My job requires I spend too much time with RW'ers (default). What or how do you define these people,

[galileoreloaded]

because I just am not seeing what you all are seeing I guess, or there is a regional difference in RW'ers or ??

Do a majority of you live in the south?? I mean, is Arizona different than say, Alabama?? My arguments with them are generally quite substantive, and rarely devolve. We argue issues on the merits 95% of the time, and religion hardly ever comes up in a political discussion, or frankly in daily routine. Had one born-again who was annoying as hell but he was ignored to the point of toning it down past zero. I mean, we are talking a VERY conservative industry, and being here in AZ there is no shortage of Mormons. And they will talk your ear off and pry, but back down VERY quickly. Darn it, I hardly ever experience these drooling, misspelling malcontents the way people here describe in their daily interactions.

What gives, is it me?? Am I becoming desensitized?? Am I lucky? What??

[galileoreloaded]

1. How do you rec a question?? I mean, thanks but......

[CaliforniaPeggy]

2. I think you're very lucky.

Perhaps there's a strain of slightly more intellectual RW'ers where you are.

Or perhaps they respect you more than the average RW person.

I doubt that you're desensitized.

Count your blessings!

:hi:

[sandnsea]

3. They're always rational - until election time

Well not all of them, but I've known a number of republicans like you describe. I don't know how they do it, but when it's time to vote or pass a law, all that reasonability goes right out the window and they're walking, talking bobbleheads.

More Democrats in Arkansas voted for Kerry than Obama, if that tells you anything about regional differences. I have family in Arkansas and have spent a good amount of time there. I'll take western rebublicans any day. Hell, I'll take western freemen any day, lol.

[tammywammy]

4. I work with mostly republicans I would assume

I live in Texas and work in what is considered a very republican/conservative industry. I assume the vast majority of the employees are republican. I don't talk about politics much nor does it come up either. It's not like they're around me talking about it and I just don't participate. I was out to lunch with my boss and he knows I'm a democrat as do a few other coworkers. I was discussing this summer's Texas democratic convention with one, saying I didn't think I could make it. He also got a bit of why I think Perry is such a horrible governor.

I've never talked religion with my coworkers either.

Maybe it's my Hula Homer on my shelf that wards this off from me.



It's true Hula Home is 100% fun.

[Warpy]

9. I never asked, either. I worked in health care

and, as I worked with people over the years, I was able to sort them out.

Politics was one of those supremely unimportant things in a fast paced hospital unit.

[tammywammy]

12. I know my boss is a republican for sure

I don't really care, he's by far the best boss I've had in years. And he loves Hula Homer as well. :)

[Fumesucker]

5. So what substantive reasons do they give you for voting McCain over Obama?

Or for thinking Palin would be a good VP?

[galileoreloaded]

10. Thats the funny part, these are what I consider hard right libretarian types,

now true I probably lean left-libertarian. As for McCain, everything I hear is his ass is gone, primaried out. Not right wing enough, believe it or not.

As to the reasons for voting McCain/Palin, basically they held their nose or obstained (this group-30-40 people), but no real love at all, for either McCain or Obama. But this is what I mean, it's hard to tell, because politics are brought up in general and policy formats, not "who or why did you vote for "

You know they are conservative, but they don't really wear it on their sleeve. What I HAVE heard this morning is a very quiet and introspective murmur RE: Citizens United. Give it a few more days, and I'll let you know what they are willing to do about it. NOT HAPPY, is an understatement. But see, they hate the current HCR bill as much as I do (as it is seen as a corporate giveaway), but then love the idea of union free workplaces..

It's schizophrenic, but cogent......

Maybe they are more Goldwaterey??????


Edit SP

[TNDemo]

14. "Darn it, I hardly ever experience these drooling, misspelling malcontents..."

That would be libertarian, not libretarian and abstained, not obstained.

[Political Heretic]

17. I promised myself I would never ever make spelling an issue

Because I knew it would come back to bite me in the ass.

Glad I'm not the guy you just nailed, lol.

[TNDemo]

18. And with a southern education to boot.

Imagine.

[galileoreloaded]

26. Ha, Ha caught me posting late...

and misspelin wordz..

[Fumesucker]

15. But in the USA the average citizen does not get to vote for policy..

At least not at the Federal level..

So if they abstained then they have no reasonable grounds for complaint about policy because the only route to having an effect on Federal policy for the average citizen is through voting for their Representative/Senator/POTUS.

[KILL THE WISE ONE]

6. is Arizona different than say, Alabama? WELL DAHAAAAAAAA

PHOENIX or TUCSON?
I have lived in most regions of the country. Western people are not the same as southern people. Just drive from AZ to California. See the difference. THEN I DARE YOU TO DRIVE THE OTHER WAY. I will not live in the former confederate states without a 40K/year premium. so I can Fly away in all my time off. TUCSON HERE, the Tucson Raquet Club used to keep my dog in Tennis balls but that UNDERWATER house is currently rented and I am working in Seattle.
anyway stop reading my drunk rants and travel !

