Ralph Nader: An Unreasonable Man

[Adenoid_Hynkel]

This looks to be a stimulating film.

Trailer here:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=9ycR36N68R8


"In 1966, General Motors, the most powerful corporation in the world, sent private investigators to dig up dirt on an obscure thirty-two year old public interest lawyer named Ralph Nader, who had written a book critical of one of their cars, the Corvair. The scandal that ensued after the smear campaign was revealed launched Ralph Nader into national prominence and established him as one of the most admired Americans and the leader of the modern Consumer Movement. Over the next thirty years and without ever holding public office, Nader built a legislative record that is the rival of any contemporary president. Many things we take for granted including seat belts, airbags, product labeling, no nukes, even the free ticket you get after being bumped from an overbooked flight are largely due to the efforts of Ralph Nader and his citizen groups. Yet today, when most people hear the name "Ralph Nader," they think of the man who gave the country George W. Bush. As a result, after sustaining his popularity and effectiveness over an unprecedented amount of time, he has become a pariah even among former friends and allies. How did this happen? Is he really to blame for George W. Bush? Who has stuck by him and who has abandoned him? Has our democracy become a consumer fraud? After being so right for so many years, how did he seem to go so wrong? With the help of exciting graphics, rare archival footage and over forty on-camera interviews conducted over the past two years, "An Unreasonable Man" traces the life and career of Ralph Nader, one of the most unique, important, and controversial political figures of the past half century."

[Cobalt-60]

1. I thought Ralph was the Man

Until he helped the Chimp steal the election.
Whether it was his intention or not, the results are so catastrophic that he needs to permanently retire from public life.

[newsdude]

3. Stop it.

Nader is trying to preserve democracy.
The corporate wing of the Democratic Party sold out long ago.

[Hippo_Tron]

5. Yea, the corporations just love environmentalists like Al Gore

:eyes:

[newsdude]

19. They love Free Traders like Gore

Free traders like Gore can protest environmental degradation all they want ...
By supporting Free Trade, they're encouraging companies to countries where they don't care about environmental rules ...

[Hippo_Tron]

30. Oh please, the United States is responsible for 23% of the world's carbon dioxide emissions

And we have 1/20th of the world's population. With all of the outsourcing we've done, we're still the world's largest producer of greenhouse gases and per capita we're the largest producer by a landslide.

The fact is that corporations are not friendly to people like Al Gore who will hinder corporate profits by requiring corporations to comply with higher environmental standards. Furthermore, you're incorrectly assuming that President Gore would not attempt to change the emissions standards in other countries.

[TheWraith]

6. So you think that Al Gore would have done everything the same as Bush?

If so, then just say it. If not, then you're covering for Nader.

[wtmusic]

8. Gore was a less-than-inspiring candidate.

To those of us who knew his record, he was the only one. But being a good candidate includes being able to sell yourself, at which he was miserable. Does his recent 180 change any of that? Nope.

Dubya was an atrocious candidate, a convicted drunk driver who couldn't speak to save his life. It should have been a landslide, and blaming Nader is sour grapes.

[jpgray]

9. Nader did not cause the Bush victory. He didn't help though

Plus I like my leftist heroes who will never win a candidacy to be a bit less hypocritical.

[Lobster Martini]

13. Ralph Nader's Personal Demons

Ralph Nader has done a lot of positive things over the past 40
years.  It is hard not to like a guy who, to some degree,
influenced Congress to pass the National Traffic and Motor
Vehicle Safety Act, the Wholesome Meat Act, the Clean Air Act,
and the Freedom of Information Act.

But when claiming that he wasn’t the spoiler in the 2000
election, he is either in denial or mendacious.  If Nader
hadn’t been on the Florida ballot, most of his 98,488 votes
would likely have gone to Al Gore—it’s pretty hard to imagine
Bush being more popular among Nader’s voters than Gore—and
Gore needed only 51% of those votes to take the state. 

I have no doubt that Ralph Nader didn’t intend to hand the
Presidency to George W. Bush.  But I also have no doubt that
the roofing nail I’ve just pulled out of my steel-belted
radial didn’t intend to give me a flat, and I have no doubt
that because of Ralph Nader, Al Gore’s candidacy deflated
faster than my tire. 

On the other hand, why do interviewers keep bringing this up?

[wtmusic]

15. blame

We can either blame others, or we can maybe entertain the idea we were good but not good enough.

The fact that Nader, a man with no political experience, got 100,000 votes in FL--says more about Gore than it does about Nader.

[Lobster Martini]

16. The Exculpatory Evidence that Nader Doesn't Mention Either

There is one seldom-mentioned fact that exonerates Ralph
Nader.  By losing in Tennessee, Al Gore accomplished a rare
feat--prior to the 2000 election, the last major Presidential
candidate to lose in his own home state was George McGovern in
1972.  If Gore had taken his own state, the outcome in Florida
would have been irrelevant.  But no one, including Ralph
Nader, mentions this.

[wtmusic]

17. It is certainly a dubious honor

not to be compared to George McGovern, but to have your campaign compared with his.

Pardon my bad manners -- welcome to DU Lobster Martini!

:bounce: :toast: :bounce:

[davekriss]

25. I happen to think Nader is an honorable man...

...who has fought for progressive causes all his life. However, 2000 was a major major blunder. And it's not that we didn't see it coming. I participated in fierce debates here and elsewhere in 2000 and took the side that Nader's presence would peel votes away from Bush. Though in principle the presence of third parties pulls the impacted dominant party left or right, it was clear in 2000 that too much was at stake with George W Bush.

However, I hold no grudge toward Nader, a man I respect and honor, albeit I would say to him if we ever sat down to lunch, "Ralph, Ralph, what were you thinking?!"

[zalinda]

11. The media kept showing Gore in a bad light

They did the same to him as they did to Howard Dean. I've read so many comments here about Gore changing, and he's so much better now. Sorry, but he didn't change. When he was running I watched a segment on him, and he was just as relaxed as he is in AIT. They lied and said he grew up rich, they dissed his time in the Vietnam (he was just a journalist) and they took every opportunity to display him as a wooden puppet.

Stop blaming the candidate for what the media decides to show of them. The media wanted Bush to win, and so showed him in only the best of lights. Nader came on and said that both candidates were cut out of the same cloth, and he got plenty of air time. The only thing the media showed consistently of Gore was the lock-box statement, and they made fun of that.

zalinda

[wtmusic]

14. Gore in 2000 had half the fire he does now

When I look at his MoveOn speech at NYU from 2003 there's no comparison. There's nothing pre-2000 that comes close.

He was running a careful campaign, a political campaign, a campaign more obsessed with appearance than substance. Obama and Hillary are doing the same thing now, and like it did in 2000, it will backfire.

[dsc]

23. He gained 20 points in 16 months

I hate when candidates such so much.

[newsdude]

18. Sorry, but My Vote

Doesn't go to the "lesser of evils"

It goes to who best represents my ideals.

Nader vs. Gore?

No question.

Nader.

When the Democrats get away from Free Trade policies that are killing the working class, then we'll talk

[WinkyDink]

31. Say what you want, but do NOT attempt to command "Stop it".

[wtmusic]

7. Ralph is still "the man"

Ralph's tireless fight for mandatory safety equipment on cars has saved hundreds of thousands of lives.

You have a lot to thank him for.

[Bill Delp]

20. An Unreasonable Man film about Nader & his newest book Seventeen Traditions

After you see the great new movie AnUnreasonableMan.com at the IFC Center in Manhattan's West Village at 6th Ave & 3rd St. you'll see (as others have) that Nader didn't help W. Nader has been working to: impeach W & Cheney; end (& prevent) the wars in Iraq, Afghanistan, and Iran at DemocracyRising.us ; strengthen democracy; defend ALL citizens & our environment from corporations and corrupt governments, etc! His brand new book Seventeen Traditions gives you a view into his early family life and formative years in Winsted, Connecticut. The corporate controlled media has LIED about Nader with a vengeance that echoes the way he has ALWAYS TOLD THE TRUTH about corporate and government abuse of the environment and citizens. Peace!

[John Q. Citizen]

2. I saw a clip from that movie the other night. The Big Sky Documentary Film Festival

is showing it this year. Looks good.


"The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man."
-George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman (1903)
"Maxims for Revolutionists"

[Stephanie]

27. You're in Montana?

I'm so homesick! :hi:

[catnhatnh]

4. Jeepers...

Do you mean that rear engine cars (Back then about 95% of those were the "foreign VW or Corvair) suffer camber tuck???

[zalinda]

10. I won't waste my time or money on anything

with Ralph Nader. Yeah, Ralphie, Bush and Gore are EXACTLY the same, doesn't matter which one is elected. He lost me with that statement. Oh, then of course, taking money from repubs for his campaigns. Yeah, I really have a lot of respect for that "man".

zalinda

[Bonobo]

22. Looks like you most respect the "Straw Man". he he.

[Downtown Hound]

12. When Ralph started taking money from the Repukes in 2004

He forever lost what respect I had left for him. It is the height of hypocrisy to accuse Al Gore of being the same as Bush because he takes corporate money and then to sell yourself out the the corporate party four years later.

And I have a confession, I voted for Nader in 2000. I wouldn't have done it if I didn't live in CA, which was a safe Gore state, and I literally made the decision to vote for him while I was driving to the polls and listening to radio saying that Gore was sweeping CA. But do I still regret it? Yes. Because over time, I've come to see that Al Gore represents my conscience much better than Ralph Nader. I only wish I could have seen that back in 2000.

[SaveElmer]

21. Pass...

Had enough of Mr. Nader...

[Bridget Burke]

24. Ralph should have stuck to consumer protection.

Everyone said that, since I live in Texas, my vote wouldn't "count." But I proudly voted for Gore & was among the nationwide majority on his side.

Whether or not Florida could have been stolen without Nader's help, the world knows which side he was on.

What a pathetic little man. (I accidentally caught part of a recent interview on TV.)

[Stephanie]

26. I saw the movie last night - it was fascinating.

I did not know the full extent of Nader's activism, everything he accomplished. I started to understand why he felt he had to run. The movie's well done, I really recommend it.

[ShaneGR]

29. And run again in 2004?

Hoping to pull just enough votes away to elect Bush again?

[ShaneGR]

28. In between electing George W Bush and accepting Republican Money

I lost all respect for that fraud. Ya, he did a lot in his prime. Sadly he got so full of his own ego that it stopped mattering to him what the consequences of his actions were. Shame on him.