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Jkid Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:27 PM
Original message
Things that public schools should have taught before graudating high school.
There are plenty of skills that high schools should have taught students before they graduate high school. Life skills such as cooking basic meals, balancing a checking account, looking for a job and job skills. Basic life skills! Why they don't do that anymore?

Name some life skills they should be taught.
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Subdivisions Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:27 PM
Response to Original message
1. Spelling? n/t
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begin_within Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 10:15 PM
Response to Reply #1
43. In college I had a roommate who wrote "ic te" on the grocery list
I asked him, "What is this?" and he said, "Iced Tea." And he was a high school graduate. That was in 1977, I don't think much has changed since.
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csziggy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 10:17 PM
Response to Reply #43
45. He was just ahead of his time. If he were texting "ic te" would be fine. ;-)
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ThomWV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 09:37 AM
Response to Reply #45
63. No it wouldn't. Its just as much a misuse of the language on a small screen as it is on paper
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Johonny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 10:58 AM
Response to Reply #63
87. How do you misuse language
I'll be laughing at your post all day. The point of language is to communicate a thought. Once that's accomplished the rest is just window dressing.
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GoCubsGo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 10:49 AM
Response to Reply #43
82. I purposely misspell items on my grocery list
It's a joke I picked up from my dad, who will send me recipes with "eggz", "unyuns", "cheez", etc., just to be silly. My cats insist that I list "kat fud" in honor of that old "The Far Side" cartoon.
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Lance_Boyle Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 10:54 AM
Response to Reply #82
85. I always found '1' to be perfect grocery list shorthand
for "half and half."

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hfojvt Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 03:27 AM
Response to Reply #1
55. doncha mean grammer?
'They' is not mis-spelled, but it oughta be 'that'.
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GoCubsGo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 10:44 AM
Response to Reply #55
80. No, he means "grammar"
You were being facetious here by misspelling "grammar", weren't you?
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Luciferous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 02:50 PM
Response to Reply #1
100. Bad spelling is one of my pet peeves :)
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XemaSab Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:27 PM
Response to Original message
2. Changing a tire and jumping a car battery
n/t
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csziggy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 10:19 PM
Response to Reply #2
46. We had to learn those to get out of Driver's Ed
And a lot of the parents in our town would not let their kids get their licenses until they passed that class.
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GoCubsGo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 11:15 AM
Response to Reply #46
90. Yep, it's not a matter of "teaching"...
It's a matter of LEARNING. Case in point: My older sister. She and I went to the same schools most of our lives, except for a couple of years where I went to a different high school. We had the same teachers and same curriculum. My sister's spelling, punctuation and grammar are atrocious. She can't do math beyond the basics. She had to call me to help her daughter with her math homework. The were learning fractions. And, before anyone criticizes public schools, my sister went to Catholic schools for all but one semester of high school.

Schools DO teach a lot of this stuff. The kids just don't learn it, or they memorize it long enough to pass a test and graduate.
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DesertFlower Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:28 PM
Response to Original message
3. did they ever?
i graduated high school in 58. they did have a home economics class for the girls and a shop class for the boys. i didn't take the home economics.
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Johonny Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 10:56 AM
Response to Reply #3
86. We had to take both
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Tansy_Gold Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:29 PM
Response to Original message
4. 1. How to use the DU spell checker. "graudating"
Sorry. Call me a nitpicker or even a flaming asshole if you want, but don't get up there and talk about the things public schools didn't teach you when you can't even proofread your own DU post well enough to catch a major typo.


Tansy Gold
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Catshrink Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:29 PM
Response to Original message
5. There isn't a test for those things -- my Mom taught me that stuff
and Dad taught me about tires, checking oil, etc. Schools can only do so much -- parents need to step in and participate in educating their children.
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WHAT Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 03:08 PM
Response to Reply #5
101. In exchange, children can teach their parents...
and older relatives and neighbors

How to: put somebody on speed dial
text definitions and texting
change fonts
download graphics
post to youtube
use and organize itunes

the list goes on and on...

there could be an exchange of skills day :)
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Davis_X_Machina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:31 PM
Response to Original message
6. I and a teaching colleague once decided...
...that in a perfect world all you would really needto do for a diploma was prove you could write a five-paragraph essay, bake a loaf of bread, and play a twelve-bar blues.

Everything else is decoration.
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nosmokes Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:48 PM
Response to Reply #6
17. D'ya get extra credit if ya do the blues in 5/4 time?
;)
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Davis_X_Machina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 09:41 AM
Response to Reply #17
68. Hell no... You get points deducted for showing up the teacher.
Come watch me try to count off 5/4.
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ProfessorGAC Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 09:47 AM
Response to Reply #17
72. Yeah, And Does The Instrument Matter?
I can do Davis' first and third, and we have a bread machine. So, apparently i did ok in HS! LOL!

I'd give you the extra credit for 5/4 by the way. Or 7/8 time. That'd be good too.
GAC
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rurallib Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:32 PM
Response to Original message
7. never trust a Republican
Not even a "moderate" one.
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Bluebear Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:32 PM
Response to Original message
8. How to spell "graduating" :)
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Orsino Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 10:54 AM
Response to Reply #8
84. And how to avoid misplaced modifiers. n/t
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A HERETIC I AM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:35 PM
Response to Original message
9. The very basics of investing.
Like what the money market is.
The differences between stocks and bonds.
What a mutual fund is.

Etc., etc.
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Common Sense Party Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 11:00 AM
Response to Reply #9
88. The dangers of buying on credit. The importance of living within
one's means when possible. "Budget" isn't a bad word. Etc...
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A HERETIC I AM Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 11:15 AM
Response to Reply #88
91. Agreed.
Replace my use of the word "investing" with "money" and it would go far to improve the financial well being of the population,

How ya doin, CSP? Still traveling? Staying busy?

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Common Sense Party Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 11:19 AM
Response to Reply #91
92. Still traveling, unfortunately. Looking for something off the road,
but will still pay the bills.

How have you been? What are you doing now?
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virgogal Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:35 PM
Response to Original message
10. Reading would be nice.
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11 Bravo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:37 PM
Response to Original message
11. Swimming. Three quarters of the planet is covered by water.
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PacerLJ35 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 09:18 PM
Response to Reply #11
27. And probably more in the future...
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jmowreader Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 09:48 PM
Response to Reply #11
34. Then you will like this
Up until a couple of years ago, a swimming test was a requirement if you wanted to graduate from the University of North Carolina.
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11 Bravo Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 08:31 AM
Response to Reply #34
58. I'm a graduate of UNC-Chapel Hill (Thank you GI Bill) and I well remember mornings ...
at the Bowman Gray (sp?) swimming pool.
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:39 PM
Response to Original message
12. How to learn that shit from PARENTS maybe?
Just a thought.
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RayOfHope Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:46 PM
Response to Reply #12
15. +10000 n/t
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sandnsea Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:54 PM
Response to Reply #12
19. Agree
This is not what an education is supposed to be about.
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dysfunctional press Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 09:17 PM
Response to Reply #12
26. and if the parents are fucking worthless/clueless- it's the child that suffers.
Edited on Wed Jan-13-10 09:18 PM by dysfunctional press
how is that fair to the child...?

THAT'S why a lot of that regular/real life stuff NEEDS to be taught in the schools.
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 09:59 PM
Response to Reply #26
36. And it STILL ends up being the fault of the public schools.
I get it.
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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:41 PM
Response to Original message
13. as a parent, i do feel an obligation to teach my children SOME things.
i will take on those life skill duties and leave academics to the schools.

though

i do believe there is a required course that will include check book and that does talk about jobs and job skills. my 6th grade son told me today in social studies councilor talk to them about two occupations. business and teaching. and thru out the year they periodically interrupt class to discuss other occupations. i know my oldest son had an 8th career class. not sure what is coming in high school
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dysfunctional press Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 11:00 PM
Response to Reply #13
50. the problem is that not all parents feel that obligation...or are even up to it...
for the sake of the individual students, and the society at large, it's important that all students have a way to learn the regular life stuff.
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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 11:35 PM
Response to Reply #50
53. if the parenting is so poor, not learning to cook or do a check book is the least of the childs
Edited on Wed Jan-13-10 11:45 PM by seabeyond
problems. if the parenting is so bad that they are not willing to teach their child the very basic skills to survive in the real world then that parent is not teaching them how to work, how to make good choices and decisions, how to be a parent, or have a marriage, or be outside of themselves and a part of a caring and productive world.

anyone can say, you know, need to learn to feed myself and teach themselves how to cook. not that hard. i didnt cook when i was single for 15 yrs. ahd to learn when i got children and had to feed them. need to balance a checkbook is common sense. if a child has not learned to be responsible and make good choices, they are not going to pick up a check book and balance it. not rocket science here.

but this is all irrelevent, because i believe they teach at least the check book and other stuff one needs when they go out on their own. my niece had to take a course i believe her sophmore year that covered this stuff

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dysfunctional press Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 10:14 AM
Response to Reply #53
74. they need to go beyond the checkbook stuff.
we're producing an extremely ignorant electorate. for instance- most of them don't understand the banking 'crisis'- so it's easy for the powers that be to screw the people over. there needs to be a return to COMPREHENSIVE civics courses, so that students can better understand the world they're entering, and the way the country they live in operates.
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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 10:22 AM
Response to Reply #74
76. i dont know how old you are, but i know we have never had high school courses that
went over the banking and market street issues.

these are college course.

it wouldn't be a return to, it would be a whole new academic realm for high school.

the point of this is, .... the kids are already being given way more than in the past because more parents aren't doing their job and we are having to do parenting 101 in our schools where parents fail. and then the teachers and school systems are being blamed for the failure of the raising of children. as you now insist college course should be a part of the curriculum in high school.

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dysfunctional press Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 12:11 PM
Response to Reply #76
95. what passes as high school education in the u.s. is sad compared to most of the industrialized world
coming out of high school, citizens should have a basic understanding of contracts and finance, and especially civics. when i graduated in 1979, civics was required for graduation, and yes- we did cover some basic finance in our coursework.
but- things have also gotten MUCH more complicated in those fields, and as consumers who will have to deal with it all- it's only fair that they have an understanding of what they'll be facing. the corporatists don't really see it that way- an ignorant consumer/voter is much easier to manipulate.

and yes- i agree that parents are the biggest part of the problem- but if they fail the kids, and the schools fail the kids, what kind of a society will they develop into as adults?
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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 12:41 PM
Response to Reply #95
96. i graduated in 79 also. we had a business class. kids today have a business class
their education is way beyond what we had in our day. my kids are learning early and more than we did.

i haven't gotten this push on du to go after the school system, from what i see in my kids education. what i have seen in the schools, is the children not doing well, not learning, not taking the opportunity they are given is a result of the parenting. and that is hitting a couple different ways. the parent over protective and making the excuses for a lazy ass kid, with not my kids fault. and the parent that is simply not a part of the kids life. that doesn't demand, insist on nurturing education and academics

i do not get how we can blame a school system that offers the opportunity, but cannot force the education on the child, especially without the support of the parent

i have watched my brother for a decade to try and teach his daughter responsibility and ownership for behavior, and making good decisions. he hasn't accomplished this. and he demands others (myself included) fix her. aint gonna happen.

if a child wants to be educated, and aware, and civics oriented, they will be. the opportunity is there. the classes are there.
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dysfunctional press Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 03:45 PM
Response to Reply #96
106. the classes aren't there in every school system.
that's one of the reasons that i'd like to see it made a requirement.
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 02:02 PM
Response to Reply #95
97. We teach civics
It's required by law.
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dysfunctional press Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 03:47 PM
Response to Reply #97
107. not every state requires it anymore.
but they should.
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 09:20 PM
Response to Reply #107
111. True. 39 of 50 states require it.
The other 11 have it as part of a social studies curriculum, but not required as a separate class.
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Clovis Sangrail Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:41 PM
Response to Original message
14. how to add a module to apache /nt
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proud2BlibKansan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:46 PM
Response to Original message
16. Have you been asleep since 2001?
Schools don't teach these things anymore because of NCLB and the plan to test our kids as often as we can. Our children have become lab rats who are numbers on a report. The end result is the test score, not the life skills.
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notadmblnd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 08:52 PM
Response to Original message
18. too busy studying for stae mandated tests.
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Obamanaut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 09:22 PM
Response to Reply #18
29. or state mandated tests. nt
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notadmblnd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 09:41 PM
Response to Reply #29
32. Yes, I know how to spell state. I fat fingered a key; is that all right with you?
If you were unable to figure out what I was saying by that one word not being spelled correctly, then you have to ask yourself, just who the deficient one is?:shrug:
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Obamanaut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 09:45 PM
Response to Reply #32
33. Spell check can be found, even with fat fingers. nt
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notadmblnd Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 09:01 AM
Response to Reply #33
61. Spell check doesn't work in the subject line. Try it yourself
I'm sure you can force yourself to make an error.
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Obamanaut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 10:49 AM
Response to Reply #61
83. Actually, it will wurk on the subject line, as well as the message.
It is ok to admit mistakes. Note that my fat fingers made a response to the wrong post. My mistake.

