Our neighbor's Toyota Tundra floors itself regularly.

[elehhhhna]

She's had it in the shop 3 or 4 times -- long before this recall talk -- and they can never make it happen. It's there now. She says the gas pedal goes to the floor by itself.

[d.gibbs]

1. I had a neighbor who said her door opened by itself

and made a creaking sound when she wasn't looking...

[Kolesar]

2. No, the Tundras frame rust in half

and bend when you put them on a lift

[LiberalFighter]

3. Maybe the car is running a video software?

http://www.toyotasimulator.com/

[ingac70]

4. She's not the only one....

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=7912529&mesg_id=7913764

[TexasObserver]

5. Yes, it is an intermittent problem, probably computer.

If Toyota could fix it, they would. I think that is their biggest problem: they can't fix it.

Thanks for posting this. The need some have to find fraudulent all these owners and their problems is troubling. One expects more rational thinking on a progressive site.

[Fumesucker]

6. If it is a drive by wire system there is no mechanical connection to the pedal..

In other words the computer might be able to open the throttle all the way but the pedal will not move at all, there is no mechanism to make it move.

On the other hand if it is a mechanical throttle then the only way the computer can floor the pedal is by actuating the cruise control, the cruise control mechanical linkage can be easily disconnected so there would be no way for the computer to floor the pedal.

The person with the truck in question should have the cruise control disconnected from the throttle if it is a mechanical linkage, if the pedal continues to randomly floor then there's a good chance the truck is possessed by demons.

[TexasObserver]

7. The Tundra in the OP has been to Toyota several times about it.

The suggestion you make cannot be done by the consumer. It would void the warranty and make impossible holding Toyota responsible for the design defect.

Whatever the problem, it's Toyota's, not the Tundra owner's. The owner doesn't need to do anything except take the car to a Toyota dealer and say "fix it."

The Tundra owner should NOT have anything disconnected from the the throttle. They should get another vehicle, because this one is too dangerous to drive. If Toyota wants to take the car back and jury-rig it as you've suggested, they can do so, but a consumer should never make the alteration you suggest. If they do, they buy the problem that currently belongs to Toyota.

[Fumesucker]

9. Unhooking the cruise control cable is something that can easily be undone..

It only takes a few minutes, breaks nothing, and could hooked up again any time the truck was taken in for servicing, Toyota would have no way of knowing it was ever unhooked.

Now the owner of the truck can fight with Toyota all they want but in the meantime I suggest a way that they can be sure their accelerator pedal will not randomly floor itself.

I think the odds of the owner getting the kind of satisfaction you outline from Toyota are fairly poor, should they just park the truck while they fight it out or do what I suggested?

[TexasObserver]

14. It Voids the warranty, and therefore cannot be done by the consumer.

No, the owner should not do as you suggested. I don't know what their note or payment arrangements are with Toyota or some other lender, but they shouldn't drive the vehicle, they shouldn't alter it as you suggested, and they should demand that Toyota buy the vehicle from them.

If Toyota doesn't buy it back, the consumer should sue Toyota. Jury rigging the vehicle only helps Toyota avoid paying for the harm they have caused and may cause.

A consumer simply cannot alter the mechanics of the vehicle to change the acceleration without voiding their warranty and exposing him or herself to liability for the tragedy which may follow.

Driving a dangerous vehicle is unacceptable, even if one has a note on the vehicle. The consumer is already in a bad situation. Your solution may work, but if it does, that's a decision for Toyota to make and implement. But if the solution is simple, why haven't all the collective minds at Toyota come up with it? The likely reason: they did consider it, but won't do it because it won't work.

[Fumesucker]

15. And how long is a lawsuit going to take?

Most likely years.

During which time the owner has basically four choices, drive the vehicle with it dangerous, modify it as I outlined, park the vehicle or sell it..

I really get the impression you are not particularly knowledgeable about cars.

[TexasObserver]

16. Not as long as death, or serious injury, or being sued for hitting someone else.

I'm knowledgeable about law and business, the areas in this discussion which are relevant. Your belief that you've figured out what Toyota hasn't been able to figure out is laughable.

I'm not trying to fix their car. That's Toyota's job, not mine, and not yours.

Anyone who knowingly drives a Toyota after it accelerates on its own is taking a huge risk of harm, not just to them, but to anyone they might kill or maim. Anyone who alters the mechanics of their vehicle voids the warranty and exposes him or herself to additional risk of liability.

[Fumesucker]

18. Let them take the financial bath then..

They can either continue paying payments or let the car be repossessed and take the hit on their credit..

Maybe they'll get something back in a lawsuit and maybe not.

It's not my responsibility..

[TexasObserver]

24. Tell media you have it figured out.

I suggest that you call your local TV station and tell them you know how to fix the problems and want a chance to discuss it on the news. See if you can get them to cover you. See if you can convince them you have the solution. You'll be a hero. You'll be on all the talk shows. You'll be famous.

As for their liability on their note, they already have that. As for selling the vehicle, they could do that as long as they make full disclosure of the problem. Any solution is better than the owner driving the vehicle or altering it.

[Fumesucker]

25. They have *already* driven it after having the problem..

Multiple times in fact, if the OP is to be believed..

[TexasObserver]

28. Your attempt at avoidance is noted. Call media and give them your solution.

Why don't you call media and tell them you know how to fix it?

Are you only message board confident of your solution?

You can be handsomely paid by Toyota if you can fix this problem. Or, you could call any of the plaintiff's lawyers handling a Toyota acceleration case, explain your level of "expertise" in understanding cars, and explain how easy it is to fix this problem. They will then employ you as an expert to testify as such. You'll be rich and famous.

All you have to do is submit your curriculum vitae to Toyota's legal department or to the plaintiffs' lawyers and your economic future is set.

[Fumesucker]

29. You said they should not drive it, I point out that they have..

And will most likely continue to drive it..

As you so ably point out, they will be responsible if someone is killed now that they know the vehicle is not safe.

[TexasObserver]

30. That is immaterial to their current dilemma, except as notice of the defect.

They are charged with the knowledge that (1) their vehicle runs full out on its own, (2) Toyota has tried to fix it but can't find the problem, and (3) there is now widespread knowledge that many, many Toyotas are subject to this defect.

Their DUTY is to act responsibly once they have that knowledge. Responsible action includes not driving such a vehicle.

That's why they should reject your advice, and not drive the vehicle again.

[Fumesucker]

31. I bet they will drive it though..

Most people simply can't afford to let an asset of that size sit unused, no matter what they should do, practical realities take over.

I was just making a suggestion from my own knowledge of cars as a long time enthusiast who has built, rebuilt and modified more cars than I can remember.

Edited to add: The best predictor of future behavior is past behavior, the past behavior of the person in the OP leads me to think they will continue to act in the same way.

[IDemo]

8. What Fumesucker said

The one and only mechanism within the pedal on a "drive by wire" vehicle that may cause these symptoms is the return-spring. If this were to fail - either by breaking or escaping its retention clip, the pedal might appear to the driver to be pulled to the floor. But the throttle would remain permanently nonfunctional until the spring or the entire pedal assembly were replaced. In many of these cases, the over-acceleration comes and goes. In zero cases so far have the springs (there are two) been found broken.

The vast majority of these cases are almost certainly caused by a faulty engine control computer, likely the firmware (this is from a hardware tech, however :))

They need to put one of these on the dashboard:

[Imagevision]

10. Looks like it'll take more lives lost to Toyota cars before the people get real...

[Historic NY]

11. Hello Dave.............HAL2000 software.

[FarCenter]

12. If it is a 2007 to 2010 Tundra, there is no mechanical connection between the pedal and anything

The gas pedal is a self contained unit that sends an electrical signal to the engine control computer.

There is no mechanical linkage with anything else that can pull the gas pedal to the floor or move it in any way.

The resistance to foot pressure that causes the pedal to spring back when released is provided by a spring in the gas pedal assembly itself near the pivot point.

[Tesha]

32. Oh man, don't harsh their buzz with facts.

They're certain that a pedal assembly that consists of
nothing but a lever, a return spring, and a transducer
can somehow "move itself to the floor".

Tesha

[lovely]

13. that's pretty creepy

:scared:

[Edweird]

17. Well, according to some here, it must be a hoax!

[Fumesucker]

19. If it's a 2007 or later Tundra there is no mechanical connection from the pedal to anything

Except a spring..

If the spring breaks or unhooks itself it isn't going to unbreak or rehook itself..

[Edweird]

21. Yeah, but how are her finances? That's the real issue here. Has she been investigated yet?

[Fumesucker]

26. A lot of people think that particular incident sounded very "balloon boyish"..

Those of us who have a good understanding of cars are mostly skeptical of the story, the only ones I've noticed on DU who aren't are those who have an antipathy for foreign cars to start with.

[rucky]

22. Brand loyal yuppies conspire in mass suicide attempt.

isn't it obvious?

[Fumesucker]

27. I'm neither young, upwardly mobile or a "professional"..

And I haven't owned a Toyota in fifteen years..

In fact I have an Expedition and an F150 right now..

[Iggo]

20. Toyota's scientists say you're lying.

[grahamhgreen]

23. (Tin Foil Hat Alert) Maybe it's a malevolent software virus put out by GM or the Chinese......????