Who remembers the Jimmy Carter years??

[kentuck]

To me, today's political environment seems eerily similar.

But I think today's economy is worse. Inflation was bad but the unemployment rate was not that high. Like the huge debt and deficits today are not really the results of Obama's policies, neither was the inflation of the late 70's the result of Carter's policies. It was mostly the result of high energy prices that were left to fester.

The Republicans attacked Carter unmercifully. That helped Teddy Kennedy to decide to run against Carter in 1980.

There are many similarities. Carter came to Washington with his own people and was not ready for the gladiator-like atmosphere of Washington. He was not a bad President but he was not able to adapt to the political demands of the politicians.

[keith the dem]

1. The similarity is the well funded right wing smear machine

that was begun to defeat Carter.

Carter was a much better president than the media narrative gives him credit. By your statements, it sounds like you have swallowed that narrative. They are trying to set in motion the same narrative for Obama, despite his considerable accomplishments so far.

[LeFleur1]

2. At Least When Carter Was President

I was making some interest money on my savings.

[kentuck]

5. I think Carter was an historically important President...

Following Vietnam and Watergate, after people had lost faith in the government, Carter was the right man for the job at that time.

[izquierdista]

14. It was a Model T then

Now they have a Ferrari.

[Fumesucker]

3. They were some of the happiest years of my life..

I remember them fondly.

[kentuck]

7. Were you one of those "streakers"?

:-)

[Fumesucker]

I will neither confirm nor deny that accusation..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mV_gK3Zz608

[kentuck]

19. A classic!

:-)

For those that fondly remember the Carter years.

[d_r]

37. I remember that song very well

But honestly I think that video had to be made retrospectively in the 80's - look at the chicks' hair.

[Fumesucker]

47. Nope..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ray_Stevens

In 1974, Stevens recorded perhaps his most famous hit, "The Streak", which poked fun at the early-1970s fad of running nude in public, known as "streaking". It made No. 1 in both the UK and the USA and No. 3 on the country chart.

ETA: At least the *song* was done in 1974, country music had a different sensibility than pop anyway, the hair could have been from practically any era of country.

[d_r]

49. I know the song was from the 70s

You are absolutely right about that. I remember it very well. I had the record to tell the truth. Guitarzan and yakity yak and all that. But I think the video was made in retrospect in the 80s. I really think that video is 80s. I will try to find out.

[d_r]

50. OK I actually have an answsr.

The internet is amazing. Apparently it was made for a video that was released in 1992.

http://www.amazon.com/Ray-Stevens-Comedy-Video-Classics/dp/B00005Y6XY

[Cassandra]

4. The inflation...

was left over from the Vietnam war. Remember Ford idiotic WIN buttons?

[kentuck]

9. Exactly.

And the long lines to get gasoline.

[bikebloke]

17. Whip Inflation Now!

:eyes:

[SOS]

42. Since Ford issued them, I wore mine upside down....

No Immediate Miracles!

[liberal N proud]

6. Obama is being smeared far worse than Carter was

Carter didn't have to endure 24/7 media blitz criticizing his every move and breath.

[kentuck]

11. Remember Day 400 of the Iran hostage crisis...

or the killer rabbit incident?

[DURHAM D]

25. Yes - and Nightline News started up because of the Iran hostage situation.

And so began the continuous need for "news" and if necessary to fill the time just make some shit up.

I also remember paying attention for the first time to the increasing amount of Christian programing. I found it very frightening and kept asking my friends to watch a little of it so they could realize where a major portion of the country was getting their news and that it was all lies all of the time.

I didn't care much for Carter's religious bent but was truly shocked at the hypocrisy of the "so-called Christians" as they went after him. They continue in this vein to this day.

Also, the unrelenting attacks on Rosalyn Carter were shocking. A theme that has continued for all Democratic first ladies to this day.

[MilesColtrane]

29. delete

[liberal N proud]

44. Yes and how it was so mysterious that they were released as soon as raygun took office

And now we know who the true diplomat really was/is.

Todays situation with Iran might very well look much different if Jimmy had remained in office.