Spell check told me that 'wurk' is incorrect, and suggested 'work'. Imagine that.
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Obamanaut Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 10:34 AM
Response to Reply #33
78. self delete - fat fingers made me respond to wrong post. nt
Edited on Thu Jan-14-10 10:37 AM by Obamanaut
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stray cat Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 09:06 PM
Response to Original message
20. addition, subtraction, multiplication and division - some college biology graduates are incompetent
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salguine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 09:14 PM
Response to Original message
21. The most damaging omission from school curricula now is the loss of Civics instruction. Our
democracy has paid and will continue to pay a heavy price for that. Not that I think that isn't deliberate.
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ThomWV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 09:37 AM
Response to Reply #21
65. +100
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salguine Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 09:15 PM
Response to Original message
22. How many years before our schools have mandatory instruction in basic infantry tactics?
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ThomWV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 09:39 AM
Response to Reply #22
66. In the 60's and before many Colleges required ROTC enrollment from male students
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ProgressiveProfessor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-15-10 03:51 PM
Response to Reply #66
114. Prior to the 70s it was required at Obama's high school
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ProgressiveProfessor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-15-10 03:52 PM
Response to Reply #22
115. Never, but gun security and safety would be a damn good idea
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tammywammy Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 09:15 PM
Response to Original message
23. Spelling and proofreading n/t
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dysfunctional press Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 09:16 PM
Response to Original message
24. civics.
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-..__... Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 09:16 PM
Response to Original message
25. How to cross a street before looking both ways.
I have lived and worked in and around the Boston area (y'know... Harvard, MIT, Boston College, Boston University, Northeastern, etc), for 54 years now (been driving for 36 of them), and I swear a day doesn't go by that some self absorbed or situationally unaware
pinhead has no idea that a 150lbs human body is no match for a 3,500 lbs chunk of rolling steel and rubber.

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Nikki Stone1 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 09:19 PM
Response to Original message
28. Dangling participles
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Davis_X_Machina Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 09:42 AM
Response to Reply #28
69. Thanks. Having read the Wikipedia piece,
...dangling participles now seem much more important to me.
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Odin2005 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 09:33 PM
Response to Original message
30. Logic and critical thinking.
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90-percent Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 09:36 PM
Response to Original message
31. Civics
Civics

As suggested a long time ago by my hero Frank Zappa.

-90% Jimmy
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noamnety Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 09:53 PM
Response to Original message
35. One of my favorite quotes:
“A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly.”

People might take issue with a couple of those items (butchering/invading), but I like the nongendered sentiment and focus on skills that make a difference in life.

I hate the NCLB crap, race to the top crap, with the focus on noncritical academic skills - and some evidence of that educational system is seen in the responses to this thread - the running theme that you don't have credentials to talk about education if you made a typo. Some of the smartest people I know have the absolute worst typing skills ever. One can set bones and deliver babies but can't type his way through a sentence without making me cringe. The other is a guy I just brought in as a technical expert for a sculpture class I was teaching - he was in there measuring watts and plugging one of the girls' soldered masses of confusion into a transformer figuring how much resistance they need to add so they don't blow out their creation when they plug it into a real socket. That's a guy who was in remedial reading for years because of undiagnosed dyslexia. He's got a masters in optical engineering and can explain how lasers work til my eyes glaze over, but I guarantee if he tried to post here people would mock him and make him feel inferior, like he was unworthy to post. It pisses me off.

To the OP, shrug those comments off. For the rest of you making those comments, I would just say it might be good to consider that the OP's discussing what really MATTERS, and what you chose to focus on ain't it.

I also see from some of the comments that some of the people are out of touch with the reality of life for lots of our students. Here's the reality. Some students never had a dad teach them how to change a tire because their family can't afford a car. Some never had a mom teach them how to do it because their moms were brought up in a sexist culture where women weren't supposed to learn such things. Some don't have the benefit of parents at home - if they even have a home. Some of my kids have one parent who is disabled, or absent parents, or parents in jail. I've read some criticism of DU about how we are primarily well educated upper middle class suburbanites who are out of touch with the realities of being poor in America, and some of the replies in this thread might serve as evidence of that.

Me, I don't teach home ec or shop. But I've had students get a flat and search me out to fix it. I don't fix it, though - I stand next to them and guide them on how to fix it. I've taught kids how to cook - from scratch - without a recipe book, just common sense. I wish we would get rid of this bullshit of forcing kids to learn trig in order to get a high school diploma, when it's clear to me that a large number of my students never mastered how to use a ruler. I can tell you that in my life I've had to use a ruler a hell of a lot more than I've had to use trig.

The OP is right, we teach shit just for the sake of being able to claim we taught it and to claim we are "competitive" not because it's of any use. And our kids, they might not always have the best test scores, but they aren't as dumb as the system treats them - they know this shit is a bunch of hoops to jump through with no relevancy to their lives. Funny how that works, force someone to be in a class and study shit they know they will never use after a test, and they become disengaged. That's true for teens, it's true for adults. Put me in a classroom and teach me some obscure database I know I'll never use, and I'll do the bare minimum I can to survive it without making any effort to commit it to long term memory.

If we taught what they need, if we taught what's relevant to their lives, they'd be more engaged and the result is that they'd end up smarter.

I'm NOT saying we should dumb down education, but I am saying the selection of what we teach is badly misguided for many of our students and it's doing them a huge disservice to allow them to walk out of our schools with no skills that will help them if they aren't on an academia/college track.
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niyad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 10:05 PM
Response to Reply #35
37. interesting list in your first paragraph, but I don't plan on doing any invading, or fighting.
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ProgressiveProfessor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 10:11 PM
Response to Reply #37
40. May you not need those skills
Its a list from a Heinlein novel, and is a pretty good place to start.
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niyad Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 10:19 PM
Response to Reply #40
47. I'm not lazarus long or slipstick libby, or valentine michael smith, so my guess is, I really won't
be needing those skills.
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noamnety Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 11:17 PM
Response to Reply #47
52. Wow, they seem like normal skills to me, not sci fi stuff.
change a diaper < done that

plan an invasion < not exactly, but I can plan smaller aspects of army operations (I've been on the phone with NORAD coordinating things, never hostile actions, luckily). Not sure it's something I'm proud of, wouldn't recommend enlisting or serving. There are better ways to serve humanity. But that could be edited to plan operations in general - like relief efforts.

butcher a hog < I can clean a fish but don't know how to butcher a mammal. I have eaten road kill, though - my ex knew how to do basic cleaning and butchering. If you eat meat and the animal's already dead ... may as well not let it go to waste rather than rely on someone else do your dirty work and package it nice for grocery store displays.)

conn a ship < lived on a sailboat for half a year

design a building < me, no. But my daughter can and has designed and built cobb buildings.

write a sonnet < sure

build a wall < no, but I learned to fix a roof from my parents, a skill I put to use as a single mom with no money and a leaking roof.

set a bone <no, but I can see the use for it, all you have to do is watch the news today to get that one.

comfort the dying <done

balance accounts, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, analyze a new problem < all that, routine for most of us

solve equations < did it tonight (admittedly this was to figure out how much whiskey I had to add to other ingredients to match the proof of baileys in a knock off recipe.)

pitch manure < done

program a computer < done

cook a tasty meal <yes!

fight efficiently, die gallantly. < hope not to have to test my skills there.

--------------
I view those as pretty much things that humans DO have to do, not extreme things at all.

I deliberately incorporated soldering, basic wiring, sewing, cement mixing and using power tools into my intro sculpture class because they weren't being taught elsewhere in our school, and I thought those were all more important life skills - more important than what they would get from a semester of pure ceramics work, which was how the class was taught in some previous years under a different instructor. Knowing how to use a drill struck me as more important than knowing how to make a pinch pot.
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ProgressiveProfessor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 04:13 AM
Response to Reply #47
56. You must live a marginal existence...
Not to be able to cook a good meal...yikes!
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TeeYiYi Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 03:14 PM
Response to Reply #56
102. Made me laugh. :) ...
"Good" is subjective. Depends on how hungry you are. I enjoy all of the meals I cook for myself, but I'd never throw a dinner party around them.

TYY :hi:
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 10:10 PM
Response to Reply #35
39. Nowhere does Heinlein say all that should be taught in school.
At some point, there has to be a realization that K-12 public schools CANNOT be responsible to teach every life lesson a person needs before they die. I'm tired of taking the blame every time a person wanders through life never knowing how to balance a checkbook or change a tire or bake a cake. 47% of our kids enter school not speaking English, fer chrissakes. Give us a break for once and take some responsibility as individuals, community members, parents, siblings and friends to make sure those around you learn these lessons. I don't dispute they are important, but we cannot carry the load any more.
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noamnety Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 10:13 PM
Response to Reply #39
42. I think we can carry that load.
Or rather, we would be able to, except we're too busy spending our resources on NCLB and proving to the state that we should get merit pay because our kids mastered differential equations.
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 10:55 PM
Response to Reply #42
48. Bully for you, but I just got home.
Another 13 hour day. I'm tired. Good night.
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cyberswede Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 10:20 AM
Response to Reply #39
75. True
Obviously, parents SHOULD be teaching this stuff. But communities should help out, too. We have a local mentoring group for kids starting in 3rd grade. In addition to tutoring for school, the group has speakers and activities on a wide variety of topics (a visit to a hangar and chance to talk to a pilot, a dance teacher who taught the kids their own dance routine, a visit from a dietitian, etc.).

On one occasion, the mentors took the kids to a fancy restaurant for dinner, where the kids learned etiquette and which fork to use first, etc. I think this is a great confidence-builder for kids who might otherwise feel ill at ease in social situations as they grow up.
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ProgressiveProfessor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 10:10 PM
Response to Original message
38. How to do a tax return, gun use and safety, basic algebra, self defense, basic sewing and cooking
Note that all of those were available where Obama went to school (Punahou). Some are life skills more than academics.
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noamnety Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 10:15 PM
Response to Reply #38
44. Self-defense is a good addition.
I would add how credit card interest rates work and not just cooking but how to grow food. Not a single bean plant in a rinsed out school milk container - but REALLY how to grow food and deal with compost and worms.
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flvegan Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 10:12 PM
Response to Original message
41. Nutrition.
REAL nutritional training. Can't think of anything more important.
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 10:56 PM
Response to Original message
49. Does it ever occur to people -
that making lists of tasks for OTHER people to do is really pretty rude?
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ProgressiveProfessor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 04:17 AM
Response to Reply #49
57. This is really a list of things that HS grads should know or be able to do
Not more topics for exit exams.

A major part of any management or leadership position is to allocate and distribute tasking, which in part is making lists of tasks for others. Wasn't rude, it was required.
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 08:34 AM
Response to Reply #57
60. Right.
Bullshit. The requisite bitching about how schools don't teach anything worthwhile now amply illustrates my point as correct.
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ProgressiveProfessor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 09:22 PM
Response to Reply #60
112. Post your complaints to those who are doing it, Your whining is of no particular interest
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donco6 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 09:27 PM
Response to Reply #112
113. Simply countering your empty, groundless argument.
Don't be bitter.

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ProgressiveProfessor Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-15-10 03:55 PM
Response to Reply #113
117. I am derisive, not the one complaining bitterly about just coming home
As an educator, I thought it was refreshing to see the wildly varied thoughts of what people thought young people entering adulthood should know. Traditional HS may not be the place for all of it, but I for one am thinking that traditional school system in place in the US needs some rethinking.

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Bitwit1234 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Wed Jan-13-10 11:15 PM
Response to Original message
51. Well for starters
Reading
Writing
Arithmetic
History
Geography
Spelling
Person skills
Just for starters. Because all you have to do was watch Jay Leno's jaywalkers and you see how stupid even some of the teachers and college graduates are.
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Igel Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 03:23 AM
Response to Original message
54. Gricean maxims.
Elementary probability and statistics.

World history for when the US was involved in its own struggles. It's gone like this for people I've talked to: International stuff until around the Revolution, then US-only until the French Revolution. US war of 1812, then Europe in 1848. US civil war, then perhaps a European war, then Spanish American war and then WWI, Depression, WWII (Western front).

That anything of interest happened any place else in 1812, the 1770s, etc. doesn't cross the kids' minds.

For starters.
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cali Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 08:33 AM
Response to Original message
59. too bad you weren't taught basic grammar.
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raccoon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 09:34 AM
Response to Original message
62. I meant to unrec, but accidentally rec'd. nt
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howard112211 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 09:37 AM
Response to Original message
64. Introduction to the implications of Quantum Theory and Relativity Theory.
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ThomWV Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 09:41 AM
Response to Reply #64
67. I think you have to start by giving them some inkling of what probability means first
If the very basics are not taught first I don't think their application is going to sink in.
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howard112211 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 11:33 AM
Response to Reply #67
93. True. Basic statistics/stochastics seem to be a skill many people lack.
Try to make a point by pointing out that the probability of dying by a car accident is infinetly larger than dying by a terrorist attack
and see how far that gets you...
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blueamy66 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 09:44 AM
Response to Original message
70. In the year 2010...
how to add a COMPLETE signature line to a business e-mail.

I am so sick and tired of receiving e-mails from my website e-mail link that are signed "Mary".

Um, MARY WHO? WHAT COMPANY? DO YOU HAVE A PHONE #? WHERE ARE YOU LOCATED????

Ugh. How hard is it to insert your sig?????

Yes, this really gets my goat. :-)
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seabeyond Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 09:47 AM
Response to Reply #70
71. same with calls. this is candy...... fuck that shit. who are you. who are you with
and the fuckin games they play

i am just a hard ass on the phone anymore.

i worked business where i had to make calls. was simple. hello, this is... from.... may i speak to....

not a tough one.

i am even making kids calling the house introduce on the phone. i get hi. and then pause. or who is this ... when i pick up

geeez
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blueamy66 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 02:42 PM
Response to Reply #71
98. Yep.
I get those calls too.

How about those that leave you a message and rattle off their call back # so fast that you cannot even hear it, better yet write it down?
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LeftinOH Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 09:51 AM
Response to Original message
73. I learned cooking & checkbook-balancing in Home Economics class (and I'm male)
-also sewing (threading a needle, repairing holes in torn clothing) without a doubt, it was the most useful class in High School. Industrial Arts taught basic tool skills and general repair (although I really didn't need help with that). Public school system with scanty funding, no less.
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hobbit709 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 10:27 AM
Response to Original message
77. Basic math skills WITHOUT a calculator.
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Common Sense Party Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 11:02 AM
Response to Reply #77
89. How to mentally calculate change back from a $20. n/t
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Luciferous Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 02:49 PM
Response to Reply #77
99. I remember going into a Subway one time when the
cash register wasn't working correctly and having to tell the teenager behind the counter how much I owed and how much I should get back because she couldn't figure it out on her own :eyes:
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gkhouston Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 04:43 PM
Response to Reply #99
110. I was in a drugstore today and a woman was coaching her teenager on how
much money he should give the cashier and what change he should expect. He gave the cashier way too much money, so Mom got the change. Bet he'll do better on the math next time. :P
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jmowreader Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 10:39 AM
Response to Original message
79. Give 'em a basic 20-station Student Stakes
Like Soldier Stakes in basic training (well, at Fort Dix in 1981-82), students will be required to pass Student Stakes to graduate.

FINANCIAL
1. Balance a checkbook.
2. Fill out a 1040EZ tax form with the correct numbers. (For extra credit, do a 1040 with a Schedule A.)
3. State the difference between a stock, a bond and a mutual fund. (Extra credit: discuss basic derivatives such as puts, calls, mortgage-backed securities, asset-backed securities, credit default swaps and collateralized debt obligations.)

HOME ECONOMICS
4. Cook a basic nutritious meal for one person consisting of a salad, entree, starch, hot vegetable, beverage and optionally dessert. And then eat it.
5. Give the student a bottle of chlorine bleach and a bottle of ammonia. The students will explain whether they should put both of these chemicals in the same bucket of mop water, and defend their choice.
6. Given 12 pounds of dirty clothes, a washer-dryer combination and a shelf of laundry products, the student will produce 12 pounds of clean clothes that are the same color and size they started with.

BASIC MECHANICS
7. Assemble a randomly-selected item.
8. Change the tire on a car.
9. Perform a basic inspection on a car, in which the student will check all the fluids, inspect the belts, inspect the tires for inflation and excessive wear, check for body and glass damage, ensure the license plates are still there, then start the car and ensure it's not making any weird noises.

CAREER AWARENESS
10. Name three jobs that are available in the student's local area that he or she would like to do, and explain what preparation would have to be taken to get them. (Example: if the student says she would like to cut hair, she must say she'd have to go to cosmetology school and get a license.) The answers to this question are going to differ depending on the student's location--Alaskan students might name "crab fisherman," but you'd never hear that from an Oklahoma student.)
11. Given three products or services selected at random, name the type of business you would procure them from.
12. Explain the basic process for getting a job.

CIVICS
13. Explain the three branches of government.
14. Tell why there are two houses of Congress, and why one of them has over 400 members while the other has only 100.
15. Name the following elected officials: the President, your state's two senators, your district's representative, the governor of your state, any state representatives or senators for your area, the mayor and the sheriff.

LICENSES AND TAXES
16. Name three state or federal licenses.
17. Name three kinds of tax.
18. Describe the procedure for getting one of the three licenses you named, not counting a driver's license.

OTHER
19. Name at least ten foreign countries.
20. The test starts at 8am. Be there on time.
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Silent3 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 10:48 AM
Response to Original message
81. Critical thinking skills, basic civics
There are of course basics of math and language that need to be taught, but beyond that, we need to give children the tools to function well in a democratic society.

1) All children should learn basic logical fallacies like the false dilemma (excluded middle), the slippery slope, appeals to authority, etc. Understanding these things is crucial to resisting manipulative advertising and political campaigning, even to resisting peer pressure, and to forming better thought-out opinions.

2) Some basic probability and statistics, not just the mathematics of it, but how probability and statistics are used and abused, how natural human skills at judging things like risk vs. reward are often terribly bad without a little training -- for example, people getting all worked up over the tiny risk of being a victim of terrorism while not putting anywhere near the money and effort and political focus on fixing a health care system that kills 45,000 per year for lack of insurance.

3) The difference between majoritarianism and constitutional democracy, getting children to think about (or at least be aware of the concept of) where what the majority wants should end and where inviolable rights of the individual begin.
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howard112211 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 11:36 AM
Response to Original message
94. To distinguish a statistically relevant trend from anecdotal events.
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lightningandsnow Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 03:21 PM
Response to Original message
103. I had one semester of civics and one of careers in high school.
I also had family studies, which was mostly cooking, in middle school.

I went to school in Toronto, Canada. What do they teach in the US?
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ehrnst Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 03:36 PM
Response to Original message
104. Because there are no standardized tests for those skils.
Life skills:

Conflict resolution.

Reading and understanding the labels on food.

Handwriting.

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upi402 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 03:38 PM
Response to Original message
105. workers' rights. labor history
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GreenMetalFlake Donating Member (102 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 03:48 PM
Response to Original message
108. how to approach things logically rather than route memorization of 'what' to think
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crispini Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Thu Jan-14-10 04:18 PM
Response to Original message
109. My PARENTS taught me that stuff.
Why should high schools teach that?
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RT Atlanta Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-15-10 03:53 PM
Response to Original message
116. Typing
n/t
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anonymous171 Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Fri Jan-15-10 03:55 PM
Response to Original message
118. Civics, American History (all of it, from 1776 to 2010.), and Algebra
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