My Easter Present.....Look at the tailgate that was in front of me this afternoon

[Mira]

I know I bitch and moan about the bright red district I live in that has kept the nasty Virginia Foxx in Congress and helped put the Buffoon Burr in the Senate.
So I want to show there are kindred spirits as well.

This guy was in front of me in a long line of vehicles waiting to get free mulch from the city.
I had plenty of time to walk up to his window and shake his hand.

Told him the smile is the giveaway if it's friend or Palinite.
He had a nice belly laugh

[CaliforniaPeggy]

1. My dear Mira!

Now, that's great!

You made him happy, and us too!

I love love love his other stickers too...

Good on ya!

:hug:

[Mira]

3. My dear CaliforniaPeggy

I wish you a wonderful Easter, I thank you for your sweet words, and if you feel like it go to the photo forum and look at some more photos of my excursion this afternoon.
You'll read it and see why I am unable to move a muscle tonight.

:)

[murray hill farm]

15. Those bumper stickers...

give one pause...and pleasure! they are wonderful.

[NoPasaran]

2. Good stickers. although I'm not sure the one about Jesus, Mary and Joseph is accurate

After all, they did have a home in Nazareth. They were just in Bethlehem for the Census and didn't have a reservation. If Expedia.com and the iPhone had existed in those days, the entire Nativity story would be different.

Rec'd anyway.

[OnTheOtherHand]

4. poetic license?

The eastern sky was full of stars,
But one shone brighter than the rest,
The wise men came so stern and strict,
And brought the order to evict.
You'd better get born in some place else,
Move along, get along, move along, get along,
Go, Move, Shift.

Ewan McCall

[caseymoz]

40. The entire Bible was written with poetic license. nt

[The Green Manalishi]

47. Cool song, my band covers that one!

Heard a cop is Scotland tell someone to "SHIFT" just last summer. Seems to translate well to "Get the f**k out, NOW"; especially when coming from someone over two meters tall and armed (the guy being told to do so was parked illegally).

[LiberalFighter]

7. FYI There isn't any support that a census took place as described in the NT.

[NoPasaran]

9. Don't tell the teabaggers, m'kay?

[LiberalFighter]

12. I want to mess their mind up as much as possible.

They probably don't know that the Jesus they believe in was a Jew. Or that their religion is actually based on Paul.

[RC]

21. WHAT!

You mean to tell us that Jesus wasn't raised a Christian by his Christian parents? :evilgrin:

By the looks of the box and back window, he been dealing with some republicans lately.

[sam sarrha]

31. Paul... Psychotic Narcissist.. never met Jesus.

[LiberalFighter]

32. Nearly 1/2 of the books in the NT are letters written by Paul

They thought more of Paul than of the disciples of Jesus.

[aquart]

37. Yeah, the NT was short so he threw in his Sent file.

[The Green Manalishi]

48. Interesting that Jesus, Mohammed and the Buddha

did not leave any writings; it took subsequent followers to fuck everything up.

[sam sarrha]

53. there is plenty about Muhammad..the Koran is in and from bits and pieces, but the Hiddah and Sunnah

books are very detailed, day to day stuff about muhammad, even how he smelled. detailed enough that any Psychiatrist could easily diagnose him..

Buddhism is older, it is actually pretty simple, people were mostly illiterate in 500 BCE, the Wheel of Life exists from his day, he dictated its construction so that illiterate people could learn Buddhism. Buddhism isn't a Religion.. actually you can't be a Buddhist if you believe in Riligion/all powerful God. there is a lot in Buddhism anyone can use, it's more of a Psychology. it is based on a single Logical statement from a man. all else s commentary. the lack of a paper trail is probably due to mold, an very good oral tradition.. and having been invaded by Muslims who destroyed everything they could from the *Dark Times* everywhere they went.. *any teachings by anyone else before Muhammad*.

http://www.buddhanet.net/wheel2.htm


the bible was re-written 7-8+ times, translated from a language based on Metaphor into a logic based language, Greek, into a dead language Latin, into english..used to enslave generations.. who can say what it first meant. there is a comment by Jesus where he comments that none of the Disciples really understand what he is talking about. the bible is full of professes of a dooms day nature, because Jesus led a Dooms day cult.. there were numerous such cults then. the Apocrypha of john was not the Disciple john, but a guy 90 years later from Rome criticizing the government in code..it is common knowledge in the Catholic church.. but they leave it in rather admit the bible is full of mistakes and isn't the perfect word of god..

