You're So Left Wing!

[babylonsister]

http://crooksandliars.com/logan-murphy/discuss-youre-so-left-wing


You're So Left Wing!
By Logan Murphy Friday Jan 29, 2010 1:00pm




I recently had a political conversation with a few friends and family members, most of whom are Republicans, and it was nothing short of exasperating. I thought that some of them had progressed over the past few years, but I now know they still have a long way to go.

After George W. Bush was installed in 2000, I told all of my Republican friends and family that not only would he be an abject failure, but that he would take us to war in Iraq and our economy would be in ruins by the time he left office. I was chastised for years after, but I never gloated as time went by and I was sadly proven right. Dubya and his party ran our country into the ground and I thought that many of those conservative friends and family had come around -- but as it turns out, not so much.

Just minutes into the aforementioned discussion, it became painfully clear that the right-leaning narratives put out by our corporate media had indeed sunk in and they had bought into them hook, line and sinker -- and most of these folks admitted they can no longer stomach Fox News so I knew they were getting their talking points from the likes of CNN and other non-Fox media outlets.

No matter what the topic, from health care reform to Wall Street, and no matter how many points we agreed on or how many facts I laid at their feet, someone would invariably turn to me and dismissively say "Yes, but you're so left wing that you..." or "This is a center-right country, and you're so far left that..." In each case I asked them to explain -- please give examples of what makes me, or anyone, "left wing." The only thing they could come up with was deficits! Pelosi and Reid! Beyond that, it was because I didn't hate people like Al Gore and Howard Dean and I watch Keith Olbermann and Rachel Maddow, and EVERYBODY knows they are really "far left."

Head. Smash. Desk.

The irony of it all is that in the end, we agreed on about 90% of everything we talked about. Old habits die hard and they couldn't let go of the old targets they were trained to hate by the right wing media. In their minds, any policy or legislation that comes from Democrats with no support from the right is just far left and that can't be good. We ended up agreeing to disagree ... on all the issues we agreed on! I'm sure I'm not the only one who has suffered through these kinds of skull-numbing experiences so if you've found yourself in the same position, please feel free to use this post to vent.

(Note: That's not me in the picture...at least on the outside.)

[HBravo]

1. hear hear

:banghead:

[sharp_stick]

2. Before I noticed your Note

I thought, Man that's sure not how I pictured you. ;-)

[depakid]

3. Precisely why the administration and the Democratic leadership shouldn't reinforce the narrative

and framing. Yet- time after time, that's what they do.

Then they wonder why they can't get much of anything that's rational, responsible and productive done.

Robert Reich discusses this exact deal after the SOTU:

The President wants businesses that hire new employees this year to get $5,000 per hire, in the form of a tax credit. That will come to about $33 billion. It's good step. He's also supporting a cut in the capital gains tax for small businesses. That makes sense; after all, small businesses generate most jobs.

But here's the problem. Both of these measures, and many of the other tax cuts he's proposing, give ammunition to supply-siders who think the way out of this awful economy is simply to cut taxes on businesses. If a new jobs tax credit is a good idea, why not a cut corporate income taxes? If it's useful to reduce capital gains taxes for small businesses, why isn't it useful to reduce them for all businesses?

...if the public learns the wrong set of lessons -- that tax cuts for businesses are good, and deficit reduction starting now is good -- there's no hope for getting wise policies out of Congress. The debate is framed all wrong.

The President -- any president -- is the nation's educator in chief. Everything he proposes contains an implicit lesson. The economic lesson President Obama ought to be teaching is that targeted tax cuts, mostly for small business, are good to the extent they give businesses a nudge toward creating more jobs. But businesses won't begin to create lots of jobs until they have lots of customers. And that won't happen until lots more Americans have work. The only way to get them work when businesses aren't hiring is for government to prime the pump.

Much more here: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/robert-reich/obama-needs-to-teach-the_b_441369.html

[babylonsister]

4. Get lost. These rethugs had their minds set way before Obama

even arrived on the scene. And they're former faux watchers. Did you read the second para.?

They don't like Democrats because they've been 'taught' not to like them, or liberals.

If anyone is to blame, blame the media they're currently watching, for starters.

[depakid]

11. Every time you reinforce their narrative, it makes matters worse- for more and more people

I read the entire piece and understand the psychological dynamics that they're talking about (as does Robert Reich).

Now, you're finding that the narrative's insidious and has found its way into other media outlets- BIG SURPRISE. To the exclusion of a progressive narrative that furthers more responsible policies.

Why do you think that is?

Hint: It ain't all the media's fault.

[hfojvt]

17. but lots of people watch the SOTU who are not rethugs

So when they hear "Reagomics rules!!" from a Democrat, it does not make them more liberal.

[hfojvt]

16. amen to Reich

exactly why I was cringing during the SOTU. "We cut taxes, and I propose even more tax cuts and tax credits, and I am gonna cut spending!" God bless Reaganomics.

[Go2Peace]

5. The Republicans and corporations have done a phenomenal job of framing and reducing

we need to read more works like George Layoff. The (R)s are lousy at the science they do not like, but they have had absolutely brilliant cognitive scientists and have been playing the language game remarkably well. They *almost* completely extinguished liberal thought in the population. If you can control the language you can control people's perceptions.

I think we are just in the process of discovering this, and that is what is happening lately with Obama's changed demeanor

[babylonsister]

7. You're right, Dems have always had a problem with their framing.

Now they seem to be gathering steam and not letting the rethugs off the hook anymore, which I welcome!

From Axelrod yesterday:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=433x159995

snip//

the White House will make a big push in 2010 to increase public awareness of Republican obstructionism through the use of the filibuster. "They get to work with us, or they have to pay a price,'

snip//

While Axelrod again emphasized that the White House would be focusing on 2010 for now, and on attempting to make Republicans either work with them or pay a political price for obstructing them, he offered no pushback against the idea of changing the rules of the Senate to eliminate the filibuster.

From my vantage point, the implication was very much that the White House would be working on educating the public about how Republicans are using the filibuster to defend the status quo, and that the White House would be very interested if a campaign to end the filibuster altogether if it began to take off concurrent with their efforts.

[lib_wit_it]

13. Good grief--I've been saying this for years! And I'm not a political scientist, just a regular

person who could clearly see that the Rs were using that angle and we weren't. How could this have been missed by an entire party?!

[Deep13]

6. I had to refute that myself recently.

I was in the DA's office with one of the other ADAs just after the MA disaster. We were all Ds there and the other ADA, let's call him "Dude" said that the election was a wake up call indicating that we should not be catering to the "far left" of the party and hat the HC effort was too liberal. I told Dude that there was no far left in the D party. I pointed out that the Senate HC bill was a corporate give-away. The boss asked what I meant. I told him about the subsidies, the mandatory nature on the customers' side, but no price control on the insurers' side. I told dude that right, left and center are not fixed positions and that every time the Ds move to the center, the center and the whole country move further to the right. As it is we have a conservative D. party, a fascist R. and no one representing me.

[lib_wit_it]

14. So true and so excruciatingly frustrating! I am sick to death of the teabaggers freaking out at

how far left "comrade" Obama is. The "socialism" panic. All that ridiculously unsupportable nonsense that is being popularized by the corporate money behind it in multifaceted force.

[cliffordu]

8. Is that grantcart??

[L0oniX]

9. Inappropriate picture ...this one's much better and has class.

[babylonsister]

10. But this is what they're thinking...

[ddeclue]

12. The FACTS aren't left right or center.. the problem with the right is that they invent their own

facts to make sure they don't have to use the real ones because the real ones don't support their ideology... translation don't confuse them with the facts.. that's why they have to watch FakeNews and listen to Douche Limbaugh and Glenn Beckkk for their news.. when they have to deal with reality, their right wing psychosis falls apart.. it's why Obama kicked Republican ass today too.

[hfojvt]

15. you probably think this post is about you

you're so left wing. I'll bet you think this post is about you, don't you, don't you?

[ikri]

18. I've had similar conversations

Ok, so in the UK politics is nowhere near as polarised as in the US, but I've talked with people who have been told that they're Conservatives for so long that the fact that they don't really agree with any conservative policies seems to pass them by.

When asked for their beliefs, point by point, on more traditional left wing policies they tend to agree with them more often than not, but somehow they always end up deciding that they're still conservative.

Try asking your friends to complete the Political Compass Test, they may be surprised where they actually stand compared to the main parties.