How come Obama didn't push this hard for health care when

[quinnox]

the Democrats had the 60 vote hard majority in the Senate? I don't get it. The Democrats had months to get it done but didn't take action.

Now Obama is FINALLY pushing hard for Health care apparently and challenging the republicans to join in or be bypassed by reconciliation measures. Why didn't he do this months ago? Did it take him this long to wake up and smell the coffee? That the republicans weren't going to allow the Democrats to pass anything of substance with their help?

[leftstreet]

1. Because he knew the bill was Insurance Care, not healthcare

They all knew this would be hard to sell

[laughingliberal]

2. Because he wasn't going to fight for HCR until it was the bill he wanted

Now it's the one he wants. Too risky back when some of those progressive policies were still a possibility. I mean, what if something popular like a PO had gotten into that final bill? What would he tell Karen?

[quinnox]

6. Its hard to argue

that point. I don't get it. Back when the Dems had the majority we could have had a progressive bill by reconciliation and bypassed the joe liebermans of the world. Now we are getting a bill not nearly as good as it could have been and now Obama is fighting hard? This is baffling.

[laughingliberal]

10. Not baffling is you take into account his promises to AHIP. nt

[dflprincess]

9. He's still not fighting for HCR

he's fighting for pharma and the insurance companies.

[tridim]

14. Please explain to me why HC Insurance stocks took a huge hit yesterday?

It must be because they love being regulated so much. :eyes:

[laughingliberal]

19. Fail. Lots of factors affect the stock market

In fact, my husband told me the market went down, overall, but oil went up which was baffling. Gold was up which was to be expected but no explaining oil going up as it usually falls with the overall market.

Edited to add: A 35th Senator signed on to the letter supporting reconciliation to pass a PO yesterday.

[rhett o rick]

20. There is the key. The president wants to pass the bill before anymore Senators

sign on for a PO.

[tridim]

22. Their stocks dropped like a rock immediately after the President's speech.

2 + 2 = 4

[laughingliberal]

26. Correlation doesn't prove causation

And a 35th Senator signed on for to support the public option. The entire stock market dropped, overall, yesterday. The bill stinks. Just because it doesn't stink as much as the industry would like it to does not mean it's a good bill for the American people.

[tridim]

28. It stinks for the status quo and the GOP.

It's good for the people and the Democratic party.

You'll understand soon enough.

[laughingliberal]

31. No, I already understand the harm the bill does to the American people

and, once people have to live with the damned thing, it will sink the party, too. Do NOT condescent to me with "You'll understand soon enough." I have found, through multiple discussions here that most who want to regale me with the saving graces of this bill have never even read it and simply repeat the talking points of the bills' supporters. Just asking, you wouldn't be one of those, would you?

I read the final version of the Senate bill and all the bills which passed out of every committee since this debate started. This bill is the status quo on steroids. It's mandating people to participate, by force of law, in the status quo. What is your problem with demanding we make this bill better?

[tridim]

36. You left out the industry regulations. Again.

You don't have a clue what this bill does, and why we need it desperately.

[laughingliberal]

40. I have every clue as to what the bill does. I read it. I suspect you have not.

Every regulation they have told us we are getting in this bill has a corresponding loophole. There is a loophole that keeps rescission legal. There is a community rating system that will price people with preexisting conditions out of the market. There is a loophole to allow annual limits on coverage. Read the bill. Without reading the bill you are trusting someone else to tell you what it does and their motives are suspect.

There are those who need this bill desperately but it ain't us. We need health care reform desperately and I've been fighting for it since before most in this country knew we needed it. This bill is not health care reform.

I left out the regulations cause the bill leaves them out, too. There is a weasel in the bill for every regulation they are telling us is there.

[eridani]

47. There are no regulations that are worth warm spit n/t

[bvar22]

50. Gee. Do you believe those "regulations"....

...will be as effective as the regulations they put on the Credit Card Companies?
Or how about those "regulations" they put on Wall Street! woo-hoo.
LOL

And where is the new watch dog agency that will ensure that the Health Insurance Cartel is actually abiding by the new "regulations"?...or will it be up to the consumer to police the Health Insurance Industry? I guess we can always file a lawsuit from our hospital bed.

You know, the Democratic Party does NOT have a very good track record at regulating giant corporations over the last 30 years...
In fact, the current crop of "Centrists" are de-regulators.
Anything that is regulated, can be easily de-regulated,especially after the Democrats lose the majority in 2010/2012.