[Art_from_Ark]

52. Really

Carter was being smeared all the time-- for being a "yokel" peanut farmer, for having a "nutty" brother, for wearing sweaters and turning down the thermostat in the White House, and of course for Iran, which occupied at least half of each night's news programs.

[oldlib]

56. The Republicans

at that time,used ridicule of Carter as their primary strategy. The ones that I talked to always discussed him in a joking manner. Carter was an extremely qualified President and didn't deserve that kind of treatment. I personally always think of him fondly.

[Bluerthanblue]

38. Jimmy didn't have to face the racism and bigotry that

Pres. Obama is facing now. The radical 'right' was in it's infancy. Jerry Falwell was mobilizing his "moral majority".

There was an innocence to the 70's that just doesn't exist anymore. The fact that Nixon was forced to resign made it seem like it was possible for justice to prevail in government. This was before Iran/Contra, Ollie North, H.W Bush's instigation of the first Gulf war, the bogus Lewinsky investigation, the false denial by Bill Clinton-(which shouldn't have been a public issue in the first place) the theft of the election in 2000- and the hellish Bush years.

The level of hatred is higher and much more widespread in my view.

And the media, which includes the internet have given all kinds of extreme voices a mouthpiece that wasn't available back then.

It's uglier, and more volitile than ever imo.

[old mark]

8. Very similar - seems the GOP never changes tactics...they attacked

Carter no matter what he did, and it was a real shame that he was only one term.

I am wondering how much the dissatisfaction on the Democratic left is setting up Obama for the same thing...

I really want Obama to be more agressive in promoting his own successes - to us as well as to the general citizenry, and I am wondering if the obviously bad advice he seems to be getting from his people can be overcome...They have pissed off a lot of people who voted for him in '08, and much of the anger has come from thougtless, stupid remarks by his closest people.

Rec
mark

[kentuck]

12. Yep.

You are correct.

[BurtWorm]

10. Democrats attacked him too, also unmercifully

And not just from the left. Scoop Jackson attacked him as weak on defense.

Carter was a terrible president whose idea of fighting back was to be petulant and arrogant.

But you can't beat him as an ex-president.

[kentuck]

16. I don't remember Carter as "petulant and arrogant"??

Are we talking about the same person??

[BurtWorm]

21. Yes we are.

:shrug:

I recently read Right Star Rising, by Laura Kalman, about the Ford-Carter years and it brought back a loooot of bad Carter memories. If you want to know when the democratic Party got of track (when it was in the best position it had been in since the Roosevelt years), look no further than 1976-1980. Carter blew it for us.

[kentuck]

22. I don't agree.

With that assessment.

[BurtWorm]

24. Time, apparently, has healed your Carter-inflicted wounds, I guess.

;-)

I'll never forgive him, myself. But he is a top-notch ex-president, no question about it.

[kentuck]

27. What wounds did you get?

It was a tough economy. Then Reagan adopted much of his energy policy and that prevented another oil crisis. He benefitted from Carter's ideas.

[BurtWorm]

31. Carter did indeed initiate a lot of Reagan's policies

That's my problem with him.

[Lasher]

51. Scoop Jackson would have attacked Atilla the Hun for being weak on defense.

Jackson was a bigtime neocon.

[still_one]

13. No comparison. Carter was in a period of inflation which Volker remedied

by increasing interest rates. The current situation is extreme deflation, accelerated by the rampant repuke agenda of deregulation, and starting two wars, one which was based on a lie

[sandnsea]

15. Unemployment went from 6% to 7.5%

And continued upwards to over 10% under Reagan.

A lot of jobs were created under Carter, just not enough for the huge number of baby boomers entering the job market.

And with that many boomers entering the economy, clearly demand would rise and there would be inflation. Coupled with rising oil costs.

I still think it was worse then. Everything was out of control. Right now we've just got to keep the bottom from falling out while we move the green economy forward. We don't really need to be building more roads when it would be better to get people out of their cars and on to light rail.

