The Missing Voices at the Healthcare Summit - John Nichols

[slipslidingaway]

http://www.thenation.com/blogs/thebeat/534817/the_missing_voices_at_the_healthcare_summit

The problem, of course, is that most of the really meaningful disagreements went undiscussed...

Instead of Republican grumbling about how Obama is going too far, why not have a rational discussion about whether Obama is going far enough? ...

PNHP leaders, including the organization's national coordinator, Dr. Quentin Young asked to be included in the Blair House session. (And this White House knows Young. The Chicago physician whose office once cared for Obama and his family and whose friendship with the future president was forged more than a decade ago.)...

Consider Dr. Young's assessment of the president's plan.

"Regrettably, the president's proposal is built on some of the worst aspects of the Senate bill," Young said, in an accurate assessment of Obama's approach. "For example, the president's proposal would ship hundreds of billions of taxpayer dollars to the private health insurance industry in the form of subsidies. And to help finance this, it would impose a new tax on health benefits of workers, especially those in high-cost states...

"In short," added Young, "this proposal is an insurance company bonanza, not good, evidence-based health reform. The president would do better by abandoning the insurance and drug companies and instead taking up the single-payer approach."

Young and his allies are not another "party of 'no'" -- they actually propose a viable alternative that could save hundreds of billions of dollars annually by simplifying health administration..."

[BrklynLiberal]

1. I had noticed a couple of days ago that the list of those that were not invited was a lot more

interesting than the list of those that were....
I think the usual term is "conspicuous by their absence"

[polichick]

2. +1

[slipslidingaway]

5. Yes! they were! n/t

[LWolf]

12. +1,000

[polichick]

3. Glad to add #5 k&r

[slipslidingaway]

6. Thanks n/t

[Echo In Light]

4. K&R

[slipslidingaway]

7. :) n/t

[jannyk]

8. K&R

[slipslidingaway]

10. Thank you! n/t

[slipslidingaway]

9. Polls - Over half of Americans want non-profit national health insurance: Medicare for All

http://www.medicareforall.org/pages/Chart_of_Americans_Support

"Eight polls in 2007

◦See the bar chart below and its list of sources

9 – Associated Press - Yahoo — 65% — Dec 2007
— Question ISS14. The United States should adopt a universal health insurance program in which everyone is covered under a program like Medicare that is run by the government and financed by taxpayers: 65% yes; 34% no; 2% refused / not answered

8 – Associated Press - Yahoo — 54% — Dec 2007
— Question ISS15. Do you consider yourself a supporter of a single-payer health care system, that is a national health plan financed by taxpayers in which all Americans would get their insurance from a single government plan, or not?: 54% yes; 44% no; 2% refused / not answered

7 – Los Angeles Times / Bloomberg — 53% — Oct 2007
— Create a government-run, government-financed health insurance program that would cover all Americans: 53% agree, 36% disagree, 11% don’t know.

6 —- CBS News Poll — 55% — Sept 2007
— one health insurance program covering all Americans that would be administered by the government and paid for by taxpayers (55%); keeping the current system where many people get their insurance from private employers and some have no insurance (29%); not sure (9%)

5 – CNN/Opinion Research Corporation Poll — 64% — May 2007
— “Do you think the government should provide a national health insurance program for all Americans, even if this would require higher taxes?”

4 —- National Small Business Association — 60% — Mar 2007
— federally-funded, government administered health care system financed through taxes in which everyone has health care coverage for all medically necessary treatment and procedures

3 —- The New York Times / CBS News — 64% — Feb 2007
— federal government should guarantee health insurance for all

2 —- The New York Times / CBS News — 47% — Feb 2007
— one health insurance program for all administered by the government vs. 38% keep current system where many people get their insurance from private employers and some have no insurance"

[slipslidingaway]

11. Thanks for the additional recs :) n/t

[amborin]

13. knr

the whole thing was such a charade

the financialization of all areas of life; healthcare, education, etc........

interesting litmus test article here:

http://www.thenation.com/doc/20100308/burner

[slipslidingaway]

14. Thanks and that just passed ...

http://perriello.house.gov/index.cfm?sectionid=25&parentid=6§iontree=6,25&itemid=480

"House Passes Perriello's Bill to End Monopoly Protections for Health Insurance Companies
02/24/10

First Health Care Reform Bill to Pass With Overwhelming Bipartisan Support..."

[branders seine]

15. red herring logical fallacy

Of course, the republicans are scum who should all be imprisoned for treason and who offer nothing constructive whatsoever tot he issue.

For over a year now, Obama and the Democrats, pretending that they must, against their will, cave into the hard right on point after point after point, have created legislation that no longer resembles actual health care reform. Indeed, even Obama has quietly slipped into calling it "health insurance reform." So, for the actual reform that was single-payer (supported by 82% of Americans in late 2008), Democrats substituted the red herring of a "public option" (a term so vague that no one really knows what it is), but the secret deals made with the insurance lobby back in early 2009 won't allow even a "public option," so Democrats substituted yet another red herring of "free-market competition," which is now a key part of the pretend debate.

Most Americans are stupid enough to go along with the idea that health care reform is still the heart of this debate, but that idea is no longer even in the room, while the two not-really-opposing "sides" kick around red herrings and straw men and jockey for political position with their bases and with independents prior to the 2010 election cycle.

It's the cartoon before the Buck Rogers sequel before the matinee. It's all phony. Meanwhile, the wealthy get wealthier, and 40,000 Americans a year die.

[slipslidingaway]

16. Well said, the Dems in general ignored what the people wanted

by excluding Medicare for All and marketing the PO idea without any real defintion of how it would work.

:(

And a little more history on the policy ...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=433&topic_id=195835&mesg_id=196245

Politics, the policy had already been decided by late 2007 as noted in this article by Jacob Hacker and subsequent comment by Dr. McCanne.


Where are we on reform? Part 2 (Hacker)
Health Reform Lessons from the Past

Jacob Hacker, PhD
National Conference on the Un and Underinsured
December 12, 2007 (Day 3)


.....

Rewind to what was said by PNHP contributor Dr. McCanne in January 2007 when the Health Care for America planned was introduced.


Jacob Hacker's "Health Care for America"

Health Care for America
by Jacob S. Hacker
The Economic Policy Institute
EPI Briefing Paper #180
January 11, 2007

[ThomWV]

17. What logical fallacy are you referring to?

Where do you see a fallacy? Please point out the elements and name the fallacy, because I don't see it and this is something I pay attention to.

By the way, beginning with the ad hominem attack doesn't do much for your argument.

[branders seine]

19. I did.

Red Herring logical fallacy.

In debate on the issue of health care reform, Democrats substituted "public option" for single payer. Public option was a red herring, not the real reform desired by most Americans.

Then, when a version of public option not acceptable to the medical insurance lobby showed signs of possibly passing, Democrats substituted the "free market competition" red herring into the debate to take attention off the "public option," using numerous arcane subsitutes, for example, exchanges, fee-for-services provisions, health cooperatives, tax credits, expansion of state-run programs, etc.

The lobbyist-controlled Congress has pretended to battle over the red herrings of "public option" and then "competition" instead of the real reform that was expected by most Americans after the campaign of 2008.

In another sense, the politician branch of the DC lobbying industry has shifted attention to the red herring of health insurance reform and away from the actual issue of health care reform.

[xchrom]

18. Recommend

[slipslidingaway]

20. :) n/t