[Greyhound]

7. Arizona is far different than Alabama is different than Texas is...

Hell even in Arizona, you'll find big differences between the people in Phoenix, Flagstaff, and Tucson. You'll find more reasonable, informed people in Tempe than you will in Tatum Ranch, etc.

The real south has a whole different strain of crazy, while the most virulent, red-faced, screaming nutballs I've ever run into were in California (inland OC).
:shrug:

[C_Lawyer09]

21. Interesting Observation

My feeling is that at least 1/4 of the Republican party belongs because of one strong feeling or stance. For example, guns, abortion, national security, etc. That is why, in my opinion, it is easier for them to maintain a loyal base. As we've seen, especially in the first year of the Obama administration, the Democrats are nowhere close to galvanized. It takes much more effort, damn near constant work to obtain enough support to proceed with strength. I have plenty of Western Republican friends, most of whom are of the Goldwater tradition. They truly believe in fiscal conservatism. Of course most don't seem to realize that Reagan, as well as Bush I and II were huge deficit spenders.

On a personal level, I have an easier time relating to those who come from the less intrusive govt. standpoint than moralizers or corporatists. I've spent a lot of time in many regions of the South, as well as Orange County CA. My experience is that the Orange County Repubs, knowingly are the "haves" and knowingly don't give a shit about the "have nots". B-1 Bob Dornan was an example of what I think to be the typical Orange County Republican, an unctious, big business and industry panderer, corrupt to the core. I grew up in the Pacific NW, mainly in Western conservative enclaves, like Roseburg Oregon. Some of the things that anger my former neighbors, I can relate to on a personal level, though I might not agree. For the most part, decisions that are made by bureacrats with extremely limited regional knowledge, or knowledge of the industry in which they are attempting to legislate/regulate.

Sadly, some of the middle of the road Republicans that used to be common from Western states have dissapeared. The Republican brand is so tarnished because there is no variance within the party, at least such that can be obviously seen. Mark Hatfield was a great Republican Senator. Tom McCall, former Governor of Oregon, was a darned good governor.

There are many Libertarian principles I do agree with, especially relative to social issues, and scaling back imperialistic policy. I also think there is a vast chasm between big, and effective government. So, while I don't agree with scaling back govt. to the point of mainly protecting property rights, and dropping programs like medicare and social security, I also think many govt. programs negatively impact the business cycle, artificially raise prices and create bubble markets, and create pay to play scenarios, and wasteful spending. For example, all the reading I've done, does not support the Reid claim that Cash to Clunkers was a viable program, from an environmental or stimulative standpoint. I strongly support auditing the Federal Reserve, and I don't believe in programs like the TARP. Reason being, the big players get access to the money before the consumer, and before the inflationary effects have taken place.

[Greyhound]

34. It seems to me those western state "middle of the road Republicans" now call themselves Democrats.

Unfortunately, they haven't changed their minds about anything so they push what used to be the Republican agenda in the Democratic Party.

[krabigirl]

33. Yes. This. I live in OC and I've run into some of the WORST here.

I get along (mostly) with the many libertarians here, even if we disagree, but the fundie right-wing nutballs are insane here. It's because they are a minority in CA as a whole. So they are louder and much ruder than garden-variety Repubs.

[ChicagoSuz219]

8. I don't think it's regional...

...they seem to be scattered around.

There are normal, right wing everyday Republicans who may disagree with you on certain issues and are more conservative. You can have a conversation with them & agree to disagree.

Then, there are the wingnuts... the teabaggers, the birthers, the deathers, the dittoheads, the people who get ALL their news & views from Fox & Rush, believe it as if it came down off the mountain. They think Pres. Obama is a Muslim/Communist/Socialist/Racist that "pals around with terrorists" and wants to kill your Grandma with the guns he took away from you. They think the choice of Sarah for VP was a great idea & running for President an even better one.

They're easy to spot. They're LOUD, obnoxious, ill-informed, dress like they're going on Let's Make a Deal & can't spell for sh*t!! (DUers sometimes refer to them as "Morans," for that reason.)

Hope this helps...

[47of74]

13. You just described the Teabaggers at my place of employment

[ChicagoSuz219]

29. LOL... what was the giveaway?

I bet it was the spelling... ;-)

[47of74]

30. They're loud, obnoxious, and think Sarah Palin is God's gift to America

[ChicagoSuz219]

31. LOL... do they dress funny, too? n/t

[47of74]

32. Actually, the one does from time to time

[TxRider]

11. Yeah AZ is a lot different than Alabama

Texas is a mix, conservatives here hail from all over. Some are sane, some not so much.