[The Green Manalishi]

54. Yes, but I mean that non of them actually sat down and wrote out what they wanted recorded.

[The Green Manalishi]

55. Yes, but I mean that non of them actually sat down and wrote out what they wanted recorded.

[sam sarrha]

56. Mohammad was illiterate.. little exists cause at the time there was no paper, things were written

on animal skins, Birch bark..reeds flattened glued together with sap. mud pies.. we know a lot about egypt cause it was dry enough for them not to rot, no bugs to eat them.. much was buried and found after the end of the Ottoman empire. the Mohammedans destroyed cultures wherever they went. they destroyed all teaching other than Mo's. they put 80,000,000 to the sword in india alone, burned libraries wherever they went, destroyed temples..murdered cultures wholesale.

besides at the time of the Buddha there was a totally miss-understood oral history. the best example today is the Hopi's and their clan Kivas. on prescribed days the clans meet and everyone tells the "Story". the others listen and make sure each has it right. the story is the history of the "People" from long before the ice age.,

in Rome there was one Census keeper, he remembered everyones name address and profession.. in Rome. there were people whose purpose in life was remembering perfectly, teaching others and passing on the information.

i have received numerous teachings from different Tibetan Lamas who are the Linage of various Buddhists who initially were trained monks who sat at Buddha's feet and were trained in specific teachings, to pass them on. one monk to another from Buddha's voice to other generations of monks to the one i learned it from. there are systems in the process to preserve the teachings, it isn't a game of 'Telephone'.

one must always consider the "Source".. 'ESPECIALLY' Islam. which is definably the best preserved.. it is after all only 1400 yrs old. the Koran is bits and pieces, it is described as "listening to 2 people you don't know talk about something you don't understand" .. it horrifically redundant. the first western interpretor of the Koran described it as "Wrist slittingly boring". Mo was undoubtedly Schitzophrenic..Frontal Lobe Epilepsy which causes hallucinations of a religious nature and he obviously had Acromegally..which caused Turbocharged on steroids hyper sex drive, obsessive compulsive behavior, hallucinations paranoia. ..the quest to understand Mohammedanism is really important. but be careful who you tell anything to. it can be vary dangerous. in Sharia Law there are 442 individual things you can do that will prompt your father, brother, best friend to kill you on the spot. for instance.. simply asking any question about the Koran or islam.

i am fascinated with Islam, as one acquires more information it becomes evident that it is really Mohammedanism. it is all about Mohammad.

this is the essential 1st book to read...
http://www.amazon.com/Understanding-Muhammad-Ali-Sina/dp/0980994802/ref=pd_bxgy_b_img_b
"Why are some Muslims intolerant, violent and supremacist? Why do they bully? What spurs them to riot and murder over the silliest things? To understand Muslims, one must understand their prophet. This psycho biography seeks to unveil the mystery of the prophet of Islam. Historians tell us Muhammad used to withdraw to a cave, spending days wrapped in his thoughts. He heard bells ringing and had ghostly visions. He thought he was demon possessed, until his wife reassured him he had become a prophet. Convinced of his status, he was intolerant of those who rejected him, assassinated those who criticized him, raided, looted, and massacred entire populations. He reduced thousands to slavery, raped, and allowed his men to rape female captives. All of this, he did with a clear conscience and a sense of entitlement. He was magnanimous toward those who admired him, but vengeful toward those who did not. He believed he was the most perfect human creation and the universe's raison d'être. Muhammad was no ordinary man. This book ventures beyond the stories. Focusing on the "why" rather than the "what," it unravels the mystique of one of the most enigmatic and influential men in history. Islam is Muhammadanism."


probably the best of the Apostate Biographies
http://www.amazon.com/Cruel-Usual-Punishment-Terrifying-Implications/dp/1595551611/ref=pd_sim_b_3

this woman was a Gynecologist MD from Syria.. excellent
http://www.amazon.com/God-Who-Hates-Courageous-Inflamed/dp/0312538359/ref=pd_bxgy_b_img_c

both of the women above are on Youtube, both have Fatwas ordering their head removed from their necks.. because they quit Islam.. check out Wafa Sultans youtube on Womens Rights.. my hero..

