POLL: Elderly HCR haters on Medicare claim to not be on Medicare

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

Okay... in this Gallup poll (below) people with medicare coverage are split on the HCR bill: 45% say it's a good thing it passed, 47% say a bad thing.

But people aged 65 and up years old are strongly opposed. 36% good thing, 54% bad thing.

Are those numbers possible? Even if 100% of non-medicare seniors think HCR is a bad thing I doubt that discrepancy could exist.

What percentage of 65+ have medicare coverage? It's a big number, right?

Maybe a lot of folks don't know they are on medicare. (People with AARP medicare-supplemental insurance might think all of their coverage comes from AARP, and so on.)

But even if that is the case, one way or another the ignorant respondents are specifically, disproportionately and overwhelmingly opposed to HCR.

We already know the polling number for people who know they are on medicare: 45-47. And we know that 90%+ of seniors are on medicare, whether they know it or not. So there's no way around it... most hostility to HCR among 65+ in this poll comes from people on medicare who are ignorant of the fact. Even if we assume the genuinely non-medicare 65+ group is super hostile to HCR I don't think the numbers work.

Another possibility: a lot of people 65+ who happen to oppose HCR are lying to Gallup, not wanting to admit their participation in socialism.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/126959/Majority-Poor-Young-Uninsured-Back-Healthcare-Bill.aspx

[Hello_Kitty]

1. I'm not sure how many, but some older people are on Tricare or union plans. eom

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

5. Agreed, but even that raises questions

Given the size of the swing, if everyone reported accurately what health coverage they have or do not have then there is a HUGE HCR approval difference between 65+ on medicare versus 65+ on some other plan.

It's a puzzling poll result...

[Bitwit1234]

9. When I retired from the state I first had to take medicare

and was then signed up for the supplemental insurance coverage. I think most places do it that way. Medicare in conjunction with other insurance. I don't understand why some seniors reject Medicare unless they don't want to pay for it, but that's ridiculous. AND most regular insurance companies when you retire won't cover you unless you pick up Medicare first.

[LiberalFighter]

14. The older they get the less they begin to understand.

Especially if they don't keep their brain active.

[emilyg]

21. I'm 72 and most

likely understand more than you do.

[LiberalFighter]

13. According to the website for TriCare

It becomes a secondary payer after one becomes Medicare eligible.

Not knowing about other union plans but my plan before it was transferred from the employer and after the transfer also became a secondary payer when one became Medicare eligible.

I would think that all employer provided, government provided, union provided insurance plan would convert from primary to secondary once one became Medicare eligible.

[Hello_Kitty]

18. True, but your typical military retiree will say they're on Tricare. eom

[emulatorloo]

2. Well remember that Republicans have told them they they are going to face DEATH PANEL

and if Obama doesn't have them killed, then their medicare benefits will be taken away.

Pretty classy, scaring the elderly like that.

[The Magistrate]

3. A Number Of These People, Sir, Have Probably Accepted A Republican Lie

Namely that the reduction in subsidies to private insurers for theri 'Medicare Advantage' shell game contained in the bill is really a cut in their Medicare benefits. It is, of course, no such thing, but the lie has been out and about for some time.

[customerserviceguy]

11. I'd like to know where you think

the money that will not be paid to Medicare (and the cuts are not ALL Medicare Advantage) is going to come from. Surely you don't believe that 100% of the money paid to MA went completely into the pockets of the CEO's of the health insurance companies, with zero of it going to doctors and hospitals.

[Juche]

4. Weird

There are roughly 40 million people 65 and older and medicare covers 45 million people. So you'd assume it is 90%-ish coverage with the rest being people on dialysis and other conditions.

http://www.aoa.gov/agingstatsdotnet/Main_Site/Data/2008_Documents/Population.aspx

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medicare_%28United_States%29

No idea how it works.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

7. That sounds about right. I think 12-15% of medicare folks are under 65

[jwirr]

6. One of the problems with knowing if you are on medicare or not is

that many on medicare were put on an insurance company to cover medicare part D. Then that company talked them into medicare advantage programs and they no longer deal with Medicare directly. This allows them to think they are no longer on Medicare. What they do not know is that the advantage program is paid for directly out of Medicare funds.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

8. Correct. That is part of my assumption as well.

But the fact remains that people on medicare who don't know they are on medicare are overwhelmingly against HCR while those who know are split evenly.

The ignorance itself is not surprising but the implied uniformity of opinion specifically among the ignorant is striking.

One would not assume that mega-strength of correlation. Or at least I wouldn't have.

[Name removed]

10. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[customerserviceguy]

12. I see I'm among the first to denounce you

but if you had used gender, race, or possibly religion as your example, I would have my response to you at the end of a long line by this point.

[SolidGold]

15. Denounce but first use a dictionary to read what ignorance means.

You can denounce everything you want but the truth is that old people are easily scared and they are ignorant, as in the real definition of ignorance - not the american slang term.

Main Entry: ig·no·rance
Pronunciation: \ˈig-n(ə-)rən(t)s\
Function: noun
Date: 13th century

: the state or fact of being ignorant : lack of knowledge, education, or awareness

The fact remains, old people aren't aware, aren't knowledgeable about the new emerging world and for the most part, they aren't interested in increasing any of these traits to become more educated. This is the majority of old people and unless I live in some microcosm of only old ignorant people then I'm fairly positive my opinion stands firm. There are exceptions to the rule and that's why I stated most old people.

If they weren't ignorant, elderly people would be in support of making sure the younger generations get the healthcare they require just like the elderly do.

[customerserviceguy]

16. Why don't you look up "ageism"

Or just simply the word "bigot"?

[LiberalFighter]

17. Your assumption is wrong.

There are more white idiots than black idiots.
There are more stupid jackass whites than stupid jackass blacks.

But only because the percentage of those groups will be consistent regardless of race. And because the percentage will be consistent there will be more whites for most categories.

[Hello_Kitty]

19. A lot of people are on Medicare but it's called something else so they don't realize it.

All the Medicare Advantage plans are called something else, like "Secure Horizons" or something like that. Or they're just the HMO name, like Cigna. I used to sell long term care insurance and a lot of my potential clients had no idea what their plan was or what it covered. The vast majority of people think Medicare covers nursing care when it doesn't cover most forms.

[Kurt_and_Hunter]

20. My best theory of this:

After looking at this for a while I will offer a theory...

People with supplemental insurance are less likely to grasp that Medicare is actually their first payer.

People with medicare supplemental insurance are likely to have higher incomes.

So the thing becomes a round-about income marker.

That's my best guess.

But either way the fact remains that, for seniors, not knowing (for whatever reason) what the F' kind of health insurance you have is incredibly correlative with opposition to HCR.