[livetohike]

18. I do. I remember waiting in line at the gas station on alternating

days for gas (based on your license plate number). I remember Jimmy Carter's speech on conserving energy. I remember the media and their daily count of the hostage crisis. My husband and I were in our mid 20's then and able to stay employed. We bought a house and a new car in 1979. I don't remember being stressed over the economy (except for energy prices).

The Republicans attacked everyone in Carter's family including Amy :eyes:.

[EmeraldCityGrl]

33. The only time I remember waiting in line for gas was

during one of the many radio station promotions for free gas.

The Carter years were great years for me. At nineteen years old I bought my first house. Of course houses were a lot more affordable.
We were in peacetime and the middle class was still strong.

[kentuck]

34. My memory may be wrong?

But I thought the long lines were during the first oil embargo when Gerald Ford was President?

[pinboy3niner]

45. 1979 was the second gas crisis

After the Shah of Iran was deposed and OPEC raised oil prices. Some state governors imposed rationing (i.e., VA, MD, TX and others), and I remember waiting in long lines for gas under an alternate-day rationing system.

[Fire1]

20. So true but I think this administration is getting a little more done.

[Yupster]

23. I was an exchange student in Austria

for a year.

The botched hostage rescue and Iranian crisis was very embarrassing and hard to defend to the Germans. I tried for a while - then just shut up.

This wasn't that far aftyer WWII. Every Austrian/German later middle aged person was in the German armed forces in World War II. The opinion was pretty much unanimous. "How can you sit there and let that little country humiliate you day after day? Then the rescue was botched, and I didn't even get questions anymore - just disgusted looks."

Like it was my decision or something.

On edit - just another memory -- the Austrians/Germans were very much on Ted Kennedy's side during the primaries. They were very interested. I think it was the Kennedy name more than anything. Never heard Reagan mentioned by a German. I don't think they really understood our primatry system. All the news was Kennedy versus Carter.

[DURHAM D]

36. I spent every summer during the Carter years in the UK and Europe.

Like you, I was unable to defend Carter's passivity. I generally tried to attribute it to his religious beliefs. It was not a defense I wanted to make but it was the only thing I could come up with to help explain his non-action. As you can imagine - it didn't fly.

I also think Carter's Christian faith is why he let The Shah enter the U.S. for medical treatment. stupid, stupid, stupid

Carter put his personal beliefs ahead of issues of national security. I think Carter still shows he is hard-wired to blindly seize the moral high ground. I find it arrogant.

[Not Me]

26. Had this country (read: Reagan) left his energy policies in place

we would probably not have had Iraq I, 9/11, Iraq II or the Afganistan wars.

This country would have been well on its way to energy independence.

I had the opportunity to meet (Professor) Carter at Emory University in the 90's. He is one of the most brilliant men ever to sit in the Oval Office.
History, if we can keep it honest. will remember him well.

[TomCADem]

28. What a surprise! A DUer Repeats The Corporate Media Narrative: Obama = Carter = Loss In 2012

Once again, a corporate narrative that is repeated over and over again gets adopted as "liberal" truth on DU. Right wing pundits have been pushing this narrative before President Obama even took office. The times are very different between Carter's era and Obama's era.

Biggest difference: Oil and inflation.

Carter: High oil prices and inflation.
Obama: Low oil prices and deflation.

Absolutely different circumstances, yet this will not stop the right wing, and some DUers, from pushing the Obama = Carter = Loser in 2012 narrative.

Obama may face a tough re-election in 2012. But, it will not be due to him being Carter 2.0.

[kentuck]

35. A DUer attempts to warn you...

of the similarites so you can prepare yourself.

You're welcome!

[TomCADem]

53. When DUers Offer The Same "Warnings" As The Corporate Media, What's the Use Of DU...

Google "Obama" and "Carter" and you will find mostly conservative commentary offering this comparison all the way back to 2008! Your "warning" is a bit late, and now mostly redundant of such right wing talking points. Heck, I find that I can take many right wing attacks, substitute "corporatist" for "socialist" or "leftist," and I have a DU attack from the "left."