THESE ARE REALLY INFORMATIVE, mostly history/comparative religion, the previous 3 are auto-biographies.
http://www.amazon.com/Politically-Incorrect-Guide-Islam-Crusades/dp/0895260131/ref=pd_sim_b_10

http://www.amazon.com/Complete-Infidels-Guide-Koran/dp/1596981040/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1270516759&sr=1-1-spell

[sam sarrha]

57. 2 millenna ago people didn't sell books. those you refer to had scribes Buddha was a Prince, most

likely literate.. he was an Ascended Master. he dedicated his life to teaching. there were definitely many scribes and oral memory people everywhere he went. he was not attached to this world.. he had attendants who protected him from ignorant people who would ask him to plead with the gods for something.. he would have gone to make them happy.

Jesus was most likely illiterate.. Mohamed was definitely illiterate.. he would have a seizure, hallucinate and then tell people around him what he saw/heard. Allah was also obviously used as a Sock puppet to get what he obsessed for. his adopted sons wife.., 6 year old child of a cousin as a wife..:puke: when he related his conversations with angel Gabriel people wrote down what he said on anything Handy.. a bone during dinner.. a leaf, there was no paper..

what you so intently desire is actually a moot point.. projecting todays values/perception of reality to archaic times.

[happyslug]

17. More recent data says one did occur in 1-2 BC

Rome used two census, one of everyone under Roman rule run every 15 or so years, an another every five years of Roman Citizens. With this later census most subject countries would also have done a census of their own non-roman citizens so a Census of 1-4 BC is possible. Furthermore it is now believed Herod the Great died in January 1 BC since that Lunar eclipse fits what is described as occurring at the time of his death better then the eclipse of 4 BC, which had previously been given as the date of his death: For more see the following:

http://www.denverastrosociety.org/dfiles/mickle/StarofBethlehem.pdf

The above cite relies on the following cites extensively:
http://sciastro.net/members/portia.php/2009/01/30/the-star-of-bethlehem
http://www.ankerberg.org/Articles/editors-choice/EC1205W3C.htm

Now a lot of Scholars still cling to the 4 BC date as can be seen in the following:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Census_of_Quirinius
http://www.orlutheran.com/html/census.html

[LiberalFighter]

44. The problem is that Judea was not part of the Roman Empire until 6 AD.

Prior to this Judea was a third-class province of insignificant importance.
When Judea was annexed into the Roman Empire in 6AD it was as part of the Syrian province.

Source
Then A.D. 6 Archelaus was deposed from the throne of Judea and Quirinius was sent by Augustus to become governor of Syria, to liquidate Archelaus' estate, and to hold a census to determine the amount of tribute the new province might be expected to pay into the imperial treasury. Josephus records the move thus:

Quirinius, a Roman senator who had proceeded through all the magistracies to the consulship and a man who was extremely distinguished in other respects, arrived in Syria, dispatched by Caesar to be governor of the nation, and to make an assessment of their property. Coponius, a man of equestrian rank, was sent along with him to rule over the Jews with full authority. Quirinius also visited Judea, which had been been annexed to Syria, in order to make an assessment of the property of the Jews and to liquidate the estate of Archelaus. Although the Jews were at first shocked to hear of the registration of property, they gradually condescended, yielding to the arguments of the high priest Joazar, the son of Boethus, to go no further in opposition. So those who were convinced by him declared, without dispute, the value of their property.

Josephus Ant. 18.1.1

Roman custom for a census was based on the place of residence.

Quirinius was governor of Syria from 6-9 CE. About 10 years after Jesus was born.

Universal Roman census were held 28 BC, 8BC, and 14AD.

Galilea was not under the jurisdiction of Archelaus who ruled from 4 BC to 6 AD.

