GOP WANTS to run against an unpopular MANDATE....FORCE them to vote & run against Medicare-for-All.

[Faryn Balyncd]

The GOP's dream is to run against a Democratic Party foolish & unprincipled enough to be the party that mandates purchase of insurance from a No-Public-Option cabal.

When only 34% of Americans (left,right, & center) believe the pending no-public-option mandate is "better than passing nothing", the GOP thinks Democratic short-sightedness in backing a fatally flawed bill as a gift from above.

The GOP's worst nightmare would be a principled Democratic Party that has the spine and patience to unwaveringly champion Medicare-for-All, the genuine reform backed by 65% to 72% of the American people (surprisingly even including 82% of 2008 Obama voters who,out of disgust and a sense of betrayal, voted for Scott Brown in 2010).





Standing on principle with the American people is a strategy for which the GOP has no defense.

Instead of allowing the GOP run against a wildly unpopular pseudo-"reform", based upon a no-public-option mandate, we should force them to vote & run against the REAL THING, the Medicare-for-All that is favored by overwhelming majorities of the American people.

If they are to vote down, for now, real reform, force the obstructionists to physically filibuster, and publicly vote down, in a recorded vote, a Medicare-for-All bill favored by large majorities of Americans.

Then make them pay for their actions in November.

Don't give them their dream of running against Baucus-Lieber-Care.






:kick:





:kick:




"If Barack Obama’s bill gets changed to exclude the public entities, it is not health insurance reform…it rises and falls on whether the public is allowed to choose Medicare if they’re under 65 or not. If they are allowed to choose Medicare as an option, this bill will be real health care reform...."

- Howard Dean

[mdmc]

1. Here is the plan

1. Pass HCR with mandates requiring private for profit "health" insurance.
2. 38 million uninsured Americans become insured Americans.
3. These 38 million join the class of the working poor. The working poor have employer provided medical insurance, but lack access to affordable health care (due to out of pocket expenses).
4. It becomes obvious that for profit health insurance does not offer affordable access to medical treatment.
5. Community Health Centers are used to treat all those who cannot afford medical care.
6. Obama is re-elected and decides that affordable access to medical treatment is more important then mandated private insurance that offers no affordable medical treatment.
7. Obama either goes single payer, or the GOP proves that the HCR failed to provide access to affordable medical treatment, and the GOP ends the HCR bill once they are able to do so.

No one thinks that private for profit health insurance companies will provide affordable access to medical treatment (if they did this, we would not need reform. This HCR bill will fail to provide access to affordable health care, and will either be scrapped or fixed. That is the next fight.

[anonymous171]

4. #4, #6, #7 are ridiculously presumptive

Obama is not a saint. He is not going to do what is best for us UNLESS WE FORCE HIM TO.

[mdmc]

8. Well, if Obama will get us what he can from corporations

then #4, #6, and #7 will be the way to go.

If Obama thinks that the working poor can shell out $40.00 to see a doctor, $20.oo to get medications, then we really didn't need much reform.

He already provided for big pharma and these for profit health insurance vampires.

He can continue to do their DLC bidding, or he can do what is right.

Time alone, time will tell..

[BP2]

30. It pisses me off to no end that we have to watch Barack like a hawk and parse his every

statement to glean what he really meant.

[No Elephants]

31. How do you suggest we "force" him to?

You seem to have bought into some mighty convenient Presidential political bullshit.

If the POTUS doesn't do the right thing, somehow it's our fault for failing to figure out the magic way to "force" the President of the United States to do the right thing? I thought having him do the right thing was a "gimme" for voting him into office with such a nice margin.

FDR said people had to force him, but, in the end, he "just did it." Whatever he thought had to do to save America, whether you agree with his decisions or not. WPA, court packing plan, WWII, Manhattan Project. No one really forced him to do any of that. He was ready to blow up the Supreme Court if it wouldn't stop obstructing him (so it stopped, btw). Ditto the isolationsts who wanted America to stay out of the war.

If a POTUS wants to do something, he'll do it and, if he wishes, he'll also claim the people forced his hand. Lord knows, I'm sure Obama has received enough feedback from all points of view to be able to claim whatever he wants. And if he doesn't want to do something, or can't get it done, he can--if you let him--shrug and say (lamely and falsely) "I told you that you had to force me and you didn't force me. So, it's on your head, America, not mine."

The POTUS and head of the Democratic Party not doing the right thing simply because no one "forced" him? And he gets to define when he has or has not been "forced" sufficiently?

Please.

[Faryn Balyncd]

5. So you're saying that passing a (permanent) mandate to buy from a cabal, failing, RE-ELECTION(?!), &

.....then getting it right next time, is the way to get to Single Payer?


You seem to be overlooking the whole issue that passing a MANDATE, that, besides being permanent, is, in your own words destined to FAIL, is a recipe for NOT getting re-elected....


In fact, it seems to be a recipe for losing majority status, and turning government back over to the Cheney-ites (who, by the way, actually proposed in 1993 a no-public-option mandate very, very similar to the Baucus/Liebermann bill. If they get back in, they will change things (eroding the crumbs of benefits) but they will NEVER revoke the MANDATE.

[mdmc]

10. the mandate gets Obama mad big phama / health insurance cash bribes

He can either cash out and have that be his legacy, or he can fix our health system.

The HRC failure will either be Obama's fault, or the fault of for-profit insurance companies that failed to lower health treatment costs.

I bet the voters blame the for profit health insurance companies. But time alone will tell..

[subterranean]

12. The flaw in that plan

is that most of the reforms, including the mandate, wouldn't take effect until 2014, well into Obama's second term (if he's re-elected). And I just can't see him telling the American people, "Oops, the health insurance overhaul we just started was a mistake. It isn't working. My bad. Let's try single payer."

If the Democrats pass this bill, we will be stuck it with it for at least the next 15-20 years, no matter how unpopular it turns out to be.

The only way we'll get single payer, or anything close to it, is if we begin at the state level. And that will only be possible if the Democrats fail to pass the Senate bill.

[Zenlitened]

29. Seven-dimensional chess? Yikes.

:thumbsdown:

[No Elephants]

32. What you saw this past year gives you confidence in the outcome of the "next fight?"

Cause the more time goes by, the less conservative, and more politically courageous Democrats have been becoming?

Geez, I can't even tell from half the policy posts on this board whether a Democrat or a Republican is posting--and no one here is even trying to get elected via these posts.

[leveymg]

2. You hit it on the head, FB. The Senate Bill is poison. Could be fixed by Reconciliation, but the

problem is, the House Democrats justifiably don't trust the Senate leadership and the White House to deliver the so-called side car. We could all be stuck with a deeply unpopular mandate that everyone was foolish enough to sign off on without reasonable guarantees of a defensible bill.

I've been trying to explain to folks why there should be no House passage of the Senate Bill until we have a binding agreement on the particulars of Reconciliation, including a very public White House vow to lead passage of a decent bill that restores the Public Option, lifts the anti-trust exemption, and puts back Rx drug re-importation. We need to know, and be assured, of exactly what's in the Instruction, including which lines of the budget, how budget items are defined, which committee does the reconciliation, and the date the reconciled bill has to be reported back for passage by the Senate.

Show us the Reconciliation Instruction, and we'll think about supporting this.

In the meantime, the Senate Bill continues to be poison.

[TornadoTN]

9. [phone] n/t

[upi402]

3. wouldn't be prudent, keep powder dry

America is burning but bring on the missing white girls!

Nothing to see here, move along...

[chapel hill dem]

6. Break up the bills and pass them one issue at a time. n/t

[PHIMG]

7. DLC Role = get dems to do things that would hurt the Republican party

Like this mandate.

