parallels between now and Gilded Age of 1800's ?

[steve2470]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gilded_Age

The end of the Gilded Age coincided with the Panic of 1893, a deep depression. The depression lasted until 1897 and marked a major political realignment in the election of 1896. After that came the Progressive Era.

I don't know how accurate that quote is, but the part that interested me was the beginning of the Progressive Era, which, I think, we would all be approving of. I know our era is fundamentally different, but could another progressive era be coming in the next decade or so ? I hope so.

[kentuck]

1. I think that is possible.

Good post.

[Mendocino]

2. Some consider the Gilded Age

lasting till 1913 when income tax for most of the population was levied. The Roaring 20's and the open stock market was a last hurrah before the depression and war.

On progressives, would Teddy Roosevelt be a Democrat today?

[nadinbrzezinski]

Nope, see Biull Moose party

Teddy these days would form a third party AGAIN, and run on it's ticket.

[nadinbrzezinski]

4. Nope, see Biull Moose party

Teddy these days would form a third party AGAIN, and run on it's ticket.

[Mendocino]

8. Like the Greens?

(except for his war mongering)

[nadinbrzezinski]

10. Not quite, last time I checked

Bull Moose pulled dissatisfied people from BOTH the Rs and the Ds. The Greens don't do that.

The last attempt at something like this that worked the same was Ross Perot.

[nadinbrzezinski]

3. Where do you want me to start?

That is why I don't think the excesses will be truly over until three things happen:

1.- Tea pot scandal... we are not there yet... moving towards it. At times it feels like at galloping pace.

2.- Labor takes to the streets. I fear that is even more far away than Tea Pot.

3.- People read a little history and realize just how similar we are.

Suffice it to say the corps are people started with a USSC note on a court opinion during this period.

[steve2470]

5. Tea pot ? As in Tea Pot Dome ? nt

[nadinbrzezinski]

6. Yep, the same

[steve2470]

7. ok ty

[Hannah Bell]

14. teapot dome = 1922. progressive era = 1890-1921.

[PufPuf23]

9. One thing I learned about the oil gusher and BP

We sell the public commons to international corporations under contract terms adjusted for time not unlike resulted in Iran, Iraq, Ecuador, and Venezuela when they chose nationalization.

The fact is on domestic oil contracts, American citizens do not get a fair return. This is ascerbated as we are no longer an oil-reserve rich nation.

The Guilded Age, Roaring 29s, and now are the periods of history when wealth, income, and taxation were most disproportionate in favor of the wealthy and powerful. Fact.

A mixed economy -- that we already have -- true controls on capitalism and a strong social safety net -- are the only sane and pragmatic course. Insanity is losing more of the public commons at a discount to short-term paper profiters. Insanity is too much war.

[Hannah Bell]

15. The top three oil producing countries are Saudi Arabia, Russia, and the United States.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Petroleum

http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0922041.html.

[PufPuf23]

19. I was talking of oil reserves not current domestic production

One point I was trying to make was that oil leases from federal lands (the public commons) are sold at relatively cheap pices and lower return to USA citizens.

The USA is 3rd in production but first in use and first in net imports.

The USA does not have the natural resource base (oil reserves) to supply present consumption nor continue domestic production.

The chart below that I copied from your link does not reflect newer assessments; example the US Geological Service now estimates Venezuel has 200 + billion barrels of recoverable oil (oil reserves) from a more recent report.

===================================================================================================

Greatest Oil Reserves by Country, 2007

The table below lists the countries with the largest oil reserves in the world, as of 2007. The information was compiled by the US Energy Information Administration.

Rank Country Proved reserves
(billion barrels)
1. Saudi Arabia 262.3
2. Canada 179.21
3. Iran 136.27
4. Iraq 115
5. Kuwait 101.5
6. United Arab Emirates 97.8
7. Venezuela 80.012
8. Russia 60
9. Libya 41.464
10. Nigeria 36.22
11. Kazakhstan 30
12. United States 21.757
13. China 16
14. Qatar 15.207
15. Mexico 12.352
16. Algeria 12.27
17. Brazil 11.773
18. Angola 8
19. Norway 7.849
20. Azerbaijan 7

Top 20 countries 1252.04 (95%)
Rest of world 65.4 (5%)
World total 1,317.447

NOTES: Proved reserves are estimated with reasonable certainty to be recoverable with present technology and prices.
Source: U.S. Energy Information Administration. http://tonto.eia.doe.gov/ .

http://www.infoplease.com/science/energy/oil-reserves-2007.html#axzz0x4XiRbPR


Read more: Greatest Oil Reserves by Country, 2007 — Infoplease.com http://www.infoplease.com/science/energy/oil-reserves-2007.html#ixzz0x4YDhYk7

[pnorman]

11. You might want to search out two books by Matthew Josephson, written in thee 30s.

"Robber Barons" and "The Politicos"

[pnorman]

12. The above books by Josephson are mentioned in this article: "The Lost World of Gilded Age Politics"

http://history.missouristate.edu/wrmiller/populism/texts/lost_world_of_gilded_age_pol.htm

Some time back, I had found the complete edition of "The Politicos" in HTML format on-line. I'll see if I can find it again.

[steve2470]

13. thanks for your research, kind of you nt

[steve2470]

17. self-delete nt

[steve2470]

16. any other thoughts ? nt

[old mark]

18. Rec - I have thought this before - there are similarities and of course differences, but

the spirit of the times seems similar...big money runs the nation for its own benefit with no reagard for society or the country in general...The GOP really seems to want to destroy the middle class entirely, leaving low paid poorly educated workers with nothing and the owners of everything.

Sort of a mix of the Guilded Age and some '50's futurist Sci Fi...


mark