I just received my fourth mailing from the US Census Bureau.

[virgogal]

1. A letter to tell me the Census form was coming.

2. The Census form itself.

3. A postcard reminding me to mail it back.

4. A letter today telling me that I am one of the people that has been chosen for the American Community Survey,which will be sent in a few days, thus creating mailing #5.

Our tax dollars at work. What a damned waste.

[frazzled]

1. Did you mail it back?

We got the notice saying it was coming (necessary, I believe--just as credit card companies warn you a new card is coming). Then the Census, which we filled out in about 4 minutes and took to the post office within a day or two. And we haven't gotten anything else yet.

Who knows, maybe we'll get the "Community Survey"--but I don't think this is a waste. It's important data being collected.

[virgogal]

8. I will fill it in and mail it back tomorrow. April 1,2010 is the date

for which they want the data,and April 1 is when I will answer.

Virgos tend to be very literal.

[whistler162]

22. Missed it by that much.... tommorow is the 31st.

[virgogal]

63. Oops !

[Redbear]

2. Actually, I think they have found those "wasted" mail pieces make a big difference

in response rates.

[demmiblue]

15. I agree.

I remember seeing/reading about someone from the Census Bureau making that same point when asked about the apparent waste. The additional mailings actually proved to be very cost effective as compared to the cost of sending out people to obtain census information.

[babylonsister]

36. Yep. The Census guy was on Jon Stewart and said just that, that the

price of postage has proven to be worth it because more people respond. Census takers won't have to go door-to-door for those people, which costs a lot of money and might require 2 or more trips to catch folks at home.

[Gormy Cuss]

58. They do. An advance letter is good for an immediate bump up in response by 5-15%

depending on the survey, and a follow up letter is usually good for another 10%, with subsequent follow ups add a few percentage points for each mailing. Sending letters or postcards is inexpensive relative to the cost of following up non respondents by telephone or in person. Since the decennial census aims for as close to 100% response as practical, every return submitted by mail is one less household that will need to be contacted by more expensive means.

The advance letter, census form, and reminder notice were sent in quick succession again because this is a proven strategy to increase response rates. Most people who do respond to mail surveys do so quickly after receiving the form or a notice -- that's why three notices in three weeks was used here.

As others have noted, the Commerce secretary was on Jon Stewart's show and explained that Census estimates it saves eighty-five million dollars for each addition percentage point of response by mail. That's huge.

[CreekDog]

3. The Census sent you a letter saying you were "unfortunate"?

okay, i'll just assume the rest of your message is as reliable and accurate as that statement.

:hi:

[virgogal]

5. Edited----that was kind of silly,wasn't it?

[CreekDog]

10. How do you propose getting people to mail these forms back?

Are you proposing that people not be mailed reminders?

Are you proposing that if you get the American Community Survey that it be in the same envelope as the standard Census form?
by the way, how would that work? would they order some materials from the printer to look the same on the outside, but have different materials inside?

[virgogal]

20. Certainly both could have been mailed in the same envelope,why not?

[CreekDog]

25. okay let's say they could have

but that only deals with one mailing you're objecting to.

no postcards either, right?

[virgogal]

27. Many census workers were hired to follow up on unreturned forms.

I'd rather see the money go to them than on ridiculous mailings.

[CreekDog]

40. i thought you didn't like waste? how many extra gallons of fuel would that consume?

you aren't as literal as you claim to be.

[virgogal]

43. A paycheck is a paycheck.

[CreekDog]

45. you said you didn't like waste --maybe you should edit your OP again

since waste is okay now.

just own what you say or don't say it.

[LibDemAlways]

4. Have you ever seen the American Community Survey? Those

who work for the Census will defend it to the death. I found it very intrusive. The response rate isn't great, and some of those who don't fill it out are selected for harrassment by the census bureau with repeated follow up calls and knocks on the door. Just a fair warning.

[virgogal]

29. Yes,I did one years ago. I never won the office pool but seem to be very

lucky when they are choosing survey participants.

[dixiegrrrrl]

52. Whoa...there is another survey that some people get?

Here the Census Bureau is saying the Census is "just" 10 questions,
now I am hearing they send another "intrusive" survey to some folks???

[LibDemAlways]

69. Here's a link. They send this thing out to

around 200,000 households several times a year. Sooner or later you'll be the recipient. Mine ended up in the circular file, and I was one of the fortunate ones who was not chosen for follow up harrassment.

http://usa.ipums.org/usa/voliii/formACS2005_2006.pdf

[Ian David]

6. Did you get any of the plastic travel mugs?

In fairness though, I read somewhere that it costs thousands of dollars per visit if they have to go to your house to administer the census in person.

After you calculate all the overhead and such involved in coordinating all those home visits.

So, spending a couple hundred dollars per person on mailings would be a savings.

[baldguy]

7. Sending a letter costs 44 cents. Sending a Census worker costs $55.

Considering that the Census is Constitutionally mandated, sending out mail is 125 times more efficient.

[CreekDog]

13. the mail carrier is already coming by anyway

a census worker would need to drive their specifically and use the resources necessary to make the trip.

but mail is the waste problem here.

[virgogal]

32. Ah,but that $55.00 goes towards a paycheck for someone.

[DCBob]

9. Incredible waste of money..

IMO.

[anigbrowl]

12. Compared to what?

You do know the constitution requires a census be carried out every 10 years, and has done ever since the Republic was founded?

[DCBob]

16. Compared to common sense..

These repetitive mailings dont change many minds about responding. Either you will or you wont.

[alcibiades_mystery]

18. How do you know?

Have you seen studies on this? Or are you just speaking from some vague personal experience?

[DCBob]

21. Vague personal experience.

How about you?

[alcibiades_mystery]

24. I'm not making a claim one way or another

Maybe it is remarkably effective, and that's been proved by marketing and other studies over 20 years. Or maybe it is totally ineffective. I don't know.

And neither do you.

And neither does "common sense."

[DCBob]

33. Here are some hard numbers on how effective this system is working in Texas....

King County (92.% for McCain) – 14% return rate, down from 48% in 2000.
Roberts County (92.1% for McCain) – 22% return rate, down from 68% in 2000.
Ochiltree County (91.7% for McCain) – 39% return rate, down from 71% in 2000.
Glasscock County (90.1% for McCain) – 30% return rate, down from 49% in 2000.
Oldham County (88.4% for McCain) – 26% return rate, down from 72% in 2000.

You could send these idiots a thousand mailings and they still wont participate.

[scarletwoman]

66. That's not exactly a negative. Congressional representation is based on census data.

If the wingnuts don't want to be counted, they just might lose a Congressional district. Their district will be folded into another district and there will be one less seat in the House of Representatives for their state.

Think about it. If Democratic voters conscientiously turn in their census forms, their Congressional district will survive. If wingnuts refuse to cooperate, their Congressional district might disappear.

[DCBob]

67. The census should not in the business of undercounting Republicans.

If a certain sector of America is not being counted correctly, for whatever reason, then that is a Census system problem.

[scarletwoman]

68. No, it's the problem of those who choose not to be counted.

I live in a rural area with lots of hidden away properties, and was an enumerator in the 2000 census. My job was to drive around on miles and miles of dirt backroads and do my best to cajole those who hadn't returned their census forms to do so when I came to their door.

Some people simply refused to answer the door when I arrived on their property -- you are required to have a placard displayed in your car windshield that identifies you as a census worker. There were others who met me with shotguns, or with agressive dogs. If they were that dead set against participating there wasn't anything I could do about it. Their choice, not mine.

sw

[crispini]

34. You are quite correct, sir. It is effective, and it has been proven.

I'm sorry I don't have any links handy (they're on the work computer) but when trying to get surveys returned, you 1) tell them that it's coming and 2) remind them at least twice. This has been proven by people who study such things -- and people DO study such things -- it's called "market research" and there's beaucoup money in it. :D

[Gormy Cuss]

59. Actually, they do.

Anyone who has done survey research (like me) can attest to that.
The repetitive mailings won't get everyone to reply but it will encourage those who intend to return the form to do so.

[babylonsister]

37. Nope. See post #36. nt

[DCBob]

44. This reminds me of email spam "justification"...

If you send a million spam emails and you get 1% response then its successful.

[Ineeda]

11. ah, but...

responding by mail, even factoring in multiple mailings, saves hundreds of thousands of those tax dollars, compared to house-to-house efforts. Don't drink the Bachmann Kool-Aid.

[blogslut]

14. I don't think it is a waste

I worked with the general public for a long time. On the whole, we humans are a forgetful bunch. An accurate accounting of our population is vitally important. If a few extra bits of mail helps ensure more citizens participate then I'm all for it.

[Xithras]

17. The Census costs need to be investigated.

A friend sent me some numbers a few days ago:

Year Census Cost Per Person Total Census Cost
1960 71 cents $127.9 million
1970 $1.22 $247.6 million
1980 $4.76 $1.07 billion
1990 $10 $2.5 billion
2000 $16 $4.5 billion

2010 $46.93 $14.5 billion

The numbers have been climbing steadily with inflation over time, but why the MASSIVE jump from $16 per person in 2000 to nearly $47 per person ten years later? Inflation doesn't even come close to explaining the jump. Where is that money going?

[izzybeans]

26. Here is the GAO report

http://www.gao.gov/new.items/d06822t.pdf

The people complaining about receiving mail are complaining about one of the cost-cutting initiatives that were put in place.

[Xithras]

41. Thanks, I think I found the answer...

The Bureau is relying extensively on contractors to supply mission-critical functions and technologies for the 2010 Census

I should have known...

[izzybeans]

47. Couple that with population growth and

an extremely mobile population and you probably account for more than 3/4 of that increase in per household costs.

It's always cheaper to do it in-house in my opinion. Contracting in both public and private sectors is a huge waste. Usually a means of giving money to friends, who may or may not be good at what they are contracted for.

[crazylikafox]

60. +1

[dixiegrrrrl]

55. There is that "mission critical" phrase again.

Have you noticed how much that is used in the last few years, particularly striking for things that would not usually warrant the term " mission".

[anigbrowl]

48. Here's where the money is going

http://www.census.gov/

Go have a look around the site, and consider that it's only quite recently that this vast trove of data has been accessible to the general public. I consider it massively useful. I particularly like this subsection, where you can find all sorts of useful economic data: http://factfinder.census.gov/servlet/DatasetMainPageServlet?_program=ECN&_tabId=ECN1&_submenuId=datasets_4&_lang=en

This information has much greater value now that it's been placed on the internet rather than inaccessible to the public. Cheap at the price if you ask me. It would cost you a fortune to gather this sort of stuff if you had to do it yourself or mail in FOIA requests and then conduct all the statistical analysis.

[dalaigh lllama]

That IS a steep jump

Don't know why it's so much higher, or how they arrived at the 2010 figure before it's done, but also remember there's about 30 million more people to count, plus all the foreign folk who aren't citizens.

[izzybeans]

19. You may want to enlighten yourself on the survey process.

The response rate goes up with each mailing. And it will not be perfect after the last. Better to send the mail than send too many Census workers out on the streets. For your benefit, btw.

Oh and fill out that long form. Us researchers need your responses to help write grants and justify funding for our programs and services. Thanks for doing your civic duty.

[GreenTea]

23. Mail the fucking thing - that's all they are asking!

[SPedigrees]

28. The reason they haven't received ours yet is question #2 on page 1.

They are asking about additional persons residing at our home on 1 April 2010. Two days from now we'll check the last box and mail the damned thing back. Geeze, census takers, if you ask questions about the future, be prepared to wait until that future date to get an answer!

[CreekDog]

42. Should they have put March 25 on your form?

I wonder why they didn't?

[SPedigrees]

56. 1 March 2010 would have worked. We've had the form for a few weeks now I think. nt

[anigbrowl]

49. Why, do you expect someone to move in between now and then?

I mailed mine back already. I guess that's bad in the event someone dies or we get a new resident, but I don't see either of those things happening in the next 48 hours.

[SPedigrees]

57. That's your privilege, but I dot all the i's and cross all the t's

or I don't bother.

[virgogal]

35. I'll mail it back tomorrow. See my post #8.

[CreekDog]

51. I know you are literal and all, but the OP you said it was a waste of tax dollars

and then to me you said you preferred sending census reps out to count, which would actually cost more tax dollars for something that could cost less.

we all say things without thinking at times.

i think this time is one where you didn't think this through and you're trying to defend taking contradictory positions.

[Oregone]

30. "Our tax dollars at work. What a damned waste."

The census dude explained on Jon Stewart that the rate of return which is increased by the mailings is totally worth it. It costs billions to send people out to each lazy home to get it done.

[Texasgal]

31. I haven't even received one yet.

:shrug:

[Brickbat]

38. In the grand scheme of the federal budget, I think it's money well spent.

[PA Democrat]

39. It costs $60 per household if a census worker has to be sent out to collect data.

So, if you get only a small incremental percentage of people to return their forms by mail with each mailing, it's still cheaper than collecting the info in person. It also does not help that people like Glenn Beck and Michelle Bachmann have planted crazy census conspiracy theories in the minds of the gullible public.

<snip>

He said the bureau is hoping to match or improve upon its 2000 performance of seeing 72 percent of America return its census forms by mail, because that saves so much money compared to sending a census-taker out to homes that failed to respond.

The cost difference is an average of about 42 cents spent by the government on counting homes that mail in forms, compared to $60 for those that must be visited starting in May, Dr. Groves said.

"If you don't mail the form in, you've just added to the federal deficit," he said in a media briefing. "You've taken $60 that could have been used for some other purpose."

At the same time, the bureau is using a $340 million marketing campaign to try to overcome anti-government resistance, privacy fears and other factors that may make people hesitate to participate willingly.



Read more: http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/10085/1045774-84.stm#ixzz0jhIUmkBo


Read more: http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/10085/1045774-84.stm#ixzz0jhHnHfR6

[ipfilter]

46. Filling out the Census is a civic duty.

I can't believe this is even an issue on a progressive forum.

[virgogal]

61. What on earth are you talking about? Filling out the Census

isn't the issue,the multiple mailings are.

[donco6]

50. It's not a waste at all.

Why would you think so?

[rucky]

53. I hear they know someone in the US Postal Service

who can hook 'em up ;)

[mariawr]

54. It's called the Dillman Method for Mail Surveys..

...and it helps to promote a higher response rate. It's an approved procedure by those that deal with gathering data.

[virgogal]

62. I'll be damned----you learn something every day. Thanks.

[bigwillq]

64. I got 3 of the 4

all but the last one listed. I already sent my census back before the reminder mailing arrived.

[southernyankeebelle]

65. I answered it and sent it back. Many republicans aren't going to do it. That's

great become it will mean less republicans in the house. They already said that Bachman's district will be elimanated. Couldn't happened to a better screwball.

[Lugnut]

70. We never got a census form.

This is the first time in over 40 years that we didn't receive one.