I agree. It is much better for healthcare long term if the Democrats fight the good fight and lose, then pass something that will screw over the LEAST BAD PARTY and embolden the Republicans.

The funniest thing is the Republicans pretending they'll repeal this reform. They want this reform for thier corporate supporters, its just that they can't enact it. They really took a huge hit for Medicare Part D and they learned their lesson.

DLC Democrats

[rudy23]

11. Most Democrats I know don't even know about the mandates, & don't expect them to stick.

When I talked to my Dem friends and family over Christmas, they were SHOCKED that it was possible that the Dems would pass a healthcare bill that forced them to buy insurance. They thought it was just talk, and that obviously, Barack Obama would never sign a bill that forced us to buy health insurance. They thought it was typical freeper/birther hyperventilating.

If he actually signs a bill that does that, especially with no real controls on insurance companies, we're going to have a full-on revolt from all the lo-info voters who tuned out of the healthcare debate in August.

Three things the public almost universally loathes:

insurance companies
government mandates
the IRS

So the Dems are passing a bill that FORCES people to buy from insurance companies, and will be enforced by the IRS? Who exactly is in favor of this?


Are they trying to lose in 2010? Oh yeah, they probably are. If they were "relieved" to be back at 59 seats as it was reported, just wait to see how relieved they are when they have 49 seats.

[ShortnFiery]

13. Excellent Suggestions.

I'm THERE - with you 100%. :thumbsup:

[Lasher]

15. Me too!

Put up good legislation and force them to go on record voting against it!

[reggie the dog]

14. I have been aruging this for months

force the republicans to block health care reform, real health care reform, tell the voters that you really need 60 seats of REAL DEMOCRATS and wait until after 2010 to get the job done if the repubs really hold out.

[Lasher]

16. Double Dog K&R!

Why is it that something so simple is so hard for Democratic leadership to grasp?

[asdjrocky]

17. Big K&R!

Unfortunately it's something the Dems will never do because their corporate masters won't allow it.

[Billsmile]

42. 50 & over.

Bet the corporate masters wouldn't be so upset if Congress extended Medicare to those 50 and over.

This would help the segment of the population most in need, take more sick folks off of the insurance industries hands (they hate sick folks anyway), and lower the per person cost of Medicare to the government by bringing more healthy folks into the fold.

Obama would be a hero. Dems would look good & lobbyists would have been taken for a ride.

And the nation would be moving in the right direction.

[AzDar]

18. K & R

:kick:

[saracat]

19. k+R

[pleah]

20. K&R

[MissDeeds]

21. Excellent idea

Forcing them to vote against something so many citizens want would be terrific. Let the creeps go on the record.

K&R

[amborin]

22. K&R

[scarletwoman]

23. It makes perfect sense. Therefore, it won't happen.

"Standing on principle with the American people is a strategy for which the GOP has no defense."

Unfortunately, it's also a strategy that has long utterly eluded the Dems.

Rec'd, of course,
sw

[harun]

24. +1, not gonna happen.

[slipslidingaway]

25. Unfortunately we do not have Dems in power or in front of the media...

who advocate for Medicare for All.

Sorry to say that people were led to believe the public option would be just like Medicare and then they dropped their support for a national, not for profit HC system for all.

:(


How many times did we hear that the PO should be thought of just like as Medicare, it did help to bolster poll numbers for the PO, although many did not know exactly what the hell it was.

Maybe 6 million people enrolled in the PO in the next ten years and not open to everyone, left something to be desired.

[theFrankFactor]

26. This Presumes That Cong. Democrats Care About You--THEY DON"T. This is what they WANT to do.

We have to stop thinking we can help them. They don't need help! they need to FEAR US until and unless we can begin serious reform of corporate influence.

[theFrankFactor]

27. The Unitary Corporate Party is Working Just Fine Without Your Meddeling...

besides, how do you propose we get any of these shit heads to do anything. There is no reasonable explanation for the SHIT BILL we have now. ALL of this could have been done from the outset. Single payer was shut out BY DEMOCRATS!

We have to create a power structure OUT HERE to fight them IN THERE. They are shit. C'mon! We lost one vote in the Senate and NOW Democrats don't have enough votes to do a god damn thing? It insulting really! THEY DON"T GIVE A DAMN ABOUT US!

[No Elephants]

34. I think Scott Brown put some fear into Democrats. And, while everyone on the media/Republcan

payroll says, "The clear message from Massachusetts is that Democrats are too far left," those who know how Massachusetts has voted for decades know better than that.

[Zenlitened]

28. K&R. It is a simple truth:

Standing on principle with the American people is a strategy for which the GOP has no defense.

Many of us on what is now considered (scornfully, I might add) "the far left" have been saying that for a long, long time.

That it doesn't happen... that the Democratic Party refuses to do just that... well, it's hard not to become cynical, let's just say. :(

[No Elephants]

36. What is now considered the far left is anyone left of PNAC. Helloooo. The far left is Marxist.

To the right of Marxists are Socialists (true Socialists, not Republicans throwing around lies "socialists").

The rest of us are garden variety, classic Democrats. If you are to the right of us, guess what?

[Kermitt Gribble]

33. K&R! n/t

[tucsonlib]

35. Has ANYONE Read HR 676?

It's concise, beautifully written (I actually cried when I read it), and would go down in history as one of the most powerful, seminal pieces of legislation ever to emerge from Congress. If the American people knew about this bill, they would demand its passage. Only the most shameless corporate shills would dare oppose it.

http://johnconyers.com/hr676text

[Faryn Balyncd]

37. thanks for link.

:hi:



:kick:

[No Elephants]

39. Almost 100 co-sponsors, yet it never got as far as the Congressional Budget Office.

What does that tell us?

[New Dawn]

38. K&R

[emsimon33]

40. K&R

[igfoth]

41. Doubtful Medicare Care for all will happen

even though forcing the Pubs and Blue Dogs to actually stand up and filibuster live on CSPAN is the best path to go, it always has been, it will not happen Obama and Milk Toast Reid both don't have the balls or spine to do it.

Now that the Gang of 5 has given corporations carte blanche in the upcoming elections it is even more less likely to happen, the Pubs would be flooded with money from Medical Insurers and Big Pharma combined with the money from big oil to kill HCR the Dems will lose in droves.

If Obama and Reid are willing to go down the path of Medicare for all then do it now and derail the Pubs early before it is to late, if they wait a few months, nothing will happen because everyone will want to protect their seat.

Bipartisanship is Obama Achilles heal, always has been and still is today. I have been saying this for over a year now, not here but on other political boards and yes sometimes it sucks being right all the time.

[grahamhgreen]

43. I KNOW...and a black man will never be elected president... Yes We Can!

[Amonester]

44. KICK & BOOKMARK

Too bad it's too late to recommend.

Yep. That's the gift from above they R HOPING for.

As for the tens - and perhaps even HUNDREDS, sadly - of THOUSANDS of citizens who will JUST DIE or LOSE EVERYTHING because THEY DON'T HAVE ANY ACCESS to TRUE HEALTH CARE until...

WHAT?!? FOUR YEARS from NOW?? WTF%?

Make sure all the DINOs will be held ACCOUNTABLE for their SPINELESSNESS.

Thank you for posting.

[change_notfinetuning]

45. Yes, force all them Congress critters to go on record. This current approach

is a recipe for disaster, both in terms of health care reform and damage to the Democratic Party.

[upi402]

46. Force a vote on public option, have funded rivals for primary in the wings

But how to force a vote on a public option? There are very few who would. I still see "Democrats" talking about bipartisanship like they want us to buy into it.

Is there a chance? I wonder.

[alberg]

47. K&R!