In Arizona, ethnic harmony has given way to fear

[pampango]

Source: Recordnet.com

Not long ago, people in Arizona got along for the most part. Latinos, Anglos, African-Americans, Asians, Native Americans and others didn't just peacefully co-exist. They often celebrated their differences. Arizona was no East Coast version of a melting pot. It was more like a pozole, a Mexican stew with many different ingredients that complement one another.

With polls showing about 70 percent of white Arizonans supportive of the law and roughly the same percentage of Latino Arizonans opposed, the comity is gone. Relationships are frayed. Families are divided. People who have been friends for years now hardly speak.

Phoenix boomed, and this was fine by the Phoenicians - many of whom envisioned their city becoming a desert metropolis with all the trimmings. But they weren't prepared for the demographic side effect: the gradual sense that they were losing control, and the fear that whites would eventually become a statistical minority in Arizona just as they are in California, Texas and New Mexico.

Something had to be done, and that something was the immigration law, or as some activists have dubbed it, the Mexican Removal Act. Others say the law makes bigotry socially acceptable. "The racists are out of the closet now," said a lifelong resident of the city who works at a university. "And even more are going to come out in the future."

More than one person told me they believe the fear factor went through the roof when Barack Obama was elected president. For many Americans, this was a sign the country was changing too fast for their taste. And, for their own comfort level, they wanted to change it back to the way it used to be. The problem with trying to do that in Arizona, where Mexicans are indigenous, is that "the way it used to be" looks a lot like the way it is now.

Read more: http://www.recordnet.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20100808/A_OPINION0611/8080317/-1/A_OPINION

[givemebackmycountry]

1. THIS is a great line....

The problem with trying to do that in Arizona, where Mexicans are indigenous, is that "the way it used to be" looks a lot like the way it is now.

And that's true in a few more places than just Arizona.

[pgodbold]

3. I agree, you don't come across a line that perfect everyday. nt

[MellowDem]

22. Not very good line at all...

Mexicans aren't indigenous to Arizona. The territory Mexico claimed was a European creation. Mexico claimed territory that was owned by the indigenous Indians of that land, who did not and do not consider themselves Mexicans.

Either way, the idea that there is any true "native" is a rather stupid idea, one that hopefully will die fast.

[EFerrari]

27. Who do you think Mexicans are, exactly?

And yes, there are indigenous people in these United States. Don't let yourself be the last to know.

[Igel]

40. There are indigenous peoples in Arizona.

The Yup'ik are not indigenous to Arizona. Neither are the descendents of the Maya or Aztecs.

The problem is twofold: What does "indigenous" mean? What's the area under discussion?

For the latter, some people assert that if you're born in the Americas you're indigenous to every place in the Americas. That's rather like saying that the Norwegians are indigenous to Thailand or the Chinese are indigenous to Britain. I demand my right to migrate back to my Scots-Irish homeland, the Maldives. The Yup'ik are indigenous to the Atacama, one would think, and the Mixtec to Greenland. But they're not, are they?

The second is "indigenous." The meaning keeps shifting. Does it mean that the ethnicity first became distinct in that area? That the racial features developed in that area? That the people living there are the currently surviving inhabitants whose ancestors lived there the longest?

By the first, Navajos and Apaches aren't indigenous to Arizona. Both are immigrants. They may not have spoken the current language and had the current culture, but they were distinct prior to immigration. American whites aren't "Europeans"; our culture and mix of genes is different, if a bit patchy. This definition does handle the Chagossians, though, known to be the descendants of immigrants--voluntary or not--from the very late 1700s and early 1800s. (Gee, my mother's family immigrated to the US in the late 1700s. We're indigenous!)

The racial features for most immigrants to Arizona developed elsewhere. Oddly, since African-Americans with a long family history in the US are genetically distinct from Africans as a whole, they *are* indigenous to the US. At least portions of it.

If we go by ancestors' place of habitation, then "Anglos" are as indigenous to Maryland as the Spanish are to Mexico (since we use the Spanish word for my ancestors oppressors to describe me, let's use the English word of the Central Americans' oppressors to describe them.)

We could go back a bit further. Then, of course, the "indigenous populations" of the Americas are found to be Asians.

Most of those definitions don't match what you want. I can't think of one that just includes what you want included while excluding what you want excluded.

You want Yup'ik to be considered indigenous to Patagonia, just as the Aymara are indigenous to the Sonora and the Zapotecs to Alberta--but only as needed. If it's not "only as needed" then having the Cherokee given reservation land in Oklahoma is justifiable--after all, they're indigenous there, right? In other words, the word "indigenous" and the area under discussion are changeable, and only certain groups have the right to impose their linguistic usage on others.

[EFerrari]

61. Sophistry fail. n/t

[Desertrose]

36. What?!

"Mexicans aren't indigenous to Arizona. The territory Mexico claimed was a European creation. Mexico claimed territory that was owned by the indigenous Indians of that land, who did not and do not consider themselves Mexicans."



From Wikipedia -" All of present-day Arizona became part of the Mexican State of Vieja California upon the Mexican assertion of independence from Spain in 1822."

This makes them Mexicans and indigenous to Arizona...

....and yeah, just who do you think Mexicans are?

[Igel]

41. Why did it do so?

Did the indigenous population vote?

No. It based its claim upon independence from Spain on the fact that Arizona was part of Spanish territory that belonged to Mexico and was administered by Mexico.

This is precisely the same sort of "inherited from the empire" claim that Argentina often uses to claim the Malvinas/Falklands.

I guess you're right, though. The Apaches, Zuni, O'odham, and Navajo are definitely Mexicans. After all, they were part of Mexico.

Then again, that makes the Cherokee, the Algonquian, and the Cree English, and means that the English are indigenous to Virginia and New Hampshire.

[JonLP24]

51. Most Mexicans

As well as Mexican-Americans have Native American blood. Vice versa as well.

[marmar]

2. In other words, many people are fine with harmonious race relations.....

..... as long as they get to be the majority.

[xchrom]

4. They're fine until some one drives in wedge.

That's how I would say it.

[Bobbieo]

6. I live in a border town in southwest AZ and will be willing to be that most of the Anglo

Democrats that were in the club I belonged to several years ago DID NOT vote for Obama.

[TheDebbieDee]

10. Anglos are terrified of becoming a minority in areas of this country!

Is it because they secretly fear being treated as they have treated minorities? Are they terrified of losing their "white priviledge" status? A status that they currently will not even admit exists?

[Tempest]

15. Whites will still be the dominant race

It's not like the Asians, Blacks and Hispanics are all going to group together against the whites.

[TheDebbieDee]

18. So why are they SO damned scared?

The Asians, Blacks and Hispanics of this country would never treat any group (other than women, I guess) as badly as the Anglos have treated them. At least, I can't imagine that happening.........

[Tempest]

19. Because their leaders (religious right and GOP) are breeding fear

That's how they use their power and influence.

[Xicano]

39. See post #38

Hi Tempest. :hi:

[Tempest]

49. Hiya back!

Great post! Thanks.

:toast:

[Igel]

42. "I can't imagine that happening."

A lot of whites have trouble imagining dragging a black man by a chain from the back of a truck.

A lot of whites had trouble imagining the concentration camps in Germany and in Croatia.

A lot of blacks had trouble imagining Rwanda or Zimbabwe.

A lot of Arabs and Turks have trouble imagining the black slave trade that Arabs conducted for far longer than a millennium, even under the Ottoman's, and still deny the anti-Jewish and anti-Christian pogroms that happened at their ancestors' hands. Remember, the Russian national poet, Pushkin, had an black ancestor taken from Africa by Arabs and given to the Turkish sultan, who then gave him to Peter the Great.

We can't imagine New Guineans or Native Americans as waging genocide, but they did.

Lack of imagination is a bad premise for making any positive assertion. As long as sufficient members each ethnicity thinks they're somehow morally superior or special, the stage is set for them to fail to notice atrocities. Lack of imagination prevents planning to forestall such things. Lack of imagination leads to early denials of possibility, and by the time they're forced to accept it lots of dead bodiesm, people killed because of religion or ethnicity, are scattered about and rotting.

[Xicano]

38. Hi DebbieDee.

Here's a video clip of a guy named Tim Wise speaking about this "priviledge" status.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J3Xe1kX7Wsc

[JonLP24]

52. +1

That video first came to mind reading the questions on what exactly do they want to go back to? Tim Wise explains it perfectly what the Teabaggers wants to go back to.

Actually this is the video I was thinking of.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nj5vFl-YxaI

About 10-30 minutes into it he explains what it is exactly the tea party wants to go back to.

[Xicano]

64. +1

Thanks for the link JonLP24. I watched it and Time Wise lays it out pretty good. I remember seeing another video of one of his lectures and thought he had done a good job on that one too.


Peace,
Xicano

[Ken Burch]

16. Also known as "we'll get along just fine...as long as you remember I'M THE BOSS"

Too many of the Anglos were still secretly obsessed with turning the pozole into salt-free, low-fat, tomato rice soup-or maybe "Tomatoey-flavored", since tomatoes sometimes DON'T taste bland.

[AlbertCat]

24. as long as they get to be the majority.

Bingo.


And I don't believe AZ "Used to live in harmony". Yeah, like the South during that "separate but equal" thing. Everything was just about hunky dory....those darker skinned folks knew their place!

[blondeatlast]

32. I've lived here since well before the state had a million citizens.

I grew up in a small community where we most assuredly did get along. Everyone? Hell no--but the kind of palpable hate that is so obvious today was NOT tolerated 20 years ago.

[Downwinder]

5. Time goes only in one direction.

[SoapBox]

17. Very...well...said...

and it is not backward, no matter how some people try.

This whole thing reminds me of the Star Trek: Next Generation episode, where a planet
was ready to explore space with warp drive. I believe that some of the Enterprise
crew revealed themselves to persons on the planet. BUT, there was a group of persons
that simply would not believe that others existed outside of their planet/society (like
it feels here a lot...the universe circles around Earth and there is no one else out there).

The denial group was flipping out...that's how I think of all these Haters these days.

[BeFree]

7. well shoot

All this time I thought the Arizona law was about illegal immigration.

And now we see it is nothing more than out of the closet racism.
Racism on a state-wide scale. Gov. enforced racism.

If the whites start a war, they will lose.

[Tempest]

8. WTF???

the fear that whites would eventually become a statistical minority in Arizona just as they are in California, Texas and New Mexico.

That's not true of California or Texas.
http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/06000.html

[Warpy]

9. It is true in New Mexico and we all like it just fine

and wouldn't change the cultural mix that makes this state unique for anything.

[Tempest]

12. Traveled around NM in 1998

And loved it.

The people, of all races, were friendly and accommodating.

Santa Fe is a beautiful city due to the Mexican influence in its architecture. And I was lucky enough to visit Bandelier before the fires.

[BarbaRosa]

45. +1

so true, Warpy

[BarbaRosa]

46. dupe

[EFerrari]

28. The right has bee working this fear as long as I can remember

here in California.

[pampango]

56. My guess is that the author is referring to non-Hispanic whites (42.3% in 2008: California).

They had Hispanics at 36.6%, Asians at 12.5%, Blacks at 6.7%, and others at 1.9%. Of course, it all depends on how you want to count Hispanic whites, but that seems to be how you can come up with whites as a minority in California. The census seems to group all Hispanics together, regardless of their race, rather than divide them up between whites, blacks, etc.

Likewise the census has non-Hispanic whites in Texas at 47.4%, Hispanics at 36.5%, Blacks at 11.9%, and Asians at 3.5%.

Maybe it's more accurate to say that in racial terms whites are still a majority in both states, but in terms of ethnicity Anglo whites are a minority.

[SoapBox]

11. wow...there are so many great one-liners in this article...

This was one of my favorites:

"For many Americans, this was a sign the country was changing too fast for their taste. And, for their own comfort level, they wanted to change it back to the way it used to be."

...the country was changing too fast?

SO, maybe those WHITE AZ persons would be happier if maybe 2, 3, 4 thousand YEARS pass before they are able to accept people with color in their skin? 'Cause that is what it seems to be about! And change it back? Like roll back time? Gads...

"the fear factor went through the roof when Barack Obama was elected president"

THAT is the key...that "n-word" guy that moved into OUR (as in the white guy's) White House.

I cannot get over how a segment of America imploded over this...the hate, hate, hate that is spewing is unbelievable.

[Tempest]

14. The very definition of conservative

Is resistance to change.


disposed to preserve existing conditions, institutions, etc., or to restore traditional ones, and to limit change.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/conservative

[Edweird]

13. Maybe it wasn't as 'harmonious' as you believe.

[Alexander]

20. I lived in the Phoenix area for 6 years - it was incredibly racist.

This was from about 2003 to 2009.

A huge number of the people I encountered tossed around racist language as casually as people discuss the weather. I heard the n-word used more times than I can count.

Most of the racial epithets I heard were used by white people against black or Latino people. Although every now and again I'd encounter someone of one minority who hated those of another minority.

Of course, the fact that Sheriff Joe has been there since the early 90s speaks volumes about Maricopa County's attitude towards racial tolerance.

I was quite pleased to see Phoenix in my rearview mirror - and I don't expect I'll be going back any time soon.

[jaysunb]

30. I'll second everything you wrote !

Although I live in So California, I have always dreaded trips to Arizona. Being Black, over there chills me to the bone, no matter how hot it is. :evilfrown:

[blondeatlast]

33. I've lived here essentially my whole life--and I'll tell you that something changed

in the late '90s.

The blatant racism wasn't tolerated before then, although I know there was a lot of latent racism. I try to figure out what happened, I just can't for the life of me understand.

[classysassy]

43. The carpetbaggers arrived

and they brought their racism with them.Brewer from california,McCain from texas/panama,Kyl from colorada,Sheriff Joe from new england,Peerce from utah.Hayworth from north carolina,all of those snow birds that decided to remain here in arizona,all of those senior citizens with old racist views that they can act out in this climate..

[rufus dog]

47. Lived in Phx until 85

and it was basically a segregated city. Very few blacks outside of the South Mountain area, City Council Districts were gerrymandered to have one rep from that area and all others from safe Republican districts.

Most of the locals were wannabe Texans, (hell the Dallas Cowboy stickers outnumbered rebel flags)so IMO it was the locals along with those carpetbaggers and retirees who make AZ what it is and always will be.

[blondeatlast]

48. Could be; I lived in Pinal County at that time and it was actually pretty harmonious.

But I agree that many of the older parts of Phoenix are quite segregated. I live in a much newer part that is pretty affluent but there is a healthy representation of African-Americans--but very, very few Hispanics.

[rufus dog]

55. rather than edit mine I will respond to yours

AZ as a whole has the possibility to change. Maricopa County/Phoenix has always held the state back from moving forward.

[blondeatlast]

58. I couldn't agree more. I'm trying to find work outside of Maricopa County

even if it means moving.

I hate the atmosphere here--people just assume that I think like they do. :scared:

[KeepCongressBlue]

63. that's the strange thing about Arizona

in many other states like Illinois or Texas the rural areas are much more liberal than the rest of the state, in AZ the urban area is slightly more conservative than the rest of the state. I've always what the matter with Maricopa County is. It has the fifth largest city in the country and host to a large college in the liberal PAC-10. Usually that is the recipe for liberalism.

[KeepCongressBlue]

62. you're spot on about the wannabe texans part

have you seen the movie raising Arizona. It came out that same time period and it had that redneck vibe to it too.

[Zoeisright]

21. Gee, perhaps if white people had treated ethic minorities better,

they wouldn't be afraid now.

What goes around comes around.

[Skip Intro]

23. Hopefully this will be addressed at the next White People's meeting.

:eyes:

[KeepCongressBlue]

25. My grandparents lived in Phoenix for a while

they told me that Phoenix started as a whitopia in the 1950s. It was the epitome of the American dream where you could get an affordable house, good schools, and the temperatures rarely below freezing. Here is an advertisement for a subdivision from 1958:

Maryvale! Fortunate home of the American dream. A single-family detached house in the suburbs: three bedrooms, living room, den, all-electric kitchen and carport, laid out in a neat rectangle of a one-story ranch house. We've got thousands of 'em, ready to sell, on safe winding streets in brand-new Phoenix. New as a hoola hoop. New as a teal '58 Chevy. New as this morning's hope. Leave behind those snow shovels and below-zero winters. Leave behind the old dingy cities of the East and Midwest, with their crime and racial trouble. Time for a fresh start, thanks to a VA mortgage and the FHA. You've earned it: backyard lifestyle with a new swimming pool. Here in Phoenix, its eighty degrees in January, and in summer, we've got air-conditioning. Green lawns, blond children, pink sunsets. All in Maryvale.

In the 1980s, many white people moved out of Maryvale because of an inordinate amount of cancer cases. The prices of the house plummeted and a lot of poor people moved in and turned it into a ghetto. In my opinion, Phoenix now is the epitome of white flight and the big sort.

[Downwinder]

26. You can see the seeds for today in the ad. "...blond children..,"

[EFerrari]

29. That was true for suburbia all over the country. n/t

[Tempest]

54. Whites should look to the message of Albus Dumbledore

Kreacher, Sirius Black's house elf, turned him over to the Death Eaters because of the treatment he received.

"I warned Sirius when we adopted twelve Gimmauld Place as our headquarters that Kreacher must be treated with kindness and respect. ... I do not think that Sirius took me very seriously, or that he ever saw Kreacher as a being with feelings as acute as a human's."

[blondeatlast]

31. AZ ReBPublicans were stirring the fear before Obama, but

it is a rather recent development.

[Odin2005]

34. The bigots are nauseating.

[jaysunb]

35. Nice article, but I have nothing but contempt for Ruben Navarrette

I'm glad to see that he may have finally taken off his Republican "blinders."

I've always considered him the Alan Keyes of the Latino community. His hate for Democrats and Liberals is astounding considering the plight of NON illegal Latinos. I thought he would learn something from Prop 187, but...

Ever heard of the site Townhall ? Check out one of their feature contributors:
http://townhall.com/columnists/RubenNavarretteJr

I hope they arrest him the next time he ventures over there. :evilfrown:

[blondeatlast]

37. Wow, he must've changed his tune since he left Phoenix.

He used to be one of the few consistently left columnists at the Arizona Republic (and yes, this Phoenician realizes that means toeing the center at the very least).

[Romulox]

44. What's an "Anglo"? Is it anything like a "Spaniard"?

:hi:

[Celeborn Skywalker]

53. In the SW

We use it to generally describe an english speaker of non-black, indian, or hispanic descent.

An assimilated Spaniard might be called an Anglo but I don't know.

[Romulox]

57. So...English speakers call other English speakers (who aren't English) "Anglo"?

Sounds both ignorant and mildly racist.

"An assimilated Spaniard might be called an Anglo but I don't know."

"Spaniard", when used indiscriminately, is considered offensive by many.

[Celeborn Skywalker]

60. I wasn't saying it's correct or proper.

I personally think it's a stupid term because I'm mostly Irish and the term anglo IS kind of offensive for me.

I'm pretty much just saying that many around here use the term for non-hispanic white people.

[Romulox]

66. And I knew very well what it meant when I asked.

Rhetoric........

Rhetoric.

[JonLP24]

59. People of European descent

Usually.

[Romulox]

65. Most Mexicans are said to be of mixed heritage. So that doesn't work, either. nt

[JonLP24]

50. Wow- I didn't know about that stat

I thought Arizona was on pace to become the first majority minority state but your article says they're 3 already. I didn't know that.