When I hear a "Centrist" Democrat tell me that everything is going to be fine because they are going to put in "protections for the taxpayer/consumer"...I grab my wallet.
I have heard that shit waaaay to often from that crowd.
Its not MY fault that I no longer trust them.
It IS their fault, based on their track record since 1992.

"Its OK.
We'll Fix It LATER!":hi:
LOL.



"There are forces within the Democratic Party who want us to sound like kinder, gentler Republicans. I want us to compete for that great mass of voters that want a party that will stand up for working Americans, family farmers, and people who haven't felt the benefits of the economic upturn."---Paul Wellstone

[laughingliberal]

56. Nobody on DU lays it out more clearly and consistently than you.

Right to the heart of the matter, every time.

[eridani]

46. It is notthing but the worst kind of fuckover for people 50-64

At least now if there is a cnflict between paying ongoing health care expenses and paying for really shitty insurance, I can choose the former without having the IRS take even more money from me.

[sabrina 1]

49. It could be because now after months of Democratic leadership

and their political operatives (we saw it right her on DU) arguing that reconciliation could not be used to get the bill the Democrats supposedly wanted, either a Single Payer or as a compromise (remember when a PO was a compromise?) a Public Option into the bill, NOW there is talk of using that procedure.

What that means to anyone with a few brain cells still functioning is that there will now be a huge push by the Democratic base and many Independents, to use the procedure since it is clear Republicans will never get on board with or without it, to get what the American people want, a bill with a Public Option.

Investors in the Insurance Industry are naturally skittish now in fear that it just might happen and the market is reflecting their fears. I'm sure they are aware of the petitions being signed, and of the fact that now that Democrats have admitted they can use Reconciliation, they have no more excuse NOT to include a PO.

The question for the Insurance Industry now is, 'will Dems remain loyal to the Insurance Industry, risking re-election in the Fall, or will they cave to the base and include a PO'?

It's obvious that Dems cannot excuse using this procedure to push the Senate Bill as it is. They will lose half their base if they do. That fact cannot be denied. I'm sure Democrats are being strongly lobbied right now by the Ins. Industry. Promises are being made that they WILL be re-elected with lots of money from the Industry.

Meantime nothing is certain although I would put my money on the Insurance Industry. They need not worry imho, that Congress cares one bit about the American people's wishes.

[laughingliberal]

57. +1 nt

[Echo In Light]

17. +1

[DJ13]

3. Honestly, I think the WH wanted it to become do or die

Its easier to push through the Senate abomination they really want (because its so insurance industry friendly) now that they've made it an issue of winning for the entire party.

Oh sure they have promised to change things in reconciliation, but we know what promises are worth in DC.

[barbiegeek]

39. Exactly!! everyone read his reply

[proud2BlibKansan]

4. He had to wait for the lobbyists to tell him what they wanted in the final bill

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

5. He now knows he fucked it up and is deperate

[laughingliberal]

11. I'm still of the mind that Feingold was correct when he said this was the bil the President always

wanted.

[DrDan]

15. +1

[rrwcf]

16. Yes. He is desperate.

He is backed into a corner.
My first DU post --
I hope to learn a few things in here.

[laughingliberal]

21. Welcome

:hi:

[rrwcf]

38. Thanks!

[napi21]

7. I honestly think he was so scared off by what happened with the Clinton bill,

he delely gave too much decision power to Congress. He didn't want to hear anyone saying HE pushed HIS ideas through with no concern about the opinions of those elected by the people of each State who (should) know what their constituents really want.

In hindsite, it seems obvious thaa midle position would have beern much better, but that's all in the past now.

[rhett o rick]

55. Great. Just what we need, a scared President. nt

[dflprincess]

8. It is curious that he never felt the need to act before.

I'm guessing that pharma and the insuraNce companies are worried that all the deals they made might fall through and Congress might decide to pass some reform as stand alone bills so they're pressuring Obma to do something. Because it's pretty clear he's still not listening to what the public wants.

[NJmaverick]

12. When there were 60 votes they didn't need his help

[rhett o rick]

24. So you are saying he didnt help because 60 votes is a big enough margin to not worry?

Why didnt he help when they had only 59 votes?

[laughingliberal]

27. Or, when, early on they had only 58? nt

[NJmaverick]

30. Had Ted's seat stayed in Democratic hands health care would already been passed

[rhett o rick]

32. Please explain. The help we need is to reconcile the HOR bill and the Senate bill.

That can be done with out Ted's seat. The reconciliation of the two bills is what is taking so long and could have used the president's help.

[NJmaverick]

37. President Obama's healthcare summit gave the Dems the political cover to

go the reconciliation route. Had the Dems skipped the summit then it would be harder to defend against the Republican's claims that the Dems ignored the will of the people and rammed through a partisan bill. By including Republican ideas the BILL is bipartisan (even if the support isn't) and all that the President has done has defeated the Republican claim that Scott Brown's election was the public's condemnation of the health care reform bill.

[rhett o rick]

52. "political cover", "harder to defend against", are you serious?

The republicans are going to attack regardless of your "political cover" and "including republican ideas". I say forget the bullshit and full speed ahead. Stop all pretense of "bipartisan" everyone knows it's a joke. Add to the Senate bill the strong PO that is in the HOR bill and pass it with reconcilation and tell the republicans to go fuck themselves. Tell the Blue Damn Dogs to go fuck themselves. I am so damn sick of this pitty pattying around, afraid the republicans might get mad. Get some damn guts and go for it. The American people respect a strong party, they dont respect the whiny weak-assed party of Rahmbo.

[tridim]

45. Are you insane? Did you sleep though all of yesterday?

The FUD being spread here is just disgusting.

[rhett o rick]

51. I see that any kind of dialog with you is useless. Good bye. nt

[AllentownJake]

13. Good question

incompetence or complicty, neither look good.

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

18. Well, because you weren't paying attention...

or just intentionally want to misrepresent the facts...

Obama's been pushing hard for health care reform for a year now. Back when it looked like we might actually have 60 votes, he was pushing for the public option. When that fell through, we're at what we've got now.

[rhett o rick]

23. Good grief. Interesting that some of his supporters in here

claim that Obama never campaigned for the PO. They make that claim to answer the criticism of his not supporting the PO.

I trust you have some proof that he strongly supported the PO?

[laughingliberal]

58. Strongly supported=Mentioned it a couple of times and called it a sliver. nt

[cameozalaznick]

66. I never saw him push all that hard for a PO. NT

[rhett o rick]

25. He is in a hurry now to get a bill passed w/o the PO. The 35th Senator just signed on

for the PO.

[tridim]

29. In your opinion.

[rhett o rick]

34. Can you show me anything to suggest that the president supports the PO? nt

[tridim]

42. He has said he supports a PO hundreds of times.

But no, he doesn't reiterate it every minute of every day.

Here are just a few links showing his support for the PO..
http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2010/02/sebelius-if-senate-leadership-wants-a-public-option-obama-will-absolutely-fight-for-it.php
http://articles.latimes.com/2009/oct/05/nation/na-healthcare-obama5
http://my.barackobama.com/page/community/post/obamaforamerica/gGGGpK
http://openleft.com/diary/17464/breaking-obama-will-support-the-public-option-if-reid-will
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/08/18/AR2009081803652.html

[laughingliberal]

44. Last I saw he was saying he never even campaigned on it

Words are cheap. Support might mean kicking a little Blue Dog butt in the Senate. But nooooo. All we heard was praise and glory for the 'work' of Baucus' committee and not one little attaboy for 4 other committees that had their work done much sooner and included a PO in their bills.

[rhett o rick]

48. I guess a strong PO isnt definitive enough. He may support the "exchange"

crap, but that is hardly a strong PO. Strong means to me at least as strong as the HOR bill. The "exchange" isnt a PO, it is a reward to the insurance industry.

[rhett o rick]

53. Hundreds of times? I reviewed your links and found that the closest the President

comes to endorsing a strong PO is his exchange. That might meet your definition of PO, but I consider it a weak-assed option. He is caving to the insurance industry. Why doesnt he go for a real PO?

[laughingliberal]

59. But he mentioned it in a couple of speeches and he called it a sliver

Isn't that strong support?

[Bluebear]

33. Because Presidents are not allowed to present legislation. Only Congress can do that.

At least that is what we were told re: Don't Ask, Don't Tell repeal. :silly:

[damntexdem]

35. Because they didn't really have a 60-vote majority.

They had less plus Lieberman, plus several blue dogs.

It has only been after Brown's election in Mass. that the facade has been stripped away and a push could come that did not rely on LIEberman and the other traitors.

[upi402]

41. so tuck nuts and cluck?

like the tepid chickens they are? if now isn't the time to fight, when? he missed his window of opportunity, i think

[gleaner]

43. I think it was because he took about ...

$28,000,000 from the health insurance industry before he was elected not to pass a meaningful bill that would give people a choice outside of their policies. It has been discussed several times on DU. No single payer, no public option. No he has a pretty much worthless bill which he has filled with the GOP wish list and he keeps reassuring them that he incorporated every idea they gave him. We got bupkus. More of our money would get funneled into the insurance companies and we will just get sicker and sicker. The bi partisanship is just the way he tries to cover what he is doing, or maybe he really is pushing the Republican agenda because it feeds the health insure res.

Yet another example of how you can buy almost anything if you have the money to do it. He also has been revealed to have ties to the pharmaceutical companies which is why the ability of US citizens and their state governments to buy drugs outside the US has been kept illegal.

I wonder how much pocket money we would have to save before we could buy ourselves our very own politician? More than I'll ever see. All I know right now is that I'm going for someone else in the Democratic primaries. No more free rides for Obama and this Congress from me.

[berni_mccoy]

54. Probably because he expected Congress to do it's job. Remember, the angry republican

Mobs didn't happen until late summer and Baucus betrayed with stall tactics long enough for that crap to happen. It's called trusting your coworkers to do thier job. When they failed, he finally stepped in to do the job.

[laughingliberal]

60. As I recall, the President had nothing but praise for the good work Baucus' committee was doing

I'm sure of it. I remember having to restrain myself from throwing things at the television while he sucked up to Max and his gang of six thugs. And not one word, not one, of encouragement for 4 other committees that got their work done before August and all had a PO in it. Not a high five, not an attaboy, nuttin. It was pretty clear, then, where his heart was.

[berni_mccoy]

63. That's not exactly true. He praised him until Summer came and went. Then there was some

serious head-knocking on what the problem was when Congress resumed in October. Then there was the failed effort to go bipartisan because too many in the Democratic Caucus couldn't agree on what it should be. Then winter came and we lost Kennedy's seat.

[laughingliberal]

70. Nevertheless, it was clear to me he was much more enthusiastic about Baucus' bill

than he ever was about 4 other committees who all included a public option. Not one word of praise for any of those 4 committees. Not one.

I think he made a deal with AHIP. I can't prove it but his behavior is consistent with that.

[DefenseLawyer]

61. The Insurance Industry was made certain assurances at the beginning of the process

It may be you that has yet to rouse and whiff the java.

[laughingliberal]

62. Yeah, a little denial goes a long way around here. nt

[ProSense]

64. Because he didn't need to?

The bill survived three Senate votes garnering 60 votes each time without him lifting a finger, right?

The way some people are talking one would get the impression that the bills aren't in conference. Contrary to Republican spin, the House and Senate passed separate bills to arrive at this point.

[rhett o rick]

67. I believe you are serious. The president didnt support the PO because he didnt need to?

All we are asking is for him to give support. Give some SOME indication that he supports the middle class. And you say he doesnt need to. If you havent been paying attention, the Senate bill is a piece of crap. And you say the president did NEED to help. THE BILL IS A PIECE OF CRAP and has taken a year to get this far. AND WE STILL DONT HAVE ANY HCR. But you and your apologist friends say he didnt need to help us.

If we get anything it will be a piece of crap because the president doesnt care.

[ProSense]

68. "THE BILL IS A PIECE OF CRAP" There are some

who would disagree:

The Senate-passed bill includes a Franken provision, co-authored by Sen. Jay Rockefeller (D-W.Va.), that would require insurance companies to use 85 percent of customer premiums on medical costs.

But Franken’s big push has been on the public insurance option, a controversial liberal priority that dominated the debate last year and caused Republicans to charge that it was the first step to socialized medicine.

Franken said he supports health care legislation that does not include the public option, but he said the public option is still his preference for reform. He signed on to a letter penned by Sen. Michael Bennet (D-Colo.) pushing for the public option through budget reconciliation rules that would allow the Senate to sidestep a GOP filibuster.

“I really think the public option is the right thing to do. Now, whether we can get it through reconciliation is a whole other story,” Franken said. “I know that Sen. Jay Rockefeller is someone who’s for the public option but doesn’t think that it will be able to go through reconciliation because, I think, of the rules. It doesn’t fit under the rules. I think it does, but we’ll see.”

link

[rhett o rick]

69. That's it? That's what you got? No PO but a requirement for insurance companies to use

85% of customer premiums on medical costs. That's it? And you dont believe they can beat that with all their money and lawyers.

We deserve much more from our President.

[TransitJohn]

65. Because the midterms are closer now

and it's imperative that the Dem team get something passed, so they can concentrate on milking health lobbyists for cash all summer.

[Bluebear]

71. nodding

[DailyGrind51]

72. And, before August, 72% of Americans favored HCR!

But he pissed the summer away, letting Freedomworks and the rest of the astro-turffers steal the podium.