To the trolls here reading DU: If you don't like Gay Marriage then here's my advice

[LynneSin]

Don't marry someone of the same sex. Other than that MIND YOUR OWN BUSINESS!!!

BTW same advice for abortions too - Don't like them then don't have one!

[saigon68]

1. Excellent Advice

[Styxiv]

71. Hmm

I just find it funny they are ALL ABOUT FREEDOM when it comes to guns, it's like " Hey Government STAY OUT OF MY BUSINESS!! oh unless it's about gay marrage and abortions then its all HEY WE NEED YOU TO BAN THEM!! Bunch as hypocrites!!! Lets start votes and legislation on banning guns and see how whiney they get.

[gtar100]

110. Supreme advice.

They complain about "big government" being involved in their personal business but are so willing to stick their nose into everyone else's.

I guess that "Do unto others..." part of their bible went a little over their heads.

[Kali]

2. and then the reality is

they project and want to control everybody else - THEY are the ones with the wide stance and the suggestive text messages to young same sex pages or are sending their daughters off to special clinics for the hidden abortions

it would be a LITTLE more understandable if they actually behaved the way they try to force others to

[LynneSin]

7. Imagine substituting GUNS for Gays when it comes to Prop 8

Imagine that instead Prop 8 being about whom you could marry, Prop 8 was about whom could own guns.

nuff said.

[jdlh8894]

10. Uh? There already are laws

as to who can own guns. Or, actually,who can't own weapons.

[KILL THE WISE ONE]

49. yes, and i like those laws mostly, felons and crazy people do not need to own guns

[Moonwalk]

75. I think they meant laws that said you couldn't own a gun based on--

--race, religion, gender, or sexual orientation. If they said gays couldn't own guns, think how the conservatives would be up in arms (joke there!). They'd be saying exactly what the rest of us said about Prop. 8--if the majority can make this into law about gays, who next? Quite right that they wouldn't stand for such a restriction if it was about gun ownership rather than marriage.

[Electric Monk]

31. But what about people who might want to marry their guns?

[27inCali]

34. Colbert is God -nuff said

[Ken Burch]

48. "same-caliber marriage"?

n/t.

[Chulanowa]

33. Because I know I'm going to marry another guy before I go hold up a liquor store

Wait, what?

[Vickers]

3. Here's my advice: if you are against gay marriage,

FUCK OFF AND DIE YOU ANTI-FREEDOM SACK OF SHIT.

Hope this helps.

[rurallib]

74. do you think they can understand that?

:shrug: :shrug:
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[Ken Burch]

85. I'm thinking...LARGER font....they can BARELY see that.

:sarcasm:

[66 dmhlt]

101. Here's a more subtle message to Wingnuts ...

[aquafina]

77. I live in Georgia

I can't speak my mind on this issue.

I mean I could....but you know what I mean.

[alp227]

79. OR...

move.

[lunatica]

4. And take your prop 8 and shove it

neener, neener

[uncommon]

5. Prop 8ers hate our freedom.

They hate America.

:P

[The Wizard]

47. Hate America and Americans (NT)

[closeupready]

6. Amen, Lynne!

:hi:

[AndyA]

8. Most people would not want the beliefs of others forced upon them.

So they should also not force their beliefs on someone else.

Freedom of religion also means freedom FROM religion if that's the way a person wants it.

[OZark Dem]

9. I am disappointed

I would have made the message "bite me".

[awoke_in_2003]

60. Welcome to DU

:hi:

[Warren DeMontague]

94. That works, too.

Allow me to second the welcome. :hi:

[Lugnut]

11. Hear, hear!

:applause:

[joeybee12]

12. KNR!

[david13]

13. I'm not a troll. But I can't say I "like" gay marriage, but that is not

something that is up to me. It is up to the two participants of the proposed marriage. And no one else.
I think you make two excellent points there. The evil is that people want to impose their questionable, or religious based morality on others, using the power of the state to do so. In essence it establishes their interpretation of the religion into the state's agenda.
dc

[HERVEPA]

35. What is there to like or not like about it?

[david13]

84. I won't comment on that. But I think what the op was saying, was

just because you wouldn't want to enter into a same sex marriage yourself, does not follow that you can then say that the state will not allow other people to enter into a same sex marriage.
Perhaps like wasn't the right word.
dc

[Withywindle]

114. Oh, you don't "like" it?

Oh, so sorry. Do you have a legitimate reason for not "liking" it, or do you just still fear queer-cooties at your advanced age?

[City Lights]

14. Couldn't agree more.

Recommended.

[Froward69]

15. Is it Okay if

I do not like Marriage at all?... period?

after all it is a weak contract that only guarantees losing half your stuff.

[LynneSin]

16. Then don't marry

But you knew that answer :D

[Johonny]

17. you can lose way more than half

[Tuesday Afternoon]

19. +1

way.more.

[Patchuli]

70. Sad and too true! nt

[obxhead]

76. How's the joke go?

I'm not ever getting married again. Instead I'll just find someone I don't like and buy them a house.

[sinkingfeeling]

18. " but they'll never take... OUR FREEDOM! " ... William Wallace (Braveheart)

[laughingliberal]

20. We're such a nation of panty sniffing busy bodies. nt

[LynneSin]

22. That's easy enough for them to do since they don't keep their guns down there

:grr:

[jberryhill]

21. Go With Tradition - Find Someone You Don't Like And Buy Them A House

It saves a lot of time.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

23. They switched into passive-aggressive mode BIG TIME.

"Mumble grumble the majority voted for it mumble grumble minorities voted for it mumble harrumph grumble the people of the state yargle gargle blarrrgh."

[Touchdown]

24. I'd say if they don't like it, then move to Iran!

There's no gay marriage there.

[awoke_in_2003]

61. or somalia...

then they will have the added "benefit" of small government.

[AspenRose]

25. Absolutely

:kick:

Oh, and K&R

[Ignis]

26. K&R

:yourock:

[WolverineDG]

27. anti-marriage equality trolls are kindly invited to

kiss my fat white ass.

dg

[awoke_in_2003]

62. and like Cenk said...

not the left cheek, not the right cheek, but the hairy, crusty center.

[Name removed]

28. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[mstinamotorcity]

29. People are people

There is the good,the bad, and the downright ugly. I personally think that they should call all unions between heterosexuals,same sex or multi cultural ( at one time it was against the law in some states), should be called civil unions. And if your particular religion or definition of marriage is conforming to your beliefs then so be it. Most religions are the ones who determine what marriage is anyway. Hell the ceremony in itself in my opinion is really an elaborate way to spend lots of cash for about ten minutes of sappy vows that most people don't take seriously at all. And isn't finding real love hard enough with out everyone trying to put labels on it.

[awoke_in_2003]

64. we have had over 200 years...

of it being called marriage in this country, and the vocabulary is unlikely to change.

[we can do it]

30. What She Said !

[Name removed]

32. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[LiberalFighter]

36. What those that are against gay marriages forget...

1) is that the government can't force a church to marry two people of the same sex. (1st Amendment)

2) is that the government can't force individuals to marry someone of the same sex or even of the opposite sex. (1st Amendment, 8th Amendment)

[4lbs]

37. Those Repuke idiots want to legislate conduct and apply it to OTHER people, not themselves.

They argue "family values" and berate anyone that doesn't support traditional family.

Yet when one of their own is an adulterer, liar, thief, cheat, etc., they don't pound the airwaves for that person's resignation.

Ensign, Vitter, and Sanford are still in office, yet they were all too happy to go after Bill Clinton, Eliot Spitzer, and now Charlie Rangel.

Yeah, like I'm sure all those Repukes pay 100% of their taxes and declare everything. Yeah, right. :sarcasm:

Yet, they glob onto people like Giuliani and Gingrich.

[Proud Liberal Dem]

38. Sage advice

I've always wondered how, with everything going on and everybody's lives being so jam-packed with everything, some people can amazingly still afford to invest so much time, energy, and money in denying OTHER people the right to control their own sexual and reproductive lives. I...just..don't....get it.

:wtf:

[TK421]

39. I'm convinced some people exist only to stick their noses where they don't belong

and these people would qualify

[Proud Liberal Dem]

40. They must

There's no other explanation. I barely have enough time to think/worry about my own life and family. I can't think of a time where I've had the time (or the desire) to wonder what the people next door are doing from minute to minute.

[TK421]

41. exactly, and here I am unable to find work and still on unemployment

after a year...and I'm going to worry about what two strangers do in the comfort of their own home? fucking really???

that reminds me; I also think some people just exist to stir up bullshit and make trouble for others, and I'm glad those fuckers lost yesterday

[Proud Liberal Dem]

46. That was a sweet victory

Hope we have more of them. It would be nice if somebody would just stand up to these busybodies and call them out on it.

[MadMaddie]

91. They are unhappy and miserable people

they want to feel superior to anyone they can.

They are selfish and lazy. They look for excuses to hate. Just as the judge ruled and pointed out all of the bogus claims that the Prop 8 people supported.

That' about it....

[Orsino]

42. You do realize, though, that minding everyone else's business...

...is human nature? That even those who conceded equality in this arena returned home to their reality TV shows and tabloids?

I think the urge to spy on our neighbors may be even more powerful and instinctive than the hate and fear we're fighting.

[Spazito]

43. Love both the advice and the succinctness with regard to...

the delivery! Well said!

Recommended.

[Ticonderoga]

44. Now come on Lynne

Just because some one does not have the same likes/dislikes as you is no justification for lableing them as trolls. C'mon girl, narrow that brush you paint with.

[awoke_in_2003]

65. in this case...

"homophobic troll" is a better descriptor.

[LynneSin]

104. I'm not talking lurkers here - those are people new to DU who haven't posted yet

I know I lurked a few weeks before I joined. Perhaps you did too before you joined.

A troll is someone who comes with the sole purpose of hating and disrupting.

[Dawson Leery]

45. That would work quite well.

[lonestarnot]

50. K & R! And MIND YOUR OWN BUSINESS

is my favorite fucking part! Edit for damned "dominionaters." :evilgrin:

[Desertrose]

51. It could just be so simple, couldn't it?

Damn shame it's not.

So glad stupid Prop 8 got overturned!!!

:bounce: :toast:

[Fearless]

52. But they don't want the rest of us to have them either!

That's the whole issue.

[Lisa0825]

53. Proud to be rec # 100. nt

[Butch350]

54. Like WTF is wrong with gay marriage...

I keep my F**king nose out of other people's biz. And if it's some kind of sin against GOD are some other
dim witted excuse - then let GOD F**ken deal with it.

Sticking to my own biz is a full time job for me.

I am not gay - but I feel if two people love each other then WTF?!

[BrklynLiberal]

55. I am in awe of your eloquence...

:applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :yourock: :yourock: :yourock: :yourock: :yourock: :yourock: :yourock: :yourock: :yourock: :yourock:

[teewrex]

56. People said crap about inter-racial marriage and we see how that

has destroyed the fabric of society.
All people have value and treating anyone as inferior for any reason is self-righteous stupidity

[humbled_opinion]

57. HMMM ....

I thought all the hoopla about this issue was that a judge trumped 7 million citizens in a state that voted in majority not to change the technical meaning of marriage?

Silly me....

[awoke_in_2003]

66. Do you think the judge...

shouldn't have trumped the citizens? Had civil rights legislation been put up for vote it probably wouldn't have passed.

[Name removed]

69. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Paladin]

72. Since When Is A Majority Opinion Always Correct?

There's a majority supporting Arizona's immigration law, but that doesn't make it right. Those 7 million Californians were wrong, pure and simple. The new decision puts things right, and does so with historical, forceful eloquence.

And civil unions do NOT equate with marriages, no matter what you and Obama might think.....

[awoke_in_2003]

73. no, i do not...

we call them marriages in this country, and the vocabulary will not change anytime soon. I am married and an atheist- marriage has zilch to do with bronze age belief systems.

[cate94]

80. We are NOT playing a game of semantics.

Civil Unions are not equal to marriage. There are about 1200 legal rights that marriage confers. In order to make civil unions equivalent we would have to change all those laws to include civil unions.

Can I vote on whether you can marry? Would you think it fair if we all had an opportunity to say that you were less than the rest of us and therefore not deserving of marrying the person you love?

Marriage has deep spiritual meaning for me too, what is your point? No one will force any religious institution to marry anyone it doesn't want to marry. There are many religious organizations that are more than willing to marry gay people but are not allowed to because of state law. Does the desire of the Catholic faith to keep gay people from marrying trump the Episcopal faith which wants to be able to marry its' gay parishioners?

The opinion was based on the Constitution, not one man trumping the will of the people. I suggest you read it.

[humbled_opinion]

83. No arguments...

Just my opinion, even though it got deleted, and as far as the Constitution is concerned I will await the decision of the SCOTUS to make the final determination and if they do equate this issue with civil rights and they do find that there is reason to believe that people being denied the Word marriage in their union is unequal then in fact I will respect and accept the majority opinion.

[Zhade]

87. It got deleted because it was bigoted. Might want to think about that.

A gentle reminder: if you do not support our equal right to marry, you are NOT welcome on DU -- and that's from Skinner himself.

