Everybody who is saying they want to move to Canada or Europe

[WildEyedLiberal]

Is that even actually possible? A lot of you guys are making it sound like all you have to do is buy a one-way ticket and some property in the country of your choice and you're good to go. I've looked casually into emigrating to Europe, and it seems next to impossible to do if you're an American. Basically you have to have a job lined up, and it has to be some job that no one else in Europe can do, or you have to marry a citizen of whatever country you're trying to move to. Canada is easier but it's still not as simple as hopping in your car and crossing the border.

So the people who are saying this - is this just an idle threat, and you really have no intention of doing it? Or are you serious? If you're serious, have you actually studied the immigration requirements for the country you're interested in, or are you just hoping they'll take you anyway? I'm seriously wondering, because I've thought about it (though admittedly more from an 'I love being abroad' than an 'I'm fed up with America' POV), but it seems like you need to have an advanced, obscure job talent, be a child of a citizen, or marry a citizen before any other country'll even look twice at you.

[Codeine]

1. Those countries have rational immigration policies.

Showing up in a saggy diaper crying about the DLC won't be enough to get one fast-tracked for Swedish citizenship.

[nemo137]

2. You forgot countires with diasporas.

Both Italy and Ireland have provisions such that you can get citizenship if you are descended from someone who emigrated from there. My friend is getting his Italian citizenship so that he can work in Europe.

[WildEyedLiberal]

9. That only works if you're a grandchild of a citizen of that country

Believe me, I've looked into that too. I have Irish ancestry, and my great-great grandfather was an Irish immigrant, born in County Tipperary. But that's way too distant and disqualifies me for the diaspora immigration, which requires that the original relative be no more distant than a grandparent.

[JuniperLea]

13. My father's father was from Canada...

And had dual citizenship.

My mother's 10th great grandmother was Mary Chilton... maybe I could go back to England and beg...

[WildEyedLiberal]

14. Haha, yeah, I have TONS of (distant) British ancestry

I think they should take me, because with the exception of the random Irish branch I'm as British as tea and scones. I doubt that'll get me far at with the Home Office, though :(

[JuniperLea]

19. I could make public apologies to my countrymen...

For the error of my ancestors' ways! Traitorous colonists!

[treestar]

43. My mother can be an Irish citizen

But I can't, because she didn't claim it before I was born.

I looked into what she could do if she moved to Ireland, if she could get me in. I concluded that I could live there but not work until I got a job that it was proven no Irish citizen could do. If I could do that I could get the Irish equivalent of a green card.

Mom, however, is a citizen and could work there!

[dgibby]

34. Do you happen to know what the rules are in Ireland?

I'm Irish on both sides of the family and can trace both maternal grandparents back to Ireland. I also have one paternal grandmother (ggg) from Canada. I'm wondering if any of that would help me if I chose to go.

[WritingIsMyReligion]

48. Grandparents, I think.

my mother could be an Irish citizen if she could prove that her grandmother was born in Ireland, but the church where the birth records were held burned down many years ago now.

[dgibby]

52. Thanks.

That leaves me out. Waaaaahhhh!

[HughBeaumont]

51. Uh-oh.

Grandfather was born in Sicily.

Gotta look into it should America sink to a dystopia.

[sandnsea]

63. Mine came from Canada in 1658

So am I in?

:bounce:

:rofl:

[Faygo Kid]

3. Too old for me now. But if I were younger, you bet your ass.

Can't you see what has happened, and what is coming? This country is a train wreck. Canada would work for me, but I am just years from retirement. That ought to be pretty.

Spare me platitudes about the "good ol' USA." I have always loved this country, warts and all, and am a passionate American history buff. That's why I say It's Over. If somebody wants to make it happen badly enough, they can make the move elsewhere.

And all the best to them.

[WildEyedLiberal]

6. Way to not answer my question

I didn't offer ANY platitudes about the "good ol' USA", so I'm not sure who you're talking to, and I didn't ask if someone WANTED to immigrate. I asked if they actually thought they COULD. And you talking about what a train wreck the USA is doesn't answer that question. I am pretty sure another country is going to require more from a potential immigrant than their claim that their homeland sucks. I am seriously trying to find out if it's even POSSIBLE for the average American to LEGALLY immigrate to another country without marrying a citizen, because I really don't think it's a simple as packing a bag and showing up at a foreign customs office.

[Bryn]

4. I am already retired

and thinking of Mexico. I could live nicely there? LOL

[dgibby]

35. My nephew and his wife just retired to Mexico in Oct.

Heard from them at Christmas. They seem very happy there.

[treestar]

44. You can retire to a lot of countries

If you don't need to work, that is "steal" jobs from the natives there, a lot of countries will take retirees.

[katanalori]

5. checked New Zeland

They will welcome you if you have a half million to deposit in the bank (they do not take your $, they just want to see that you are stable). That is a lot of cash.
It would be worth looking into requirements in Canada and Europe - lots of ex-pats in those places due to Bush - can't all be wealthy, married to Country's citizen or have specific job talents - can they?

Weigh in ex-pats!

[treestar]

45. I looked into it during bushco

There is a good chance if you are well under 40 or so and have a degree.

[nadinbrzezinski]

7. I looked into it, but not Europe

it would be going for me from the pot into the fire...

There are reasons... and I could potentially do it.

And Canada we simply do not meet requirements...

So yes it is that simple, we are stuck fighting the good fight and losing horribly

[Haole Girl]

8. When I consider moving to India, it is not an idle threat.

The cost of living is much lower there. There will be very little social security left, and I am not of the wealthiest 3% who can afford to live off of savings. Nor do I feel like working until the last day of my life.

p.s., My husband is from there. So migrating to India is a very likely possibility with the way things are going in the U.S. Very likely.

[WildEyedLiberal]

11. What I'm trying to gauge is how actually possible it is for Americans to do

It sounds like India is a real possibility for you if your husband is from there. What I'm trying to figure out is whether there's some easy way to emigrate that I am unaware of, because there are a lot of people talking about how they're going to move to Europe or Canada, but in my own research into the immigration policies of various countries (including Canada, the UK, Ireland, and Sweden), it's pretty damn hard for an American with no family affiliation to that country to move there.

[Name removed]

10. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

12. Deleted message

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[slampoet]

16. Calling names reveals the real you, and proves my point.

It would be hard for you to do.

[Name removed]

21. Deleted message

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[slampoet]

24. What is it that brings out the small words?

[Name removed]

59. Deleted message

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[JuniperLea]

22. Oh the irony...

I'm alerting on your horrid, foul mouthed post...

[Name removed]

29. Deleted message

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[rucky]

17. Asking is a form of research.

[slampoet]

23. No, asking is what research answers.

[Name removed]

50. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Joe the Liberal]

15. It occupies my thoughts for a large chunk of the day......

It's nothing serious at the moment though because I have other things I must do before emigrating becomes even remotely possible. Just a day dream at the moment, nothing more, but I would certainly like to move elsewhere at some point in my life.

[brooklynite]

18. But consider the advantages...

You won't have to worry about actually fixing anything here and every decision of Government of your new Country makes will be completely in line with your political philosophy...

[Edweird]

20. I have been researching it. I have a calender year until I am licensed in my trade.

I'm not sure if that trade is, in fact, a preferred occupation. Some sources say yes, some no. It's unclear at this point. However, in a year I will be trying it out - provided I can keep my job until then....

This is for emigration to Canada.

[depakid]

25. Of course it's possible

and the necessary skills don't always involve advanced degrees.

Australia for example needs tradesmen.

http://www.articlesbase.com/travel-articles/tradesmen-needed-in-australia-668646.html

[WildEyedLiberal]

27. You're an expat, aren't you?

Did you emigrate on your own, as a skilled worker, or through marriage?

I'm not saying I want to leave tomorrow, but the way this country is going, I'd certainly like to know what my options are.

[depakid]

39. My advice is to spend quality time in any country (and city) that you're looking at

Make some friends, see how people live and what the opportunities, benefits and drawbacks are.

For instance, we have a friend who migrated from New South Wales to Ottowa. Her experiences there (imcluding language preferences) are quite different that they would be in say, Vancouver, B.C.

[Raineyb]

64. I was surprised to see Accountant on that list.

Is there something about the profession that the Australians don't like?

[Motown_Johnny]

26. I can have my house paid off in 4.5 years. at that point I would consider selling

and using that money to move.


So, yes I am serious but not immediately. Also things may improve in that 5 year span.

[Maru Kitteh]

28. I am currently obtaining the education to ensure that I can.

[stevedeshazer]

30. Those who do are quitters and chickenshits.

Sarah Palin quits.

My family has been here since 1760. We're not leaving.

I despise this stuff. No wonder we are losing. No one has the guts to fight.

[laughingliberal]

36. I think people get to do what they feel is right for them to protect themselves and their families

I have no disrespect for those who saw what was coming with the resurgence of the right wing in Germany and got out ahead of it.

[Telly Savalas]

40. There's nothing wrong with pursuing what you perceive to be a greener pasture.

But it is annoying to be a whiny fucking drama queen about it.

[donco6]

55. I'm 50 and would like to be married before it's too late.

It's an option I'm exploring.

If it makes you happy to call me a chickenshit, oh well.

[Hissyspit]

58. You going to pay my health bills?

[old mark]

31. My dad and grandmother came here from Europe in 1920 on a ship.

Hell, I can drive to Canada....


mark

[laughingliberal]

32. Depends on your training. Some occupations do not have to have a job lined up

As an RN there were countries I was rated as 'highly skilled.' They did not require I have a job lined up already in some countries. In others I would have had to but there were plenty of institutions willing to offer RN's jobs and sponsor them. I was just over the age for occupation of preference or highly skilled worker emigration by the time I realized we're going down in flames here.

My advice to those young enough to still pursue it. Find out what occupations are in demand and easiest to emigrate with and do whatever it takes to get trained in it. Start contacting people who can help with work visas as soon as you're close to having the training you need.

Another route if you are trained in one of these occupations and are working with a company that has locations in other countries, look into transferring. Once you're there you can look around for job openings in that country. I knew one couple who did this with Australia. He knew he was being sent to Australia by his company for a period of a couple of years. He did know about it ahead of time and looked into occupations of preference. Then he enrolled in a degree program online at a university. By the time his assignment there would be up he would have completed his second degree and have a good shot at finding a job and being able to stay.

[RainDog]

33. I'm no expert. here are things I know

if you want to immigrate to another country, you have to show you have the funds to survive for a while if you don't have employment or intend to be self-employed (if you have a line of credit for your biz, etc., I don't know if that counts - or if you have assets that are expensive and part of your biz... which is something to look into.)

if you want to move to another country to open a biz, diff. countries have diff. requirements. you have to check with the place you're interested in. some, for instance, stipulate that your biz hire one citizen of that country to work for you. not a bad thing, if it's not your first language... anyway, those sorts of rules will vary by nation and maybe by the size of your biz.

if you want to go there to work for someone else, well, I'm in a field that hires across national boundaries, but the standards are pretty high and most people from other w. eur democracies are more fluent in Eng. than Americans are in their languages (tho, of course, this varies.)

anyway, depending upon your destination and your job area, you can go to international sites for companies or organizations and see what sort of jobs are available in your field.

some people have done the ESL way - gone to another place to teach english. I know a guy who now lives in Czech who went there for this reason. he ended up marrying a girl there and stayed. another guy I know went to Japan to teach English and ended up marrying a girl there and stayed. My ex was from another country, moved here to attend school, ended up marrying a girl and stayed (here.)

it's my understanding that there are some farms and communes in Europe where people can go work/live - you don't go there as a permanent resident, as far as I know, but you learn organic farming, etc. by working on the farm.

I've applied for jobs off and on in a few places (I'm really fed up with what's going on, but I also just like to experience other cultures.) Right now I'm working on my own business that I hope will lead to more flexibility relocating.

of course, learning the language of the other place is the real place to start, I guess.

[WildEyedLiberal]

37. Thanks - that's a lot of good information

I appreciate it.

