Getting involved in my neighbor's business, yes or no?

[noamnety]

This is odd timing, given another epic thread going on at the moment. But anyway, here goes.

Tonight during dinner my husband turned on the tv, there was nothing much on (can't quite hang with the bachelor pad or beauty contestant scene). I don't know why he likes to watch city council meetings on tv. (He likes the weather channel, too.) Tonight was code violation night. Most seemed to be vacant houses with nobody at the meeting to represent the violator. But one was a couple who recently bought a house that had been vacant for a year or so, maybe longer. They bought it, they were struggling to get it up to code, but they keep getting cited by people for preexisting problems they haven't had a chance to fix yet. Tonight's main issue was a fence around a swimming pool that's missing boards.

They kept asking for more time because they said they've spent all their money, they need to save up to fix it properly, and they don't understand why they have one week to fix a problem that predated them by at least a year. They both work, they can't take time off from their jobs.

My husband says don't get involved, but I looked up their address. They're only a mile and a half away from me, and I have a pile of excess cedar boards I got in a craigslist deal. Do I drop by their house and offer the boards? Do I offer some free labor as well since it's not gonna kill me to help them out this week? Or do I stay out of it because they might be embarrassed that someone saw them in the pathetic Rat-Your-Neighbor-Out show on tv? We might be the only people who watched it, the camera panned the audience at the town hall, every single seat in the camera shot was empty. I don't want them thinking everyone in our city has watched their public shaming.

[KittyWampus]

1. Offer the help with the attitude "I know what it's like to deal w/ neighbors."

edit- in fact, those would be just about the first words out of my mouth.

And I"d probably just show up with the materials with me at the same time. And maybe some beers or sodas or cookies or something.

Remember when neighbors got together and helped each out?

[noamnety]

19. Showing up with at least one board would make sense.

They aren't anything great - they were used when we got them, I crowbarred them off a bunch of privacy fence panels. But at least they are cedar. These ones here:



(I realize how OCD I am that I have photos of used boards online, but I was proud of turning them into raised beds in my garden.)

It wouldn't lead to a professional looking fence but it sounded like the city wanted them to fix the holes in the fence now for safety reasons since they have the swimming pool, and save up for a new fence in the spring. The existing fence was already scraggly and mismatched colors, it's hard to believe we could do anything to make it worse. I know nothing about fences though. :)

[KittyWampus]

31. I scavenged pickets from an old graveyard fence sitting in piles on the side of the road.

But didn't get photos :)

[petronius]

2. I think it would be very appropriate to offer to help out

Perhaps you can leave a note with your # when they're not home, so they can ignore it if the embarrassment would be too much?

[noamnety]

20. A note has some advantages

the main one being that I hate knocking on people's doors! I tried that once with moveon, and the stress was not worth it at all for me.

Maybe a note along with a photo of the boards.

[Vickers]

3. I vote to get involved.

I went around and helped about 12 of my neighbors reattach roof tiles after Hurricane Wilma went through here. You could tell that they weren't used to getting (or asking for) help, but there simply weren't enough professional roofers to go around.

Once you jump that initial hurdle, it'll be OK.

Good luck to you (and them!).

[RandomThoughts]

4. I know some things that think they can use shaming as some training tool

Ha, I say, Ha.

LOL

I can't be shamed, I know who I am :) However smearing and shaming are not the same thing.

[mzteris]

5. You're a wonderful person

and yes, I think you should offer the boards - and the time, if you're so inclined. The world needs MORE "good neighbors".

I can't imagine their being upset, but if they are, then it truly would be their problem and not yours.

[noamnety]

23. It's more paying it forward than being a great person. :)

I got all those boards for free and used what I needed, so it makes sense to donate the rest to a good cause if we can.

[mzteris]

25. I wasn't just talking about this incident -

and volunteering your time really would be over and above...

[realisticphish]

6. I second KW

Just say "damn, those people are being assholes about you guys. I know you're busy as hell, do you need a hand? I'd be happy to help get them off your back"

Or something like that. Commiserate with them

The worst they can do is say no :shrug:

[noamnety]

32. I like the commiserating with them idea.

Also I can portray this as my husband wanting me to get this excess material out of our yard (which has a grain of truth. He hasn't complained out it, but I know it bugs him when I let things like that pile up sometimes.)

[blaze]

7. I vote for offer to help. n/t

[yawnmaster]

8. Its already a public issue. Ask them if they'd like your help and then go by their answer...

there may be other issues going on with them, one never knows with these things.
but then again, it may truly be a black and white issue - they want to fix things up but need more time/money.
offer help and see what they say - my opinion.

[Luciferous]

9. I think that it's nice of you to want to help them out, so go for it!

[lisa58]

10. If you have the resources and know how...

...do it. How can it hurt - all they can say is, no (which they won't) and if it was me, I'd want someone to care.

[noamnety]

24. I definitely got the sense they felt nobody cared.

It was sad to watch, they were an older couple and the woman kept saying they've been working so hard to get all the parts of the house up to code, and they work full time, she said she was so exhausted she could barely stand up.

[Merlot]

11. If someone did something like that for me, it would make my day!

I say, make their day.

[Ineeda]

12. They sound like nice people, and responsible ones.

I'd definitely offer to help. That's what neighbors do. (Or what they used to do, not so long ago.)

[savalez]

13. Maybe send them a letter first? Explain what you saw and...

tell them that you can help them for free. Ask them to call you if they wish to take you up on the offer. If they don't call, then there's your answer. They may even call to say "no, but thank you". Anyway you might make a new friend. I dunno. Just a thought.

Write it something like this:

"Hi neighbor. Funny thing. My husband likes to watch city council meetings on tv and he saw that you might need cedar fence planks. We got a lot of them and you can have them for free! Believe me, you'd do us a big favor getting them out of our yard! Call us and we'll take them over. We'll even help you put them up! My number is ______________!"


This way you don't touch on hardships or lack of funds or anything like that.

[salvorhardin]

14. Hell yeah!

Just start out by leaving a note saying something like, "Hi, I'm Mrs. noamnety and my husband and I learned of your predicament from when we saw the city council meeting on TV last week. I know what jerks codes enforcement can be, and I just happen to have all these extra cedar boards lying around. They're yours for the taking, and if you need help getting them up to repair your fence just let me know. My phone is xxx-xxxx."

I've certainly lived in some dumps in my time and I would have loved neighbors like you.

[Withywindle]

46. I agree with this.

Maybe include the picture of the boards. A note like that is not threatening. They already knew it was on local TV and they're already humiliated - leaving a note discreetly is a way that allows them to save face. They can choose to call you or not. But I bet they'd really appreciate it.

Hell, it's just a low-tech Craigslist. Think of it like they posted an ad looking for cheap lumber to help fix a fence, and you posted an ad saying you had lumber free to a good home.

Don't tell them you're willing to do volunteer work in the note, though. Sad to say, that might make them suspicious. It's that kind of time - people are always wary of an offer that seems too good to be true. If they call, you can tell them in the phone conversation.

You are good people. :hug:

[noamnety]

59. That's what I did in the end.

No mention of offering to help install anything, I said I had the extra boards from when I got a bunch for free. I had the same thought - I don't want them thinking I'm trying to scam them to get paid for it and they'll be stuck with creeper handyman person looking for handouts once a week. I did mention though that if they wanted to arrange to get the panels I found on CL for free, I had a truck because I don't want them to not pursue that because of a problem transporting them. (If they have a truck though and can get them themselves, that would be more awesome.)

[Toucano]

15. There's no shame in not having enough money in this economy.

I think it's great to give them a hand if you're able.

[beyurslf]

16. In that situation, I would appreciate help. If they don't like, you can always

take your boards and your labor back home.

[david13]

17. Offer. But without saying anything about the violations and the meeting.

Knock knock.
Hello, we were in the neighborhood and we're a volunteer group what helps people with their property. Would we be able to help you with any repairs or anything around here?
Like that.
Then let them say, oh, you could help us with our pool fence.
Or, you git off my prop a tee. Madge, bring me muh shotgun!
dc

[noamnety]

26. Ha!

I've been ordered off someone's property before, that was fun.

I can't pull off a lie about being part of a group. They'd ask me what group, I wouldn't have a name for it, or if I came up with something, with my luck they'd be telling a bunch of friends about my group and everyone would be demanding supplies and help from me!

[david13]

29. Well, don't get involved then. dc

[BlueCheese]

18. Interesting story.

Personally, I think you should offer them the boards and your help. If I were them, I'd really appreciate it, though I might think you're a little strange for watching town hall meetings. :)

I'm not surprised that nobody was at the town hall meeting. People are too busy trying to get by, raise their kids, etc. Not many people have the time. Unfortunately, when that happens, power is easily concentrated and abused by people with big egos, such as the neighbors who keep pestering the homeowners you talked about.

Something similar is happening with the HOA in the neighborhood of some relatives. The same cabal of homeowners has occupied the board for years, presiding over elections in which only they vote and meetings that nobody attends. Suddenly, though, when my relatives made some minor uncontroversial changes to the exterior of their home, the HOA hired a lawyer to send them a letter threatening to sue them if they didn't undo the changes (at a cost of several thousand dollars). One year of arguing back and forth and it looks as if my relatives are going to lose. Of course the great majority of homeowners either like the changes or don't care.

I wonder who has that much time and inclination to nose into someone else's business. Does anyone in the country actually like the idea of HOAs, except for a few Mussolini-wannabes? The scary thing is how these few can abuse the rules and systems in place to make lives irritating for everyone else.

[noamnety]

22. HOAs scare me.

We don't have one here, thank god.

But a while back we had a new furnace put in, which necessitated a visit from the city inspector. Normally nobody leaves my house without taking a bag of vegetables or fresh herbs. I waiting til he was done and we passed because I didn't want it to be perceived as a bribe, and then accosted him about whether he cooks, and talked him into taking some herbs.

We went outside to cut some and I realized I really don't know if my garden is legal or not because it's in the front yard. It would have sucked if I offered him some stuff and then he cited me for it!

[BlueCheese]

33. In my relatives' neighborhood...

... whether you'd get cited would depend on whether you're on the board or are friendly with the board members. They approve all sorts of things for themselves that are specifically against the printed rules (which I think are ridiculously overcontrolling), but bring the hammer down on others. Now that I've read their HOA rules carefully, I can say that gardens are not allowed in the front yard. Really.

My relatives pay the mortgage and the taxes, but sometimes it seems that the HOA really owns the house.

[savalez]

36. I understand that in some places if you don't pay the dues the HOA can foreclose your home.

[Angry Dragon]

21. I say go for it

I think you have already made up your mind to help them.

As one poster said above "Remember when neighbors helped each other??"

[TheKentuckian]

27. I'd vote yes. They need the help and probably haven't a clue where to get it

It is very overwhelming when stuff starts going to crap and many of us have been programmed not to ask for help but to be quick to give it. Those are probably good people in a pickle they can't keep up with.

[MerryBlooms]

28. I'd definitely offer the help and materials.

[tammywammy]

30. I vote to leave a note n/t

[dkf]

34. That is so sweet...makes me cry. :)

It's a beautiful gesture and exactly what this cynical world needs more of. I love some of the suggested wordings too.

[pitohui]

35. i would bring over the cedar boards and offer to help them out

you don't need to mention the teevee show, you can say that your pastor or your AA sponsor or whatever suggested it as something you would like to do to improve your karma

if they are both at work, and you are a people avoider, you could just put the missing boards in place and make the repair while they are not there, which 1) avoids all human contact and 2) gives them a nice surprise when they do get home

i like that because i'm not a person who is into human contact and a secret good deed is better than a known good deed for a number of reasons

if they DO have a lot of problems, in this way, you don't meet em and get involved in their problems, and if they don't, well, you've given some people a genuine step up, sometimes all good people need is a "chance"

but any way you want to play it i say find a way to give em the damn cedar boards, save their ass and worry about any future embarrassment later...a mile and a half away is not that close, you could always say you're moving out of town blah blah blah some kind of white lie/fib so that you can help them and even if they are embarrassed they can go abt life never seeing you again

you have a good heart, you can find a way to make this work but make it fast if they only have a week...

[noamnety]

38. You're a lot like my husband

He takes care of one person's driveway when it snows - but he always acts like it's a secret operation and he mustn't get caught.

Once she came out and tried to give him 20 bucks for it and he was embarrassed, he has a job, he's not looking to take her money - and she's probably equally embarrassed by not paying because she doesn't want to be a charity case. I don't know what he's thinking though - it's hard to be stealthy when you're blasting a snow blower!

[Freetradesucks]

37. I say help them out,

they would have to be assholes to take offence, and you might make some new friends!

[applegrove]

39. Pay it forward. If they don't have the money you will be helping them out a great deal.

[uppityperson]

40. Offer to help them out, we are all in this together and helping each other helps

[flvegan]

41. Pre-existing? For a year? I'd ask if they bought an Owner's title insurance policy.

If anything was filed of public record prior to them purchasing said property and said Owner's Policy, and said policy didn't take Exception to said issues, then I'd be calling my underwriter and asking for a fat check.

Otherwise, yeah. Offer your help. Call first. Just showing up might seem a bit creepy. Real simple though. "Hey, caught your hearing on the telly, and I've got this stuff. So here you go."

[noamnety]

43. I don't have a way to call first.

I caught their address from the citation being read, but other than going to their house I don't have a way to contact them.

I don't want to seem creepy - that makes me think a note might be best instead of ringing their bell.

[flvegan]

45. Then send them a note.

Say that you caught them on tv and you've got gear you can provide and that you'd like to drop by on August X if that's okay to drop it off. If they say no, drop it off anyway.

Good looking out, btw.

[noamnety]

47. I'm laughing now.

"If they say no, drop it off anyway."

That could work for decluttering my whole basement. I'm picturing notes left on random doors around town. "I've got an old dresser I'd like to leave here on August 28 if it's okay to drop it off." And if they say no, drop it off anyway. :D

[Terra Alta]

42. I say go for it.

Help them out. Show them that compassion DOES still exist in the world. They may be slightly embarrassed at first, but they will appreciate your help in the long run.

[seabeyond]

44. i think kindness from the heart is always.... always a good thing.

if your willing and wanting, all they will say is no thank you. but you still warm them...

[earth mom]

48. Your thread is helpful and positive. I see nothing wrong with offering to help

your neighbors.

The other thread struck me as shaming to the neighbors as well as telling them how to live.

No one likes that.

Of course, we all do it here on DU all the time, but in real life, face to face? Yikes, no thanks, lol!

I think your OP is a great example of paying it forward. :thumbsup:

[tblue37]

49. Offer the boards for sure--and the help if you can. nt

[Mariana]

50. Please do offer to help.

If it were me in their position, I'd be extremely grateful.

I don't understand why they haven't covered the holes in the fence, though. It can be done very inexpensively and quickly with something like chicken wire and staples, or any old scrap wood or metal as a temporary measure. It's ugly, but it works.

I have a pool, and it's 100% the owner's responsibility to keep it safely behind an effective fence. The most important thing is to prevent someone's child or pet from crawling through a hole and drowning. The complaint may have come from a parent who's afraid their kid may do just that, and that's not unreasonable. It's even possible that the complainant talked to the owners first, only to be told the same things you heard them say at the meeting about why they weren't going to fix it any time soon.

If the fence was inadequate for a year before they bought the place, and no one was living there, the city should have dealt with it (if they were ever notified of the situation) either by repairing the fence or draining the pool.

[noamnety]

53. From what they said

They've already spent $3000 on getting the pool drained and properly cleaned - it was like a festering swamp and health hazard when they bought the place. And they had inside issues that had to be brought up to code. I didn't get the impression they were defiantly saying "We aren't going to fix it anytime soon" - it was that they had drained their accounts on downpayments, moving expenses, trying to patch everything at once, and very few people can do that for very long.

Yes, the city should have fixed it and charged the mortgage company, but they didn't. Maybe people are less likely to report a house while it's empty, thinking there's nobody there to fix the stuff anyway - who knows?

[MineralMan]

51. I think you have a very good idea. Please do what you can

to help.

[rucky]

52. Pride can really get in the way of progress.

We need to help our neighbors more. You didn't rat 'em out. They'll appreciate it.

[noamnety]

54. There's a note in their door now.

I included a photo of the boards I have.

I saw on craigslist today there's a person 2 towns away giving away a bunch of full panels of privacy fencing, they could use those to replace the whole thing properly for free instead of bodging it together board by board to repair gaps, so I gave them a link to that as well and an offer to use my truck to get them - though there's no guarantee the fence panels will still be available by the time they get home from work (or notice my note in their door).

[walldude]

55. Good job.. You should never second guess yourself when you are doing the

right thing. Even if it turns out they don't want the help(which I doubt) at least you score some karma points for making the attempt.

You know it's funny, I was in Nashville during the big flood. People were helping each other out all over the place. No one asked what party you belonged to, or whether you were here illegally, or what church you went to. People saw people in need and came through. I like to think that if you strip away all the bullshit, most people are good at heart.

[noamnety]

58. I get confused when the husband's resistant.

I'm not sure what he's worried about, he went down and helped during Katrina, he donates to charities, it's not that he's selfish or lazy. He just doesn't involve himself in other people's business uninvited. Even when we were out walking the other day and I saw the parking lot of the funeral home had caught fire from a smoker dropping their butt in some mulch, he was not going to stop in and tell them Hey, you need to go dump some water one that. There were no flames, just a slow burn with lots of smoke, but it had crept across an area already a few square feet by the time we saw it. I did stop in and take care of it because it would be pretty bad if flames erupted and we could have prevented it.

[Luciferous]

57. I hope they take you up on your offer. It's very nice of you :)

[XemaSab]

56. I would totally go help them out

Or at least drop a note in the mailbox offering help.