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Employer Mandate Dropped: 5 Million to Lose Coverage, Millions More to See Coverage Get Worse - FDL

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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 07:47 PM
Original message
Employer Mandate Dropped: 5 Million to Lose Coverage, Millions More to See Coverage Get Worse - FDL
Employer Mandate Dropped: 5 Million to Lose Coverage, Millions More to See Coverage Get Worse
By: Jon Walker Wednesday January 13, 2010 1:33 pm

<snip>

Perhaps the most consequential decision in the health care negotiations between the House and Senate may have been made yesterday without much fanfare. The decision was to drop the House’s employer mandate and go with the Senate’s much weaker “free rider” provision. This decision will result in 5 million fewer uninsured individuals gaining coverage because of reform, will likely dramatically reduce the quality of the insurance coverage for another 10 million Americans, and reduce government revenue by over $100 billion.

5 Million More Without Coverage

The Senate bill only expands coverage to 31 million people who would otherwise be projected to not have insurance in 2019. The House bill is projected to expand coverage to 36 million. The primary reasons the House bill covers 5 million more people is due to the employer mandate, a provision now rumored to have been dropped.

Over A $100 Billion In Less Revenue

The employer mandate in the House bill collects $135 billion in fines from employers who do not provide coverage. The Senate bill’s free rider provision will only collect $28 billion. In addition to collecting $107 billion less, the Senate’s weak free rider provision will encourage employers to drop coverage and have their employee get tax credits on the new exchange. This, in turn, will drive up the cost of reform even further.

9-10 Million With Worse Coverage

The Senate bill’s weak penalty on employers combined with tax credits for individuals without employer-provided coverage, will result in employers dropping coverage for roughly 9-10 million people, according to the CBO. 9-10 million individuals who would otherwise have received coverage from their employer will not as a result of the Senate bill. On the other hand, the House’s employer mandate would result in a 6-7 million net increase in individuals with employer-provided coverage.

The 9-10 million people who will be dropped from their employer provided coverage as a result of the Senate plan will likely get insurance on the new exchanges instead. It will primarily be small businesses and companies that employ many low-income workers that drop coverage. The quality of insurance on the new exchange is of a much lower quality than typical employer-provided coverage from small businesses. This means millions of the people will likely end up with worse coverage.

Long Term

I think the CBO is dramatically underestimating the effect of the Senate’s free rider provision. Providing an individual with coverage costs several thousand dollars, while not providing coverage only results in a $750-per-employee fine. With employers knowing their employees will still be able to get health insurance, even get extra government money to buy insurance, it will make strong financial sense to stop providing coverage. This will result in millions shifting from employer-provided coverage into the exchange, where the minimum standards and quality of insurance is just very bad.

The employer mandate in the House bill was one of the most important funding and coverage expansion mechanisms in the reform proposal. Dropping it will result in a major loss of revenue that could have been used to increase affordability tax credits on the exchange, a serious decrease in the number of individuals who will gain coverage, and millions getting lower quality health insurance. While the employer mandate has not gotten much media attention, dropping it in favor of the free rider provision will make reform substantially less progressive. It could also imperil the long term success of reform.

<snip>

Link: http://fdlaction.firedoglake.com/2010/01/13/employer-mandate-dropped-5-million-to-lose-coverage-millions-more-to-see-coverage-get-worse/

:banghead:

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AzDar Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 07:48 PM
Response to Original message
1. Kill This Bill... (before it kills us)
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Mari333 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 07:49 PM
Response to Original message
2. knr
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Cleita Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 07:51 PM
Response to Original message
3. It get's worse and worse.
I am truly disappointed that of all the industrial nations of this world we still have to behave like a third world one when it comes to looking after our citizens.
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FiveGoodMen Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 07:52 PM
Response to Original message
4. Who'd have thought they'd make it worse?
Lots of posters have said, "I need something now. Can't wait. We'll fix it later."

Well, at this rate, the final bill will outlaw doctor visits, take 50% of our paychecks without anything in return, mandate that we kill ourselves at the first sign of illness, and charge thousands in record keeping fees for the death.


KILL.

THIS.

MOTHER.

FUCKING.

BILL!


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villager Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 07:56 PM
Response to Reply #4
8. but they'll *make it better later*, because you always know Democrats keep their word
...to their base!
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Luciferous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 07:53 PM
Response to Original message
5. There is nothing good left in this bill
they should kill it... but they won't. They'll pass this piece of shit and pat themselves on the back for passing "reform".
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 07:54 PM
Response to Original message
6. The more people who go to the exchange
and get taxpayer subsidized assistance, the more people who will be in a pool and ready to transfer to single payer.

A month ago these people were complaining because people were going to be forced to have employer covered insurance, now they're complaining because people will be able to go to the exchange and choose and get a subsidy.

They Are Idiots.
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WeDidIt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 07:56 PM
Response to Original message
7. LiarDogFake
Reporting shit they know nothing about.
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berni_mccoy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 07:58 PM
Response to Reply #7
11. +1
There isn't even a bill yet and nothing has been confirmed one-way or the other.
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katandmoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:00 PM
Response to Reply #7
12. Is this not true then?
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WeDidIt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:06 PM
Response to Reply #12
16. No. It is a lie
How do I know?

THERE'S NO FUCKING BILL OUT OF RECONCILIATION YET, THAT'S HOW!
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:12 PM
Response to Reply #16
20. It Is Supposed To Be Reconciled In A Conference Comittee...
They've chosen to go "Ping Pong" instead of Conference.

Link: http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2010/01/a-ping-pong-primer-how-and-when-will-congress-finish-health-care.php

Just so you have your facts straight.

:shrug:
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WeDidIt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:15 PM
Response to Reply #20
22. It may not even go ping pong
If Coakley loses next week, it's the Senate version as-is, no ifs, ands, or buts.
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:21 PM
Response to Reply #22
24. Dude... If Coakley Loses, Then There Are Only 59 Dem Senators
And the Republicans can filibuster final passage.

:shrug:
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WeDidIt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:27 PM
Response to Reply #24
28. Dude, the rules are, both houses pass an identical bill.
Edited on Wed Jan-13-10 08:27 PM by WeDidIt
If there are only 59 senators in the Dem caucus, the House passes the current Senate bill (as-is with no changes) and it goes to Obama's desk.
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:38 PM
Response to Reply #28
30. OK... Identical To What ???
Who gives... the Senate to the House... riiiight???

And We Win WHAT... Exactly ???

Pyr·rhic victory - noun

A victory that is offset by staggering losses

a victory in which the victor's losses are as great as those of the defeated

Also called Cadmean victory


Link: http://www.thefreedictionary.com/Pyrrhic+victory

:shrug:
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OmmmSweetOmmm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:42 PM
Response to Reply #24
32. If Coakley loses, expect Snow/Collins to come to bat. This is theater. The pukes want it too.
Edited on Wed Jan-13-10 08:50 PM by OmmmSweetOmmm
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:46 PM
Response to Reply #32
33. Interesting Point
Since the biggest benefactors will be the Health Insurance Industry...

You may be absolutely right.

:shrug:
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natrat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:26 PM
Response to Reply #22
27. and you would like that, senate bill passing
Edited on Wed Jan-13-10 08:28 PM by natrat
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Name removed Donating Member (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:07 PM
Response to Reply #7
18. Deleted message
Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.
 
WeDidIt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:11 PM
Response to Reply #18
19. And you see no differences?
LiarDogFake reports: MANDATES DROPPED!

AP reports: Mandates MAY BE Dropped.

As I said, LiarDogFake. The bill may never make it out of conference as Coakley could lose in MA and the only choice would be for the House to pass the Senate bill AS-IS.
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rhett o rick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:21 PM
Response to Reply #19
23. So do you actually see a chance to save the mandates? IMO the final bill will resemble the Senate
bill more than the HOR bill. Do you think different? How do you feel?
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Robb Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:48 PM
Response to Reply #23
34. It's irresponsible, but profitable, to "report" in this way.
It will catch up to them. See also: Dewey defeats Truman.
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rhett o rick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 10:48 PM
Response to Reply #34
40. Well so far when anyone said the health care bill is getting worse, they been right. Just sayin.nt
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sendero Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:57 PM
Response to Reply #19
37. Yeah..
... and when the confirmed report comes in, you'll be right here with a retraction. Not.
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dflprincess Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 12:03 AM
Response to Reply #19
42. No there is another choice
the House Progressive Caucus could grow a spine and refuse to sell us out to the insurance companies.
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KittyWampus Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 07:56 PM
Response to Original message
9. FireDogLake is like porn for some DU'ers
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:14 PM
Response to Reply #9
21. Do Tell...
:evilgrin:
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rhett o rick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:26 PM
Response to Reply #9
26. Do you have a specific beef, or is this just a drive by fruiting? nt
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:55 PM
Response to Reply #26
36. The latter. Always the latter.
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rhett o rick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 10:46 PM
Response to Reply #36
39. Got it. nt
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OhioChick Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 07:57 PM
Response to Original message
10. Kill the bill. n/t
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ixion Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:01 PM
Response to Original message
13. Kill this ludicrous piece of legislation
it just keeps gettin' uglier.
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Donnachaidh Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:03 PM
Response to Original message
14. Seems FDL pisses off all the little bots with the boots
really sucks to have a site that really reports on the *change we can believe in*...
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WillyT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:05 PM
Response to Reply #14
15. +10
Yep...

:evilgrin:

:hi:
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flyarm Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:41 PM
Response to Reply #15
31. I'll match you 10 and raise you 100!! ..eom
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bvar22 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 11:41 PM
Response to Reply #31
41. I'm in too....with a REPEAT:

"Seems FDL pisses off all the little bots with the boots

really sucks to have a site that really reports on the *change we can believe in"
...


Thanks, Donnachaidh.
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ima_sinnic Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:07 PM
Response to Original message
17. we were better off without this "reform"
but I guess the poor widdle insurance companies needed our help.

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kenny blankenship Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:23 PM
Response to Original message
25. It seems like they're really straining now to find ways to make this worse
All the easy screwjobs have been accomplished already. Now they're coming up with redundant and derivative screwjobs, scraping the bottom of the barrel.
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highplainsdem Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:38 PM
Response to Original message
29. K&R
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Better Believe It Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:54 PM
Response to Original message
35. The House can and should kill the Health Insurance Industry Protection Act

Universal healthcare reform advocates only need three Democratic House members who voted for the House bill to vote the bill written by the Senate down.
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defendandprotect Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 09:59 PM
Response to Original message
38. k
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leftstreet Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 12:06 AM
Response to Original message
43. K&R
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slipslidingaway Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 04:18 PM
Response to Original message
44. knr nt
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