The bashing of the Boomers begins!

[Joanne98]

If your a Boomer don't get upset. This was planned out going all the way back to the 1970's. When the right-wing and the corporations got upset about two things. Protesting WAR and being nice to black people.( and not shopping) The Boomers broke the taboos.

The corporate elites paid close attention to the "generation gap" that occurred and decided to try to recreate it on the other side. BECAUSE.. Generations think alike but they skip one.

WW2 and Gen X Boomers and M's.... The problem they're trying to solve is how to convince M that they're more like WW2 than their grandparents.

Another thing they've done is ignore WW1. It's easy to figure out why. WW1 (the greatest greatest generation) gave us the New Deal and the unions) So of course they get treated like they didn't even exist. WW1 also ended up anti-war due to suffering.

So according to the MSM, this generational argument starts with WW2 and goes forward. Nice trick but it won't work. M's are going to relate to Boomer no matter how much the MSM tries to deceive. Note the college protests yesterday. Look familiar?

Another problem is that because of the birth control pill and abortion, the generations are mixed. M's have parents from two generations now. The studies show there is NO gap between M's and their parents, another problem for the corporatists.

The minute Tom Brokaw came out with his book, The Greatest Generation, you knew what the plan was. The Boomers had to be evil.

The Boomer sins...

Protesting WAR.
Siding with black people during the civil rights movement
Becoming hippies and refusing to SHOP! GASP! (that may be the biggest crime of all)

Anyway it's all designed to fool M's into doing what they want. I personally don't think it's going to work, especially if M's are informed about what's going on.

Kids aren't stupid and if they decide to punish the elites for their obvious deceptions all they have to do is demand that the Empire be shut down.

Combine college tuition protests with, STOP THE WARS THEY COST TOO MUCH, and this whole game goes to Hell.

Also, get ready to be called "self-centered" everyday. Andrea Mitchell started that yesterday. I had to laugh at that. Whoa. One of the most self centered people ever born is calling me out! LOL

Anyway, good luck with you're great project MSM! And get ready for it to blow up in your evil faces!

[Tunkamerica]

1. generation x is like the ww2 generation how?

[Richardo]

2. Boomers didn't shop? Where were YOU in the 80's?

Boomers were in their mid-20s to mid-30s and spending like mad.

What the hell's an "M"? Must there be a cutesy name for everything?

[Odin2005]

5. The Millenial Generation, people born from 1982 to 2001.

[sinkingfeeling]

9. I don't count anybody born after 1955 as a 'boomer'. Only things I was spending money on in the

1980's was my kid's education and my house.

[Odin2005]

12. Boomers are people born from 1943 to 1960.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

17. 1946-1964

[Berry Cool]

26. Don't believe the "to 1964" crap.

People born in the mid-to-late forties and people born in the early sixties are usually pretty different in many ways. Us midsixties people really aren't quite Boomers (born too late to have the advantages they did) or GenXers (born too soon to have much in common with them). We're stuck in the middle.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

29. There's nothing to believe. It's a fact per the Census Bureau.

That being said, I appreciate the spirit of the point that you're making.

[sinkingfeeling]

38. I agree with Jonathan Pontell. He defines 'Generation Jones' as those born between 1954 and 1965.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Generation_Jones

"The name “Generation Jones” has several connotations, including a large anonymous generation, a “keeping up with the Joneses” competitiveness and the slang word "jones" or “jonesing”, meaning a yearning or craving.<6><7><8><9><10> It is said that Jonesers were given huge expectations as children in the 1960s, and then confronted with a different reality as they came of age in the 1970s, leaving them with a certain unrequited, jonesing quality."

[Lost4words]

145. thats such garbage! nt

[MidwestPerspective]

160. Experts, Data, and GenJonesers themselves sure don't see that as garbage

Whether you like it or not, the generational map is being redrawn to include GenJones; if you research it, you'll see there is an inevitability to the GenJones movement as it builds nationally

[MidwestPerspective]

94. Census Bureau has absolutely nothing to do with defining generations

"It's a fact per the Census Bureau"?! Are you joking? The Census Bureau has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with defining generations. When they refer to the 1946-1964 baby boom, they are strictly speaking to that demographic phenomenom, not in any way to the cultural generations born during that time frame. It is important to distinguish between the post-WWII demographic boom in births vs. the cultural generations born during that era. Generations are a function of the common formative experiences of its members, not the fertility rates of its parents. And most analysts now see generations as getting shorter (usually 10-15 years now), partly because of the acceleration of culture. Many experts now believe it breaks down more or less this way:

DEMOGRAPHIC boom in babies: 1946-1964
Baby Boom GENERATION: 1942-1953
Generation Jones: 1954-1965
Generation X: 1966-1978

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

97. Fair: CB does not dictate "generations."

Nor does anybody else.

Horseshit: Your assertion. There is no body that "officially" draws the lines for these demographics. There is only popular understanding. To whit:

Baby Boomers, born between 1946 and 1964, make up about 26.1% of the U.S. population, or an estimated 78 million people.
http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/census/2009-11-10-topblline10_ST_N.htm

The United States Census Bureau considers a baby boomer to be someone born during the demographic birth boom between 1946 and 1964...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baby_boomer

America's baby boomers are in a collective funk. Members of the large generation born from 1946 to 1964...
http://pewresearch.org/pubs/880/baby-boomers-the-gloomiest-generation

ad infinitum...

[GoCubsGo]

37. Look up "Generation Jones"

We were born to parents of another "cracker" generation--those who were Depression babies born before WWII, but too young to fight in it.

[ieoeja]

40. I was born in '62 and largely felt like we were transitional.

As far as plain numbers, where I grew up, '62 and '63 were the #1 and #2 largest birth years respectively. So I can definitely see where we would be boomers by the definition of a baby boom.

But culturally ... there was a huge gulf between my high school graduating class and the one just a year before us. There was also a gap between us and the class two years after us. But then we graduated in 1980. In just two years the Reagan Revolution flipped my hometown from staunchly liberal to radically conservative.

Ironically, it seems it was only those of us who left who retained the values with which we grew up. I saw that evidenced twice. Once when my father blew up at a bunch of people he'd grown up with for talking like a bunch of yokels. Sure, we had an accent. But we used to speak proper english and aspire to college before education and intelligence became vilified. The vast majority of my high school class, for instance, went to college. My niece and nephew tell me that the vast majority of their classes had no interest in going to college largely because they viewed college as a bad thing.

The other time the loss of values was shown in stark relief was when some friends who stayed behind accused me of having changed since moving to Chicago. So I took them down a list of our social and political views when we were in high school. They were forced to admit that their views had completely reversed on all but one issue, the only one upon which we still agreed. Of course, they said that just meant they had grown up and gotten smarter....

No, wait, not smarter. Wiser. Being smarter is bad. Forgot that for a second what with my being a whackjob liberal and all.

[Grand Taurean]

73. Those born from 59 to 64 are a transitional generation.

There are always transitional generations that lay between the two main generations.
In the same respect, those born between 78 and 83 are a transitional generation between Gen-X and the Millenials.

[WolverineDG]

52. My true Boomer cousins & brother grew up in a different world

than my younger brother, cousin, & I did (we were the tail-end Charlies born in the early 60s). The world we three remember is the post-Civil Rights Act one.

dg

[MidwestPerspective]

95. Consensus of experts now is that Generation Jones exists between Boom & X

Yes, you're right, we are between Boom & X, but we no longer are stuck anonymously...we have name now which is developing quite a big following: Generation Jones. Google Generation Jones, and you’ll see it’s gotten lots of media attention, and many top commentators from many top publications and networks (Washington Post, Time magazine, NBC, Newsweek, ABC, etc.) now specifically use this term. In fact, the Associated Press' annual Trend Report chose the Rise of Generation Jones as the #1 trend of 2009. I found this page helpful because it gives a pretty good overview of recent media interest in GenJones: http://generationjones.com/2009latest.html

[NoSheep]

109. Not all are that different. I feel I have my feet in the Boomer world and the generation after

I grew up in a small town where things didn't change as quickly...it also has to do with birth rates...not something you can get "wrong".

[flyarm]

113. baby boomers go to 1964..look it up damn it! or do we boomers have to look it up for you? eom

[MidwestPerspective]

127. But only very few actual experts still believe it goes to 1964

There are no official generational boundaries, they are always the subjective opinions of experts. Usually a consensus of sorts emerges, and if you study current expert thinking--in academic journals, books, and more scholarly articles--you'll find that it usually looks more or less like this lately:
Boomer Generation: 1942-1953
Generation Jones: 1954-1965
Generation X: 1966-1978

[flyarm]

205. I call ...bullshit!

Sloan Work and Family Research Network Boston College
http://wfnetwork.bc.edu/glossary_entry.php?term=Baby%20Boomers,%20Definition(s)%20of&area=All




Baby Boomers, Definition(s) of
Ages 38-57 (in 2002) (Families & Work Institute, 2004).

“Born between 1947 and 1966…The last generation to force great changes on society, Baby boomers grew up in relative prosperity and safety… They came of age in the optimistic sixties and seventies and believe in growth, change and expansion. The boomers tend to pursue promotion by working long hours and demonstrating loyalty…” (Allen, 2004).

“At 78 million strong, they are the largest generation and make up the current workforce majority. Born between 1946 and 1964, Baby Boomers are optimistic…Boomers grew up in a time when mothers stayed home, while fathers went to work…On the job, Boomers arrive early and leave late, visibility is key. The longer the day, the higher the pay, believes the Boomer” (Hatfield, 2002, p.72).

“Baby Boomers (born between 1946 and 1964)…” (Singleton & Maher, 2004, p. 228).

“Boomers’ birth years are variously reported to begin anywhere from 1940 to 1946 and to end in 1960 or 1964…The Boomers are estimated to be 78 million strong…(Schaeffer, 2000)” (As cited in Smola & Sutton, 2002, p. 364).


xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

http://www.bbhq.com/whatsabm.htm

Baby Boomer Headquarters
So What's a Boomer, Anyhow?
Glad you asked. Stated very simply, the demographers, sociologists and the media define baby boomers as those born between (and including) 1946 and 1964. (There is no law or constitutional amendment so stating; and other boundaries have been suggested. But this is the time frame most commonly used.) In 2010, that would make us between 46 and 64 years old. There are about 75 million boomers in the U.S.; we currently represent about 29% of the U.S. population. (In Canada, we are sometimes known as "Boomies"; there are 6 million of us there. In Britain, our generation is known as "the bulge.")

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Britannica Concise Encyclopedia:


baby boom
In the U.S., increase in the birth rate between 1946 and 1964; also, the generation born in the U.S. during that period.
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Columbia Encyclopedia:


baby boom
baby boom, a period in which the birthrate is significantly higher than in other periods, especially the post-World War II period in the United States, Canada, Australia, and New Zealand. In the United States, the postwar baby boom was the largest demographic spike in the nation's history; more than 78 million Americans were born. Experts differ about the span of the U.S. baby boom, which the Census Bureau defines as 1946 to 1964; the number of births peaked in 1957.

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/chc/reinventingaging/Report.pdf

Reinventing Aging

BABY BOOMERS AND CIVIC ENGAGEMENT
Harvard School of Public Health–MetLife Foundation
Initiative on Retirement and Civic Engagement

Approximately 77 million babies were born in the United States during the boom years of 1946
to 1964. In 2011, the oldest will turn 65, and, on average, can expect to live to 83. Many will
continue well into their 90s.
The baby boomers soon will have the opportunity to redefine the meaning and purpose of the
older years. As some of the demands of work and family that have commanded their attention
in mid-life recede, boomers will have the potential to become a social resource of unprecedented
proportions by actively participating in the life of their communities.



xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Kennedy School Bulletin summer 2007

(Harvard Kennedy School)

http://www.hks.harvard.edu/ksgpress/bulletin/07summer/features/boomers.html

Will you still need me?
Will you still feed me?
When I’m 65
by Lewis Rice

But a generation defined by the turbulence of the 1960s could face turbulence ahead. And so could the country, as it faces unprecedented entitlement expenditures for the approximately 75 million baby boomers born between
1946 and 1964.

