I am hearing some conservatives say that if HCR passes..

[Roon]

it will guarantee them a win in november and they will void HCR.

Is this possible?

[ananda]

1. Yes.

That's what you get when you pass a bad bill.

[tabasco]

10. I bet you agreed with them

when they said Clinton's first budget would "destroy the economy."

[WeekendWarrior]

17. And if this were a bad bill

you might be right. But this is merely a mediocre bill and better than nothing.

[Bicoastal]

18. How petulant. You are waiting for schadenfreude...

...which may never come.

The only way the Dems are 100% assured of defeat in November is if they DON'T pass this bill.

[shraby]

2. I have a bridge in Brooklyn..want to buy it?

[Roon]

9. Book marked for november and beyond

[Bicoastal]

15. Uh-HUH. So was this a legitmate question...

...or the equivalent of one of those infamous "SOME SAY Obama is a Marxist" reports on Fox News?

[Joanne98]

3. I hope they run on repealing it. It will backfire big time.

[proud patriot]

4. I think the republicant party is on the wrong side of history

:patriot:

[ThomThom]

29. again

always

[DFLforever]

5. They'd need a 2/3's vote to overcome the Pres's veto

Good luck with that.

[The Magistrate]

6. It Is Possible, Sir, You Will One Day See A Puppy Float Up Off The Floor Like A Soap Bubble

But it is not too likely, and this far right line is an exercise in whistling past the graveyard that has a similar order of probability.

[berni_mccoy]

13. lolol! Thanks for the laugh sir!

[MineralMan]

7. Whistling Dixie past the graveyard, to mix a metaphor.

And my wife tells me I mix a killer metaphor. Cocktails at 5.

[Davis_X_Machina]

14. You're just beating...

..a dead horse of a different color in midstream, admit it.

[MineralMan]

24. For want of a horse, I lost my wallet.

[Alias Dictus Tyrant]

8. They could win in November, but Obama still has to sign it. n/t

[Warpy]

11. HCR will be the same third rail that Social Security is

Yes, they'll want to get rid of both of them, but every time they try, they find out it's a very, very bad idea.

The only way they could do it is if they assassinate everybody down to a Republican Speaker of the House.

I wouldn't put it past this bunch of crazies, either.

However, I think if HCR passes and people find out what they're getting within the next six months, they won't have a chance. People will remember how hard the GOP fought against any reform, at all.

The tactical blunder the Democrats made in this one was not passing reform measures, it was not including a drop in Medicare eligibility age, at the very least.

Will that be enough to sink them? I don't think so.

[pretzel4gore]

12. if they conservative, the repukkes never get any power

just an observation (Orwell warned us the nazipoohs would use language to turn evil into good etc)
and screw obama and his rip off antics- if he was real, why even fight a loser battle (the pig is rich and owns the pigmedia, and the insurance system, Barack, so why attack a fortress with turkey bone slingshots!)

[BlueIdaho]

16. They will need a President's signature.

Its not going to happen - but it does prove they are scared shitless about the whipping they are going to take when people realize HCR is the real deal.

[alp227]

19. The facts support health care reform, see Cong. Budget Office reports

CBO says that HCR will reduce the deficit over the next several years. As long as Democrats keep running on fact-based campaigns, all that Republicans will have are personal attacks and spin.

[sabrina 1]

20. It makes it very possible. The only thing that might save

Democrats from public outrage over this horrendous bill is the fact that they made sure most of it would not go into effect until after the next two election cycles.

And of course, the rewards Democrats who killed all hope of a Public Option will get from Big Insurance. Democrats have proven to be the best friends of Big Business. They beat the Republicans at transferring public funds into private business. The Medicaid fund, now funneled into private insurance corps. Wall St. bailouts.

Big Business is going to want Dems to stay in power, until they get their hands on the Social Security Fund. They have been very effective with the Health Insurance Business. Bush tried and failed with SS. Obama is far smarter than Bush. Too bad he wasn't working for the American people.

[blogslut]

21. Anything's possible

The party in power tends to lose seats in off-year elections.

However, the repubs have given this country a solid two years of pettiness, obstructionism and manufactured fear - actions that don't sit well with the American people, who have been living a legitimate economic crisis. To steal a line: We've been drowning and the right wing has done nothing but describe the water. By comparison, our Democrats are the party that has actually done something to steady the waters and keep people afloat.

[livetohike]

22. They are dreaming about winning in November

and they have miscalculated. They won't win the House, nor the Senate, imo. How will they possibly get Dems to come to their side if they try to repeal something? They aren't going to make the bill better.

[Nicholas D Wolfwood]

23. Then why are they fighting so hard against it?

If they really believe that, let it happen and win in November. Think about it.

[Bicoastal]

25. +100!

The OP is their new spin, because they know they can't stop it.

[Roon]

27. Great point!

I am going to start using that, if you don't mind. Thanks!

[Cirque du So-What]

28. Oh, that's easily explained

The repukes are masters of six-dimensional chess. It's an incredibly complex Jedi mindfuck trick, made all the more inscrutable when the many, MANY millions spent by the insurance companies on astroturf campaigns are taken into consideration. Those who vote for the bill are falling into their clever trap.

:crazy:

[conscious evolution]

34. Misdirection

Its the bad cops duty to act like an asshole to wear you down and trick you into giving your confession to the good cop.

[kenny blankenship]

26. I don't know - but don't you think that a bill whose "benefits" kick in so late

opens you up to that sort of possibility, particularly if you have to pass it by let's just say extraordinary procedures?
Republicans will have a LONG TIME to say whatever they want to - whatever they think is most damaging and de-legitimizing- about the mandatory insurance bill. And if the bill has positive benefits for the overall shape of healthcare, they will be a long time in materializing by comparison to the attacks.

That is why, many months ago, I warned that if Democrats are going to do something on health care and especially if we are going to end up pushing it through by "extraordinary procedural measures", the legislation had better:
Benefit the vast majority of voters - MUST GO LARGE.
Benefit them in a way they can immediately grasp before passage.
Start delivering those benefits really fucking soon after passage.

Because you're going to get your faces ripped off by Republicans claiming ANYTHING you do is Marxist-Leninism run amok. And they're going to point to any dodgy procedure you used in passing it as confirmation that you're in fact pushing a radical leftwing godless communist fascist takeover of America and putting fluoride in the children's ice cream.

[Name removed]

30. Deleted message

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[Name removed]

36. Deleted message

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[JustinL]

31. it's mathematically impossible

If the Republicans win every single Senate election, they will still only have 59 seats, i.e., not enough to override the President's veto.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Senate_elections,_2010

[Roon]

33. Thanks Justin

I knew there was a simple answer. This is not the type of question that you can google so I posted it. Thanks again!

[Motown_Johnny]

32. they need 60 votes in the Senate to void this bill. Do you think this is possible?

I don't

[elehhhhna]

35. if by "void" they mean "cr@p all over it"', they've been at it for years...

Yeah. Kill HC reform. That's a winner.