Amish, others who have "religious" objection to insurance can opt out of mandate

[Bluebear]

WASHINGTON — Federal health care reform will require most Northern New Yorkers — but not all, it turns out — to carry health insurance or risk a fine.

Hundreds of Amish families in the region are likely to be free from that requirement.

The Amish, as well as some other religious sects, are covered by a "religious conscience" exemption, which allows people with religious objections to insurance to opt out of the mandate. It is in both the House and Senate versions of the bill, making its appearance in the final version routine unless there are last-minute objections.

Although the Amish consist of several branches, some more conservative than others, they generally rely upon a community ethic that disdains government assistance. Families rely upon one another, and communities pitch in to help neighbors pay health care expenses...

Sen. Charles E. Schumer, D-N.Y., who was a key negotiator on the Senate bill, supports the religious exemption, said a spokesman, Maxwell Young, who called the provision a "no brainer."





http://www.watertowndailytimes.com/article/20100109/NEWS02/301099964

[MercutioATC]

1. The ranks of the Amish are about to swell.

[joeybee12]

2. Hmmm...that religion does seem to make sense to me now...n/t

[laughingliberal]

4. I predict mass conversions. nt

[earth mom]

11. I'm thinking about it and I'm agnostic.

:spray:

[laughingliberal]

13. Lol! New action alert

Everyone email the White House and say if the Senate bill passes in its current form we're all converting to Amish. I think 1000's of emails showing up at once with this would be funny and effective.

:rofl:

[tammywammy]

21. Doubtful n/t

[doc03]

3. Amish have money to burn n/t

[kenny blankenship]

5. Because only religious people can have consciences.

I mean, for real consciences. Consciences that the government will tiptoe around and for which the government will ignore its own rules in order to accommodate. Everyone else who claims to have a conscience is just a liar and a remorseless bastard. If you think your imaginary friend wouldn't want you to participate with your fellow citizens in a mutual assistance program that would preserve health and save lives, YOU can give us all the finger in His holy name. As a country we consider that fine and beyond questioning. But if on the other hand, you object to the federal govt. robbing people of their money to make insurance companies rich(er), than you can just go fuck yourself and we consider you a terrible person. And if you refuse to participate in this crony-capitalist armed robbery because it deeply offends your conscience, you can expect a call from the IRS and the Federal Marshals.

[Uncle Joe]

6. I believe that would be violating the First Amendment.

Thanks for the thread, Bluebear.

[NightWatcher]

7. looks like time again to start my own religion... we shall be called The Ale-ers

a very open minded sect that believes that beer is good and aside from that, you make your own rules.

Check in if you'd like to be made a high priest (aka Big Mug)

We will apply for every tax dodge and gimmie that we can get away with....

[Cairycat]

8. Great - let's pile on the misconceptions

Some Amish are well off - from living simply and managing money well. But many more have been hit pretty hard with the economic problems affecting the rest of the country.

No one says that non-religious people don't have a conscience. The Amish believe that reliance on the government is not right for them, that interdependence within the religious community should replace it, and therefore they want to be exempted from the mandate.

But don't let any inconvenient facts get in the way of your religion-bashing fun.

[doc03]

10. I don't know about the Amish in Iowa if there are any but

in Ohio they are doing quite well. They operate a whole county full of craft stores selling crafts made on China. They don't believe in modern machinery but they have no problem using modern machinery when it comes to building homes for the "English". They practically own Holmes county and now they are buying up the farm land around here, us Englishn don't have that kind of money. My neighbor worked as a carpenter all his life and he says their homes look nice on the outside but underneath they break every rule of carpentry there is. They do a lot of hunting around the area they don't think game laws pertain to them either they kill any deer they see doe, fawn, buck it doesn't matter. Same goes for fishing laws.

[girl gone mad]

18. There is an Amish furniture store near me.

Everything in it is insanely expensive.

[The Straight Story]

15. That freedom of religion thing seems to bother some a great deal

And the bigoted/stereotypes flow from ignorance while usually progressive people turn into the type of people they rail against.

[Bluebear]

17. I see.

[Bluebear]

16. So, you suggest we don't discuss it, because posting this information is "religion-bashing fun"? Wow

Was the newspaper bashing religion too when they posted the same article?

[Cairycat]

19. Unclear how you think I suggested this not be discussed ...

My point was that true information should be used in the discussion, not stereotypes and digs at religion in general. Straight Story's reply #15 is excellent but seems beyond the grasp of many DUers.

No one, least of all me, claims the Amish are perfect, any more than "English" are perfect. They do seem to hold to the interdependence of the religious community (the "Gemeinde") quite well, and I support their request for exemption from the mandate. They seem to come from a mindset that differs from the "rugged individualism" espoused by the Rethugs but also from the idea that mutual support must be on a country level.

[Bluebear]

23. Your repoly was to me. There was no "dig at religion" made by posting the article,

anymore than the original newspaper was making any "religious dig" by printing it. The point being, do you support anybody else being expempted from the mandate based on something other than religious belief?

[Uncle Joe]

24. I was wondering about Libertarians? It seems to me, for the government to give special discretion

to any religion when the same principle isn't applied to the non-believers, is in fact giving respect to a single religion or all religion and thus violates the First Amendment.

The same can be said for treating the gay community differently in regards to not respecting or allowing their marriages.

[Dr.Phool]

9. I can go from Atheist to Amish overnight.

[ddeclue]

12. I think I've just become Amish.. pardon me while I destroy this computer.. it's the devil's instrumt

:P

[WildEyedLiberal]

14. I believe the Amish are exempt from Social Security taxes as well

So this really isn't unprecedented and the comments in this thread are misleading. The Amish believe in setting themselves apart, and have historically tried - and won - the right not to be taxed for programs their culture does not partake of. They are also exempt from laws that require children to attend school until age 16 - most Amish are educated only through the 8th or 9th grade, and then begin apprenticeships or otherwise join the work force. The Amish are also conscientious objectors and are exempt from any military draft.

This isn't the same as some random "church" deciding not to pay taxes because the Amish lifestyle is radically different from the average American's.

[Nikki Stone1]

20. Is there a pagan religion that I can join that has a conscience issue with the mandate?

I don't look good in a bonnet.

[upi402]

22. ugh, don't expect rationality and fairness I suppose. n/t

[Stevenmarc]

25. Oh great now I'm going to have to join Farmville and have a barn raising

[dysfunctional press]

26. what a coincidence...i had a vision from GOD last night...and he called me to start the true church.

the ONE true church.
and one of the principal tenets of that religion is to shun anything short of single-payer healthcare for all.

Praise! His Holy name!