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MadHound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-11-10 10:09 AM
Original message
On third party support
There comes a point in time when politics as usual simply doesn't work in this country. When those of us on the left find that continued support for the Democratic party is not just not getting us anywhere, but where it is actually hurting us. Let us examine a couple of those times in the past, and see why a third party threat can be a good thing, both for the people and for the Democratic party.

Many of you around here have heard my first example, FDR, but let me go through it again.

After FDR was elected many on the left in this country didn't believe that FDR was moving far enough or fast enough. Thus they started exploring other parties and the one that grew to be the biggest threat to FDR's first re-election campaign was the Socialist party. FDR became acutely aware of this threat from the left and he quickly went about defusing it. He took two large planks from the Socialist party platform and made them his own, pushing them through Congress as part of the second New Deal package. Good thing too, otherwise we wouldn't have Social Security or Unemployment insurance.

This political move did indeed endear him to the left in this country and the Socialist party threat was defused.

The other example is from the largest depression before the Great Depression, the one in the 1890's. During this crisis there arose a vast, left leaning movement called the Populists. Not only was it a political party, but is was a movement to help those who had been left out in the cold by both parties, especially the Democrats in the South. This party was particularly successful in the election of 1892, electing dozens of office holders throughout the South and Midwest. But since it was a loose knit affair, it quickly fell apart after the election. Yet the threat posed by this party forced to the Democrats to address many of the issues near and dear to the Populists, like crop prices, minting more silver, etc. In essence, out of self preservation, the Democrats moved to the left.

That is the value of third parties. They may not win much at the ballot box, but they scare the shit out of the established parties, to the point where one of those established parties actually moves in the direction of the third party. This is simple political evolution, the people are pissed, they express it via a third party, and a mainline party moves in to woo those voters. Essentially third parties act as a check on both parties becoming too cozy with each other, a situation that we're faced with today.

In response, don't be terribly surprised when a third party pops up to make a serious run at the Democrats, just consider it as political evolution and a chance for the Democratic party to move back to its liberal roots and base.
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sabbat hunter Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-11-10 10:11 AM
Response to Original message
1. Right now
I see more far right wing parties having a chance of popping up, due to hatred of Obama.

like the tea baggers.
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MadHound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-11-10 10:12 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. Possibly, but with the ongoing wars and measures like HCR
The left in this country is pissed and looking for a new home.
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StarfarerBill Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-11-10 10:42 AM
Response to Original message
3. If the best a third party can do is pressure the DP back to the left, that's great.
Edited on Mon Jan-11-10 10:56 AM by StarfarerBill
Still, having more alternatives, as many other countries do, is more desirable than our current duopoly.
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MadHound Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-11-10 11:09 AM
Response to Reply #3
5. I agree with you, I would love to see a multiparty system
But the fact of the matter is that under our current set of rules, the best that third parties can do is influence the other two major parties.

Personally I think that we need to exercise that power, quickly.
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dionysus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-11-10 09:10 PM
Response to Reply #5
8. knowing that a leftist third party will ensure republican victory, you want to push that? really?
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sharesunited Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-11-10 11:20 AM
Response to Reply #3
6. Those which have parliamentary systems give lesser parties the chance at actual governing power.
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Pharaoh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-11-10 10:46 AM
Response to Original message
4. K&R
Edited on Mon Jan-11-10 10:55 AM by Pharaoh
I am pissed too and very disappointed in the Democratic party and this worthless 2 party system, the corporations own them both. That should begin to be plain to see for everybody right now.


http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x7438496


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DKRC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-11-10 08:54 PM
Response to Reply #4
7. Added Dorgan to your list nt
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WeDidIt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-11-10 09:13 PM
Response to Original message
9. third parties do nothing other than be self defeating
And that's the historical fact.
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dionysus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-11-10 09:16 PM
Response to Reply #9
10. not self defeating. whatever party that is closest in ideology to theirs defeating.
Edited on Mon Jan-11-10 09:16 PM by dionysus
basically the OP advocates pulling voters aways from dems... so we'll lose.

you can't spin it any other way.
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leftstreet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-11-10 09:16 PM
Response to Original message
11. It'd be nice if we had two parties to begin with
Right now The Central Leadership Corporation could stand some opposition
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TexasObserver Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-11-10 09:22 PM
Response to Original message
12. Nader helped Bush, and Perot helped Clinton.
No need to go back to FDR.
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UTUSN Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-11-10 10:05 PM
Response to Original message
13. Uh: No?!1 n/t
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Vidar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-11-10 11:11 PM
Response to Original message
14. K&R.
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readmoreoften Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Mon Jan-11-10 11:12 PM
Response to Original message
15. K&R
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