How poor do the rich have to make the rest of us?

[n2doc]

They take our jobs and send them elsewhere.

They take our Pensions and "invest" them in scams, mine the money out of them and leave us with nothing

They take our health care, drive everyone out of the system and into the emergency rooms, so that they don't have to wait for treatment

They take our houses and resell them for pennies to "investors" to rent back to us.

They take our Schools, replacing them with "test factories" teaching a twisted view of history and science.

And they've taken our Government, so that we can be stuck with a huge debt that paid for nothing of value, only wars, bailouts and subsidies.


And we sit around and fight over the remaining crumbs

How poor do we have to become before we fight those who really are the problem?

[marions ghost]

1. These are their

major achievements, for which they are privately proud. Indicators of success.

[av8rdave]

2. History shows that eventually the poor WILL fight those who are the problem

But it's going to have to get a LOT worse than it is already to create the anger and momentum for that to happen.

[Initech]

57. The sad thing is, we're getting there.

But I feel a revolution is desperately needed - what's it gonna take?

[glinda]

58. I predict the HC Bill, if weak, will tip it.

[proteus_lives]

60. Are you ready to put people up against the wall?

Their families too?

[leeroysphitz]

100. We should do the families first and make the bastards watch. n/t

[proteus_lives]

121. How cute.

You would have fit right in at the Reign of Terror.

[leeroysphitz]

124. Just trying to be part of the solution. n/t

[proteus_lives]

126. Of course, the first round of butchers are usually the first to go in the next stage.

When the revolution starts to eat it's own.

So what would you prefer, show-trial after being accused of counter-revolutionary activities or having your throat slit while you take a bath?

[leeroysphitz]

129. How about an axe instead?

I'm prepared to be "Trotskied" for the team.

[wolfgangmo]

108. re; are you ready to put peole up against the wall?

Aren't you?

For me I would be pretty OK with connecting the punishment with the crime.



Stole pensions from old folks and made them homeless? Everything is taken from you and your entire family for 10 years by the IRS.

Tortured or wrote the justification? Welcome to Disney's newest interactive audience participation ride - torturers of the middle east. Try your hand at waterboarding! Featuring John Woo.

Declined medical treatment in violation of writen contract? Death. For you and 1 member of your family for every person you killed by your callous actions.

Denied treatment of a serious medical condition the result of which was a lifetime disability? Guido and Lothar visit you, break your legs in 142 different pieces and you are denied reconstructive surgery for life. Further all your wealth is taken from you and given to your victim.




If you notice the thread of where these hypotheticals are going it is this. The ruling class and their enablers are breaking laws with impunity, have hijacked our democracy (treason) and should be held accountable in such a way that NO-ONE who is not insane would even THINK about perpetrating such crimes ever again. If a CEO knew that if they defrauded the public that 1 inch of penis would be cut off for every million dollars they stole (pocketted in bonus money) they might think again.

These are all hyperbole, but I think more and more people are becoming pissed off. My hard right wing brother in law lost his job 8 months ago and he no longer listens to Rush and no longer thinks that corporation and companies are deserving of tax breaks. He looks at his children and he looks at the bonuses on Wall Street and he sees red. Him and I have never been on the same side of politics EVER and now he is agreeing with me. He has seen his future and his childrens future getting flushed. If he and I can find common ground, then the revolution is not far away.

[theFrankFactor]

115. Can I Use This? "If a CEO knew that if they defrauded the public that 1 inch of penis would be cut..

If a CEO knew that if they defrauded the public that 1 inch of penis would be cut off for every million dollars they stole (pocketted in bonus money) they might think again.

That's gold Jerry!

[RaleighNCDUer]

125. The hell of it is, the people who have been using the zero-tolerance,

no leniency, no holds barred, three strikes policies against the rest of us for the past three decades will see those same attitudes enforced against them. They've created a climate of harshness, and they will experience it for themselves.

Gentle regimes do not engender violent revolutions. Create a system that imprisons people at the highest rate in the entire world, where the 'safety net' gives just enough to keep people in poverty, and not enough to help them out of it, where torture is not only common but is promoted by the highest authorities in the land, and you WILL wind up like Nicolae Ceauşescu, eventually.