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

the National Bureau of Economic Research

author is also the Mitsui Professor of Economics at M.I.T.

http://www.nber.org/aginghealth/winter07/w12585.html

Retirement Security of the Baby Boomers: the Role of Financial Literacy and Planning
The large "Baby Boom" generation (traditionally defined as those born between 1946 and 1964) is now on the cusp of retirement, with the first Boomers due to become eligible for Social Security next year. This generation has experienced a number of events that could affect its financial preparedness for retirement, including the 1983 Social Security amendments that raised the normal retirement age, the ongoing shift from defined benefit to defined contribution pensions, and recent boom and bust cycles in equity and housing markets.

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

The Free Library

http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Baby+boomers+are+reinventing+long-term+care:+strategic+planning+for...-a0156644299

Baby boomers

literally think they're going to die before they get old," says J. Walker Smith, president of the polling company Yankelovich Partners, which found in one study that boomers (Americans born between 1946 and 1964)

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Human Resources

http://humanresources.about.com/od/glossaryb/g/boomers.htm

Definition:

Baby Boomers is the name given to the generation of Americans who were born in a "baby boom" following World War II. The Boomers were born between 1944 and 1964. The oldest wave of the Baby Boomers is currently considering retirement options and looking at ways to make their elder years meaningful. The youngest group of Baby Boomers are managing the Millennialsand Generation-X groups of employees - and in some cases, being managed by them.

[MidwestPerspective]

224. Current opinion of real experts no longer believes in 1946-1964

All you've done is come up with a bunch of outdated references which mostly are referring to the DEMOGRAPHIC baby boom from 1946-1964. You need to look at CURRENT opinion of ACTUAL EXPERTS, and you'll find that very few of them still use that widely-discredited 1946-1964 definition.

[roamer65]

161. I have tons more in common with GenX'ers than Boomers.

I was born 1965 and am the leading edge of GenX.

The boundary of GenX versus Boomer lies somewhere around 1961-1962.

[WolverineDG]

51. I call BS on anything after 1960

Those of us born in the early 60s were too young to protest, engage in free love, smoke dope, grow long hair, wear mini skirts, be a hippie, unless our parents were doing those things already. We didn't get any to have any of the "fun," yet anytime a "Let's bash the Boomers" thing starts up, we get kicked in the ass for things other people did.

dg

[omega minimo]

85. 1960. The bar was moved and it's bogus

[Odin2005]

98. The sociological generation does not coincide exactly with the demographic Boom.

The start of the sociological generation has to do with draft eligibility, people born before 1943 would not be drafted for Vietnam.

[MidwestPerspective]

92. Many experts say Boomers born 1942-1953 n/t

[flyarm]

114. and what "experts " would that be? Boomers have always been defined to 1964!

news fucking flash..it is to 1964..so do you always redefine history?

[MidwestPerspective]

128. DEMOGRAPHIC Boom='46-'64 Boomer GENERATION='42-'53

You seem very angry that others don't realize that you are unequivocally right, but the truth is that there is no "right" here. And again, do research of recent material and you'll see that that old widely-discredited 1946-1964 definition is becoming increasingly obsolete.

[flyarm]

180. says who..the historical revisionism?..yeah what a crock!

who? the people trying to cover up the disparaging crap Obama said about baby boomers..when he didn't realize he was one?

Oh yeah./gotcha!!

[MidwestPerspective]

223. Like it or not, there is an inevitabilty to the GenJones movement

You seem very emotionally invested in trying to cling to that old increasingly-obsolete 1946-1964 defintion; you are fighting a losing battle and while 46-64 isn't not dead yet, it's certainly dying. And you are also completely wrong with your assertion that GenJones was somehow created as a reaction to Obama, when in reality the GenJones concept and term were introduced well before Obama's emergence on the national stage. I'd bet anything that within just the next couple of years, the current wide acceptance of GenJones within academic circles will spread throguhout the wider culture.

[omega minimo]

136. no they haven't "always." it should be 1960.

[ChiciB1]

173. Those Years Seem... Right On!! After 1953 Seems A Stretch To Me! n/t

[truedelphi]

119. However the crowd born after 1956 and before 1960

is really a bit apart from any of the Other generations.

They vary a great deal from the older siblings, who may have been born while Mom and Dad were still recovering from the after shocks of WWII.

The people born after 1956 were raised in households were there was a strong possibility that Mom was burning her bras while they were just arriving at adolescence..

I have dated guys born in 1946, 47 48, and then another crowd born after 1956. The after 1956 crowd were way more mellow.

on edit: Plus if you were a male born in 1956 or after, you probably did not get sucked into Vietnam.
Or spend a whole part of your life worrying about it.

[ChiciB1]

172. I Think 1960 Is A Little Late To Be Called A Boomer! Haven't Researched It

but to me it seems one of my older sisters was a senior then. SHE'S a Boomer for sure, but I recall that Viet Nam was beginning to percolate about that time! I have friends who died in Nam who didn't graduate until '69 or '70! But there may have been a re-classification of the years that I don't know about!

MANY protests were going on DURING the 60's & early 70's, so those kids could only have been 10 years old, or 12 at most!

I do want to say something about the M's though. I have a grandson who just started college and I find him to be MUCH MORE like me in his thinking! He's 17, soon 18 and brings his friends home with him and I have the opportunity to sit and banter with them. They're a GREAT bunch of Progressive/Liberal types who are even more open minded about race, legalization of MJ, LGBT rights and other issues. As a Boomer who lived in Texas during the Civil Rights uprising, it was pretty horrible. To the kids today, they don't seem to understand "why" it was such a problem! Inter-racial dating is NOT even a blip on the radar, and I live in Florida! He goes to FSU, a college I felt until recently was less liberal than many other Universities here in Florida. While NOT liberal like Berkley, it seems more Independent than Conservative.

I was up there at the end of January visiting with him and we had a GREAT time, and since I'm such an activist we talked about politics easily. Most of them are STILL very supportive of Obama, however there is some grumbling about his approach regarding EDUCATION! I do have to admit that we were talking to kids living in dorms, and some of the kids come from families who have money. His room mate's father works for NCIS and he doesn't have to worry about money per se. We set up a college fund for my grandson when he was born, but the dorm costs are pretty high!

What I have noticed about them though is that many have yet to truly understand the value of a dollar. Some of the costs at the college stores were staggering to me, but didn't seem to bother most of them. I would NEVER spend OVER $50.00 FOR A SWEAT SHIRT!

But, I've gotten off topic. Just wanted to point out what I experienced. The ONE thing I didn't see/hear was the type of activism we Boomers had regarding protests, etc., but it may be building. I tend to think that Florida may not be as aggressive as some when it comes to that! But, Florida is Florida!

If one could count on them being a force politically (in the future) I would venture to guess many are Independent leaning Left! However, my grandson was raised around a Democratic family, and I'm more Liberal than many here. None of our family have ever been anything but Democrats and it's all he's known.

We just need to keep them interested enough to become a serious voting block... I DON'T know how that will come about.

JMHO!

[flyarm]

181. Do the research..it is to 1964...eom

[patrice]

15. If they did, MOST of them are over it now, i.e. the see it for what it is. Nothing.

[Richardo]

23. If they did, it contradicts the OP

...which I found simplistic and broad-brushed. Generalizing, then comparing, the stereotypical behaviors of entire generations of people seems a pointless and ill-conceived exercise. In fact, labeling 'generations' of people to begin with - especially by arbitrary time-frames - is idiotic. Humans don't have estrus cycles, therefore can and do breed continuously. Saying that someone born in December 1981 is in a different generation than someone born in January 1982 makes no sense whatsoever.

The Baby Boomers were not named for the time-frame they were born in, but for the demographic sea-change they represented for program priorities and long-term policy development in this country. Of course there is an arbitrary time frame assigned to this generation, but it's based on observable data - changes in the birth rate - not the calendar.

[patrice]

28. Agreed and since, as you point out, all is in process, I hope you'll pardon me for regarding OP (any

post actually) as nothing more than hypothesis.

That said, I suppose "an ounce of prevention is (usually) more than a pound of "cure"), so thanks for you observations on OP shortcomings, hypothetical though they may be.

[Urban Prairie]

32. They were?!?

I was almost penniless during much of the Reagan years, but it took till late in the Shrub's second term to undo what prosperity my wife and I had built up during Clinton's terms of office.



Must have been a state by state thing. Michigan didn't truly begin to recover until the 90s.

[EFerrari]

74. We didn't "shop like crazy". We had a young family on falling wages.

The 90s were a short break from that until NAFTA started screwing us all over again.

[NoSheep]

110. ditto

[varelse]

162. I didn't shop

When I graduated HS in 1982, I was in competition with heads of families for fast food jobs. Guess who won?

[Odin2005]

3. Oh great, here comes the "We Boomers can do no wrong. Worship us." BS.

Us Millennials are a CIVIC generation, just like the Greatest Generation and the opposite of the Boomers' generational archetype, the Prophet.

And yes, the Boomers are the most narcissistic, self-centered generation in history.

[sinkingfeeling]

6. Really! Unlike the 'I'm entitled to have everything' Millennials.

[Odin2005]

8. Ah, yes, wanting a living wage is SOOOO selfish.

:eyes:

[TexasObserver]

151. The "I'm not supporting myself until I'm 26!" generation.

As the saying goes - "26 is the new 21" - when it comes to getting a real job, moving out, and becoming half way self sufficient. It's unusual for anyone under 26 to be self sufficient these days. Millenials mature much more slowly than their parents' generation. They simply are not ready for self sufficiency at the young age their parents and grandparents were.

[nickinSTL]

176. I'm not sure that's necessarily a Millennial thing...

and not necessarily due to choice or laziness.

I'm very solidly a GenXer - born 1972 - and I didn't move out of the house until I was almost 26.

HOWEVER, it was because I couldn't find a job that I could support myself on - not because I was lazy or didn't want to work.

I would have been happy to be out of the house at 21 - the job market just didn't allow for it.

[malletgirl02]

192. Exactly

It is hard to be self sufficient when there are no jobs. With the recession younger people are competing with more experience workers for jobs. Even if you can find a job it probably doesn't pay enough because things are so damn expensive. Some people forget that we are in a recession. I heard that young people as a group have a higher unemployment rate that the population as a whole. I live with my parents, I wish I can move out. I wish I would move out. It pisses me off that the person you responded to calls me entitled. Seriously it I were entitled I would not have taken the low pay data entry job If I were entitled.

[Uzybone]

7. And yes, the Boomers are the most narcissistic, self-centered generation in history.

I almost totally agree

Even the OP, patting themselves on the back for "being nice to black people". Lawd.

[Odin2005]

11. I wanted to bang my head against the wall after reading that.

Hey idiots, it's us Millennials that put an African American in the White House.

[flyarm]

60. yeah and it was we "Idiots" as you call us, that raised you to give a damn! eom

[theophilus]

13. No, they're not. Get a clue. People have been selfcentered since people started. n/t

[havocmom]

30. Yep, and the class war has gone on since bartering was invented

The generational diversion is a tool of class warfare, but too many miss that.

There have been demons and saints in EVERY generation.

[Odin2005]

100. I suggest you read "The Fourth Turning" by social historians Bill Strauss and Neil Howe.

Generations are a real sociological phenomenon.

[flyarm]

112. funny but Obama is a baby boomer. eom

[Odin2005]

116. He's a Gen-Xer.

[MidwestPerspective]

131. National Poll of 500 born in same year as Obama shows they identify with GenJones, not Boom or X

Just as very few actual experts have said Obama is a Boomer, very few have said he is an Xer. Many, however, have said he is a GenJoneser. Apart from experts, when normal people are asked this question, they also see Obama as a Joneser. For example, here is a poll with a nationally representative sample of 500 Americans, all born the same year as Obama (1961) who overwhelmingly identify with GenJones, not with Boomers or GenXers: http://www.thirdage.com/travel-pastimes/birthday-gift-to-obama-your-generational-identity-revealed

[flyarm]

179. the fuck he is! Baby boomers go to 1964..always have ..all the revisionism here doesn't change that!

some of you here make me laugh..and not in a good way..don't piss on my leg and tell me it's raining..this x bullshit is just that bullshit!

Obama is a baby boomer!

[MidwestPerspective]

225. Experts view Obama as part of GenJones, whether you happen to like that or not

It's obvious this is an emotional issue for you, but these topics are best approached via data and serious objective analysis, not emotion. And you also seem to be confused about the nature of social science with your talk about historical revisonism. Generations aren't detemined by some sort of historical or official proclamation which then must never be challenged. Definitions of generations are the subjective opinions of experts (like sociologists) which tend to evolve over time. Demographers originally were merely pointing out the demographic phenomena of a big spike in birth rates, it was some lazy and uninformed members of the media who attached the word "generation" after this demographic baby boom. But generations stem from shared formative experiences, not head counts. No generation before or since the so-called Boom "Generation" was ever determined at all by birth rates, which are completely irrelevant. So over time, as experts did their analysis of these populations, it became increasingly clear that there were two distinct generations born during the post war demographic birth boom. You seem to be saying that these experts shouldn't be allowed to share this insight because this would be some kind of "historical revisionism". What matters is the truth, and it has come out over time.

[MidwestPerspective]

129. Polls and experts and Obama himself all say Obama isn't a Boomer

Only very few actual experts anywhere have said that Obama is part of the Baby Boom Generation. By contrast, a long list of prominent experts have said that Obama is part of Generation Jones. Here is a 5 minute YouTube video with over 20 influential pundits talking about Obama as a GenJoneser: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Ta_Du5K0jk

Here is an op-ed in USA TODAY about Obama as the first GenJones President:
http://www.usatoday.com/printedition/news/20090127/column27_st.art.htm

[flyarm]

182. so polls now redefine baby boomers..yeah right! wow ..sucker much? eom

[havocmom]

130. Yes, generations matter. But to use them, race, political affiliation as a diverson

from who is gathering all the eggs, THAT is class warfare and it gets passed down through generations.

[bettyellen]

164. ye and these kids here fall for it hook line and sinker!

[havocmom]

166. SOME fall for it. SOME in every generation are this, that, the other

which is why I still say it's more about economic class than time period.

[flyarm]

183. +10,000!!! hey lady!!..hiii...eom

[bettyellen]

197. *hugs* how are you darling?

[Lost4words]

31. When you group people together, they stop being being human

we are all humans and therefor susceptible to the same frailties, weaknesses, cruelties. To be making vast global statements such as "all Boomers" or "all Ms" this or that is foolish, you have to know that so why do you fall so easily into the trap?

Anger and Hate are emotions that feed off the host, mentally, physically and spiritually and are counter productive.

I dont know, it seems to me we need to work on unity rather than division, and try to respect other who may be different.

[DailyGrind51]

150. "To generalize is to be an idiot" William Blake

[RaleighNCDUer]

55. So says the 'boomers can do no right'.

Maybe once you get a few more years behind you you will recognize the fallacies you are spouting.

In the meantime, study your grammar. It is "We Millennials" not "Us Millennials". You wouldn't say "Us are going to the store" would you?

[WonderGrunion]

177. Only if a bunch of us were going to the store

Otherwise it would be kind of foolish to say.

Although I would more likely just text "@ Mall C U Here"

[laughingliberal]

62. I just resent the hell out of that

I was born in 1955, graduated from nursing school in 1982, spent my entire work life in the years of declining wages and increasing work loads and worked myself into exhaustion in 26 years just trying to keep from drowning. It was also these years during which employer sponsored pensions became extinct and we were expected to save our own money out of our declining wages for the 401k scam. We also had the privilege of ponying up more payroll taxes to cover the shortfall created by decimating the progressive tax structure so the rich did not have to pay their share. I do notice some who made it into the work force 10 or 15 years before me (the older boomers) did manage to reap some of the benefits of the preceding decades during which upward mobility was still a reality but my husband of 10 years is 8 years older than I and his experience has followed pretty much the same path mine has. We talk a lot about the fact that our friends who are in the late 60's and 70's now seem to have had a little more opportunity to make it through to retirement with some measure of security.

The "Greatest Generation" was pretty much my parents and their older brothers and sisters. They had jobs that paid a fair wage for a 40 hour work week, company sponsored pensions, a GI bill that provided an education, and a chance to move up in the world. They benefited from a progressive tax structure that was eliminated soon after I began working. And that generation overwhelming elected Reagan whose economic policies assured no one who came after them had the opportunities they did. They were all fond of saying they made it without any help, all fancied themselves, 'self made.'

The "Greatest Generation" can kiss my butt.

[Odin2005]

99. The Greatest Generation is who built up the unions in the 30s.

The decline in unions and the rise of Reaganism coincides very well to when the Greatests started retiring.

[laughingliberal]

226. Yes, when they retired and no longer needed them. nt

[LanternWaste]

91. I imagine most generations

I imagine most generations decry the one prior to it, complain about the one after it, while attempting to subtly pat itself on the back whilst engaging.

[TexasObserver]

149. And yet, you owe all that you have to Boomers, don't you?

Has there ever been a year in your life when Boomers weren't providing your medicine, your health care, your food, your transportation, your educational costs, or your room and board? You have reported that you're 23 years old, attend some small rural college, and receive government provided health care. You have also reported you don't work full time.

At what point will your outrage with Boomers be sufficient that you support yourself instead of depending on your parents and other boomers to cover your life needs?

[flyarm]

204. + 1 million!!! right on!! Thank you!! eom

[inna]

171. LOL, what ridiculous bullshit.

[livetohike]

4. Add to the many boomer "sins"

Loving the earth and not wanting to use up, deplete, savage and pollute it - very bad for corporatists.

Creating free health care clinics, daycare systems, food coops and other forms of socialism - gasp!

Raising awareness of women's issues at home and in the workplace. Making it okay to pursue a career and have a family if you wanted both.

We boomers changed the culture of the society and that's what conservatives fear most.

[theophilus]

10. I, as a Boomer, admit that there is a lot wrong with my generation.

But, you know what, there is a lot wrong with EVERY GENERATION. It is past time for the Boomers to raise up some leaders to fight for us. The megarich are going to try to take away all of the Progressive measures that our parents benefited under. Sorry Boomers, no Social Security for you....no retirement for you.....no pensions for you....no medicare for you! Look folks, there are tens of MILLIONS of us. If we FIGHT this crap, we can win. We need to secure these rights and benefits and go back to our youth....forget war, let's take care of our citizens here in the good ol' USA. And not just the super rich, but the average American...middle and lower classes, too! Wow, what a concept.

Boomers Unite! We can take this country back!!!!!!!!1

[global1]

19. Look - It Was Known Way Back During The Boomer Boom We Were A Force To Be Reckoned With......

we pushed all the envelopes. We overflowed schools, we helped the housing boom, we spent money and Madison Avenue catered to us to get as much of it as possible. But the underbelly bad side they also knew and that is when we reached our senior years we would begin to become a burden on the system because of those same numbers. That's why the worry about retirement now. That's why social security, medicare and just health care in general are problematic.

Now they have to think of ways to deal with our numbers.

But now we boomers face economic ruin thanks to 8 years of BushCo and the banksters and wall street crooks. Much of our retirement funds have gone up in smoke. Can't think of taking it easy in our senior years and retire. Can't afford to. Can't afford decent medical insurance. Our houses have dropped in value. Downsizing puts us right back to where we were when we started. We should be leaving our jobs and enjoying our waning days here. We should be making room for the youngsters to take over our positions. Instead we are fighting for the same turf with them just to keep our head above water in a time where most of our jobs have been outsourced around the world.

All this and now they are going to blame us for this to boot.

[patrice]

21. I NEVER lost money my entire LIFE, until the year 2000 and EVERY year since.

[patrice]

20. THAT'S the point, according to the Golden Rule, the moment you criticize, criticism is the standard

for whatever relationship you're involved in. Why should criticism be allowed in only one direction?

When I first started hearing this stuff (about 20 years ago) about how America went all off course, all WORNG!%!@*#!!, with the evil Hippies, I couldn't help but be extremely aware of how such commentary is only allowed in one direction and even though I have known thousands, no one wants to hear an objective assessment of the serious flaws of The Greatest Generation; all anyone wants is the pretty fairy tales and I ask you HOW can you love someone really, your parents even, if you are not honest about who and what they are, ALL of it.

[theophilus]

24. I agree. People who will consider all sides are, imo, very rare. n/t

[patrice]

88. I am fascinated by the implications of multi-dimensionality,

That doesn't mean that I don't take a Stand, but it does mean that I may take that Stand in a different sort of way from more dichotomous perspectives.

[CBR]

14. What about black boomers? This is a strange post -- congratulating

yourself for "siding with black people" Clearly you are seeing it through one lens.

All generations have their flaws and their strengths (I am on the cusp of GenX and M) but boomers seem ultra sensitive.

[cdsilv]

25. I'm a 'late boomer ' ('59), and have been self-centered as a gyroscope at time.....

...but I'm getting better!

[CBR]

102. We all have been self-centered -- every generation. I just don't

think other generations are as sensitive about it.

[RaleighNCDUer]

56. It seems to me you are the one being sensitive, when you have problems

with acknowledging the OP contention that the boomer generation was the first to be wholeheartedly inclusive of blacks and black culture. That is not "congratulating yourself". Frankly, your self describing of being a GenX/M cusp means you have NEVER known a time when black culture was not mainstreamed in America.

There are many many millions of us who DO remember.

[CBR]

101. Well I live everyday with my black husband still facing discrimination

that many on DU refuse to acknowledge.

On Edit: It seems the majority of people who give me crap about my interracial marriage are not Gen X or Ms but Boomers.

[patrice]

16. So much the ea$$$$$ier to ignore "Pro-Life" standards for aging Boomers health care needs.

[Jennicut]

18. I am a Gen Xer, therefore I reserve the right to slack off and not care about anything in this post.

[havocmom]

35. LOL We boomers had our share of contemporaries with same goal

;)

We 'dropped out' Sometimes a few in each group just sees through the hype and decides to watch the clouds go by; calmer theater with about the same impact on the universe :hi:

[Jennicut]

43. I think Gen X, as a group, is smaller and that we just watch Boomers and

Millenials bash each other and scratch our heads. We are boring so the media really doesn't care much about us. Oh well, I think we always preferred it that way. Now, I will go listen to some Nirvana and wear my flannel and whine that my life is directionless.

[marmar]

117. We are boring. I'll meet you in the coffee shop with my flannel and we can be ironic.

:P

[patrice]

125. One of my best friends is a Gen X -er and she's Wonder - full and very Pretty.

and she's a very nice person.

I have several Gen X-er nephews and nieces and I'm a grand-aunt several times over.

I like all of the Gen X -ers I know.

[Javaman]

22. We are force fed a daily load of bullshit

and we the people, who are now referred to as "consumers" instead of citizen, are all to blame.

We could all easily have said, "no, we don't want it" but instead we said, "what style does it come in?"

We sold ourselves out, no matter the generation.

pass blame around to whom ever you want, that's the mission of the disinformation elites. They want to keep the middle class off balance by creating strife within its ranks.

So pit yourself against someone of your own thinking, that always does really well to promote unity.

As long as the peons fight among each other, there will never be a movement to change things.

as much as I loath the ball licking tea baggers, you have noticed recently that there is dissension in their ranks. That isn't by accident. They will decay into subgroups just like that boarder patriot assholes did.

Folks, keep your eye on the ball, don't allow bullshit to cloud your vision.

And FYI to the OP, I was born in 63. I had less to do with the peace movement and more to do with punk rock and was against ray-gun.

Don't let the powers that be dictate what you are supposed to think.

[Anna Lee]

27. Looks like no one gets it.

But it is not surprising the extent to which people who criticize others for falling for talking points invariably fall for talking points that they like. There is no accounting for the ability for things to flow over the banks from the other side when the overflow is an invitation to bash other workers.

[KittyWampus]

33. This thread has already degenerated into a food-fight. So instead of turning blacks/whites

straights/gay against one another now we can set the generations at each others throats?

Anything to keep people divided and a few people at the top in control.

[RaleighNCDUer]

58. It's always been that way. I remember (vaguely - I was a little bit late

for the 60s) the radicals of the 60s disparaging the elder generation of movement activists from the 30s - I don't think that happened by accident. Kids always think they are the first to discover something, because it seems self obvious that if an earlier generation knew what they have just learned the problem would have been solved a long time ago. The 30s activists didn't solve the problems, neither did those of the 60s, or those who protested Reagan in the 80s. And now the activists today disparage the Boomers because we didn't solve the world's problems when we were their age.

We should be so lucky that we will be around when the activists in 2025 are dissing them. By then, they will understand.

[KittyWampus]

34. ===

[lunatica]

36. Everything is a straw man now

[patrice]

72. Rhetoric, yes, but Not the empirical facts.

[sufrommich]

39. I'm a boomer, when did boomers stop shopping? As a

boomer let me say that it is by far the most self centered generation of the 20th century.We protested war because there was a draft, it was self interest and most big anti war protest that boomers took part in ended with the end of the draft.As for siding with black people, the southern strategy is alive and well and prospers because of the boomer vote.We elected both Ronald Reagan and George W. Bush twice!!This push to believe that the boomer generation is somehow special is based on stereotypes that have very little to do with reality.

[Urban Prairie]

42. Boomer women who protested the war were not in danger of being drafted

I protested the Vietnam "Conflict" vigorously, as a male despite being too young (yet) for the draft. I was born during the height of the boom (55-'56) and didn't vote for Reagan or Bush, the latter who was "selected" twice.

Fact is that every 20th century generation who preceded the boomers were able to successfully raise large (more than two children) families, and own property, work for just ONE employer for most of their working lives, and retire with SS and maybe a pension, and do so with just ONE wage earner if they wished to. Most white males did not face stiffer competition for jobs/promotions by the opposite sex or minorities, until after the 60s.

[sufrommich]

45. Yes, women were against the war too. I'm saying what

really brought the war to an end was not protests on college campuses but an across the board disgust with the war and the draft. To make the argument that it was boomers and boomers alone that ended the war is wrong.Boomers played a big part in ending it because they were being forced through the draft to fight it. That's the reason you and I have never seen a draft again. I was born in 1957, I didn't vote for Reagan or Bush either, but both enjoyed a healthy amount of boomer support, it's impossible to deny that.

[EFerrari]

76. Reagan did. Bush not so much. He was appointed once

and no one can actually find the constituencies that his campaign claimed elected him in 04.

[blueworld]

41. Ah, my Boomer cynicism is still larger than my ass. Groovy.

The only sin we committed is that there are now too many of us. When we were the main wage slaves and the main taxpayers & the main consumer base, corporate America loved us to death. As we aged & slowed down a little on the spending, they injected our "music" into every commercial from cars to Depends to try & keep the cash flowing.

Now the ultimate Boomer sin: we've aged & we're not as healthy & some of us have (gasp) retired. We selfishly demand decent health care, freakin' jobs (if still working) and environmental responsibility. We're still paying taxes, but we have the nerve to look for "entitlements" as well. We supported the government and now we want some back. Nervy bass turds are we. Like they didn't know we were coming.

I'm waiting for the corporatist commercials: "Leave Grammy & Gramps on a serene mountaintop to commune with the Cosmos. Group rates available!" (Don't forget to get a living will first - see your financial advisor today!)

"Unfortunately, old people cost money. Send yours to Central America!" "Buy your parents or grandparents a heated pre-fab! Looks a little like a dog house, but it's environmentally friendly & less housework required"!

:hippie:

[bridgit]

44. The instant Brokaw put The Greatest Generation out there I knew Boom! Voices of the Sixties

Would not be far behind

Brokaw's book on boomers is just a bummer

When Tom Brokaw told baby boomers he was writing a book on the aftershocks of the 1960s, some laughed nervously and asked, "What are you going to call this one? The Worst Generation?"

The Greatest Generation, Brokaw's 1998 best seller, successfully tapped into nostalgia about the generation that won World War II.

In Boom! Voices of the Sixties, Brokaw, 67 (born 1940), writes that he assured "my boomer buddies that I don't think they represent the worst — far from it — but I also teased that I didn't think any of them were as great as they thought they were."

The book is a disappointment, an overstuffed grab bag better at describing than analyzing what it terms "cosmic developments."

http://www.usatoday.com/life/books/reviews/2007-11-04-brokaw-boom_N.htm

How else could it have been but "an overstuffed grab bag better at describing than analyzing what it terms "cosmic developments"" coming from a guy that thinks he's Murrow, Cronkite, Rather, Garry Wills, Shelby Foote, James Michener and Doris Kearns Goodwin all rolled into one, naw...

Brokaw is imo a church mouse of a journalist. I don't see where he's rolled any big dice anywhere. He's been propelled by the yields and dividends of his personal investment portfolio for decades - nearly a whole generation itself - for doing little more sit in front of a camera, in a warm dry studio and marble the words of his script cross his tongue

Its simpler to think that Brokaw is capable of feeling a passing form magnanimity regarding his inability to actually make news himself but I just don't think that that is in him he's too busy being Tom Brokaw

[DefenseLawyer]

46. This is the curious delusion the boomers would like to believe

that they were all "hippies" and that there were 45 million of them at Woodstock.

[sufrommich]

47. I think, as a boomer, that's what peeves me the most.

Anybody that was really there surely knows the stereotype doesn't fit the reality.

[EFerrari]

57. I was watching Brokaw bash boomers last night

and he has that delusion, too. I was like 12 when Woodstock happened and Mom wouldn't drive to New York. lol

[Silver Swan]

66. I am one of the oldest Boomers (1946)

And I was almost too young for Woodstock. In fact I didn't even hear about it until it was long over.

There were a lot of hippies and war protesters that were older than I was.

Most of the 1960's activists were older than Boomers.

My children aren't Millennials they are Gen-Xers.

I just trying to say that there is no descriptor that can apply to the entirety of any generation.

[laughingliberal]

67. I was born in 1955 and I was out there protesting at 12 and I know several here in my age group

who began that young. We were nothing if not precocious. One of my closest friends was two years older than me and ran away to go to Woodstock. A big part of the activism we saw in the 60's and early 70's was spurred by college age students. Those born in 1950 were college age by 1968. By 1973 when I graduated from high school, we were still out there screaming and fighting against Nixon. I think a lot of the boomers were involved. Some of the leaders may have been older than us but they weren't out there without followers. And many of those leading the charge by 1968 were college students. The SDS and all their spinoffs were mostly boomer aged students.

But I do agree there is no descriptor that can apply to the entirety of a generation.

[EFerrari]

69. Yes, I was born the same year but it still illegal for me to drive cross country

to Woodstock. lol

My brother ('63) and I went to protests with Mom but it was a family outing, not a generational one.

[laughingliberal]

75. My friend who was 16 took off with her boyfriend and hitchhiked. She was a hero to the rest of us.

My parents were civil rights activists in Memphis who were followers of Dr. King. I, on the other hand, was quite frustrated with the process and broke away to follow the likes of Stokely Carmichael and the SDS, Weather Underground and some of the more militant. Born after I was it would have been difficult to be very involved, I know but a lot of those born in the early 60's were born to the first boomers and some of them were leaders in the movement.

[EFerrari]

81. It would have been pretty hard for me to out radical my mom.

And I give her a lot of credit because she was a naturalized citizen from a deeply authoritarian culture who developed the habit of protest and instilled it in us. I think we went to as many actions with her as we did to ball games.

[laughingliberal]

84. A very good foundation, it seems

:)

[Odin2005]

104. Often-forgotten fact: a large number of the early hippies were actually of the Silent Generation.

The generation between the Greatest and the Boomers, born from 1925 to 1942.

[dflprincess]

68. Someone needs to point out to Tommy that our parents were his "Greatest Generation"

They get some of the credit or blame for how we turned out.

[EFerrari]

71. He was openly hostile to David Harris on that segment last night.

I think Brokaw goes home and invades Normandy after work in his back yard every night.

[laughingliberal]

77. Kind of a sick, voyeuristic hero worship, I think. nt

[MidwestPerspective]

93. Brokaw's Boomer$ loses much by ignoring Generation Jones

Brokaw’s Boomer$ was an embarrassing failure for CNBC. By ignoring the growing consensus among actual experts that there were two distinct generations born in the post-WWII boom in births, the show was a mess of confusion and inaccuracy.

Most people born 1946-1964 (which the show defines as the Baby Boom Generation) who watched this show would not have related to it. This is because the practically the whole show described those born in the first half of that period (the real Boomer Generation) while almost completely ignoring those born in the second half (Generation Jones). And far more babies were born during the GenJones years, which makes the fundamental idiocy of this show that much more pronounced.

The images of childhood presented were almost all those of the real Boomers: Coonskin hats, hula hoops, Howdy Doody, school bomb drills, ovaltine, etc., etc. Most Jonesers weren’t even born then. Where was the Brady Bunch and Partridge Family, Easy Bake Ovens and Beany Coptors, etc. etc. which Jonesers grew up with? The teen/young adult years presented were those of the real Boomers: Vietnam and anti-war protests, Woodstock and hippy counterculture. But Jonesers were just little kids then, not a part of any of that. Where were GenJones teen cultural touchstones like disco and heavy metal, Farah Fawcett and David Cassidy posters?

The show was filled with contradictions. It referred to Obama as a Boomer. But this was the same network that kept talking about the generational change at last year’s Inaugural. So the Boomers were passing the generational torch to the…Boomers?! The show repeatedly stated that the Boomers were the offspring of the Greatest (WWII) Generation. Does that mean the Silent Generation (between the WWII Gen and Boomers) didn’t have any children? In reality, most Jonesers were born to Silent Gen parents. This is one of many reasons why Jonesers are so different than Boomers, since experts emphzsize the big contrast between the Silent gen vs. the WWII Gen and parental influences are so crucial to the formation of generational personalities.

For our entire life cycle, we Jonesers have been mistakenly lumped in with the Boomers (and blamed for their excesses), while getting very few of the benefits. We are not Boomers. Every national poll on this question confirms that we don’t believe we are Boomers. Mountains of data confirm the clear differences in values, attitudes, etc. between Boomers and Jonesers. Most actual experts believe GenJones exists. Yet, CNBC ignores this and puts out this show using that old widely-discredited 1946-1964 Boomer definition.

Generations are a function of the common formative experiences of its members, not the fertility rates of its parents. There was a demographic baby boom 1946-1964, but the Boomer Generation was born around 1942-1953, while GenJones was born around 1954-1965. This is what actual experts say, as opposed to clueless media companies who don’t bother to research current expert opinion.

Thankfully, many in the media have paid attention to the experts, and GenJones has been getting lots of media attention. Many major mainstream media companies now use the term; in fact, the Associated Press' annual Trend Report chose the Rise of Generation Jones as the #1 trend of 2009. We Jonesers need to help spread awareness about our long-lost generation to help avoid the imbecility of shows like Brokaw’s Boomer$.

Here are some of the good links about GenJones I found:

http://www.usatoday.com/printedition/news/20090127/column27_st.art.htm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Ta_Du5K0jk

http://generationjones.com/2009latest.html

[EFerrari]

135. I couldn't agree more. Eight years between me and my brother

and he was born into a different time entirely. I don't think anyone made him get under his desk once. :)

[WCGreen]

140. Me too... But I did march in the first Earth Day protest march....

Emptied the Junior High in protest over the Kent State Shootings on May 4, 1972...

But most of my school mates ('75)were just trying to get along, make money in a bullshit job market in the late 70's and early '80's...

Most of my "friends" were afraid of my passion and ended up becoming card carrying GOPsters...

[RaleighNCDUer]

61. Very close to that number WERE hippies, or identified with hippies.

Out of app. 82 million, well over half smoked dope, owned the Woodstock album and wished they could have been there. Of course, that does leave nearly 40 million who did NOT identify with the hippies (though they still probably smoked dope - I believe at one point it was 80% of the boomers who had at least tried it, and 50% were regulars users). There were boomers who volunteered for multiple tours in Vietnam, who joined the Young Republicans, and thronged to Billy Graham's Campus Crusade.

We boomers know this. It seems many post-boomers do not.

I'm surprised when people present the boomers as a monolithic bloc.

[DefenseLawyer]

64. Exhibit A. n/t

[RaleighNCDUer]

65. What in my post do you take issue with? nt

[patrice]

90. True. Since the return of tie-dye & the peace-sign, I have had some of the most un-Hippie-like

people you can imagine try to claim that ID. I just let it go.

[Odin2005]

103. That pretty much sums it up.

based on my reading there was much more labor radicalism among the Greatest Generation pre-McCarthy then there was genuine radicalism among Boomers.

[bettyellen]

146. mm the 60's had no need for labor radicalism at all but a genuine need for civil rights, womens...

rights and end to wars and concern for the enviornment. all of which were the focus of radicalism in the late 60
why on earth do you need to be so dismissive about those things? ask yourslef that- because you have been majorly manipuated by this anti= boomer propaganda. propaganda by Xers and g- generation elders who accomplish nothing socially, broke for reagan... and blamed boomers for everything.

it was largely the votes of the greatest generation that dismantled worker protections and dug their heels in against the antiwar folk, enviormrntalists and feminists and elected reagan. the boomers were too dirverse, half hated reagan, he would have been no where w/out the "greatest" gen.

[Name removed]

157. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[bettyellen]

163. wow, you call people names and make stupid assumptions about them? wothless post, so sad for u

i feel sorry for you. what a shit attitude, you have no clue how needlessly hostile and ignorant your post is, do you,
FYI" :I am a Gen Xer, but Im waay too smart fo this divisive bullshit

[southernyankeebelle]

48. I was never into the war protest and the hippie thing but I was a liberal. I

see a new start with the college demonstrations. They are going to realize they got power and the next thing they will march on stopping the war and protesting other social issues. You watch. The lid will be coming off. You know what when you see the police start pounding on the kids the parents will start supporting them.

[patrice]

83. I think you are right about this. They really don't have anything to lose, most of them

anyway, so they WILL step outside socially acceptable boundaries.

May the Light and Life of Free Minds & Hearts be with them.

[laughingliberal]

87. It is encouraging to see them show up for this

I know the college students of the late 60's and early 70's provided a lot of the work and energy behind the movement. I have been baffled by those who came after who have sat by while many of the gains we made have been compromised and whittled away and who have not raised a voice against the increasing economic disparities or the loss of rights we are enduring.

[bamacrat]

49. I guess I'm an "M" I was born in 83.

And all my grandparents were the greatest generation. SO does that make me like them?

[EvolveOrConvolve]

50. World War I gave us the New Deal and unions?

I think FDR would have something to say about that, were he still alive today. And unions started earlier, and grew out of a frustration with the abject poverty and poor treatment being foisted upon workers by the robber barons and their ilk.

Otherwise, I can't comment on your post as I think the generational arguments are usually a bunch of hot air.

[EFerrari]

59. Joanne is right about the media or about Brokaw, any way.

What a piece of work he is. He interviewed two men about the same age, mid 50s. One was an unbalanced Viet Nam vet who re-upped after 9/11 in the Army Reserve and the other was David Harris. At one point Brokaw intones, "This soldier is a patriot but David Harris says he is one, too."

Another slam was about consumerism. Oh really, boomers invented American consumerism? Shopping malls have been around since the late 19th C, long before we were even a gleam. lol

[RaleighNCDUer]

63. Technically, that's correct.

WWI was borne of the conceits of the Gilded Age, of literal imperialism - as in the British Empire, the German 2nd Reich, the Imperial Czars - as a fact of life, and the disregard of the aristocracy for the workers in ALL nations. Unionization was violently suppressed to the tunes of thousands of deaths during anti-labor actions, even in this country where the legal system saw labor organizers as anarchists and deserving of whatever happened to them.

WWI exposed the fallacies that were the underpinning of the world's empires, and the economic system they depended on. Millions of men who faced death every day on the battlefield returned to their civilian jobs and found they had the wherewithal to stand up to corporate goons - it's hard for a cop with a nightstick to intimidate someone who survived mustard gas attacks. The personal empowerment they experienced was translated into action when the economy collapsed. The majority of labor activists in the 20s and 30s were veterans of WWI, and not easily scared. Without their radicalization there would have been little impetus for adopting many of the New Deal programs. They were NOT products of FDR's imagination - they were, nearly all of them, platforms of the socialist and communist parties, and he adopted them to forestall a revolution here in this country. At one point we were lining up into two camps - the fascists on one side and communists on the other - and without the New Deal we could have devolved just as Germany did in a similar situation, with fascists and reds shooting it out on the streets. Just as in Germany, that was a result of WWI, only there it was the fascists who won.

[upi402]

53. The hippies were right, as it turned out

Talk about an inconvenient truth. Thanks Joanne98. k/r

[omega minimo]

137. The punks were right. The hippies went to sleep

:boring:

[KansDem]

54. What? No "Greatest Generation" book from the likes of Tom Brokaw?

DAMN! I was so hoping to be quoted!

[laughingliberal]

70. The boomer bashing propaganda is not an accident

It is meant to distract people from the reality of the economic conditions under which we have lived with many of us having lived our entire working lives under the conditions created by trickle down economics. Even the older boomers were just 37 when Regan was elected and not 1/2 way through their working lives. The upward mobility enjoyed by our parents became a thing of the past during our adulthood. Reagan raised our payroll taxes and they have been used to finance the tax cuts of the wealthy (which was not most of us). We have spent our lives working harder every year to find we were barely staying in the same place or falling a little behind over time. I have seen it said, here, that the boomers elected Reagan which is patently false. The boomers were the only group that did not vote, overwhelmingly, for him. I believe it is estimated he may have gotten 50% of the votes of the older boomers, the ones who were still benefiting from the New Deal policies that were still in force. Other than that we voted against him and he was elected by our parents who lived their lives benefiting from the very policies Reagan destroyed.

But it is inherent on the elite to demonize our generation in order to make it acceptable to screw us by now stealing the money out of SS that they have used for the last 2 1/2 decades to make up the shortfalls created by decimating the progressive tax structure which once supported the country. One more example of divide and conquer politics and, unfortunately, it works every time. Don't look up there at the top 1% who has stolen everything from the workers over the past 3 decades. Let's just blame people born in a different year or of a different or whatever else will prevent us from holding the correct people accountable.

[patrice]

78. Bingo~

[Blue_In_AK]

80. +1

I'm a very early boomer (1946), and to me Ronald Reagan is one of the worst presidents I've had to live through. There is no way I will EVER claim responsibility for his election. Not a single person in my group of friends during that time supported his presidency -- NOT ONE.

[laughingliberal]

82. Same here. Only person I knew anywhere near me in my age group who voted for Reagan

was my younger brother who was 22 in 1980. He was one of those "Reagan Democrats." By 1984, he woke up and voted against him. My peer group hated him.

[diane in sf]

144. I agree, my experience is similar to yours--born in 52

[Joanne98]

152. Bingo. And now they want the Social Security checks.

[Enthusiast]

158. I voted against Reagan twice.

Just like with Dubya.

[Enthusiast]

159. +1, laughingliberal!

Nice post.

[deaniac21]

79. Psychobabble is so entertaining.....

[Grand Taurean]

86. I could point to exceptions

in my family. (My mother's family is large with 7 children born over a 20+ year period) My eldest uncle and aunt were of the "Greatest Generation" and were horrible thugs. They had no respect for my grandparents who both slaved away at work to ensure they never were in the poor house during the depression. They also made sure that their children completed high school.
Many depression era kids were forced out of school to go to work to support the family.
For all of my grandparents hard work, they were repaid NOT IN KIND by these two.

My mother and uncle (both boomers) were my grandparents prize children. They gave no trouble to them. They excelled in school and took care of them in their elder years. My older uncle born in 24' was a pain in the rear end from day one. After the war he and his war bride bought a two family house with my grandparents. My uncle lived upstairs and my grandparents downstairs. Eventually my uncle would rent the upstairs out to a series of troublemaking bums who gave my grandparents trouble. On top of that, my uncle connected his electricity to my grandparents to save himself money! A wonderful Limbaugh loving right wing Republican he was.

[laughingliberal]

89. It seems a little microcosm of what I have observed

The Greatest Generation wasn't all that great AFAIC. They benefited from worker's rights, GI bills, New Deal policies that were in force through most of their working lives, a progressive tax structure that allowed working and middle class people to move up and then they elected Reagan and allowed the decimating of everything that put them where they were and insured no one who came behind them would have the same opportunities and told anyone who would listen how they 'made it on their own without any help from anyone.'

They can bite me.

[Odin2005]

106. Labor Radicalism by the Greatest Generation is what pushed through workers' rights.

The radicalism of the Greatest Generation during the 30s seems to be ignored.

[laughingliberal]

122. Well, I guess they abandoned all that once they had theirs, huh?

Cause they overwhelmingly voted for Reagan. Unless you think we got any 'labor radicalism' after 1980. They can bite me.

[bettyellen]

148. yes they did- the G Gen dod the dmage and Boomers get blamed. becasuse Xers and Ms are too young

and apparently believe any crap written about that time, which oversimplifies everything,

[laughingliberal]

153. +1 nt

[Burma Jones]

96. Most of the Teabaggers I've seen are Boomers or Jonses........

Or, as David Brooks calls them in today's NYT, Wal-Mart Hippies..........

I'm smack dab in the middle of Generation Jones, my wife is an Xer, I have twin Half Brothers who are Millenials, our Dad was born in 1936, their Mom is a solid born in 1949 Boomer, so this whole generational thing is indeed tres fukked anyway, I mean, my kids are 12, 9 and 3 and they love love love The Beatles.

Frankly, I know of no more conspicuous consumers than the Boomers and Generation Jones......we loves us our stuff

Self-centered? Well, each generation is perceived by their parents as self centered.....

[Odin2005]

107. There are some DUers that keep lying by claiming most Teabaggers are pre-Boomers.

:eyes:

[Burma Jones]

108. There are lots of Boomers.....period......

[laughingliberal]

124. Boomers are the only group that did not vote overwhelmingly for Reagan

It is the economic policies that were instituted under Reagan and continue to this day that have destroyed the working class. The "Greatest Generation" got theirs, turned into Reagan Democrats and left us all for dead.

[laughingliberal]

123. Really, cause it seemed a whole lot of those teabaggers already have Medicare

which you can't get until you're 65.

[winyanstaz]

105. We must stop the damned bickering and pay attention.....

This is just another way they are trying to turn the people against each other...divide and conquor and all that....
STOP PLAYING BY THEIR RULES!
We have our own rules if we live up to our own highest ideals...and we can live by them and actually like ourselves in the morning.

[patrice]

120. google Bingo~

[laughingliberal]

126. It is and any group that is not being targeted currently just gleefully piles on

with no thought that the next spin of the wheel puts them in the crosshairs. Absolutely nauseating.

[Duke Newcombe]

111. In order to differentiate, you have to kill your mother and father.

Same as it ever was...same as it ever was.

[patrice]

121. No, you separate and become Peer-Friends and Individuals.

Get help.

[Duke Newcombe]

143. Now, you see, "killing your parents"--that's what we call...

speaking figuratively. Perhaps you've heard of it?

Please, DO get out more, won't you?

:eyes:

[earth mom]

115. Am I the only one sick of people trying to lump everyone in one group?

What I've seen on this thread really pisses me off!

I'm a boomer but I hated the 80's money mentality and never bought into the "keeping up with the Joneses" bullshit.

Both my husband and I are boomers and were born to Depression Era parents with Depression Era attitudes about spending and debt.

I remember having ONE pair of shoes every year for the entire school year and never having much in the way of possessions. What little I did have I treasured.

I was too young to be part of the protests of the 60s and 70s but I did believe in those ideals wholeheartedly and still do.

At 16, I rode my bike to and from my first job and saved up (to the tune of $2.65 an hour) in order to buy my first 12 year old car.

Both my husband and I have slaved, sacrificed and had a bit of luck to get where we are today.

But on the journey to where we are now, we lived as the working poor and almost fell over the edge into homelessness.

I loathe the greed and materialism that has corrupted this country with a passion!



People need to put the blame for the mess this country is on where it belongs: on rethuglicans of EVERY generation whose unchecked greed has just about wiped out this country's middle class!

And quit pissing on liberals like me of ANY generation who aren't responsible for this mess we are all in and view it all with disbelief, dismay and disgust.

:rant:

[Nikki Stone1]

118. +10,000

.

[Gidney N Cloyd]

187. +10,001 !

[dysfunctional press]

132. "...begins" ???

where have you been? or have you just not been paying attention for a couple of decades...?

[MidwestPerspective]

133. AP chose "The Rise of Generation Jones" as the #1 trend of 2009

I mention this because a few commenters here seem to not "get" that the whole GenJones movement really has developed a major following already, and is growing fast.

[omega minimo]

138. Any good references that aren't all about Ring Dings and Fat Albert?

:hi:

[Geek_Girl]

134. Boomers did wonderful things in the 60's and 70's

Then sold their souls in the 80's and then fucked us with Bush in the new millennium. My parents are boomers they both voted for Carter then one became a Libertarian and the other a moderate Republican who always vote republican except for Clinton's second term.

[EFerrari]

141. Oh, please. That's over the top. There's no evidence Boomers elected Bush

unless you mean the majority of the Supreme Court that selected him were Boomers and that Ken Blackwell is a Boomer.

[laughingliberal]

154. That's true. As I recall, Al Gore garnered the most votes of any Presidential candidate in history

up until then. I suspect many of the younger generations who are slamming the boomers now voted for his sick butt. That whole 'would like to have a beer with him' sounds like something younger voters might get snookered by.

[EFerrari]

167. I have no real feel for the pulse of younger people -- my sons

are in their early thirties and one is a lib, the other a red like me. lol

But George Bush is singularly unattractive. It's hard to see very young women turning out for him as they did for JFK or Obama, or young independent men thinking, I want to be like this inarticulate, misshapen, rude guy! :)

[MidwestPerspective]

220. Unfortunately, GenJonesers were key in electing Bush

The cover story of the political pollster's insider's bible--The Polling Report--the week after the 2004 election was titled: "Generation Jones elects a President". The article was written by the head of Mason-Dixon Polling--Brad Coker--who did a major analysis of the election, in which he looked at all the top swing States and found that every one of them would have gone to Kerry were it not for GenJones voters, who overwhelmingly voted Bush. GenJones women were the only gen of women to vote for Bush, and GenJones men voted in larger numbers for Bush than any of the other male gens. The nature of the Joneseers' political coming of age experience turned more of them conservative (think "Reagan Youth"), which has continued through today. If you look at recent elections, in general you'll find that Boomers tend to vote most Democtaric, while Jonesers tend to vote most GOP, which underlines further the imbecility of lumping these two very different cohorts together as if they are one, all based on the irrelevant variable that both groups were born during the post-WWII birth boom. Generations are about shared experiences, not fertility rates. Those of us who care about the Dems retaining power need to stop wasting time arguing about whether Jones & Boom should be lumped together, and instead focus on targeting each of these disctinct cohorts with the messaging most effective for that group. Advertisers are spending big bucks developing distinct messaging for Boomers Vs. Jonesers, the same needs to be done politically.

[bettyellen]

147. the greatest gen put Reagan in office kid. not your parents, LOL....go read about it

boomers were very divided, because they are truly diverse. sorry to pop your bubble

[Bill McBlueState]

139. this "generation" analysis is worthless

80% of the posts on this thread are quibbling over who's in what generation. When the basis for the whole concept is on such shaky ground, of what possible use can it be? It's just a bunch of pop-culture b.s.

[laughingliberal]

156. "pop-culture b.s."

and yet another divide and conquer assault in the class war.

[fishwax]

203. .

:thumbsup:

[RedCloud]

142. Up against the wall! Mofus. Right on!

[laughingliberal]

155. I think I just had a flashback. nt

[Zomby Woof]

165. I wouldn't bash them so much

...if they didn't go on and on and fucking ON about how they are The Most Wonderful Generation in American History. Or... The Generation with Fragrant Poop Which Smells of Lilacs and Roses.

That's the kind of narcissistic tripe that invites the hate. EVERY generation has something that makes them special, and EVERY generation has its misfires.

The fact that Generation X is the first in American history to not do as well as the preceding generation did justifies some of the resentment. But the #1 cause of the resentment by far is the self-absorbed masturbatory "celebration" the boomers do of themselves.

[laughingliberal]

168. Totally ageist BS

I find those who came after us to be far more narcissistic than we.

I would argue that those of us born in the 50's have not done as well as our parents, either. My father was a foreman in a chemical plant with 2 years of college who managed to support our family of 6 on his wages and had a pension when he retired. We, OTOH, have spent our working lives dealing with the stagnating/declining wages of the past 30 years and were expected to find money out of the shrinking pot to put into a 401k that reset itself in a market crash every 10 years.

The vitriol in your post suggest some serious ageism at work, here. I'm sick of the Greatest Generation crap. They are the ones who benefited from the New Deal programs. They were educated on their GI bills and were still reaping the wage structure of the labor wars. Once they were secure, they all became Reaganites and sat by while the programs from which they benefited were torn down leaving their children (the baby boomers) to struggle without those benefits. Oh yeah, and they supported the Viet Nam war and opposed desegregation. They were truly the generation of 'we've got ours and no one else can have any of it.' These are the facts of that generation. Your post is full of personal insults and no facts.

[rookie222]

170. Things should be getting better.

But they are not. Something's gotta give.

[comrade snarky]

174. Thanks for reminding me

Besides the narcissism Zomby mentioned, there is also a tendency in some boomers (usually the same ones who feel the need to be worshiped) to blame everyone else for any shortcomings of their generation.

Because all boomers were part of the civil rights movement and none of them voted for Regan or became yuppies. :eyes:


Try it out on someone who didn't live through the 80s. It ain't all mommy and daddies fault

[laughingliberal]

191. The economic conditions of today are a result of policies instituted by Reagan

initially and continued until now. I didn't vote for him and it is known that about 50% of the oldest boomers voted for him and the others did not. We are the only group that did not overwhelmingly vote for Reagan.

Can't speak for everyone but I was part of the civil right's movement as well as the anti war movement then and in the last decade and I did not vote for Reagan or become a yuppie. I became a nurse. The average age of nurses is now approaching 50 so it would seem most of the nurses are baby boomers. Those who came after us chose more lucrative, less strenuous work. I have also never felt any desire to be worshiped. Paid a fair wage for the work I did would have been nice but no need for worship.

It ain't all your mommy and daddy's fault, either.

All this boomer bashing is, as I keep saying, just another distraction in the class war. Just as the economic conditions facing us now are not the fault of 'illegal immigrants' as the RWers would have you believe or the blacks as the racists would have you believe, or liberated women as the misogynists would have you believe, or the people who 'bought more house than they could afford,' as the banksters would have you believe, it is not the fault of a group of people who happened to be born during certain years. The longer people allow themselves to be sucked in by these divide and conquer tactics the longer it will take for us to start fighting the forces who are behind the conditions.

I don't expect this to dissuade the bigots just as reason has never dissuaded any of the other bigots with whom we have tangled over the years.

edited typo in headline

[comrade snarky]

194. I'm not the one who typed up a post blaming a previous generation

For the worlds ills now am I?

Who was that again? Oh yeah... you.

See, I didn't say I blamed the whole baby boom generation for anything. I did say it contains some of the whiniest, most self absorbed humans the world has ever seen and I stand by that. You would be exhibit "A". Someone questions the hero worship some boomers seem to expect, you post a screed blaming the world ills on your parents generation and now when called on it what happens? It's all some big conspiracy to divide and concur the generations. You bashed the hell out of the WWII generation and now want to claim people shouldn't bash other generations? Really? Nice attack on my generation as being lazy too, you really hit all the bells and stereotypes there.

All while calling for an end to generational bashing. Nice.

So lets see... you slime at the WWII generation, call the Xers lazy and defend (to the point of calling other people bigots) the boomers. You sure have a lot wrapped up in your own self righteousness don't you.

Please, tell me again how I and everyone both younger and older than you is wrong. I never get tired of hearing that story.

[laughingliberal]

195. I did not blame the previous generation for all the ills of the world

Obviously racism and poverty and many other of the worlds' ills existed before my parents were born. But, lately, it seems to have become fashionable to blame people born during my generation for the worlds' ills. The economic peril America finds itself in today is the result of the policies which began under Reagan and I have seen several here, lately, say the baby boomer gave us Reagan. And that is, statistically, inaccurate. It is known we were the only demographic who did not vote, overwhelmingly, for him. And our parents (who I actually did know) built their lives on policies instituted by FDR which were summarily dismantled by the supply siders for whom they, overwhelmingly, voted. Did they realize the damage that would be done to our lives and the lives of those who came after us? I don't know. Perhaps they just succumbed to good propaganda and were not able to see things like unintended consequences. I do know they tended to be fond of telling anyone who would listen how they 'made it on their own' and they all loved that Frank Sinatra song, "I Did It My Way," which might suggest a tad bit of narcissism on their parts, too.

Every generation has problems and flaws but it seems to be popular these days to lay it all at the feet of the baby boomers and ignore that those who came before us did not leave things rosy for us, either. So, we werent' perfect and neither were they. What would you suggest we do about that? Or is spouting vitriol and hate towards a particular generation just some sort of venting process for those who need a place for their anger? I don't know. It does seem a little over the top at times.

I'm not sure I called your generation lazy but it is a fact there has been a decided drop in people entering the helping professions such as nursing, social work, and teaching leaving us with an aging work force in these fields and no one coming up to fill the voids. That's just a simple fact. All these fields have had a dearth of new practitioners for many years now. So, this whole meme of the baby boomers being a bunch of self centered narcissists would seem to be a little overblown as we did have big numbers who entered the realm of helping professions. I don't find many narcissists in low paid, underappreciated fields where the goal is to meet the needs of others. It's just not a characteristic of narcissists to gravitate towards that lifestyle. IOW, if being worshipped and adored was my goal, I'm sure I could have found more effective means that spending my days with my hand stuck up peoples' butts digging out impactions or placing catheters in their urinary tracts or emptying their bed pans or holding the ememsis basins while they puked. Just not the glamorous lifestyle of a true narcissist.

As for the conspiracy, it's not just generation against generation. It is any group not of the upper 1% pitted against any other group who is not of the upper 1% that is the problem and it is counter productive. It's not new or unique to this recent trend to bash on baby boomers. It is a tactic the elite have used to keep the masses distracted and unfocused since long before the Greatest Generation or the baby boomers or Gen X were ever thought of. It remains as effective today, it would seem, as it ever was.

edited typo

[comrade snarky]

196. Keep on spinning you crazy diamond you

"I'm sick of the Greatest Generation crap. They are the ones who benefited from the New Deal programs. They were educated on their GI bills and were still reaping the wage structure of the labor wars. Once they were secure, they all became Reaganites"

Yeah, no blame there.

I'm not sure I called your generation lazy but it is a fact there has been a decided drop in people entering the helping professions such as nursing, social work, and teaching leaving us with an aging work force in these fields and no one coming up to fill the voids

So it's not that we're lazy... it's that we don't care. I see. The fact I have a friend trying to get into one of the 150 open nursing school spots along with 1,500 other applicants is just a coincidence. The fault is obviously with us. :eyes:


It's fascinating how much derision you put out while calling for solidarity and understanding.

[laughingliberal]

198. What I object to is not that the Greatest made mistakes which, AFAIK, all humans do

What I object to is posts I have read here on DU lately stating our parents left things in great shape and we screwed it all up. Things were not left in great shape for us. That is what I object to. The meme that the Greatest created a great world and the baby boomers destroyed it. The Greatest benefited from programs which were destroyed starting in the 80's by people we, by and large, did not vote for.

Yes, there is a waiting list for most nursing programs, now. As the job situation has deteriorated, nursing has begun to look more attractive as it is assumed there will be a demand for some time to come. It will be a while before there are enough instructors trained to begin to fill the demand. There were a number of years for which there was not a huge demand and pursuing a masters' degree was out of reach for many. I have no idea if people of your generation were lazy or uncaring. I'm sure like every other generation there's a mixed bag. But I do know there was a decided lack of interest in the helping professions for a number of years. I don't know why but nursing journals who were writing extensively about the shortages and the aging of our work force during the 90's and 2000's did tend to note there were more opportunities open to women which were better paid and not as demanding. That seemed to be the consensus for the lack of new nurses entering the field. I can't fault anyone for pursuing a career which would pay better and not make as many demands on their lives. It's just an observation about a generation who has decided my generation was a bunch of narcissists. There is evidence we were not all a bunch of narcissists.

It's your right to continue to bash on the baby boomers if you prefer. I'm sure the children of our children will do the same to them. I just don't see it as productive. Perhaps it's just that particular developmental stage.

[comrade snarky]

200. That's what makes this funny

First, you think I'm bashing a whole generation instead of a remarkably self centered minority.

Second, you complain about the abuse while striking out at everyone else. Of course those are just your utterly unbiased observations right?


Maybe it is a developmental stage, I can only hope someday I'll be as wise as you. (Do I need the sarcasm tag?)

[laughingliberal]

201. I doubt anyone has totally unbiased observations and that would include me

I really had no feelings one way or another about this generational thing until the antiboomer propaganda began appearing frequently around here. I was aware that the economic policies of the past 30 years did leave us without the financial security our parents had but I blamed the politicians who enacted these policies and wondered at people in the working class who kept voting against their own interests. I did not see this as a generational problem but an informational one. I just assumed there were people of all ages who were suffering from this. My thoughts of the generations who come after us have been of concern about how we get this turned around. How do we elect leaders who will reinstate help for higher education? How do we get jobs back to America? My fears for our world have been for all of us and I did not see it as one age against another.

As my awareness of this propaganda campaign against my generation has gotten on my radar screen in the past weeks I have found myself angry at the blame and the bashing and it is likely I am feeling defensive about it. You may not have meant to bash a whole generation but you were responding to a post of mine in a thread that was about bashing a whole generation and you were supporting another poster who was hateful in his assessment of our generation and who, subsequently, posted a really vile and profane response to me which was, thankfully, removed. You may not be an ageist but you did respond in support of a poster whose writings would indicate he is and I apologize if I lumped you in with him undeservedly.

My early life was spent as a target of the right wing reactionary groups in the south as my parents were civil rights activists who worked with Dr. King and my father was president of the Catholic Human Relations Council in Memphis when King was assassinated there. His group was standing with the sanitation workers who were on strike and who Dr King had come to Memphis in support of. There were frequent attempts on our lives and constant threats. Our car was bombed in our driveway and more than one cross was burned in our yard. I was attacked by a mob on my way home from school one day shortly after the murder of Dr. King and I was beaten pretty badly. I was 13 at that point. I do, likely, have a touch of PTSD and when I feel under attack I feel fear. I also get scared when I see the propaganda against a group of people ramping up as it has been my experience that there are reasons why groups get targeted and it usually does not bode well for that group. I lived my life from the age of 8 until I was a young adult as part of a targeted group. I now find myself part of another targeted group as I am nearing the end and I am scared. But, of course, we're all just a bunch of narcissists who fantasize that we were part of the civil rights movement and were really just wannabes who wanted to look 'cool.' This stuff is hard to take when the above really was the reality of my life.

edited typo

[comrade snarky]

207. Try not to take it so personally

Both Zomby and I brought up a segment of the boomer population. A segment, in my opinion, well deserving of some scorn. You know, the ones who were at Woodstock, Altamount, the March on Washington, the Summer of Love in San Francisco and were fire hosed in Selma when they weren't getting high with Jimmy and Janice. The ones who think they saved the world, invented non-missionary sex and feel oh so sorry for the poor benighted who weren't a part of the generation that can do no wrong. Peace and love unless, god help you, you disagree with any little thing.

Your decision to take it as a personal attack and go after other groups is your own choice, the hypocrisy that comes with it appears to flow naturally. As many around these parts keep saying about our president "criticism isn't bashing" or something like that. If you cant take any criticism of your generation then might I suggest you not engage in criticizing others? Blaming the WWII generation for the 80s as though boomers had no part in it. Note please, I said the boomers had a part in the Regan revolution not that they are solely responsible. So lets not go down that rabbit hole again.

By the way, here on the internet I'm a jet pilot, jewel thief and international corporate spy. When I'm not busy with the astronaut training that is. Maybe it's all true, maybe it's not. Has nothing to do with this discussion. Your issues from your childhood and fears are your own, how you deal with them is where you get to make a choice.

[laughingliberal]

209. Constructive criticism is fine. What I am concerned about, overall, is the

ramping up I first noticed here and then in the national discussion, generally, of anti baby boomer propaganda. I am worried about why this is happening now and I suspect it is the forerunner of things to come. My suspicion is that this is all about turning public opinion against us as we reach retirement in order to drum up support for destroying the safety net that is there for seniors. I don't know this for a fact but it has been since Bernanke, et al, have started their campaign to reform entitlements (which means cut social security and Medicare) that I have noticed the rhetoric being ratcheted up. Just as Reagan demonized the poor with welfare queen mythology in order to make it acceptable to cut services for the poor, I fear we are being served up as the next group ripe for a screwing. Not an absolute here but an observation.

Everyone who has been working since Reagan raised the payroll taxes has paid a higher payroll tax rate which funded the shortfalls created by cutting the income taxes at the top. That's pretty much 30 years for me. It is one of the top reasons why wages have stagnated/declined for everyone during these 3 decades. It is now time that the surplus of FICA taxes needs to be paid back as the boomers are now reaching retirement age. There are those who do not wish to pay it back as it will, likely, mean raising taxes on the wealthy to fund those things they have been funding with the payroll tax surplus these many years. Would it not make sense that in order to make it acceptable to leave us without the safety net they must first turn public opinion against us just as they did the poor before they abandoned them to the fates? This is what I think is behind it. The generations who come behind us will suffer from this, also but can be easily distracted from the long term ramifications of this by focusing on, as I saw one poster here put it, 'a bunch of old, rich, greedy fuckers.

Well, I'm not a jet pilot or jewel thief or anything except an RN who is now mostly disabled and who lived my early life in a home that was under attack from the right all the time. I guess it's really nothing if people I don't know on the internet beleive me or not. It's every bit true and probably not the smartest to have posted it here as I am a real person with a real life that was documented at the time the events were occurring. But I have little left to protect so the risk was acceptable.

[comrade snarky]

211. Anti Boomer propaganda leading to us pulling plugs

And ending medicare is a fantasy. A paranoid fantasy to be precise.

"Oh no! Someone said they don't like hippies and that boomers aren't perfect! They want to kill us all! Flee!"

I shouldn't have to say this to someone so old but grow the hell up. Not everything is a grand conspiracy centered around you and your generation. Jeebus, my generation is one hell of a lot more likely to work ourselves into an early grave taking care of our parents than we are to say screw you and go to Barbados while Uncle Jim dies on the street.

This is Sara Palin Death Panel level stupid.

[laughingliberal]

213. Do you expect the deficit commission is not going to come back with

recommendations to cut SS and Medicare?

[comrade snarky]

214. The Medicare and SS

That's so popular the Republicans who've spent he last 30 years trying to dismantle them but are now pretending to be the protectors of because it's so popular?

That SS and Medicare?

[laughingliberal]

215. Yep

That's why they appointed a 'deficit commission.' Allows them to divert blame.

[comrade snarky]

216. That'll work well for them

Cause old people never vote.

Unless you think old people aren't smart enough to figure out that little trick. Hell, I expect boomers to make damn sure they have medical care through that exact method. By the time there aren't enough of them around to vote themselves care we'll have a huge gerontology infrastructure competing for what's left.

Even the Teabagger idiots are angry at the thought of touching medicare and they can barely spell their own racist signs.

[laughingliberal]

217. I hope you're right about that

But most of the public was against the reappointment of Bernanke to the fed. Right, left, young, old, and everyone in between wanted this guy out. And yet there he is. And why? Cause Wall Street and the banksters wanted him. And they want our SS and Medicare money, too. Alan Simpson was appointed as the Republican head of the deficit commission and he loathes SS with a passion. His Democratic co-chair is a the centrist Erskine Bowles. So, here we have an ultra right hater of Medicare co-chairing with a centrist who is probably open to some cuts to 'entitlements.' Perhaps there will be a liberal somewhere on the commission.

I fully expect the commission to recommend cuts. There is talk of making us wait til we're 70 to draw it. Or reducing our benefit (gee, I was really looking forward to that $1000 per month since all my retirement savings had to be withdrawn for us to survive these past 2 years I have been unable to work and my husband's business had tanked in 2006 when housing and building tanked). The only saving grace I see is that the Senate defeated the bill that would have created the commission and required their recs to be voted on in an up or down vote in their entirety. That idea was supported by some of the worst opponents of entitlements like Judd Gregg and several Conservadems. In forcing Obama to create the commission by executive order the House and Senate will now have the opportunity to accept some of the recs and reject others.

I really hope you're right about it. But there are reasons for concern.

[comrade snarky]

218. It's nothing to celebrate

I expect the boomer generation to work hard to keep medicare from being expanded if we wait another 10 years for health care reform. Frankly, I expect a lot of them not to care who pays for what as long as they're taken care of. It'll be "dangerous" to expand or change medicare, something so important changing is scary.

Scared people do tend to lash out don't they?

Medicare is safer than the National Park system or the FDA.

[laughingliberal]

219. I do care who pays for what but I have little hope of seeing any fairness restored to our tax

structure. Workers have been screwed since we did away with the progressivity of the income tax. Those with less have carried a disproportionate share of the burden. The powerful will stop at nothing to make sure it stays where it is and they continue to skate on the backs of those who have far less. It is to my detriment and eternal regret that I did not leave here while I could have. By the time I saw our chances of turning things around in this country had dwindled to almost none, I was too old to emigrate under a skilled worker's visa anywhere. Right up until Bush stole the 2000 election, I thought we could make it. Bad timing. A year earlier I could have gotten into several countries.

I'm pretty much advising those still young enough to find any way they can to get trained for an occupation of preference somewhere else and start applying.

BTW, would I do that if I just wanted the young and healthy to stay here and make sure I'm taken care of as I become older and sicker? Or would it suggest I don't want to see them suffer the fate we are facing?

[Name removed]

175. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[laughingliberal]

193. Something of a false dichotomy here

To say the economic conditions under which we grew up were not as good as our parents is far from saying we can't stand any criticism. That is a nice example of intellectual dishonesty, there. Ageism is as real as racism and sexism and jingoism. And it is counterproductive. But the class warriors thank you for focusing on the distractions.

Your anger and hostility will, obviously, not be changed by any words which could be written here.

[rookie222]

169. be constructive

Why bash anybody -makes no sense.

[WonderGrunion]

178. Weren't the "Reagan Democrats" all Boomers?

Yeah, I thought so.

[flyarm]

184. NO! the Greatest generation voted him in!! eom

[TexasObserver]

185. Nope. Try the Greatest Generation for that distinction.

The oldest boomer was 34 when Reagan was elected and the youngest boomer that year was 15-16 years old.

To the extent that Reagan Democrats actually existed, they were Northern voters - many union workers - who abandoned the Democratic party over RACIAL issues. That wasn't boomers. That was their parents, many of whom clung to racism and therefore found the Republican party and Reagan a welcome change from the Affirmative Action and Busing pushed by our party.

[fishwax]

186. I don't buy the generational theories of history and society

I mean, it's an interesting subject, but as a way of actually examining the world I think it's about as reliable as an astrological chart.

Generations have never been monolithic, there's no reason to think that a late boomer should have anything more in common with an early boomer than they would with an early X'er, and aside from the demographic phenomenon of the higher birth rate after World War II, the dates to which generations are pinned is always tenuous.

[Mike 03]

188. Oh Brother. Just follow the money. This has nothing to do with The Sixties and everything

to do with the cost the Baby Boomers represent to our budget.

Dear God, most of our legislators and leaders are from that generation.

[Politicub]

189. Boomers and baptists

Boomers - one of the largest generational cohorts and perpetual victims of being maligned - reminds me of Christians.

This Xer appreciates the contributions of the boomer generation, but it gets a little old with the ongoing tug of war about who makes up the "best" generation.

Tom Brokaw is indeed a douche for bashing the boomers, but I don't expect very much of him. It's hard to take his loony ravings seriously. Isn't the WWII generation his biggest audience? He rants and raves about whippersnappers a la Glenn Beck for the retired. It's like candy for his viewers.

PS - EVERYONE knows that Gen X'rs are the pre-eminent generation BTW. Remember that we were the worker bees that staffed Internet companies during the mainstreaming of the Internet -- you're welcome. ;)

PPS - Yes, many of those companies did fail but most of the over ambitious investors were Boomers and Generation Jones-types. So there.

PPPS - This post is offered pierced tongue-in-cheek

PPPPS - There are good and bad people from each generation.

O8) :loveya:

[taught_me_patience]

190. They protested Vietnam because THEY were gonna get sent

But had no problem sending youngsters off to die in another useless war in Iraq.

[laughingliberal]

212. Seems there were a lot of us out there for the protests against Iraq, too

and we weren''t getting sent there.

[Canuckistanian]

199. I always thought 'boomers trailed off in the late 50's

I was born in '58 and I can tell you, the kids born before me were different. More restless, more volatile.

Which would explain the student and Woodstock movements of the 60's. Us 1958ers were never so restless. I never saw a GLIMMER of social unrest around me when I hit my early adulthood.

[MidwestPerspective]

222. Data shows last Boomer birth years were mid-50's

Exactly, so born in 1958 you are certainly not a Boomer, nor an Xer. We are clearly part of this GenJones group in-between. Mountains of data confirm this, which can easily be accessed and confirmed.

[flyarm]

202. Baby Boomers..who are they?????? Born 1946-1964

Sloan Work and Family Research Network Boston College
http://wfnetwork.bc.edu/glossary_entry.php?term=Baby%20Boomers,%20Definition(s)%20of&area=All

« previous BACK next »


Baby Boomers, Definition(s) of
Ages 38-57 (in 2002) (Families & Work Institute, 2004).

“Born between 1947 and 1966…The last generation to force great changes on society, Baby boomers grew up in relative prosperity and safety… They came of age in the optimistic sixties and seventies and believe in growth, change and expansion. The boomers tend to pursue promotion by working long hours and demonstrating loyalty…” (Allen, 2004).

“At 78 million strong, they are the largest generation and make up the current workforce majority. Born between 1946 and 1964, Baby Boomers are optimistic…Boomers grew up in a time when mothers stayed home, while fathers went to work…On the job, Boomers arrive early and leave late, visibility is key. The longer the day, the higher the pay, believes the Boomer” (Hatfield, 2002, p.72).

“Baby Boomers (born between 1946 and 1964)…” (Singleton & Maher, 2004, p. 228).

“Boomers’ birth years are variously reported to begin anywhere from 1940 to 1946 and to end in 1960 or 1964…The Boomers are estimated to be 78 million strong…(Schaeffer, 2000)” (As cited in Smola & Sutton, 2002, p. 364).


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http://www.bbhq.com/whatsabm.htm

Baby Boomer Headquarters
So What's a Boomer, Anyhow?
Glad you asked. Stated very simply, the demographers, sociologists and the media define baby boomers as those born between (and including) 1946 and 1964. (There is no law or constitutional amendment so stating; and other boundaries have been suggested. But this is the time frame most commonly used.) In 2010, that would make us between 46 and 64 years old. There are about 75 million boomers in the U.S.; we currently represent about 29% of the U.S. population. (In Canada, we are sometimes known as "Boomies"; there are 6 million of us there. In Britain, our generation is known as "the bulge.")

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Britannica Concise Encyclopedia:


baby boom
In the U.S., increase in the birth rate between 1946 and 1964; also, the generation born in the U.S. during that period.
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Columbia Encyclopedia:


baby boom
baby boom, a period in which the birthrate is significantly higher than in other periods, especially the post-World War II period in the United States, Canada, Australia, and New Zealand. In the United States, the postwar baby boom was the largest demographic spike in the nation's history; more than 78 million Americans were born. Experts differ about the span of the U.S. baby boom, which the Census Bureau defines as 1946 to 1964; the number of births peaked in 1957.

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http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/chc/reinventingaging/Report.pdf

Reinventing Aging

BABY BOOMERS AND CIVIC ENGAGEMENT
Harvard School of Public Health–MetLife Foundation
Initiative on Retirement and Civic Engagement

Approximately 77 million babies were born in the United States during the boom years of 1946
to 1964. In 2011, the oldest will turn 65, and, on average, can expect to live to 83. Many will
continue well into their 90s.
The baby boomers soon will have the opportunity to redefine the meaning and purpose of the
older years. As some of the demands of work and family that have commanded their attention
in mid-life recede, boomers will have the potential to become a social resource of unprecedented
proportions by actively participating in the life of their communities.



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Kennedy School Bulletin summer 2007

(Harvard Kennedy School)

http://www.hks.harvard.edu/ksgpress/bulletin/07summer/features/boomers.html

Will you still need me?
Will you still feed me?
When I’m 65
by Lewis Rice

But a generation defined by the turbulence of the 1960s could face turbulence ahead. And so could the country, as it faces unprecedented entitlement expenditures for the approximately 75 million baby boomers born between
1946 and 1964.

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the National Bureau of Economic Research

author is also the Mitsui Professor of Economics at M.I.T.

http://www.nber.org/aginghealth/winter07/w12585.html

Retirement Security of the Baby Boomers: the Role of Financial Literacy and Planning
The large "Baby Boom" generation (traditionally defined as those born between 1946 and 1964) is now on the cusp of retirement, with the first Boomers due to become eligible for Social Security next year. This generation has experienced a number of events that could affect its financial preparedness for retirement, including the 1983 Social Security amendments that raised the normal retirement age, the ongoing shift from defined benefit to defined contribution pensions, and recent boom and bust cycles in equity and housing markets.

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The Free Library

http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Baby+boomers+are+reinventing+long-term+care:+strategic+planning+for...-a0156644299

Baby boomers

literally think they're going to die before they get old," says J. Walker Smith, president of the polling company Yankelovich Partners, which found in one study that boomers (Americans born between 1946 and 1964)

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Human Resources

http://humanresources.about.com/od/glossaryb/g/boomers.htm

Definition:

Baby Boomers is the name given to the generation of Americans who were born in a "baby boom" following World War II. The Boomers were born between 1944 and 1964. The oldest wave of the Baby Boomers is currently considering retirement options and looking at ways to make their elder years meaningful. The youngest group of Baby Boomers are managing the Millennialsand Generation-X groups of employees - and in some cases, being managed by them.

[MidwestPerspective]

221. Actual experts say: Boomers 1942-1953 and Generation Jones 1954-1965

The birth years of the post-WWII demographic baby boom are clear: 1946-1964. The birth years, however, of the generation(s) born during this era are controversial. You can find lots of different references across the web, mostly parroted by "writers" who aren't remotely expert in the field, and who just repeat what they saw another equally clueless "writer" write. But if you look at actual expert opinion, the real experts who actually study this and write about it...in books, articles in academic journals, etc., you'll find that a consensus of sorts has emerged that there are two distinct generations born then, with the usual birth years set this way: Boomer Generation 1942-1953 and Generation Jones 1954-1965.

[Writer]

206. Even if you have...

Even if you need...
I don't mean to stare.
We don't have to breed."

Good luck with the thread SUCKA!

[Whoknows44]

208. If you apply conflict perspective of economics to.....

the situation the case of rising pensions for older workers and rising benefits and wages while crowding out older workers simply states the older generation is being greedy and taking more for itself at the expense of the younger generation. Makes sense to me.

Considering I'm having trouble finding a better job when 30 years ago it wouldn't have made a damn bit of difference I say it's a rational and justified argument.

[mrmpa]

210. Not my fault contraception was illegal in the '50's