[Political Heretic]

16. I lived in Idaho for over a decade, and I ran into some of both.

I had discussions with strong conservatives that were thoughtful, and the conservatives themselves were reasonable and friendly - would listen, allow one to finish speaking, and actually take information provided and read it (I would do the same, in the interest of fair-minded exchange.)

I had one "discussion partner" at work that went even beyond that, this guy was just awesome. I can't lie about it. However he did not identify as republican, but rather as conservative and independent. And yet, he wasn't a libertarian crazy. To top it all off, he was a conservative Christian too. Yet to my shock he was kind and gentle, and not trying to shove God down anyone's throat.

He and I would talk for hours sometimes, and he would listen as much as talk. And in return I listened to him to, instead of just waiting for my turn to speak. We were both formally trained in critical thinking, which I know sounds weird to say. But we had a weird job. And as part of it, we studied critical thinking and logical analysis as a technical discipline. Not juts "critical thinking" as an undefined catch-phrase. But rather the true nuts and bolts of quality cognitive evaluation and judgment making.

I think that made all the difference in the world. I would be able to better set aside my ideological fervor and really carefully listen to arguments he was making, and he could do the same. The result was that many times I was able to accept a certain concern he had about an issue as valid, but then suggest that there was a better, more responsible way to address the concern than what common conservatism could offer.

Over time, we got to the place that we joked that we should be co-president and we could change the world. Just a joke, we're not truly that egotistical.

I wrote a lot about that because I was feeling nostalgic. But on the other hand, in Idaho I ran into countless first-class hate-filled irrational jackasses. People just filled with seething disdain, who challenge Michael Savage as though he was a god.

[shadowknows69]

19. Lucky.

[Duppers]

23. Exactly what I was thinking!

Most conservatives in my 'neck of the woods' aren't nearly that thoughtful or educated. In fact, I've never met an honest, truly informed, critical thinking republican. Nor a compassionate conservative.

Some characteristics of southeastern republicans:

They lack an ability to be objective about most anything.
They are intellectually incuriosity, intellectually lazy.
They rarely read for information but rather for entertainment. They get most of their information from simple word of mouth and their 'news' from Faux.
They are superficial, one-dimensional, and view the world in an egocentric way.
They have only 3 pursuits in life: work (money), entertainment, and anything that enhances their status with their immediate peers; i.e. they are very status conscious.
While believing that they are thinking for themselves, they operate exclusively through their conditioning and live their lives relatively unexamined.
They have little to no critical thinking skills.
They distrust and doubt anyone who is not exactly like them. Although they may have many friends, they lack a wide variety of friends or associates.
Their world is relatively small and overly simplistic.

[shadowknows69]

28. Northeastern Republicans too.

I'm in upstate "liberal" NY and some days you'd think this was pre-Civil War time.

[Enthusiast]

20. I am finding Reich Wingers in my

area to be quite satisfied with themselves at this time.

They feel that the country is going down hill in a terrible way but they feel that the entire country shares their view that it is entirely the Democrat's fault.

They are confident they will win back the house and senate in 2010 and the presidency in 2012. Faux Noise told them so and they believe it.

[Tesha]

22. I try to stay away from these discussions...

with not-too-close friends and neighbors. I know I won't be able to keep from showing anger at some of the stuff they've soaked up from Fox.

But I understand your example: a month ago I was headed to a sign-holding event for health care and since I was early I stopped and talked with a man and a woman holding signs *AGAINST* health care. I was pleasant but firm, had all the right quotes and comebacks and the man was like the folks you're describing: willing to talk and actually agreed with me a bit on some points. He argued his case from facts and using reason so we had a pleasant conversation.

On the other hand, the woman was nasty. All she could do when faced with a fact was to pull a Limbaughesque rebuttal quote out of her backside. She was also aggressive and a little scary.

So both of these sorts of people exist, and they can be found in varying proportions everywhere. My conversation didn't take place in the deep South; it took place in New Hampshire.

[pipi_k]

24. Same here...I know I'm prone to

just losing it and saying stuff that's really rude, then some hours (or days) later I feel like a total ass for being so reactive and nasty.

So I don't even bother.


In any event, I know some batshit nastycrazy Republicans, and I know the same type of Democrats.

So, the illogical and unreasonable can come from either side, and I don't need to waste my time in pointless argument with any of them.

:)

[blm]

25. Arizona Republicans are more influenced by Goldwater politics. Big difference right there.

Southern Republicans were WON OVER post Goldwater and they were WON OVER by appealing to religion and race and intolerance. Cynical pols told them they were RIGHT to use those factors in the political arena.

[lumberjack_jeff]

27. A) how tall are you? b) are you the boss?

Both those factors make a great deal of difference to the average rightwinger.