the World".

But, go ahead, keep tossing around the word "racist" if it makes you feel better.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

93. Oh, no, of course you don't believe Ralph Nader isn't a racist.

:crazy:

[Luminous Animal]

97. So, you think that Ono is a racist, too?

And Patti Smith? How about Byrd and his white nigger comment?

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

101. Ono and Smith are using different contexts and are covered by artistic license.

Byrd's a well known bigot.

[Luminous Animal]

110. There was nothing wrong with Nader's context.

He specifically evoked Jim Crow laws used to deny the franchise. In both cases, southern white political power brokers sought to restrict access to the ballot.

It's pretty odd that when he said it in 2005, nobody seemed too worked up about it. Now, 4.5 years later, when the viciousness of the Democrat's tactics to keep Nader off of state ballots and deplete his campaign funds are barely a memory, it's time to smear Nader with the clearly false accusation of being a racist. Many southern state's ballot access rules are arcane and devised specifically to stymie populace 3rd party efforts that might appeal to black voters.

[kath]

99. So the book "The Student as Nigger" is racist???

sheesh.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

102. No, but people making excuses for Nader are.

[Luminous Animal]

112. So, you are calling me a racist?

Hahahahaha!!!! You've got nothing.

[d_b]

160. what do you expect from a shitty gimmick?

[Forkboy]

181. I'd love to play cards with HFPS as he only carries one card with him.

[sabrina 1]

127. I believe that the hatred for Nader is racist.

I hadn't realized he was of Arab descent until relatively recently. That explained a lot about the unhinged, hateful vitriol that never sense to me. Now it does, I guess the propaganda from the right, demonizing all people of Arab descent has caught on even on the 'left'. Sad to witness ~ I don't hate racists, I feel sorry for them. Hate is what racists are about. I prefer not to join them.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

156. Oh yeah, that Ralph Nader.

Race victim extraordinaire.

This is rich.

[LynneSin]

26. Nader is also not a democrat and oh we really did appreciate him giving us Bush

:grr:

[EFerrari]

48. I missed the part where Nader was on the Supreme Court.

[LynneSin]

183. Probably when you missed the part where Nadar kept screaming how Gore was no different than Bush

and had impact on several states.

[RetroLounge]

114. Do you guys get together and learn the parrot talk?

Nader gave us Bush, squawk!

yeah, I remember when Nader was appointed to the supreme court.

and when Gore picked Nader as his running mate.

Yeah.

:eyes:

RL

[HughMoran]

35. Yes, 'your' reality

Not mine.

Have you ever considered some of the nonsense Nader has spewed against Democrats over the years?

[HughMoran]

41. Is it not permissible to criticize Nader on the Democratic Underground?

He is neither a Democrat, nor is he a 'friend' of Democrats.

Is it OK with you if WE exercise our right of free speech to CRITICIZE Ralph Nader?

[DevonRex]

44. Nader is for either one of them as long as they'll donate for him to run against Dems.

Because he thinks the Democratic Party has to be destroyed to make America better. So he's slime in my book. Oh, and he's a liar.

[EFerrari]

50. Not really. He's a critic of the party for their caving in to money

just as a lot of people are.

[DevonRex]

57. So he takes Republican money since they're so ethical and all.

:eyes:

[EFerrari]

62. Go to Open Secrets and do a casual search for "republican" money.

[Luminous Animal]

69. Kerry recevied at least 10.7 million from Republicans in 2004. Ralph about $150,000.

[EFerrari]

75. This Nader thing is irrational.

I understand people being angry but it's been NINE YEARS and you'd think they'd have some facts in hand by now. Of course, I still remember my mom losing my Avon sample lipstick in her rush to church when I was five. lol

[Name removed]

115. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[girl gone mad]

173. and Obama appoints Republicans to his administration..

what's your point?

[Better Believe It]

15. I think you're confusing Nader with Republicans for Obama

[berni_mccoy]

13. Nadercratic Underground?

[LoZoccolo]

17. Thing is, this thread will probably get locked or deleted, or maybe I'll get tombstoned.

When really I'm not making any comments about DU that are worse than the ones being made here about the Democratic Party that are, by their longevity, considered "constructive criticism". If they weren't they'd be locked because they'd be against the rules.

[freddie mertz]

51. This is silly.

Like Oasis.

[EFerrari]

86. Oh, don't do that.

I support your right to be mad about Nader.

[RetroLounge]

116. "or maybe I'll get tombstoned."

If wishes were horses...

RL

[suzie]

194. So, let' see. The agenda is this--hope that all those who are pro-Democrats

on "Democratic Underground" get tombstoned.

Then, every single thread all day long can be about how terrible Democrats are and especially how terrible Obama is. And no one can say that the trashing of Obama by the rightwing is racist, because supposed Democrats do it on Democratic Underground.

And the media can point to the fact that the Democratic base dislikes Obama, witness the threads on Democratic Underground.

Except that everyone who calls themselves a Democrat will have been driven away from the site by the Naderites--who are basically Republicans.

Wow. Great strategy going there.

[Electric Monk]

6. Jealous?

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

8. Eeek! Get the smelling salts, Aunt Zoccolo's got the vapors!

[dionysus]

9. !

:rofl:
Oasis save us!!!

[superduperfarleft]

38. Dammit, you beat me to it. n/t

[flvegan]

111. LOL!!

:rofl:

[RetroLounge]

117. And what the hell is a Wonderwall anyhow?

:rofl:

RL

[LoZoccolo]

157. It's a movie. George Harrison wrote the soundtrack. n/t

[TheWatcher]

12. I'm sorry, did you say something?

[struggle4progress]

19. One ought to study how Nader put his ideas into action thirty or forty-five years ago:

his present views are not new, and in his heyday they motivated him to effective action, that took a variety of forms, including a number of nonprofit citizen advocacy organizations. The views themselves are considerably less interesting if unaccompanied by action

[onehandle]

20. Don't worry. This isn't the real world.

In the real world, Nader is ignored for the most part.

[EFerrari]

22. Right. He won't be real until Rahm issues orders to ignore him

every week or so. :)

[apocalypsehow]

21. Man who singlehandedly did more to give us eight years of W Bush, on the front page with recs galore

Sick business - but not surprising given the overflow of undercover Freepii who have started to tear those masks off around here lately. All the while snarling and posing as more progressive-than-thou.

[RetroLounge]

118. Nader was on the supreme court?

:eyes:

RL

[apocalypsehow]

164. There would have been no "supreme court" (Sic) intervention had not nutty Nader's massive ego led

him on into his quixotic, Messianic crusade to destroy Democrats.

Did you vote for him? Because if you did you are just as guilty of the crimes and errors of Bush & Co. as those who punched the ballot for Bush/Cheney.

Own it.

[sabrina 1]

125. Nine years later and you're still ignorant of the facts

of the 2000 election. Do you have access to Google? If not, I'd be happy to bring you up to date.

[apocalypsehow]

165. Nine years later and you're still aping those Germans who said "we didn't mean for Hitler to

stay in power...we just thought all the parties sucked, and imagined Germany would just ride out what we thought would be a brief Nazi storm, until we could get a really good Social Democrat government in office...sorry about that, Rest-of-the-World, but don't blame us...."

:thumbsdown:

[sabrina 1]

168. Wow! That post explains everything. I definitely

under-estimated the seriousness of the pathology of the Nader-hater brigade.

I think I'll save that post as exhibit A to describe Nader haters to those who haven't seen them in action. At least I got something out of this little exchange.

And to think I was actually giving you credit for having some intelligence ~ :eyes:

[suzie]

195. No, you're the one who is ignorant of the facts of the 2000 election.

BTW, where in Florida did you live in 2000?

[Starry Messenger]

23. Guess you'd better start a K & R if you love

Oasis thread.

[freddie mertz]

34. Oasis sucks. Really.

Beatles rule.

[Starry Messenger]

39. There's some history in this area.

Do a DU search for the OP with keyword "Oasis". It's an old joke here. :D

[freddie mertz]

49. I searched! 2005-6 especially rich in references.

I guess the mid-oughts were close to their peak, or the period just before that.

Bit of a fade-out since though, eh?

:rofl: :spray: :hide: :popcorn: :yoiks:

[Starry Messenger]

64. I thought you'd get a kick out of that.

:) Now we're back to the Nader Period.

[freddie mertz]

72. Instant nostalgia's gonna get you! nt.

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :popcorn: :popcorn: :hide: :hide: :hide: :yoiks:

[AllentownJake]

24. Is a shit statement

I don't know...thought I'd try your language for communication.

[freddie mertz]

25. Cry baby cry, make your mother sign... she's old enough to know better...

So cry baby cry....


:cry:

[Capn Sunshine]

31. EEEEEEEEEEY

Yo Ralphie boy
Anyway, about this movie. Basically, it’s the story of three best high school buds. They do everything together. They learn about life, play basketball, hang out at a local burger joint for some sodas. There’s a streetwise quasi-hoodlum with a heart of gold that gives them true life advice too. Oh, and it’s set in the year 2134, and robots police the whole place. And it’s up to the three buddies to help overthrow the evil robot state and free mankind from the shackles of android tyranny. The hero of the whole thing is a short, nebbishy redhead with rhyming names, who goes on this killing spree when his buddies are captured in the second act. He also has this steamy love scene with Erin Moran. There’s partial frontal nudity, but it’s tasteful.

[Uncle Joe]

33. I view that as a positive testament to the democratic process with ideas and issues rising or

falling based on their merit.

The real strength and power of D.U. is it's logical and open deliberation, whether we like the messenger or not.

[superduperfarleft]

37. ZOMG What is the world coming to???!!!

Someone get me my smelling salts...

[Nikki Stone1]

42. Does anyone really listen to Nader anymore?

I think he's just jumping on the bandwagon here. The progressives know this bill is garbage and Nader has decided he needs to have a role in this.

[JelloSka]

52. How dare many people recommend something I don't like!

Interestingly, the OP chooses to stay silent about what was it that Nader said that many DU'ers agreed with. Presumably, OP believes that Nader's statement was hard to refute.

[freddie mertz]

74. Don't you get it? "Nader" is a BOOGAH!! word...

Like "Hamsher"!

Or "Firebaggers"!

It may SEEM to be silly and childish, but it's all some folks have to cling to in these difficult times.



O8) :party:

[Romulox]

53. Far better he than LOLOLZocco, says I! nt

[FLAprogressive]

83. +1

[dionysus]

54. may the members of Oasis catch leprosy and perish.

[DevonRex]

59. ZOMG. Nader's in Oasis?????? Is he the snotty brother or the one

who can actually play the guitar?

[freddie mertz]

73. I thought he joined the Jonas Brothers!

He's the older but still cute one!

:party: :evilfrown: :evilgrin: :toast: :crazy:

[DevonRex]

113. OMG.

:scared:

:rofl:

[spoony]

124. I always figured the brothers would knife each other or something nt

[change_notfinetuning]

63. Why are some people so obsessed with Nader? I don't get it. Surely, he is

on our side more than many Democrats in Congress. Oh, that's the side that sees "reality", and says, "That's really stupid, shameful, disgraceful, asinine, tragic, uncaring, inefficient, hypocritical, primitive, criminal, bullshit . . . surely, we could do better. Can't we?"

And, I say again, Nader isn't the one to blame for Bush. Try blaming Al Gore, who would have been president if he had only won his home state of Tennessee. Presidential candidates always win their home states. Except for Gore. Maybe he should have allowed Clinton to campaign on his behalf.

[Luminous Animal]

85. Conditioning. It's a pavlovian response to a strategy cooked up by the power brokers...

in order to deflect attention from corrupt elections, a corrupt Supreme Court, and to keep us voting time after time after time for the corporate candidate.

[QC]

70. I clutched my pearls so hard the string broke.

Now I am on my hands and knees, picking them out of the carpet.

[EFerrari]

82. LOL

[Ignis]

90. ...

:spray:

[leftstreet]

162. LOL

:spray:

[Tailormyst]

76. I gave it a kick just for you!

[rug]

77. So is a video of Nancy Pelosi explaining away the public optiom.

There are no coincidences.

[seeinfweggos]

78. ralph nader is a republican whore

i wonder how much of the good stuff he accomplished early in his career was wiped out by the bush administration he helped elect.

[EFerrari]

88. Ralph Nader did not elect Bush. The fact is, that election was filthy

and a stacked court selected Bush.

And then we had a rerun 2004.

[suzie]

196. No, Nader chose to elect Bush.

The election was filthy, but without Nader, no Bush.

[KG]

96. dooga, dooga. dooga!

[laylah]

98. Won't read...he sucks...I

blame him for the past 8 years *donning flame suit* He's an asshole, lost ALL of his credibility that he had built up over the years, IMVHO.

[ShortnFiery]

100. It's too damn easy to push your buttons LoZoccolo. eom

[Edweird]

106. I don't like him, but he's right. Deal with it.

[janx]

108. How Bout a Little Street Theatre?

How Bout Some Puppets?




http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x7408845

[mmonk]

109. Nader isn't the Democrats' problem. He is a reminder of what is.

[Toasterlad]

131. Bingo.

[Forkboy]

182. Best post in the whole damn thread.

People latch on to the man without looking at the context that created his runs. And if they do look at it they want to brush it off as merely ego (as if every one who runs for office isn't loaded for bear in the ego department).

[Mayberry Machiavelli]

119. "You know, FOX turned into a hard core sex channel so gradually, I didn't even notice. "

-Marge Simpson

[spoony]

121. Nader? Eh doesn't afraid of anything. nt

[TexasObserver]

126. He's a scum bag, but he has a following among the immature.

He's a GOP lackey. He's their personal valet.

[ima_sinnic]

132. so Republicans voted for Nader?

how did that cause Gore to lose?

[TexasObserver]

133. Thanks for proving my point.

[LoZoccolo]

134. No kidding.

Why do people think they've defeated the argument by pretending they don't understand it?

[ima_sinnic]

159. your "point" is shit

if Democrats "would have" voted for Gore, why didn't they?

[TexasObserver]

161. My point is that immaturity compels support for Nader.

And post such as yours prove it.

[ima_sinnic]

171. awww, somebody didn't vote the way you wanted them to?

what compels support for republicans?
what compels lack of support for any candidate, manifested as total apathy and not voting?
what compels writing in "Howdy Doody" or "fido"?

[TexasObserver]

175. And you consistently prove my point.

Your posts are immature, like your choices.

[ima_sinnic]

177. you got nothing. People didn't vote for Gore because they didn't want to

you attribute it to "immaturity"--that is your opinion.
The reason Gore "lost" (actually, he won) or didn't get more votes, is the fault of Gore. Not enough people wanted to vote for him--or his traitorous dead-weight asshole running mate LIEberman.
If the DLC hasn't learned anything by now, you will be "blaming" some other third-party candidate in the next election. People vote for the candidate that most appeals to their needs and wants, not who they are "supposed" to vote for. Gore just didn't do it for enough people--rightly, as it turns out, very little difference was seen between Democrats and republicans. If you think Nader "stole" votes from Gore, maybe you should figure out what was "wrong" about Gore.

[TexasObserver]

180. Ralph Nader, and the fools who voted for him in key states, cost Gore the presidency.

Your posts abundantly demonstrate you are simply incapable of understanding any of this.

[ima_sinnic]

185. oh boo hoo, people voted in a democracy for the candidate they wanted

you'd think the DLC fake "democrats" would catch the clue train about it.

[TexasObserver]

186. When you can communicate as an adult, get back to me.

[ima_sinnic]

193. oh, okay, I get it: when I agree with you, get back to you

when I agree that people should be "realistic" and ONLY vote for the corporate candidates, I'll be considered "mature" enough to talk to the grand pooh-bah.

:rofl:

[Raineyb]

141. Pot meet kettle.

The most immature posts I've seen are the ones decrying Nader as though the people who voted for Bush or the Supreme Court have no responsibility for Bush having been selected.

[TexasObserver]

144. See, just like that.

The immaturity thing by his adherents.

You refuse to accept that Ralph Nader is a guy who hurt the Democratic party, the American people, and the world in 2000 with his ego driven third party run. He's right up there with George W. Bush as a scoundrel of this century.

[Raineyb]

170. Ralph Nader is not a Democrat. And if Democrats actually GOVERNED

in the manner in which they campaigned it wouldn't be so easy to pick off people who are looking for principled progressives in government would it?

Nader didn't cause Gore to lose. And you show your immaturity by refusing to hold those responsible for Gore's lost. That would be Gore with a great deal of help from the Supreme court. Nader had every right to run for office. He's under no obligation to make it easer for Democrats. If Democrats fail to earn votes it's not the fault of the weakest of their opponents.

[TexasObserver]

174. There are several who are responsible, and Nader is one of them.

Your argument is disingenuous and simple minded. The 2000 election was stolen, but it could be stolen because Ralph Nader helped Bush steal several states.

You can spend the rest of your life in your self imposed delusional state, but you can't change the facts. Nader's presence on the ballot gave several states to Bush, and that sealed his victory. I don't expect you to be able to understand the concept, and even if you did, your denial won't allow you to see the truth.

You know what you can do with Ralph Nader.

[ima_sinnic]

178. so everybody who voted for Nader would have voted for Gore?

[TexasObserver]

179. Your posts reveal an inability to think about this logically.

Everyone who voted for Nader would not have voted for Gore, but many of those Nader voters would have voted for Gore if Nader had not been on the ballot.

Try finding a Republican who voted for Nader. Try finding a conservative who voted for Nader.

Your lack of logic prevents you from understanding this simple concept.

[ima_sinnic]

184. but many people who didn't vote at all "would have" voted for Gore

if they'd only been "moved" to (gee, I wonder why they weren't? didn't they know how bad bush was going to be? didn't they care? but it didn't matter anyway, because it was only people who voted for Nader who caused bush to be appointed by the SC)
many people who wrote in names "would have" voted for Gore if they didn't have that option (but why the hell didn't they vote for Gore? but again, it doesn't matter, because ONLY those who voted for Nader voted "wrong").
many people who voted for other 3rd party candidates "would have" voted for Gore (but they DIDN'T, did they?--can't be that Gore simply didn't appeal to some number of voters, now, can it?).

In addition, I'd be willing to bet that many republicans couldn't stomach bush, but they didn't want to vote for a democrat either.

isn't it sad that we live in a democracy, where anybody who wants to (within certain criteria) can run for public office? even sadder, people can vote for whomever the hell they want!! oh the horror!! if only we could be like Iran, where your candidate would be guaranteed to win every time!

oh, and by the way, don't think Nader hatred is going to dissuade voters from doing the same thing in 2012 if they feel they've been cheated, lied to, and let down. Nader hatred and Palin threats are not going to win votes for "your" side in that case.


I think you'd be happier in some Middle Eastern country where you wouldn't have this "problem" of voters actually voting for candidates they want to vote for.

[suzie]

197. Just because Nader was under no obligation to make it easy for Democrats doesn't mean

that he's not a Republican sellout who deliberately steered the 2000 election to Bush.

[nomaco-10]

135. Why Do This?????

Don't you remember how he served our purposes in times past??? Nader is just a pathetic scape goat at this point. I would hope we're all above that at this point in time.

It just seems disingenuous at this point in time to bring him up again and again. He's old news.

Bring up LIEberLIAR. I'm all on board for that.

[Ken Burch]

137. Look, the fact that Nader was the one making the good observations doesn't discredit them

What matters is the message, not the messenger.

[LoZoccolo]

155. Well...

...a lot of other people can say (and have been saying) the same things.

[Fading Captain]

158. Nader represents Democratic values. Too many Democrats don't know what that even means

That's why you see this.


The Dems in 2009 on health care and war show us why Nader ran.

[RetroLounge]

163. Over 150 replies, and still negative recs

I guess Nader is more popular than Oasis!

:rofl:

RL

[LoZoccolo]

169. Well let's see here.

If I post a thread about DU jumping the shark, and it really had, would I expect it to be met with mass approval?

[lumberjack_jeff]

191. You mean "popular" doesn't mean "right"?

I rec'd, just for the heck of it. I check in periodically to try to find something worthwhile to read. This month, you're it.

[Dr.Phool]

192. I thought it was all those Jewish voters in West Palm that voted for Buchanan!

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: