It will be a disgrace if Massachusetts elects brown to take Edward Kennedy's Senate seat

[still_one]

I know some people would love to blame Obama and Coakley, but the fact is if the people of Massachusetts allow brown to win, that says volumes about Massachusetts

[Mass]

1. Once again, it is the people of MA 's seat. This certainly has been one of the biggest Brown's

argument. The seat does not belong to the Dems. It does not belong to the Kennedys.

If Democrats had remembered that, may be we would not all be worried about it today.

[still_one]

3. That wasn't my point. brown is a tea bagger. Kennedy is a progressive. If Mass doesn't want

progressives, then that speaks volumes for them

Again, it has nothing to do with party what I am saying, it has to do with the fact that either Mass is not that progressive anymore, or the people don't know what they are doing if brown wins

[chelsea0011]

6. I have been a bit amused by the "people's seat" comment.

Brown certainly got some press on it when he used that comment in the debate. But the wroding has always been about who occupied or occupies the seat as in Harry Reid's seat is in trouble. The use of the "people's seat" is awkward. Nobody talks like that.

[Mass]

10. You're right, but it works, particularly among independents.

They want people to talk to their issues, not to why they need to be progressives, particularly those who voted Kennedy for the pork he was bringing and despite his liberal leanings.

After all, polls show about a quarter of liberals in the state, probably more than in most states, but the vast majority of people call themselves moderates.

[still_one]

30. Really, that is interesting /nt

[Bluenorthwest]

40. The vast majority call themselves lots of things

I keep asking those who say 'I'm a moderate' to tell me what that means to them, in what ways they differ from liberals or from conservatives, and you know what? They really can not. So when I see terminology being tossed around that has absolutely no meaning even to those who are using it to describe themselves, I have to wonder what is being spoken about at all.
When asked for self descriptors, political or personal or any kind, the majority of people will answer in the way that seems to be neither self inflating or self denigrating. Ask a beautiful person if they think they are gorgeous, good looking, or ugly, they will say 'good looking'. They know they are gorgeous, but you don't say that. So 'moderate' is a word that sounds like modest, seems to mean 'not extreme' and most people, even those who think of themselves as being 'free spirits' or 'very religious' will describe their own views as moderate. You see, no one thinks they are extreme, they think they are correct and reason based. So that means moderate. It is a relative term that means nothing unless defined.
Like 90% of Americans say they are 'middle class' including those who are upper class, and those who are below the middle. What is the middle, the moderate, the modest, average and correct position? The position I stand on.

[still_one]

12. Kennedy was a liberal. brown is the furthest thing from being a liberal, that was my point

not that it was "Kennedy's", but that does the state want a right winger, to occupy it, and that is messed up

Same thing in my state California with Arnold, though he is not as extreme as brown

[horseshoecrab]

46. No one is saying it "belongs" to anyone...

Saying "Ted Kennedy's seat" is just a way of remembering his existence. He was, after all, the last elected person to hold the seat and held it for 47 years. It's a simpler way of saying "the seat vacated by the death of Ted Kennedy."

That's my take on it and of friends I've talked to. This baloney of calling it Ted's seat being a bad thing is typical Repug trash talk.

So, with all of that said, may the best woman win Ted Kennedy's seat tomorrow!


horseshoecrab

[cali]

2. oh, c'mon. blaming a whole state is just silly. of course voters

are responsible but so too is the candidate who runs a bad campaign and the national political environment.

[still_one]

5. I am talking about an extreme right winger verses a moderate to progressive. Either Mass is not

that progressive, or the people are lacking

and yes, I will blame the whole state, just like I blame Connecticut for lieberman, and my state, California for Arnold

[midnight armadillo]

47. Coakley's campaigning has been terrible

She coasted through the primary on name recognition. I would have greatly preferred to see Alan Khazei win, I think he could have brought some excellent experience to the Senate, even though I've liked MC's performance as the state's AG.

Problem is, after the primary Coakley's campaigning has been utterly lackluster, boring, and uninspiring. Brown's been running a good campaign that seems to have tapped into a lot of voter frustration with Washington. This race quite simply has been Coakley's to lose...let's hope she pulls off a win tomorrow.

[freddie mertz]

4. Hey, lay off my home state.

Yes, there are many idiots there, enough to give this to Brown if it comes to that.

But there are many good features as well.

The Berkshires, the Common, Fenway Park, museums, hospitals, bookstores, and gay marriage is legal.

[still_one]

7. Hey, I''ll critisize my own state for allowing Arnold to become govener. Also I said "IF"

that may not occur.

[freddie mertz]

11. I'll be pissed too. But I'd move back tomorrow if a job came up.

It's a great place, except for the winters.

And the summers.

[still_one]

28. I hear you /nt

[Bluenorthwest]

42. My CA transplant friend in MA says you guys have four seasons!

Almost Winter, Winter, Still Winter, and Bug.

[Name removed]

8. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[still_one]

20. First of all I said "if", but if that is the only way you can communicate instead of telling

me where I am being misguided, you have a communication problem

[MannyGoldstein]

9. Do You Blame Spouses When They're Battered?

Why aren't you as upset with the Democratic establishment who's caused this cluster$&%@ in our Commonwealth? They're the ones who ran on change, then flung poo at us once in office.

[TheCowsCameHome]

13. Bingo. Brown's success is coming as a result of Beacon Hill arrogance.

You'd have to live here to understand.

[still_one]

15. So you are telling me it has nothing to do with his being right wing? /nt

[Mass]

19. Nope. many papers and TV continue to describe him as moderate and he has been very careful

not to take very RW positions (including gay marriage was a settled law).

[still_one]

24. Interesting /nt

[TheCowsCameHome]

27. When voters are thoroughly pissed, sometimes they grasp at anything .

[still_one]

14. because this is a state issue in the end, and brown is no liberal. What does that say if he wins?

[MannyGoldstein]

16. That Folks Are SO Desperate For Actual Change

That they'll vote for an evil nut.

They've given up hope.

You think that this won't happen elsewhere? That Corzine and Deeds were flukes?

[TheCowsCameHome]

18. That the voters were fed up with a steady diet of crap here in MA.

"Do not take voters for granted" comes to mind.

[still_one]

22. That is always good advice. However, isn't brown a tea bagger? /nt

[One_Life_To_Give]

33. Wouldn't know it from the Primaries

Only ad's I heard about Brown during the Primaries was that he is a RINO. Voted for Tax increases for Schools or some such while in the Legislature, didn't condemn Abortion etc. A month later we hear ad's claiming he is a Right Wing Nutjob. Leaves people feeling distrustfull of both arguments and those who put them out there.

[timeforpeace]

48. The scary part is what if the voters don't care about that?

[One_Life_To_Give]

35. 3 House Speakers in a row Indicted

a House member under House Arrest fails a sobriety test and is sent to prison.

Nope can't see any possible reason the electorate might be pissed. :sarcasm:

[dkf]

17. "flung poo"

So sad I have to laugh.

[TheCowsCameHome]

25. With fried rice or bean sprouts, .75 extra.

:rofl:

[KharmaTrain]

21. It's Not Kennedy's Seat...It Belong To The People Of Massetchussets

No one is entitled to be elected, they need to earn it...ask for the vote and explain why. Coakley squandered this opportunity early on and underestimated her opponent (as did the DNC). While I have tremendous admiration for the late Senator and the Kennedy family, this election is about the people in that state and who they feel will best represent their interests.

[still_one]

26. I am referring to Kennedy as a liberal, in that context, verses brown a right-winger

not whose seat it belongs to, but is Mass liberal or conservative?

[KharmaTrain]

31. We'll FInd Out Tomorrow...

The last thing anyone should do is assume...(or as a boss once explained it...the "ass with u and me". Many elections tend to be based on personality rather than ideology and Brown has the upper hand there. Tomorrow voters will look at their pocketbooks, check how they feel about how things are going and vote accordingly...and since the Democrats have the control of both Houses and the executive, they're the ones who have to prove their worthy of that vote. Again, nothing should be taken for granted. It was a mistake that cost the GOOP many seats in '06 & '08.

[still_one]

32. You do have a point, and that was definitely a factor between Kennedy and nixon /nt

[Worth]

34. That is a lot of the problem,

It's not a black and white issue, too many people see it as a 2 party country when in reality there are a few hundred million people with different ideas. If we continue to play the US against THEM game, the entire country will crash and we will have nothing. Our government, the way it is now, cares about itself not the people. It has become standard policy to lie threw the campaign to get elected and then do as they wish. I moved from being a Democrat to an independent 20 years ago when it was obvious I didn't' fit into either party. I don't think the Republicans or the Democrats as a Party are good for the country anymore. I have been voting for Individuals for quite some time now. Sometimes they're Dem's and sometimes they're Reps. Tomorrow I think it will be a Rep.

[still_one]

44. I would hope that does not mean you think brown would be better? /nt

[pipi_k]

38. Yes, it was Kennedy's seat...

I said this in another thread...

Kennedy WAS the people. He spoke for us, through our votes for him for over 40 years.

If it's our seat, then it was his too.

[KharmaTrain]

39. He Serve The People...

And I would think the late Senator would think that way. For decades he was known as the hardest working Senator...working primarily for those who elected and by example for the rest of us. But I doubt he ever felt that Senate seat was an entitlement...and that's the point.

The people of Massetchussets sent him back to the Senate for 46 years because he worked for them. Coakely, for all her experience, has to earn that same respect...not expect it. Until last week, she played "not to lose" and now her last minute actions appear out of desperation...not very attractive to voters who always ask "what have you done for me lately".

[pipi_k]

41. I agree with you that Teddy would say that he served the people, but...

to the many people he served, he virtually became one of them. Many people of Massachusetts came to view him as an adopted "father", "grandfather", "brother", "uncle"...etc.

Didn't matter where he came from. What he did was irrevocably entwined with who he was...and in the minds of many, he was "us".


"Our" seat was Teddy's...and Teddy's seat was ours.


Granted, some people hated him...hated the entire family, in fact. And to some, no matter what good he did in his later years, he would always be a "murderer".


But many more of us saw him as "our" Teddy.

[bdamomma]

23. Teddy will be turning in his grave if Brown is elected.

what Mitt Romney wasn't enough abuse for the Bostonians?

[still_one]

29. I believe if there is a good turnout the right will not win the Mass Senate seat /nt

[Worth]

36. You may find it the other way around,

I'm right around the corner from Hy-port, not to many people claim to be Republican here on the sandbar, but driving around today I saw 2 Coakley yard signs, and about 200 for Brown. I think people have had enough Government spending for one year. I don't know about you guys, but when I'm broke I tighten my belt a bit, I don't go out and borrow money and spend it like a drunkin' sailor.

[pipi_k]

43. One problem with Brown claiming to be fiscally responsible

or anyone, really...is saying they'll cut unnecessary spending but they don't say HOW they'll do it.

Governor Deval Patrick got himself into some hot water recently when he tried to cut spending by cutting outpatient services at a local veteran's hospital.

I'm sorry...this is something you just do NOT do...screw over our vets.


So, after a lot of voter outrage, the government somehow "found" some extra money to keep those services going.

Politicians need to tell us what "unnecessary spending" they're planning on cutting so we don't get blindsided. That's one reason why I don't trust Brown any further than I can throw him.

[lukasahero]

45. "borrow money and spend it like a drunkin' sailor"

Who, exactly, is doing that?

[Worth]

49. Pretty much everyone we elected over the last 30 years or so.

Unless you haven't been watching the national debt you should know we haven't broken even in a long long time. Could you run your household that way? Doesn't seem to matter who is in the whitehouse or congress. Every year we get deaper in debt, and the answer from the top is always the other party caused it.

[bdamomma]

37. I hope so, cause Brown is not what we need in the Senate

don't we have enough repigs doing crap already?