[WildEyedLiberal]

38. Very helpful post - thank you!

[mnhtnbb]

41. We said it after Bush "won" in 04. Researched a lot of countries

and because we were nearing retirement, we ended up focused on Panama. Long story short, we got
involved in trying to build a place as part of a development (American developers) that turned
out to be a disaster. Four years later we have given up and decided we're going to stick it out
in the U.S. We did apply for and obtain permanent resident visas --so we could, technically, bail
if we wanted (and had the funds liquid)and go live in Panama at any time.

[treestar]

42. They are not serious

And they will not really do it.

And you are right, they just arrogantly assume they CAN do it.

Other countries have just as strict immigration laws. They don't want to be overrun by Americans.

[Libertas1776]

46. I have a right to

citizenship from a European country because my father is from that specific country. I am seriously considering claiming my citizenship right. I mean, how could it hurt? It never hurts to have a plan B and I don't plan on surrendering my US citizenship. Plus, it seems like a terrible thing to waste, considering there a thousands of people who would kill to be in my place and be afforded such an ability and not have to go through the hurdles of naturalization, work permits, visas, language proficiency, and other red tape. I mean I'm not gonna be a dick and wave it around and say nah nah nah I get to leave and you don't, and people who do that should STFU!

If you're gonna do it, fine. But don't come here and post like a freaking drama queen and rub it in the faces of those who can't or chose not to leave.

[HipChick]

47. I already have dual citizenship

but at the same time, why not stay and fight...a President Palin and Teabagger senators will seal it for me

[ProgressIn2008]

49. Heh, if I were Canadian, I'd say: "Don't run here because you couldn't fix your own country"

How weird, to act like the world is your playground, just because hard truths about the US are very, very hard. I understand the impulse, but saying "this isn't my mess, I'm outta here" is not exactly proving that you're citizenship material to another country, even if it were possible.

[Stinky The Clown]

53. I'm eligible for Italian citizenship

It has to do with what my grandfather. I actually looked into this a while ago, but decided it wasn't worth the bother.

I may need to rethink that.

http://www.italiamerica.org/id72.htm#To%20see%20if%20you%20are%20qualified

[defendandprotect]

54. Are you kidding? Do you think we'd still all be here if that were possible?????

[Luciferous]

56. Well, my husband is a dual citizen, and he also has a company

in Canada interested in hiring him, so I guess we could leave if we wanted. However, my husband isn't crazy about the idea... he's lived in quite a few countries and for a long time he told me that we had it pretty good living here. But the way things are going now I might finally be able to get him to change his mind!

I really don't want my kids growing up here if the government continues down this self-destructive path.

[Bonobo]

57. I am in Japan on a spousal visa.

I will work on getting permanent status after 6 years. Perhaps then citizenship.
The US does not deserve the sweat off my brow.

[Cessna Invesco Palin]

60. The "obscure talent" thing isn't necessarily as bad as it sounds.

Basically if a company in the EU wants to hire you, it's fairly easy to create some obscure talents for you out of thin air. In my case the company had already decided to hire me, and so we looked for the most bizarre and random skills I had (or in some cases didn't even really have) and advertised them in the most obscure places possible that would still fulfill the we-looked-for-someone-in-the-EU requirements. It's basically impossible for governments to police this stuff on an individual level without a huge amount of time and money invested.

[Number23]

61. Was granted a "skilled worker" visa to Australia but wound up getting one the old fashioned way

Married an Aussie. :blush: My children have dual citizenship which is good because I plan on coming back to the States in the next couple of years.

You're right. It's not easy to leave a country and anyone who tells you otherwise is crazy. You need to have mad skills and education or be a refugee from a war zone to get a fair shake (and far too many refugees get screwed over). Countries go out of their way to make it as difficult and freaking EXPENSIVE as possible to emigrate. I keep hearing that Canada is like the easy drunk girl at a frat party which is why so many wind up there but I can imagine even going there is not as easy as some want it to be.

[Raineyb]

62. I could get citizenship in Panama so long as I establish residency.

And my family still has property there.

:shrug: