When average families realize that their lives are easier because of HCR, what then?

[Stuart G]

Will the senior who no longer has to fill a "donut hole" for medicines be mad? (and get to keep that money for living expenses)
Will the family that doesn't have to worry about their 24 year old children getting sick be mad?
Will the family that gets insurance when they couldn't get it before be mad?
Will the family that goes to a community health center set up by Senator Sander's provisions be mad?..and as a result some disease is caught in time that would not have been caught before. Will that family be mad..

Just perhaps, those people will be thankful for this legislation. There will millions of those people. These people just might be thankful.

When average people find out this will help them, and if they are thankful, it could result in a change the political landscape.
It could.

[ixion]

1. LOL

:rofl:

[shockra]

14. +1

I don't know what planet these people are living on.

[Christa]

2. The party of "NO" could become the party of NON EXISTENT.

[Stuart G]

4. Say, just 10 percent of people who are helped change their political party to the Dems.

Just one in 10 realize this is a good bill that helps them. Then what ? Some republicans are actually helped by this bill.
And those people realize that their party lied to them? What then. That gut feeling of betrayal could be a very powerful force in politics.

[LiberalLoner]

3. I agree. There will still be about 20 to 25% of people who are so locked into

Faux News that they will never acknowledge even to themselves that the D's can do something good for the country. There is a good book I'm reading now about that effect, where people invest emotional energy in a position and then never abandon it, called "Mistakes Were Made"

There will be some people who never see reality or admit it even to themselves. That's one of the bad things about propoganda, is it cultivates a population like that.

[RKP5637]

9. And some of them will be deluded and delusional enough to believe the R's did it for them if

someone on Fox News or RW radio tells them so. We have an element in this country that is ever so hardline, gullible and ignorant.

[Stuart G]

13. I talked to one that told me that Republicans were strongly in favor of Medicare..

She couldn't beleive they were against it, since she is on Medicare. She just didn't believe it when I told her I remember her party was strongly against it.

[anAustralianobserver]

27. Reagan's "There you go again" was a reply to Carter's rebuke of Reagan

for Reagan's career-launching campaign against Medicare:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=px7aRIhUkHY&feature=related

I don't know what the 'better plan' that Reagan supported was but it must've been better because Reagan was so charmingly grandfatherly and the spirals rotating in his eyes are so soothing.

(To be fair to Reagan in that clip; he is obviously connecting better with the audience than Carter. Carter looks a bit glazed-eyed talking to the camera, while Reagan's eyes dynamically connect with the people in the studio, even as he is aware of the TV audience.)

[fasttense]

5. Like Tea-baggers are thankful that President Obama doesn't declare them enemy combatants,

and lock them all up; Or as a minimum put them in free speech zones like was done to us under the bushes.

[Liberal In Texas]

6. It's kind of like the people that don't know that they got a tax cut this year from the Dems.

The propaganda out there is powerful and widespread.

[0rganism]

8. I've seen lots of whining about tax increases

Either they're all in the top 2%, or they don't know they got a break compared to last year. Liars and fools.

[RKP5637]

12. Exactly, the liars and fools in this country are well paired into the R party. n/t

[Stuart G]

7. Politics is very strange..

There could be a significant change when average families see positive changes. Who knows?

The Repuks are betting everything that anger and hate will work, but they could be wrong.
Going to a free health clinic, or getting insurance when you couldn't get it before may be more important than Rush's rants.
Especially if that visit to a clinic saves a family member...like your child's life.

[mwb970]

10. This is why it was so crucial for the republicans to defeat the bill.

If the bill had been defeated, they could have continued to flog it, with apocalyptic lies about what "would have happened" if this "government takeover" had passed.

Ruh-roh.

Now it has passed, and as you say it is just a matter of time before people start noticing:

- their taxes went down, not up
- their coverage was improved, including for their children
- insurance corporation abuses have stopped
- Granny is not dead
- there is no sign of a "government takeover"
- freedom did not die
- there were no "death panels"

The whole structure of republican lies will come crashing down as people gradually realize that, just as with Social Security and Medicare, every single fear-mongering statement made by republicans turns out to be false, I mean really false, like WMD-level false.

This is why talk of a republican sweep in November is wrong, I mean really wrong, like Kristol-level wrong.

Pass the popcorn.

:popcorn:

[RKP5637]

16. But never underestimate the stupidity and ignorance of not a small number of American voters

when they vote. I am always amazed at those that vote in those most disingenuous to their concerns and needs, and how easily they are duped.

[Trekologer]

21. But can we defeat their echo chamber?

The GOOP has for years parroted the poler opposite of reality and people have believed them. They run against abortion but for 6 years had the White House, both houses of Congress, and the Supreme Court and did absolutely nothing to even try to outlaw abortion. But they still run on it and no one calls them out on it. They're going to try to convince people that their taxes went up and/or will go up even when reality is completely different. They're going to try to convince people that President Obama is coming for their guns. Every fear-mongering statement has been false and so far it hasn't come down on them. Instead their followers eat it up.

[RKP5637]

25. Often, as you say, "their followers eat it up." More and more I believe it is

simply a permanent mind set that devours and feeds off misinformation... they want to believe what they want to believe, even in the face of strong reality to the contrary, they will still believe the misinformation. It is hard wired into their brains and it's their essence of being. And that is sad.

And hence the Texas textbook opportunists to pre-program our youth into RW thinking if they can across the nation.

[WeekendWarrior]

11. As I said in another thread

I was on a different forum that covers a variety of topics (rarely politics), and when the reform package benefits were laid out according to what kicks in when -- one of the people who commented said something along the lines of "What have my friends been bitching about? I'm a Republican and this looks pretty damn good to me!"

Most people have no idea what's in this bill and how much it will benefit millions of Americans -- DESPITE its limitations. All but the most idealistic true believers -- who are incapable of seeing the Big Picture and put their ideology above the welfare of everyone else -- will embrace this bill.

[Stuart G]

15. Of course you are correct..."when the reform package benefits were laid out"...

most people will see this as a very strong plus.
.The truth is that this isn't so radical, or socialistic..(whatever that is), or government take over. it is an improvement

Some Republicans will be mad at being lied to. Although a small percentage, these people could really change the political landscape in our favor.

[old mark]

17. This is why the GOPers are desparate to sink the insurance regulation bill.

THEY KNOW IT WILL HELP PEOPLE, many people in one of their "target" 'bagger groups - the older people having trouble paying for meds, etc. This is why the GOP has used such preposterpous lies about the bill - if their people understood what it was really about - regulating the health insurance business practices- they would have to vote for it and go against their opposition to everything Obama.

When people find out they will benefit from this bill - and they will, this year- the GOP will be in deep shit of their own making.

November is not looking so good now, is it GOP?
I predected they would lose big in November, and I still believe that...we will gain in both houses.


mark

[Stuart G]

20. I agree...sooner or later, many people will find out the lies about this bill.

It will be simple truths, like not paying for that donut hole, or easier to get insurance. or getting a subsidy (when they figure that they can get it) for health insurance. It may take some time. But benefits will come out..for average people.

[old mark]

22. ...and that means real trouble for the GOP. I think the very moderate

aspect of this bill that we were all complaining about might well be its best feature - even republican people will find little to object to in the reality of it, and we will be able to make it more progressive over time, as was dome with Medicare, etc.
That Obama is pretty slick after all, huh?

mark

[eridani]

18. Will the vast majority of "other," who will not see anything happen until 2014 not notice?

And what happens when premiums and copays continue to double and triple?

[A wise Man]

19. When 100 teapartiers Mother or Grandmother's

lives get saved because they didn't have health insurance and now they have it. Yes they will be mad...because they are insane.

[Tailormyst]

23. Election time will show what people think about the changes

If it's good the Dems stay in power, if not everything will end up back in the hands of the repukes. Now if nothing is done RE: election reform, between now and then, the people will be persuaded to vote however the big corporations want them too.

[RKP5637]

26. So true, "people will be persuaded to vote however the big corporations want them too. " And if

unchecked, political parties will be obsolete, we will be deciding which corporation to vote for...

[customerserviceguy]

24. By the time at least some of those things come to pass

there will have been two elections. Whatever of those things might happen, it will be too little, too late. And the people for which they happen have already been voting Democratic. It will have very little effect on the people who are upset about this legislation now.

[ScreamingMeemie]

28. ...and some of us will be dead, because we couldn't afford the "high risk pool"

Dem and Repub alike. :hi: