"Obama=Bush" is a strawman. Obama Wants us to pressure him!

[Gold Metal Flake]

Don't take the bait of the "Obama=Bush" insult at face value. President Obama has stated several times that if Liberals and progressives want change that we need to force him. Continue the pressure, and apply more. No need to get caught up in a conservative diversion. We have been insulted? How is that different than any other day? To say that it is different because it comes from the President's spokesman is a bit naive in my opinion. I expect it. Consider it a challenge to apply more pressure. Imagine it not as a means to marginalize but as a veiled attempt to energize. If the admin had asked Liberals for help, they would be smothered by he corporate conservative media blanket of hate, right? So maybe this is the only way for the admin to ask the Left for help in terms of real pressure for change.

Keep up the pressure on the admin for Elizabeth Warren, for starters.

Of course, I could be wrong. Will responders be polite or will they respond like Gibbs?


Edited to change subject (I SUCK at subject lines) and spelling.

[villager]

1. I'm not sure your headline does your OP justice -- you're right about the need for constant pressure

...from a liberal/left base that's constantly dismissed, told they're powerless or on-the-fringe, yet simultaneously held responsible for the failings of gutless Democratic centrism.

(And note it's a "center" that's been pulled far to the right in the last 30 years, so even using a word like "centrism" is a dodge...)

[Gold Metal Flake]

7. I adjusted it. I suck at thread titles.

It just took a little while to cool off and remeber that Obama has asked for pressure. Like FDR telling civil rights workers "make me" change segregation laws. it's an honest request, not a bully's retort.

I hope I am right.

[moksha]

2. Good post. It was a strawman.

There are valid arguments to be made that Obama has continued *some* Bush policies. There is no denying, actually, that he has embraced and even expanded some Bush policies.

Gibbs chose the frame as a way to proclaim that the WH are not the same as the left. Of course we already know this. Gibbs has certainly put out the invitation for the left to push the hell of them.

[Radical Activist]

I see the sentiment Gibbs refers to every day on DU.

They're mostly echoing a few professional pundits and bloggers. A comment from yesterday comes to mind. Someone arguing that Obama is actually to the RIGHT of Bush and Bill Clinton. That's pretty fucking ignorant.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=8911038&mesg_id=8912023

[Gold Metal Flake]

20. I see the comments Gibbs USED every day on DU.

It's like a Fox News echo chamber in here sometimes.

[FiveGoodMen]

3. "if Liberals and progressives want change that we need to force him"

Hmmm.

Say you get married, your spouse cheats on you over and over.

You complain.

They say, "If you want me to be faithful, you have to follow me around everywhere and prevent me from doing the wrong thing. Otherwise, it's your fault that I'm betraying you."

:puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke: :puke:

[Gold Metal Flake]

8. I could be wrong, but we need to look at it.

[FiveGoodMen]

14. The thing is, we can't force him to do anything.

We can't pressure him to do anything.

The only pressure we could possibly apply is threatening not to vote for him next time.

There's absolutely no power that an American citizen has to pressure the president to do anything.

"We have to force him," is just a way of transferring the blame for anything he does wrong onto us.

That's absolutely all it is.

It's like blaming someone when their loved one dies by say, "Well, you didn't pray for them hard enough."

"We have to force him," is just total fucking bullshit. There isn't even a tiny grain of truth in it. It just makes everything look like our fault.

As it was intended.

[DJ13]

4. This Gibbs flap looks like a deliberate ploy to split the base

A sort of "with us or against us" designed to solidify the center (left and right) and dismiss the left.

All in all a cynical move that signifies a big "F U" to those who worked the hardest to get Obama elected.

[Gold Metal Flake]

15. Well, that was my initial reaction.

I'm used to American politics being money vs. worker with the parties being nothing but facades. But if Obama is different like I keep hearing, how would we know?

[dflprincess]

5. How much pressure does it take?

We tried awfully hard during the insurance debate and were ignored - some were even arrested.

[Gold Metal Flake]

10. That's true.

Maybe a weeks-long siege at the white house. Would that even be possible?

[spoony]

6. Except he was apparently lying when he said that

or he wouldn't be sending his henchmen to call us druggie retards, and saying the same thing in nicey-nice President-speak the other day.

[geek tragedy]

31. He was right when he said that people who think Obama is just like

Bush are drug-addled mental misfits.

They are.

[newtothegame]

9. At what point did all rebuttals on DU switch to a full-on dismissal of the OP?

I'm not attacking your post in particular, but the general discussions on DU. So few replies here anymore seem to be based on the content of the OP, in fact many replies don't even respond to the original content at all, they just dismiss the OP as a "straw-man post," or "lock-step post," or "apologist post." When did people become so afraid to actually read a post and respond to the questions and issues raised therein?

ed for sp

[Gold Metal Flake]

13. Sometimes folks just read the thread title and respond.

And sometimes they get called on it with hilarious comments. But, yeah, I know what you mean.

[Morning Dew]

11. Insults from Gibbs is a conservative diversion. n/m

[BeFree]

12. They feel the pressure

And they are caught in a squeeze between us and the RW.

They are only human so when we bite they cry out in pain.

I guess our bite is worse than the RW?

[Gold Metal Flake]

16. Is it really?

Or are we a weaker target?

If it looks like I am a bit confused and an bit lost in this thread it's because I am. I know I am not the only one on DU that feels this way.

[BeFree]

30. well

Mine is a positive spin.

They know they are dependent upon us to stay in office. They know we are pissed.

They know the RW will never support them and like any human they tend to lash out at those who they are most dependent upon because we are so close.

Or it could be that they feel we are costing them money.

Frankly, the whole situation is confusing, so don't feel like you are special.

[Kurovski]

17. K&R. (nt)

[Radical Activist]

18. He's asked for the left to pressure him and Congress since before he took office.

It's pathetic how many people don't get it. They think they placed an order with a waiter on election day and they're just sitting back complaining that the food hasn't arrived yet. That's not how this works. It's supposed to be a potluck. Everyone pitches in.

[DJ13]

19. Pressure doesnt work

See how fast the WH threw the PO overboard in the HCR debate for an example.

[Gold Metal Flake]

21. Seems the PO was never a aprt of the discussion in reality.

So, I am open to being wrong. What if I am? What do we do then?

[Radical Activist]

27. I don't believe pressure was applied in the right places.

First, there are many examples where pressure does work, like the fact that we got major HCR passed into law.
In that case, I believe it was a tactical mistake to focus on crying betrayal at the WH when we should have been focused on badgering the Senate.

[gkhouston]

22. If the President is incapable of doing his job properly without "pressure" from us,

he needs to think about finding a different job. I'm not feeling like being a codependent mindreader today.

[Poll_Blind]

25. Yeah, I more agree than not with you. And here I thought the big hurdle was getting him elected.

Now it's convincing him to play for the people who elected him. Sweet. That's about as lovely a thought as bone cancer. Anyway, I'm in a pissy mood about it so I'm being harsher than I will probably feel about it tomorrow but there's where I am right now.

PB

[Poll_Blind]

23. I actually agree with you. Alot. Obama has made it pretty clear that...

...if you want him to work your angle, you have to pressure him to do it. This is a huge change from Bush who obviously had an agenda from literally day one. At this point, I'm sour on the idea that even though he's being honest about what you need to do to get him to move a certain way on an issue, he "needs a little more help" to run further Left.

Especially considering how much of his huge campaign warchest came from very small donations by people who were desperate for a return from the Bush-era crap. I was frankly hoping we would have purchased with those donations someone who was going to play by the script.

Oh well, it could be worse. Obama's not "hold your nose and vote" bad in my book, but he needs a lot of work. When we elected this guy the last thing I thought was that he'd continue so many of the Bush policies. I'm still glad I voted for him. Of the other Democratic candidates, aside from Kucinich, I'm still certain he was the best choice. Which is also a little saddening. But that's for another post, entirely.

So the answer is more people demonstrating, putting more public pressure on the president. Except that's the last thing the DLC wants and they're quite a force in the party right now. They will marginalize any and all who use this tactic and that means the individuals who will attempt to use this tool on the President will receive little or no support and most-likely ridicule for their efforts. Obama knows this. He really does have an uphill battle and so do we. Let's face it: I think it's arguable that even as a Democratic president, his ability to unite Democratic Senators (especially) is debatable at best. Not a whole lot of Democratic Senators strike me as what I'd like to think of as Democratic or "Left" to begin with.

It's part cop-out on Obama's part but it's probably more absolute truth. And it's a telling one. Progressives are never in charge of the government. Not like the right. The best we can do is to elect someone who will at least respond to pressure. And the way I've seen Obama work, I believe he's being honest when he makes statements like that- like the one he gave to the recent NetRoots gathering.

PB

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

24. There's a difference between "pressure" and all the shit these twerps are doing.

[Gold Metal Flake]

26. Hi, Mr. Gibbs!

[HiFructosePronSyrup]

28. Hi, guy who had it coming.

[Gold Metal Flake]

32. That's what they all say!

As you well know!

[Duke Newcombe]

29. Ah yes. The old "3-D Chessmaster" gambit.

Sorry...I don't believe it anymore.