[Kablooie]

69. Look at the French Revolution. We aren't anywhere near there yet.

You have to have people dieing in the street and no one paying any attention to the dead bodies before a real revolution might occur.

[liberation]

80. Making historical comparisons unadjusted to account for historical context is counterproductive

I am sure plenty of appeasers while the French Revolution was brewing were rather quick to point to the masses, that things were much worse during the dark ages... thus there was no need to revolt.

[mntleo2]

84. Uhhh, thatr's already happening ...

Homeless people die all the time on our streets and nobody notices. Last year at our city's vigil for the homeless dead, we mourned 103 street people who died unnoticed and numbers keep rising, but few have cared and it is projected to get worse.

Cat in Seattle

[Kablooie]

145. Oh. Okay. Time to start the revolution then.

[RaleighNCDUer]

132. There are TWO MILLION HOMELESS in this country. When they die,

they die in the streets.

Maybe you didn't notice?

[liberation]

79. I read a study long time ago, about a research which found that revolutions in most societies....

... tend to happen when the distribution of wealth reaches a specific ratio between rich and poor, and that without exception societies which reached that threshold ended up revolting.

The US had supposedly reached and passed that ratio over 2 decades ago.

Probably the US mass media as a propaganda tool may have somehow reverse a historical trend, interesting and frightening at the same time.

[jwirr]

3. From their viewpoint - poor enough that we will work for slave wages.

[kenny blankenship]

95. At the height of its manufacturing boom China's factory workers avergaged $120 US per month

that's how poor the rich will make us.

[MattBaggins]

119. Do you have the link for those figures

Would be nice to see the median numbers and any modes of course.

[kenny blankenship]

127. There are many articles which include data like this on teh google

The Financial Crisis Seen From China
The Toy Makers of Chenghai
June 11, 2009
By TRISTAN de BOURBON

(snip)

Chenghai facts and figures

Population: there are officially 800,000 inhabitants plus 500,000 migrant workers, mainly working in toy manufacturing.

Main activity: toy making; turnover 16.2bn yuans ($2.37bn) in 2008; 80% of it through exports.

Factories: 3,000 officially; 10,000 unofficially, accounting for workshops subcontracted by the big factories.

Salaries: 14-15 yuans ($2-$2.2) for a four-hour shift, or 900 yuans ($132) a month for workers who do two shifts a day; 1,350 yuans ($198) for those doing three shifts a day.

And these are the "rich" Chinese workers of the heavily industrialized provinces.

[OffWithTheirHeads]

4. They won't stop until you say "Yes my Lord"

And they get first crack at the virgin brides on their wedding day. Welcome to the new corporate feudal society.

[lunatica]

5. Poor enough that everyone is working solely for their benefit

Poor enough that all young able bodied persons join the military to be used to protect their interests or go after something they want in other countries. Poor enough that all our jobs will be service jobs that either serve them directly or make them a profit. It would resemble the southern plantations before the Civil War and the Gilded Age mixed together. Civil right will be rescinded and the true ownership elites would again be the leaders. Just like the creators of the Constitution intended.

[yurbud]

6. until we're poor enough to drown in the bathtub

like Grover Norquist said about the government.

When they have wrung every penny out of us and there is left to do is take our organs, and grind the rest of our body into dog food.

[leeroysphitz]

101. right. it costs too much to burry ALL the dead.

[rhett o rick]

7. Someone on here said it best: "It's not that they want to kill us, they just dont care if we die."nm

[Bluenorthwest]

96. There is the fact that can lead to meaningful change

They don't give a fuck. They don't want us to be poor, they just want more. Big difference. Vital difference.

[fasttense]

99. The path to hell is paved with good intentions or more likely

collateral damage.

[rhett o rick]

133. I will go with that. They dont want us poor, they just want our money, property and labor.

Our being poor is just an unfortunate side effect.

[CrispyQ]

8. I'm truly boggled at the elite & their greedy, selfishness.

I simply don't comprehend it. Is it a game to them, this continual quest for more? Or is it something more insidious - an addiction?

[whattheidonot]

41. globization

it is globalization . it is all about competition in a globalist world. nothing else seems to matter. the powers to be are doing their best to push a globalist world. all in the name of efficiency. in theory it sounds good but really who does it benefit, the corporations. multi-national corporations calling the shots. we just have to adjust or drop out. i envision drop out enclaves where people will keep out this madness.

[hobbit709]

9. It will go on until the elite get shortened.

[rock]

10. To zero or to when we revolt nt

[Cirque du So-What]

11. Look at how slaves were treated in the antebellum south

That, to me, is the purest manifestation of capitalism, and I believe it's still the ideal paradigm in the minds of capitalistas. Of course, none of those would admit such a thing publicly; most of the truly powerful ones shun public scrutiny anyway. Along with buying & selling elected officials like commodities in order to ensure legislation that allows them to maximize profits, they also want the vast majority of people around the world firmly under their oppressive thumb. The miserable conditions under which probably 80% of the world's population live can be traced back to their exploitation at the hands of multinational corporations. For instance, Big Oil likes to tout improvements in the lives of people 'fortunate' enough to have pockets of petroleum under the ground where they live. Most of these people, however, are worse off, as their rulers use the petrobucks to further oppress the people in the name of 'security' for their regimes.

In our own country, capitalistas are answering the call to stop offshoring jobs and create jobs at home. They won't provide jobs that pay a living wage, however; they influence our government to provide jobs for prisoners paid a pittance that approximates what workers make in China or some other totalitarian regime. Also, they goad our elected officials to imprison an increasing number of people for increasing amounts of time in order to ensure an adequate 'pool' for their cheap-labor operations.

Forget the 'company towns' of bygone days; they're far too cushy for the wage slaves and far too expensive to build and maintain for the fat cats to consider. I'm convinced that they're going to do everything within their power to expand the prison-labor model over time. Like I said, outright slavery is still their ultimate goal, but they're taking steps in that direction already.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

12. Nobody is making me poor.

[n2doc]

17. Good for you!

Just don't get sick, don't get old, and don't count on a retirement. Regardless of how much you think it is secure. Your wealth is a "resource" waiting for someone to figure out how to take it away.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

19. There will always be criminals trying to take what doesn't belong to them.

I have a host of medical problems, I doubt I'll live to 70 and I have never counted on retirement. I think that covers your concerns. Thanks.

David

[asdjrocky]

21. Wow, you're a REAL man.

Ayn Rand would be proud.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

24. Thanks.

I didn't know that Rand thought that blue collar workers should marry women with large salaries so they wouldn't have to worry about retirement. Learn something new everyday.

[asdjrocky]

30. Oh come on Dude, this is me you're talking to.

Don't try to bs a bs'er. You come into many, many threads playing the rugged individualist, you know it.

No snark her my friend, you know, just keeping it real.

Nice job, by the way, on the wife, but if she is not part of the 1%, she's not safe from the lions either.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

32. Yeah that's me the rugged individualist who has to take 6 prescriptions everyday.

One completely reconstructed shoulder, a back in desperate need of surgery and dependent on my wife's salary to live in the manner I am accustom. You've got me pegged, I don't need anyone except of course 4 doctors including a psychiatrist and a well off spouse.

[kenfrequed]

131. So basically...

If you didn't have your wife you probably wouldn't have been able to afford your surgery and may have ended up out of work with few prospects and a devaluing house that you owe more and more money on?

So the only thing keeping you from being 'made poor' is your marital life preserver then?

Not much of an argument really.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

142. Sorry to disappoint.

We have lived in that house for many years and bought it when we made far less money, it is plenty big for the 2 of us. My back injury was on the job so if and when I decide to have surgery it shouldn't cost me a thing. My wife's salary allows me not to work a second and third job anymore, it allows us to support a few charities and it allows us to go out to eat a little more often. Before my wife finished her PhD's we lived on far less and still weren't poor.

[kenfrequed]

143. Ah...

So your injury, being on the job, also insulates you from the costs of healthcare?

None of the details you are adding are accointing for people that end up being poor through no fault of their own. And for the record, the average American household does not house holders of advanced post graduate degrees.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

144. I never said that people didn't end up poor through no fault of their own.

I also never said I was insulated or immune to anything. I also realize that I am blessed, lucky, whatever to be in the situation I'm currently in. As I said before I don't see me living past 70 so don't worry I will leave a surplus in whatever social security program is left when I die. Lastly, my on the job injury will prevent me from incurring costs due to that injury. Like everyone else I still have other health care costs.

[Donnachaidh]

23. and when the EMT program in your area is stripped of it's funding

then we'll hear the braying. :eyes:

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

26. Sorry I don't teach EMT classes anymore.

[bvar22]

33. Hey Dave...

Wake UP and take a look around.

Your and your children's money is NOT being returned to your local economy.
It is being diverted to Wall Street Bankers, and NOW Health Insurance Execs, not to mention INCREASING Military spending and expanding useless WARS.
You and your children have some BIG Bills to pay.

WalMart and other Big Boxes are siphoning off money from YOUR local economy and sending it to Corporate HQ.
LESS money circulating in YOUR town makes YOU poorer.

No one lives in on a Libertarian Island.
We are all connected through our local communities.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

35. My children will never have to worry about paying the governments bills.

I don't need to look around at all to know that.

[bvar22]

36. You have some secret way of avoiding taxes?

Are you leaving the country?
Seceding from the Union?
Please let us know.
I would love to be able to absolve MY children from this debt burden.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

49. Last I checked children without opposable thumbs didn't have to pay taxes.

The only children we have are of the four legged variety, Golden Retrievers and Labs.

[bvar22]

50. Well, as long a YOUR ass is covered,

everything is A-OK!

Carry on.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

51. So you want us to have kids to help pay the national debt? That's just silly.

[Greyhound]

55. Yes they are, and that you don't see it makes it far worse. What you receive for your endeavors

is such a small fraction of it's value, yet you are satisfied to accept the bit left for you and are grateful to have even that.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

56. I think I'm paid a very reasonable salary for my efforts.

Of course if you think I should be paid more, hey who am I to complain. Of course what's really sad is that you think money is what determines a man's value.

[Greyhound]

62. No, you are the one confusing value with money, but that's beside the point.

You are satisfied with what you are given in exchange for what you do, fine. I say you sell yourself far too cheaply.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

64. I have an easy job, with a very flexible schedule and I get paid well.

I like the people I work with. I am well respected in the community. I do appreciate your concern though. :toast:

[Marr]

67. For the life of me, I can't figure out what you're trying to say.

You start by suggesting everything's fine, then say you depend on your wife's salary to survive.

Then you say you're not worried about your children paying the government's bills... because you haven't got any children.

The tone seems contrarian, but you haven't got a counter argument.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

70. Did I say I needed my wife's salary to survive? I'll have to go back a look at that.

[Marr]

72. Pardon me-- 'to live in the manner to which you are accustomed'.

As far as this discussion goes, it's just as perplexing.

Your wife's salary is what makes your lifestyle comfortable. Are you suggesting that everything's fine, because 'uncomfortable' people could always just grab a wife with a nice fat salary? Seems an odd solution, even if it did work for you.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

73. I guess I don't understand what you don't understand.

I have a good job and make a very reasonable salary. My wife has a very good job and makes a considerably larger salary. We are able to live quite well on our combined income and still give a significant portion to charity. Our cars are paid for, our boat is nearly paid for (3 or 4 more payments), I have a very good set of golf clubs, and we live in a nice house in a nice neighborhood. While she was in school it was more difficult I had used golf clubs, a used boat and was making car payments but still not poor by any stretch of the imagination. I hope that clears it up for you.

[Marr]

74. I suppose I don't understand why you feel the need to

describe your own living conditions in a discussion like this. I don't see how it's relevant.

Are you trying to say that wealth disparity isn't a big problem, or that people exaggerate the issue, or call themselves poor when they're really just middle class?

[Electric Monk]

83. He's got his, and everyone else should just pull themselves up by their own bootstraps.

Seems pretty clear to me.

Kind of ironic coming from a public servant who married into money, but hey, there it is.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

94. I married a youth athletic coach who made 18 k a year.

Then she went back to school and got 2 PhD's. I worked my ass of getting her through school. I also have no gripe about paying whatever taxes I owe.

[Electric Monk]

147. Wow, I bet she was (and still is) off the charts HAAWWT!1! nt

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

148. Thanks, she is very attractive, physically and mentally.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

93. No, no and no.

[Name removed]

87. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[mdmc]

106. I have lots of wealthy friends

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

117. Must be nice. I don't have a single wealthy friend.

[PaDem]

13. Hey look over there!!

Gays want to get married. And Obama might be a Muslim or something.

[CAG]

14. tssk,tssk, now... you're just playing silly socialist "class warfare" ya know...

Its NEVER class warfare when redistribution goes upward, just downward. :-)

[Triana]

15. dead.

that's how poor.

[Kalun D]

16. They won't stop

Until they are forced to stop.

we have to fight back and win.

[Mind_your_head]

59. +10000

They won't stop, until they are FORCED TO STOP.

They have no conscience. Let me repeat, "They have no conscience" or understanding.

THEY won't stop until they are FORCED to stop.

(which is anathemic to progressive thinkers....therein lives the 'problem'/paradox).

[Kalun D]

63. Sociopaths

Basically they are sociopaths, people who value money more than human life, people who think because they are rich and powerful they are above the law.

[Mind_your_head]

65. These ppl don't even believe in the law. They are uneducated and non-thinkers....but they possess

fiat money.

The book 'Lord of the Flies' addresses the importance of living within the rule of law .... and what WILL happen when you (a society?) doesn't live within the rule of law.

[HughBeaumont]

18. "It's not enough that I succeed, but everyone else must fail."

The motto of the sociopathic wealthy.

If hyper-capitalism is indeed the best system of economics that truly benefits all people, then why is wealth-to-worker inequality so massive? Why has there been zero net job growth in a decade? Why is poverty increasing? Why is there no long-term infrastructure plan? Why is Corporate America apparently dictating all of our vital policies and what will this Administration, which billed itself as that of "Change" and a reversal of the disastrous Bush Administration, do to let working and unemployed Americans know that's not the case?

"The economy is improving . . . for some" isn't an acceptable answer; it's the same one we heard in the last jobless recovery. It needs to improve for ALL.

[marions ghost]

20. Right, that's the modus operandi

Because that's how they made their money --on the failures & oppression of others. When they succeed to an obscenely exploitative degree, their ruthlessness is admired.

The "sociopathic wealthy" learn methods of exploitation early, while the rest of us naively pledge allegiance.

It just comes naturally.

[The Gunslinger]

42. Bingo!!

an easy to become richer is to make others poorer.

[Hannah Bell]

81. it's the *only* way. "rich" always exists in contrast to "poor". no contrast = no "rich".

[asdjrocky]

22. It's not red vs blue.

Dem vs Pug. White vs black, brown, red or any of those made up colors. It's not Christian vs Jew or Muslim or any of those other faiths. It's certainly not straight vs GLBT.

So what is it? Simple, rich vs poor. As it is now, and as it's always been. Welfare for the rich and powerful and nothing for the rest.

Wake up people.

[Egalitariat]

25. How do they "take" anything?

[CAG]

28. By price gouging, by buying off politicians to deregulate, by buying

off politicians to snuff out competition, by controlling the message that says anything the people do to try to place checks and balances on those in power is just socialism and hinders their idea of freedom....

[bvar22]

43. Here is one way:

NOW we have Your Children’s Money too !!!
And there is not a fucking thing you can do about it!
Now THIS is “Bi-Partisanship” !
Better get used to it!!
Hahahahahahahahaha!


There WAS no "Impending Economic Collapse."
We made that up to Scare You into giving us the money!
We didn't use it to "Free Up Credit".
We put it in Our Pockets!!!
Hahahahahahahahaha!

[Lorien]

45. Have you paid any attention at all to current events over the past 30 years?

Try reading "confessions of an economic hit man" for starters.

[SOS]

48. Here's a few

29% usury-rate credit interest.
Pensions looted in fraudulent Wall Street "investment vehicles"
Outsourcing of manufacturing jobs to China to maximize corporate profits.
Deceptive home loans with a two year "reset" leading to seizure of property
Layoffs to cut costs and maximize officer and shareholder profits.
$35 debit card fees levied on the poorest 10%.
Purchase of the US Senate to block real financial reform, insurance reform and tax reform.
Pay day loans at 600%.
Outrageous health care premiums which then deny payment.
$3 trillion in tax payer money handed over to corrupt, insolvent banks.
Corporate off shore tax evasion.
Swiss bank accounts for the wealthy to avoid US taxes.
Pensions voided during mergers and acquisitions.
Fraudulent AAA CDOs sold to honest investors.
Credit default swaps purchased against their own CDOs!
Worst income inequality since the 1920s...

That's a start. There's plenty more where these came from

[blindpig]

140. By owning everything of value

especially those things used to make money, agricultural land, mines, factories, banks, etc.

[rucky]

27. When we're grateful to be working for third world wages. n/t

[havocmom]

75. and when we insist on scrapping environemental and worker protections laws

just so we might get some job to put a piece of bread in our mouths.

Outsourcing isn't just about wages. They want ZERO regulations on their actions and practices.

[Hello_Kitty]

118. Yup.

And DU heroes like Paul Krugman have been advocating this race to the bottom for years.

[Yavin4]

29. If You've Ever Been To A Third World Country

Then you'd know how poor they want us to get. They want children begging in traffic for money. They want families living in shanty housing. IOW, they want us living no better than wild animals while they bask in luxury.

[Lorien]

47. Desperate animals who will do damn near anything for a dime

and what will it take to stop them? Action. But we will NEVER take action and they know that. If we weren't so transfixed by the almighty media we might demand the return of the Fairness Doctrine and election reform. But until some blow dried talking head makes both issues (never) that won't happen.

[SmileyRose]

31. They DON'T want us to be poor

I have no doubt there is a plan to break unions - and unfortunately the citizens of this country general didn't care enough about unions to stop it - HOWEVER.....


The wealthiest people in the world, the one's who have the most access to governments around the world, generally do not care enough about you even give your standard of living a 1st thought, let alone a 2nd one.

[JVS]

34. They can't stop.

[jsmithsen]

37. Heard at a Finance job in NY

From the horses' mouth:

"We aren't validated enough in this society. We are better than everyone else but we only get to have one wife".

I can see where religion might get in the way.

Another quote - this time from an IT senior manager who couldn't program "hello world":

"We businessmen are like DaVinci - crossing the realms of science and art"

[havocmom]

76. Seems very plausible. They seem to insist we be beggars to validate their 'superiority'

They want to rule, not co-exist, on the planet with scum like us. They wear patriotism on their sleeves, but they hate everything America has ever tried to stand for.

Welcome to DU jsmithsen. I am looking forward to reading more of your keen observations. :hi:

[closeupready]

38. They will continue to take as much as they are allowed to, maybe more,

just enough up to below the threshold where people start speaking out.

[Newest Reality]

39. Conversly:

The rich could retort, "Just how rich do the poor have to make us before we stop laughing and become concerned and worried about their rabble rousing and dismay?"

[southernyankeebelle]

40. until all the meat has been eaten off the dead body.

[DavidDvorkin]

44. They won't be satisfied until we have nothing

Because they won't be satisfied until they have everything.

[ThoughtCriminal]

46. If we were slaves

They would complain about how much gruel we eat.

[JackDragna]

52. The ultimate political lesson is this:

Those who covet money and power will attempt to get as much of either as they can, regardless of the consequences to the rest of society. They will parasitize their own governments, economic infrastructures and societies to satiate their needs. They rarely think past tomorrow: the quickest path to wealth is the best, even if it leads to their own self-destruction. This is why regulations and constant vigilance over those who amass power and wealth are necessary, for refusing to do so not only guarantees such people will take advantage of the rest of society, but that their single-minded pursuit of avarice will fracture entire nations.

To answer the OP: The rich will make the rest of us as poor as they possibly can, right up until the point society dies.

[Desertrose]

61. Absolute truth.

Scary but true.

[Marr]

71. I really wonder how much that effect has contributed to the decline of past empires.

It seems that, as wealth and power accumulate into fewer and fewer hands, there is less and less trust in the system, and less acceptance of it as a legitimate force. Most empires seem to simply decline into obscurity, and I wonder if this isn't the usual cause. God knows it wouldn't make it into the history books, if it were so.

[vssmith]

53. We got out of the financial crisis too easily

We really needed a 1929 depression, as awful as that might be, to even things out. Think about it--all the good things that the elite want to take away from us were gained as a result of the depression and FDR. The financial crisis was solved way too quickly and any possibility of regulation was just as quickly swept under the rug.

[harun]

54. Poor enough so that we have to do what they tell us and we stop talking back.

[upi402]

66. The sooner we get enough pain and get off the couch

the sooner we will come back. this drift downward will keep the host alive longer for the parasites though.

[Kablooie]

68. Go watch Slumdog millionaire. That's where we could be headed.

[gtar100]

77. The socio-pathic nature of what these people do is astounding.

Much of this comes as a result of policies and regulations that make these things profitable and acceptable. What "makes good business sense" trumps all other reasoning and the cost to community or one's humanity isn't relevant. Truly sickening.

[pa28]

78. You were right about pensions.

However you forgot there is plenty of equity to be stripped from Social Security and the borrowing power of the federal government as well as the value of personal savings.

We still have some tempting puddles of wealth laying around that can and will be taken.

[Mind_your_head]

146. Yep......they're going to strip us of every dime.....

....and NO ONE will fight back.

The bullies have won.

[pa28]

149. Imagine these things as a bright red cherry hanging in front of the finance industry.

Are they going to say "you know what, I've had enought I'd better not take any more."

No way, they are going pick it an eat it. We've got to resist securitization and privitization.

[OneBlueSky]

82. I'm waiting for Congress to overturn the prohibition against slavery . . .

after all, they own us de facto, so why not de jure as well? . . . they could call us "Boy," we could call them "Massa," and while we couldn't be claimed as deductions, we could certainly be claimed as legitimate business expenses . . . they could deduct our food, our housing, our health care (which, of course, will be minimal -- there will, after all, be a point at which the cost/benefit analysis will demand that they just let us die), our clothing (also minimal), even our vacations (a week off the plantation, perhaps in Newark) . . . works for me . . .

:sarcasm:

[Hubert Flottz]

85. When you bring home a paycheck equal to the ones that the folks

in China bring home, the jobs will start to come back. "Free Trade" = You Work For Nothing...welcome to Poppy's "New World Order"

[stuart68]

89. Unions Leadership is helping

they need new union members somewhere, so there is heavy expansion into India and China - this will ultimately "level" the wage issue for those folks, ie, bring theirs up while lowering ours.

[Hubert Flottz]

104. ?

?

[gleaner]

86. This is at the very heart of every class struggle ...

the world has ever seen. Their motives are driven by greed and indifference and the need to feel superior. The less we have the more important they feel. I don't understand it. I never did. I get the what but the why eludes me. We are trying to push back, but how do you resist people who hold all the power, the armies, the money, the weapons and the means to lie to everyone via their wholly owned media outlets while we have no voice? That is what elections used to be for, but it seems to have fallen down a big hole with everything else we hold dear.

[stuart68]

88. You're talking about Congress, right ?

"They take our Pensions and "invest" them in scams, mine the money out of them and leave us with nothing"

Sounds like Social Security. In fact, the rest of it sounds like Congress as well - at least they are the ones that approved it all.

Oh, right, they are going to "fix it" with HC. That's why they are tacking on the colege loan scam to healthcare. Help me understand this.

[bongbong]

134. What?

Social security has been paying retirees for decades quite successfully. What do you mean when you call it a "scam"?

[Turbineguy]

90. This is just the fall-out from the toxic years

of republican controlled government.

[Lerkfish]

91. look at france right before the revolution

when people were rioting for bread. That's how poor they want us.
Why else develop that microwave "crowd control" device?

[Orsino]

92. To maintain their current spendthrift ways?

They will have to bankrupt us, then come after our blood and organs.

[rosesaylavee]

97. Seeds of the Revolt

Thanks for posting. Pitch-fork ready.

[scentopine]

98. mainstream political parties are converging - its a war on the middle class -nt

[deutsey]

102. Many seem to want to erase all progressive gains made during the 20th century

and return us to what it was like during the Robber Baron era (sans an active labor movement, of course).

Others seem to want to erase any progress made since the Enlightenment and return us to a time like medieval feudalism.

[1776Forever]

103. I think it really hit me listening to Bunning's robot speech - They have no feelings - it's Me Me Me

How can a human being have feelings when they don't even consider themselves part of the human race? Great post! Thank you for putting it into words.

[Name removed]

105. Deleted message

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[mdmc]

107. welcome to DU

[Name removed]

110. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Lerkfish]

112. why don't you provide your own definition and see if anyone agrees with it.

[mdmc]

113. rich to me

can pay for kids, kids education, kids housing, and kid's health and medical treatment without needing public assistance.

Rich people can afford medical treatment, education, housing, and transportation. It is what the middle class used to be. There are rich people all over the world, God bless them..

[HughBeaumont]

122. Money is no object for anything.

"Shaq is rich. The guy that signs Shaq's paycheck is wealthy." - Chris Rock

[Marr]

128. It's not you.

If you cash a paycheck, you are not rich. I don't care if you make $30,000/year or $600,000. The truly wealthy don't work at all. They sit by the pool and wait for daddy's money to reproduce.

[1776Forever]

141. Sure - The rich is anyone in power who controls the quality of life issues of the middle class.

Walmart owners for one is a good start! And then you have all the oversea controllers who have no love at all for America and then of course their are the hedge fund idiots who live in their own little world and are blind to the people around them.

How's that!:hide:

[Wapsie B]

109. As long as they can afford the payments on their mortgage, their bass boat, and flat-screen tv

there will be no revolution. Enough people here can still make ends meet well enough to keep them complacent.

[malaise]

111. It won't be long

People across the globe are waking up.

[Tuesday Afternoon]

114. define: fight.

please clarify, thanks.

[Jakes Progress]

116. Why do you think there is a limit?

I would guess the limit is where nihilism meets anarchy.

[branders seine]

120. they won't stop until they have every last nickel and every last piece of property.

That's what capitalism is.

And even then, they'll just print more money.

[leeroysphitz]

123. We have to give the rich people ALL the money or they wont give the rest of us jobs...

[Inchworm]

130. Until I pay all my debts I guess

That is my problem now. I'm in a self made debtor's prison with no way out.

Maybe we could pass debt to our children then have one extra child so we can lend him/her out to work off the family debt. :sarcasm:

x(

[glitch]

135. So poor that we quit clogging "their" freeways and airports. nt

[Name removed]

136. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[HughBeaumont]

137. The unrepentant and sociopathic wealthy and their paid-for government that aids & abets them.

Oh, and the corporations they run.

Like I said above.

[GreenTea]

138. The rich have no mercy - They want it ALL! They believe & want us to believe it's their right!

They shield themselves purposely from most of the poverty they've created via greedy, selfish arrogance and continue to sustain it the same way, they don't see most of the hardships & pain and they don't care to see it, they just want to ignore, rule & profit from it.

They live luxurious lifestyles among their own, have homes and vacations abroad, they believe they are the chosen ones, it's their right, they are different & special simply because they own things.

All the rich can think about is getting more, and more and more...which always comes at the expense of poor people the workers, who are only seen as peasants, peons, slaves by the rich for exploitation for the rich.

less than one percent of the rich own up to 95% of the land in many of these regressive, right-wing U.S. corporation backed dictator nations....it's own citizens have little or nothing, medical is almost and sometimes is non existent in many places, hunger is prevalent and most work for slave wages for the rich owners (corporations)and have no other choice or options in life.

If allowed it would be this way here and all over the world....that's why there has to be some regulations, laws the rich can't hide behind their loopholes...because they have proved through history they will and don't give a shit about the less fortunate...only caring to have and show the other rich that they have more and are more "successful" than they are.

The rich truly want it all and elitist republican ideology believes the rich and the corporations should have it, attain it, take it and that it's their god given right...fuck the workers, they should be at the rich and their corporations mercy to do with them as they please.

[Fire_Medic_Dave]

150. You're right the 237 millionaires in Congress and 40 millionaires in the Senate have no mercy.

Don't forget about the President, his family income was 4.2 million in 2007. Only 2 of the 10 richest Senators are republicans. Maybe we shouldn't generalize.

[Arugula Latte]

139. Pretty damn poor. Extremely damn poor.

As long as the electricity works to keep the gates shut on their communities, they won't give a shit if we're in the streets eating rats.