My take is that most people on this board are sincere. Unfortunately, the corporate media is pervasive and wide-spread, that it colors the views of liberals such that right wing talking points are re-cast as liberal ones.

[tjwash]

39. Only 2 more years of concern trolling left!

And Skinner wonders why people have stopped coming here.

[kentuck]

41. Are you calling me a troll?

Do I need to inform you, a "true" DUer, of the rules?

[kentuck]

54. I think I may have just a little higher regard for Carter than you...

I'm saying the political circumtances are similar, not that Obama and Carter are similar. I'm sorry you misinterpreted that.

[slackmaster]

30. I was an undergraduate. Many people were sure we were headed for a major war.

Or radical climate change, or something.

[mike r]

32. You don't see other presidents doing this:

[WI_DEM]

40. I remember the Carter years--and I liked Carter a lot--but Dems NEVER warmed to him in Washington

Obama is much more liked by democratic voters and the party itself, so I don't see any real chance of any dem who has the stature of a Ted Kennedy, for instance, challenging Obama. Rightly or wrongly much of the public thought Carter was well-meaning but incompetent. Obama doesn't come across as incompetent. He has actually accomplished quite a bit in a short period of time. Yes, the economy that Obama inherited is actually much worse than the economy Carter inherited from Gerald Ford. Unemployment did go down to 5.9% by 1979 under Carter, but then the much weaker 80-81 recession pushed it up to over 7% but it went over 10% under Reagan.

[LiberalAndProud]

43. I remember many things.

The Shaw of Iran was spirited out of the country preceding the coup.

Nightline was born to cover the hostage crisis. I watched Ted Kopel almost nightly. It was news then. I didn't have any idea what Ted Kopel's opinions were. And it didn't occur to me to care. Remember the Jim & Tammy Baker interview? Was that during or after Carter? Never mind, I digress.

I remember our auto industry was caught flat footed by the demand for fuel efficient cars. Japan jumped in to fill that vacuum. MPG was the sticker that sold. Detroit was hobbled.

I remember Rosalind's graciousness and Jimmy's smile. I remember how unpretentious he was and how brilliant he was perceived (rightly) to be.

I remember writing a short OP as a high school senior explaining why I thought Jimmy would beat Ford (eloquence v. banality)
I remember reading Time Magazine in civics class and the headlines screaming "Waffle". As it turned out, Carter was too intellectual for the taste of many journalists, too much of a micromanager.

I remember knowing that Jimmy would not get a second term, but *wishing* that he could be reelected after having received his education on the hill. I think a second term would have been stellar.

I remember watching as Reagan's quote was born, "I'm from the government and I'm here to help." I remember listening to him tell the electorate that it was possible to cut taxes without increasing the deficit simply by cutting government waste.

====

Although I perceive the similarities, I sense the differences. I absolutely believe that Obama will be reelected to a second term.

He doesn't have the gentle, naive quality that still clings to our former president.

The Republicons have yet to offer an apealing alternative. They have no one who possesses the star quality that it takes to win an election. (Okay, I'll grant you that Bush didn't either, but Gore didn't exude charisma either, that year. Besides, Gore won.)

I think our chances are good for two terms, conditionally. What are my conditions? J O B S. Always and forever, It's the economy, stupid.

[Kip Humphrey]

46. DISCO!!!

:party: :yourock: :beer: :toast: :grouphug: :loveya: :bounce: :boring: :hangover:

:popcorn:

[Liberal_in_LA]

48. Carter was doomed by high int rates and the botched Iranian hostage rescue

[mdmc]

55. ..

[WinkyDink]

57. It's when my mother made her little nest-egg on CD rates.

[McCamy Taylor]

58. The GOP decided in 2008 that Obama would be Carter. That was why the MSM promoted him.

His whole campaign was modelled on Carter's "Leader for a change" campaign. Obama lifted parts of Carter's speeches (maybe by accident).

If you run as the Messiah, folks will want to crucify you.

If Obama can be Carter, that would be much better than the alternative. I am afraid he is going to be Hoover.