[humbled_opinion]

99. So you are saying that

If I don't Lock Step with every position on DU that my opinion will not be tolerated? That is not Progressive it's Nazi. I am certainly no bigot and resent that ascertion. My argument for all three following this subthread is more about traditional institutions and definitions of a WORD in my mind (My opinion)this has absolutely nothing to do with civil rights, there is no question that people who partner should have every single right and equal protection as everyone else that partners. MY OPINION is that the definition of the word marriage should not have to be changed to support that protection. If you find that bigotted then maybe you are the one that needs to reflect on your position being mine would seem to be the most tolerant.

[LynneSin]

105. to not support the rights of the GLBT community is equal to...

coming to DU and say "I don't support the rights of Hispanics" or "I don't support the rights of African-Americans" or "I don't support the rights of Women". GLBTers are just another subset of people who are no different than me and deserve every right to be treated equal and have equal rights.

So yes, it's a big deal to come to a democratic website and label a group of people being who they are as not worthy of the same rights you have - then there is a serious problem with that. What does it matter if these 2 people, who just happen to be gay, want to have a marriage and live happily ever after? How does that affect anyone elses marriage? I mean already 50% of straight marriages end in divorce so honestly why are we even allowed to marry? I mean we straights can't even keep a lifetime promise we made before God. And we straights have done a good job fucking things up when it comes to Marriage with all the cheating, and quicky drunken marriages in vegas and forcing young girls to marry and the divorces. Geez Larry King has been married 8 times as a straight man and you think HE deserves some privledge of using that word over a gay couple?

Personally I like what some DUers have said - just call it Civil Unions for everyone, because that's what it is anymore - a contract between 2 couples. Then if someone wants to take it to the next level they could see if a Church would perform a marriage. And Marriage would be strictly ceremonial that offers no additional privledges that a union would. But if we went that route - it would have to still be setup equal to everyone.

[Thornleylv]

108. KnR

[humbled_opinion]

112. You completely mis-state and misunderstand my position

I do support equal rights for everyone and have said so numerous times. I also totally agree with your last para "Civil Unions" for everyone may actually be the best route and would certainly solve the concerns for equality among all couples.

I will try one last time to elaborate my point. Traditional Marriage is ceremonial and has been understood to mean the union of one man and one woman. What the traditionalists are arguing and (hence the prop 8 and 7 million votes) is that to confer a different meaning on the word leads to a slippery slope that allows unions outside of the boundaries of some of these traditional and (religious)institutions.

Now you may believe that some of these institutions are bigotted because people of one preference or another or one belief system or another would not be welcome to participate with that group but I contend that is exactly the reason for the First Ammendment.

[LynneSin]

113. Traditional Marriage also meant marrying your own race or your own religion

How's that working out these days?

Basically what you have is a bunch of scared lilly-white fundies shitting their pants that they are losing their grasps over the word 'marriage' even though they make an abomination of it with all their cheating & divorces.

[FreeState]

95. I highly recommend you read the complete ruling

From the ruling (p.24):

An initiative measure adopted by the voters deserves great respect. The considered views and opinions of even the most highly qualified scholars and experts seldom outweigh the determinations of the voters. When challenged, however, the voters’ determinations must find at least some support in evidence. This is especially so when those determinations enact into law classifications of persons. Conjecture, speculation and fears are not enough. Still less will the moral disapprobation of a group or class of citizens suffice,no matter how large the majority that shares that view. The evidence demonstrated beyond serious reckoning that Proposition 8 finds support only in such disapproval. As such, Proposition 8 is beyond the constitutional reach of the voters or their representatives.

http://www.scribd.com/mobile/documents/35374462

[cate94]

97. You are right - no arguments...

Because you can't argue with a person who bases their opinion on perception rather than fact.

Your opinion has no fact. You don't know the difference between a civil union and a marriage because it is inconvenient to check your facts. It isn't about semantics at all it is about the equal protection of the law.

[NMMNG]

86. So you're in favor of tyranny of the majority?

M'kay. How about we vote on your rights now?

[Thornleylv]

109. Sorry

But their is no such thing as tyranny of the majority, and when it comes to constitutional right is really does not matter it is not a popularity contest it just is.

[awoke_in_2003]

58. It cannot be said any plainer...

opposition to equal marriage rights is homophobia.

[onehandle]

59. To the trolls here reading DU: We will force you to gay marry.

That's a promise.

[Bluenorthwest]

63. Short and sweet and no need for any additions

save for my thanks to the op.

[Kievan Rus]

67. As long as a consenting adult isn't harming anybody else, I agree in all circumstances

This is one place that I agree 110% with Libertarians on.

Don't like abortion? Fine. Don't have one.

Don't like gay marriage? Fine. Don't marry a member of the same sex.

[Parche]

68. ditto

:hug::hug::hug::hi:

[alp227]

78. haha turning it off is the best advice

Don't like what's on TV? Don't watch, and maybe cancel your cable, sell your TV, whatever!

Why can't those conservatives just be the change they wanna be and just promote positive marriages in order to protect it if it means so much to the American way? Oh yeah, conservatism is all about "me first"!

[johnaries]

81. Ya know, I've been saying for a long time that the best way

to promote gay marriage is through the courts, not Congress and certainly not through the Presidency.

Denying anyone the right to marry whomever they want is a denial of civil rights and is unconstitutional. Period.

[The Straight Story]

82. Good advice for marriage, abortion, smoking, guns, cars, etc

Why do so many want to control others all the time? Can't stand it no matter where it comes from.

[varelse]

88. K&R

[Honeycombe8]

89. I'm not against gay marriage. But saying that those who disagree w/you are trolls...

is a bit far fetched. Per the polls I've seen in the last couple of years, most people in the country are in favor of civil unions but not in favor of "marriage," per se. A lot of those people are Democrats, I guess, since it's most people in the country.

I just get tired of people accusing others who disagree with them of being evil or Republican or whatever. There are differences of opinion.

The country is working like it should, maybe. The issue is making its way through the courts. I think it will be finally settled at the national level. I don't see how this could work on a state by state basis.

[Zhade]

92. They may not be trolls, but they ARE bigots.

NT!

[racaulk]

103. +1

[Thornleylv]

107. it's not progressive

[1badjedi]

90. More power to ya!

I dislike a lot of what people do in this life but I stick to the mantra of to each his/her own. I judge others on their merits alone. It's worked for me so far. :)

[badgerpup]

93. MHO (FWIW)

...if you ain't one of the people with yer clothes off and makin' funny noises and goofy faces...


...THEN YOU ARE NOT INVOLVED AND IT IS NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS.


This goes for all combos and flavors.

[Jim Sagle]

96. So does Obama read DU? Just sayin'...

[IowaRevolutionary]

98. "Kill Yourselves" would have been okay too.

Just sayin'.

[political_Dem]

100. Wonderful words of wisdom.

But trolls, like Republicans, don't recognize boundaries. So, they will push and push until they have the entire country enslaved to their will.

That is why we must fight back as Dems. We've taken too much crap from the GOP. Now it is time to push back one victory at a time. The overturn of Prop 8 is such a victory. They hate change. However, we must note that we are in wonderous times where there are surprises around the corner. That is why we can never give up or give in to those who try to restrain our freedom.

[anachro1]

102. On the other hand

these people make abortion a necessity.

[DailyGrind51]

106. Hey, you Fundamentalists, if you REALLY want to punish gays, let them get married!

I tried it for ten years, and it was "hell on earth"!

[felix_numinous]

111. Before I read this post

I was saying to myself, you don't hear "Mind your own business!" enough anymore. My parents were always admonishing us kids with that saying, and it really made sense. In my parents' generation there really was not enough dialog about social issues, but one thing they did have was a real sense of privacy. What seems to have happened in response to their repressiveness is now a culture of total exposure and loss of privacy and personal boundaries. In both extremes, repression and no boundaries, there is no personal safety.

So as it is with all things, there is a point of balance between the two extremes, enough privacy and enough dialog. These days, I think there is a total lack of a sense of personal boundary. I learn things about people (in the grocery check out lane for example-) that I really do not want or need to know, but I digress, that is just art mirroring life. I guess a point of my posting is that we really need to push for more privacy as Democrats. It is an important thread that links many issues, as you said, GBLTQ issues, abortion issues, and I add surveillance issues, search and seizure issues (under the guise of "War On: Drugs, Aliens, Terrorism, ect.), and internet tracking.

Many people wonder why GBLTQ issues are so crucial (not here DU people mostly understand) to all people, and it is this: The extreme Right needs enemies to practice its repression on, they need the rest of society to sit and do nothing while one group is singled out for repression and abuse. Historically it has been gays, homeless and poor, minority races, refugees and women that are made example of first. That is why these groups of people must be protected at all costs, since what is done to one group is eventually done to us all!

A part of me finds deep peace when Gay people can marry, it seems insane that this battle is going on, but it must.