[happyslug]

46. Herod the Great was a "Client-King" not a true King

As to the 4 BC date as the start of the reign of Archelaus, that is based on the fact that he succeeded Herod the Great at the death of Herod the Great. The only dating we have for the death of Herod the Great is that it was during Lunar Eclipse AND passover (look at my previous thread for the exact relationship between Passover and the Lunar Eclipse for the exact relationship between the two). 4 BC is generally given for Herod's death, but a similar argument can be made for 1 BC. From the date we have today, we can NOT eliminate either date and the 1 BC date is more compatible with the Gospels then 4 BC.

Now, the Empire under Augustus was divide into various units under the Roman Empire. These could be "Allied Kingdoms" and "Client Kingdoms", "Senatorial Provinces" and "Imperial Provinces". As to the two types of Kingdoms, neither were independent, both ruled under the Authority of the Roman Emperor. This is further complicated by Augustus making a difference between Senatorial provinces (Ruled by appointees of the Senate) and Imperial Provinces. The Imperial Provinces, were further divided between provinces ruled by a Legate (A Senator who was a member of the Roman Senate AND a Commander of a Roman Legion) and Provinces Governed by a Procurator (Such as Pontus Pilate), the Procurators were tax collectors in Imperial Provinces ruled by Legates AND Rulers and Tax Collectors in Provinces without Roman Troops. The richer provinces were ruled by Legate (a Roman Senator), the poorer provinces by a Procurator (a Roman member of the equestrian order, tThe big exception was Egypt, ruled by a Procurator for Augustus did NOT trust any Senator in Egypt for it was the single richest province of the Empire).

Herod the Great started out as a Allied King, i.e. a King supported by the Empire. Ge was forced out by a Rebellion supported by the Pathans (Then ruling Persia and modern Iraq). Herod was reinstated by Roman Forces, who made his a Client King. The difference between an Allied King and a Client King was an Allied King was succeeded by his son or other successor by whatever was the local custom. An Client King was succeeded by by whoever Rome picked. Herod started out as a Allied King, then became a Client king BUT had the right to pick his own successor. At Herod's death Augustus backed out of that agreement and divided Herod's Kingdom into the three kingdom of the time of Christ. At 6 AD, Herod's grandson was removed from ruling Judea proper and a Procurator was appointed. The Herod of the Bible (another Grandson of Herod the Great) still ruled Galilee (and did so till after Christ Crucifixion). Just before the Jewish Revolt of 70 AD, Rome again changed the Situation in Judea by appointed a new Client King. It was against this Client King that the Jews Revolted against in 70 AD. After the suppression of the Jewish Revolt a Legion was posted in Palestine and Palestine became a Legate Ruled Province.

Please note even Allied Kingdoms and Client Kingdoms could (and often did) have Roman Procurator who were to collect any taxes do to Rome. Thus under Roman census ALL could be subject to a Roman Census. My point the simple fact that Palestine was ruled by client king did NOT mean it was NOT subject to a Roman Census.

[AlbertCat]

22. There isn't any support that a census took place as described in the NT

Besides, could you imagine if everyone had to go back to their place of birth to be counted???? What a nightmare.... and of course WHY?

As with most of the Jesus story.... it makes no sense.

[aquart]

38. They had to hit certain bases to fulfill old prophecies.

Mic 5:2 "But you, Bethlehem Ephrathah, though you are little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of you shall come forth to Me the One to be Ruler in Israel, whose goings forth are from of old, from everlasting."

So the kid from Nazareth HAD to have been born in Bethlehem.

Now the reason he had to be born in a stable is really weird. Dumu in Sumerian means child. So does tur and they use the same sign. Dumuzi is the Sumerian dying and reviving God (Tammuz for the Hebrews same word with a T for D substitution) which the Jesus myth was building on. Tur also means animal stall, stye, stable. If you want to get dizzy, ur tur means puppy. Sound like any name you've ever heard?

A Sumerian pun is the same reason for the Eve from Adam's rib story. It helps to remember that Abraham came from Ur, a Sumerian city.

[happyslug]

52. As I pointed out above, the Census seems to have been one done by Herod the Great

And that Census seems to have been one to keep Augustus happy, for Herod and Augustus have had a hard relationship ever since Herod backed Anthony in the Civil War between Augustus and Mark Anthony (And Herod avoided being displaced as King for he had sent no troops to Anthony, for the simple reason Cleopatra wanted Judea and Herod opposed being a subject to Cleopatra).

Furthermore watch the term "Governor" used in English Translations of the Bible. The Latin terms "Legate" and "Procurator" are often translated to "Governor" in English, but in the time of Augustus meant two different positions. A "Legate" was the lieutenant of the Emperor. Under Augustus they were two types of "Legate", first was any commander of any Legion (Technically the Commander of any legion was "Ducus" who had been a Consul or Pro-Consul of Rome, as had been the rule under the Republic. At the end of the Civil War, Augustus made himself the "Ducus" of every legion and the actual commander was his "Legate" a person whose right to command came from the Emperor (Ducus of the Legion) himself NOT the Senate.

A second type of Legate was the actual Roman Ruler of an Imperial Province where Roman Forces were stationed, again appointed by Augustus (Syria was the nearest Imperial Province at the time of Jesus). A "Procurator" was the chief tax collector of the Roman Province, in any province ruled by a Legate. In such provinces the Procurator was independently appointed to the position by the Emperor.

Now in Imperial Provinces that did NOT have Roman Troops, a Procurator could be appointed to not only collect the taxes, but also to rule the Province (This was the case of Pontus Pilate in Judea). Procurators, being of the Equestrian order (The "middle class" of ancient Rome, not a Patrician or a Plebeian) could NOT command Roman Troops (But could, and had for centuries commanded any Foreign mercenaries used by Rome, including all of the "auxiliary" forces of Rome. Furthermore Augustus did NOT trust his fellow Patricians when it came to Money, so all his tax collectors were of the Equestrian order.

Thus it is possible for the term "Governor" to apply to at least four people at the same time in Roman Judea, the Legate of Syria, under who it was under, the Legate of the Legion stationed in Syria (Through this is the least likely event), the Procurator of Judea itself, when it was ruled directly by Rome NOT by a Client King, and finally the Procurator of Syria who had a supervisory power over the Procurator of Judea (When Judea was ruled by Rome) AND any Client King (When Judea was ruled by a Client King). A fifth is also possible, a Procurator operating in Judea but under a Client King (Rare but possible). Since all of these positions were "Legate" or "Procurator" positions, all could be viewed as "Governors".

The best argument for a 1-2 BC Census is that Herod died in 1 BC (The last Lunar Eclipse near Passover before a Roman Procurator started to rule Judea in 6 AD) instead of 4 BC (Another Full Lunar Eclipse near passover often used to date the death of Herod the Great).

Sometime after Christianity was adopted by the Roman Empire a Priest was asked to date the birth of Christ. He picked 1 BC (Zero did NOT exist in the Roman numbering system, thus the year before 1 AD is 1 BC). He had access to records that have long been lost and he picked 1 BC for some reason. The 4 BC calculation is of more recent dating, going back to the 1700s and 1800s. In the last 20-30 years 1 BC has started to come back as the date of Christ's birth BUT the evidence is NOT conclusive either way.

As to having to go back "Home" the traditional line has been when Joseph found Mary pregnant, Joseph planned to divorce Mary privately until an angel appeared and asked Joseph NOT to do it. As part of Joseph's plans as to Mary was to go back to his home town to avoid the scandal of her giving birth before nine months after their marriage among people who knew when they were married. Thus Joseph and Mary did NOT have to go to Bethlehem to be counted, but went to Bethlehem to be counted.

The Traditional line goes on and states that the Gifts from the Magi provided them enough money to go to Egypt to hide out till Herod the Great was dead and then Joseph returned home with a 2-3 year old child whose exact date of birth could be covered up. Thus Joseph and Mary did NOT have to go to Bethlehem but decided to do so to cover up Mary's pregnancy.

[demosincebirth]

41. Always has to be one (or more) to try and spoil the occasion.

[Bolo Boffin]

42. When they were hiding out in Egypt, they were homeless and undocumented.

:D

[pinboy3niner]

5. I'm in a red district, too--in a blue state

It's in another area of CA, but politically it might as well be Orange County. When I returned from volunteering for Kerry in Ohio a few years ago, sporting placards and stickers all over my car, a woman approached me at the local McDonald's, saying, "So YOU'RE the other Democrat in the Valley. What a coincidence our running into each other!"

Liberals here stay connected and serve as our own support group against the insanity. It especially helps those who are surrounded by outspoken RWingnuts in their work and church environments.

[oldlib]

27. Right Wing Valley?

I suspect that you, as I, live in Antelope Valley. There are 10 RW nuts to every Democrat here.

[pinboy3niner]

28. Bingo!

What's that quote--"We shall hang together, or surely we shall all hang separately"?:-)

Edited to provide exact quote:


"We must hang together, gentlemen...else, we shall most assuredly hang separately."

--Benjamin Franklin

[xxqqqzme]

30. FYI - Democrats have been busy in OC

We are 2nd only to LA County, in the entire state, in registered Democrats. We have a few rethuglican ghettos here but they are becoming thin. OC is also becoming more diverse which is why Democratic Party numbers are increasing.

[Liberal_in_LA]

6. nice! n/t

[dalaigh lllama]

8. I like his "Retired Pastor -- No More Mr. Nice Guy" bumper sticker

I guess I just like libs' senses of humor.

[enough]

10. It's the Jesus Mary and Joseph bumper sticker that I want. (nt)

[Mira]

13. My favorite part is that the Mary -Joseph and Baby J message is right under the

big flag.

Unfortunately 90 percent of people who put flags on their cars around here are people I approach with trepidation.
I love it when someone puts on a flag in the context of reminding U.S. about our obligations to others.

[CLANG]

33. I didn't know republicans had a sense of humor

Racist jokes don't count, right?

[sandnsea]

11. That's great!

And for the record, I don't think it matters how blue a blue state can be, seeing that kind of tailgate would brighten anyone's day! Thanks so much for taking the pic.

Might that be an alien landscape??

[murray hill farm]

14. Thanks to mark Twain for this one.........

"If Jesus were here now, there would be one thing he would not be....A Christian"!

[ejpoeta]

49. amen to that!! the teabaggers would run hm out of town anyway!!!

[MindandSoul]

16. A bright man!!!

[northofdenali]

18. These bumper stickers show a true Dem -

humor, fun, patriotism, intelligence and "in your facedness"!!

Thanks for making my morning brighter.

BTW, it didn't get true dark till nearly 10PM last night!

[RC]

23. That's because you complied with the mandate to set your clocks a hour early.

Now back to to the posted subject. Carry on.

[northofdenali]

25. Here in Fairbanks, we're actually 2 hours and (about)

23 minutes off of "real" time.

When we celebrate Summer Solstice, we have to do so at 1:19 (or so) AM on the day.

When the Pipeline finally started flowing, our illustrious REPUKE "leaders" in Juneau wanted the state to be more "in line" with Outside business relations. So we went on daylight savings time one year, and stayed there. About 2 years later, they decided to put Alaska on 2 time zones. We used to have 4 (this is one damn BIG state).

SO it's pretty fucked up.

But we still get our nearly-24-hours of daylight in summer!

[Lost4words]

19. God Bless!

[IDemo]

20. "Palinite" - that's a keeper

And the Palinites came forth, bearing misspelled signs..

:rofl:

[Enthusiast]

29. LOL!

[TexasProgresive]

24. SOCIALIST MULCH!!!!

Thanks for the picture- I can relate to the "No More Mr. Nice Guy."

[gmoney]

35. +! NO MORE MOOLCHERS!

So, I should just give the county my valuable lawn clippings and trimmings so they can turn around and redistribute it to MULCH MOOCHERS!

Big gubmint has to be STOPPED! NO MORE MOOLCHERS!

[lunatica]

26. Thank you! That truly warms my heart

[jarnocan]

34. sweet I live in that area too.

Sometimes I have to remind myself that hate is not really a Christian value:)

[graywarrior]

36. Awesome! I love him without even meeting him

[ThatsMyBarack]

39. A bit of Blue Heaven....

In Blood-Red Hell. Good for you! :D

[grantcart]

43. Perfect timing and happy Easter to all Christian DUers

[femrap]

45. k and r

I'll remember the one about Jesus and recite it to all of the hypocrites!

[bertman]

50. Thanks for the laugh, Mira. Rec.

[Skittles]

51. God bless our troops....especially our snipers

that's the bumpersticker I saw yesterday :puke: