So now Obama gets to run in 2012 that the GOP wants to take your health care away

[lovekendyl]

Sorry I am just not upset with all these new gop congressman coming in. So now Obama gets to run in 2012 that the GOP wants to take your health care away and that there a do nothing congress. To me that is a home-run and hopefully the GOP will do us another favor and elect Palin as there nominee. This will also have a domino effect bcuz all these people who WILL be elected today will be washed out in the next election when all the people worried about losing there health-care come out to get rid of them. You have to remember most people aren't into politics like ya ll, they start seeing and hearing ads saying elect republicans and they will take your health care away. Thats gunna scare the crap out of people. I know people are gunna hate to hear this but in 2012 the minorities are gunna be back out there voting for there president. Which is gunna mean votes for those down on the ticket. So all in all tomorrow were gunna still have the Senate and white house, for two years we will have to put up with a crazy do nothing congress that wont be able to pass anything, but in 2012 we will have the house, senate and president. So relax and look forward to election night 2012.


US Congress passes historic "health care bill" - The Times

[uponit7771]

1. I pray this why they didn't shout this from the roof tops this election

[vi5]

2. I agree, except here is the thing..

Obama WON'T run on that. The DNC WON'T run those ads. The leaders of our party WON'T point this out again and again and again like they should.

Instead we'll be hearing more and more about dry powder and how now is really not the time to be making waves and running negative ads or any of it.

If any potential scenario for optimism involves the current democratic party leaders (except for maybe MAYBE Pelosi) fighing or being aggressive in any way then that's not really anything I can let myself get optimistic about any longer.

[lovekendyl]

5. oh yes

Win or lose his election Reid has to go. We also need to stop electing our leaders from unsafe states. We keep putting up leaders other than Pelosi that are in vulnerable states and they keep getting knocked off. I think that they will follow the script Rachel Maddow put out last night about highlighting there accomplishments. Hell until I saw that peice last night I didnt realize all that was done.

[still_one]

3. Not so sure if your assessment is correct. The repukes are counting on the youth to agree with them

on destroying social security and healthcare

They assume that the youth don't worry about retirement or healthcare

It might NOT be a bad assumption since most people only vote what affects them now, not tomorrow

Another troubling factor is jerks like paul and angle are very direct on their positions, and the populous in those states aren't too concerned by it

I would never underestimate the stupidity of the American people

These are the same people who voted two terms for bush, even though Clinton left them with a great economy

I know, bush didn't really win in 2000, but the election was still too close for a country that had low unemployment and a booming economy when Clinton left office

[cbdo2007]

4. Health care will be a non-issue in 2012.

The repubes are only using that this year to get elected. By 2012 more parts of the Health Care Reform will have been implemented and already saving people tons of money, so it would be stupid for them to take it away. Not to mention that half the stuff was Romney's idea in the first place - and he is the most likely to be their candidate in 2012.

[lovekendyl]

7. Doesnt matter

It doesnt matter if they really are gunna take your health care away or not, its like the NRA know one is threatining to take there guns away anymore but they still run ads claiming it. Its a mind game. Your always gunna have these images of these nutty tea party candidates saying they want to repeal the health care bill, you cant take those images back and they will be played over and over again in 2012.

[Javaman]

13. On the gun issue...

notice if you will, come January or February, there will be the yearly NRA hysterical screed about how the dems are going to take away our guns!!!

It happens the same time every year without fail.

Why?

Because the gun manufacturers have to move out the old inventory to make room for the new stuff.

They never ever have to run a sale. They laugh all the way to the back on money made from fear and stupidity.

[VMI Dem]

6. Health insurance..not health care.

[The Gunslinger]

8. Bingo.

[lovekendyl]

9. Same thing

In peoples eyes health insurance and health care is the same thing. Without health care theres no need for health insurance. Plus the headline the day after the vote read (US Congress passes historic health care bill - The Times)

[emulatorloo]

10. If you don't have health insurance, you can't pay for healthcare. Republicans want to take away

affordable health insurance.

- no pre-existing condition coverage
- companies can drop you if you are sick

They basically want to de-regulate all industries, including the insurance industry.

[thetonka]

12. WRONG

If you don't have Health Insurance you CAN pay for health care. Stop spreading the lies.

Now whether you can afford expensive procedures is a totally different argument. I can go to a really good doctor and get a complete physical for $80 today if I pay cash.

This lie that Health Insurance guarantees Health Care or is required for Health Care is THE ROOT OF ALL THE PROBLEMS.

I've posted this before on here......

My brother in law is getting a pacemaker/defibrillator installed. Since he has no Health Insurance, and does qualify for Cali state support, he has to pay cash. If the procedure was paid for by an insurance company it would be $160,000 at the 5 hospitals he called. For cash the procedure ranges from $23,000 to $27,000


Let's see that again.....


Insurance cost $160,000
Cash cost $23,000-$27,000

If you really think that Health Insurance is a solution or more Health Insurance solves any of the problems we face YOU ARE PART OF THE PROBLEM.

STOP SPREADING THE LIE!

[NNN0LHI]

19. Whats the name and number of that doctor who does complete physicals for $80 if you pay cash?

Thanks in advance.

Don

[thetonka]

23. I'll get the office name and location from my Brother in Law.

[emulatorloo]

25. And what would his out of pocket be if he were insured?

It would probably be much less that $27,000.

Most people would go broke if they had to pay $27,000 out of pocket.

Here's hoping all goes well with your brother-in-law; my dad had a pacemaker installed, it was great.

EDIT Spelling

[thetonka]

27. And the out-of-sight out-of-mind attitude only makes things worse

Health Insurance is not free health care, someone has to pay for it. Passing the costs onto someone else do NOTHING to solve the real problems.


If the procedure is worth $23,000 why is anyone, even an insurance company, paying $160,000? Why would anyone think it is a good idea to ignore this and let it continue, or worse empower this scam to continue with the support of the federal government?


Thanks for your thoughts, but think about what you are saying. Thinking that a persons out of pocket expense is low makes the massive increase in actual cost from $23K to $160K OK is at the core of the problem. His out of pocket expense on this is going to bankrupt him, but how he got into this situation is his own fault and of his own decisions. None of this should allow anyone to ignore the real problem.


The Health Insurance reform is simply a bandaid and pushes out the real cost and real damage of the high cost and corruption of Health Care to somewhere else out there in the future. It solves NOTHING, and in the end will likely make things SIGNIFICANTLY worse when we actually do have to address the real problems.

Why are so many people so apathetic and complacent that they think everything will be OK as long as someone else has to deal with the problem, or pay the bill? We keep talking about the impact of our current environmental decisions on our grandchildren, but so few seem to think about the impact of our financial decisions on our grandchildren. Won't really matter how clean the air is if they can't afford to buy food.

[emulatorloo]

30. The insurance company does not pay $160,000. The hospital discounts it. Stop Demonizing me.

The health insurance industry needs to be regulated. It is a first step to getting this mess straightened out.

[thetonka]

32. Health insurance is NOT a viable solution.

I know people in medical billing, you'd be surprised at how much things cost and how much the insurance companies pay. That $160,000 is what the insurance company would pay for that procedure. It is an agreed upon price.

They do discount, but they play games on what they discount. i.e. during negotiations they will get a discount on common procedures but a massive increase on less common procedures.

The entire structures eliminates the ability to pay what medical services are worth. Insurance is NOT supposed to be about maintanance, it is supposed to be there to pay for unforeseen costs that we can not plan and budget for. As long as we expect Health Insurance to pay for preventative maintenance and basic medical it is no longer insurance and we all suffer.

[Javaman]

11. While on the face of it, that is true, however...

never forget that the repukes will continue to label it as "Obamacare". That should be sufficient for the mouth breathers to continue to vote against their own best interests.

You have to remember one thing and one thing only: the repukes know and depend on the fact that their moronic base never read the details.

[lovekendyl]

16. ah

and thats why Obama himself should start calling it Obama care bcuz by the election some of the benifits that people like will have kicked in.

[Javaman]

17. That would be an interesting tactic. nt

[thetonka]

14. Lies from both sides

The Democrats did NOT give us Health Care reform.

The Republicans can not take away something we do not have.

[leftstreet]

15. +1

[SammyWinstonJack]

20. +2

[NNN0LHI]

22. That you Jon?

[thetonka]

28. Who is Jon?

[Cronus Protagonist]

18. Because it's health INSURANCE and not health CARE

And I got a bill to pay for nothing. Crowing about the Health Insurance Giveawaway is not going to get me excited. I expect there are a lot more people like me who do not benefit from this massive dose of fascism.

[lovekendyl]

21. Fine

Call it what you want. Fine then run on the gop wants to take away your health insurance IDK about semantics.

HEADLINE
US Congress passes historic "health care bill" - The Times

[thetonka]

29. That times headline is a lie!

[lovekendyl]

31. beating thy head against thy wall

Headline
Barack Obama's healthcare bill passed by Congress

Headline
Health Care Bill: Congress Passes Landmark Reform, Obama

It may be not what you wanted but its a start....

[thetonka]

33. No, it's a step backwards

None of it was about Health Care, it was about Health Insurance and Health Insurance is at the root of almost ALL the problems.

And I don't give credit to Obama, he was barely involved. If you want to give credit give it to Pelosi and Reid, they lead the charge, they did the dirty work.

[kctim]

24. First, it is PRESIDENT Obama

(sorry, but a pet peeve of mine)

Second: Why would President Obama run on one of the main issues that drove all these people to the polls to vote against? Do you really think the POTUS is an office that should be left up to the "we have a few more votes than you" tactic?

[lovekendyl]

26. haha

So you think he should shy away from it like he just did and allow the GOP to trash the health care bill which just allowed the gop to take over congress as your trying to state. Yeah good logic, I think he is smarter than that now to sit back and let them trash the health care bill again. Trust me he will be out there praising it in 2012.

[kctim]

34. Of course he will praise it

its his freakin bill. But you said he should run on it and try to scare people into voting for him because the Republicans are going to take it away from them and that is NOT going to happen.
1. The bill will not be fully implemented by 2112.
2. The bill will be old news by then. Those for and against it have already made up their minds.
3. Anybody with any sense can easily see that people are not going to vote for a Republican over a Democrat because the Democrat was not a progressive. Thankfully, President Obama knows that you do not get the moderate Dem vote by pushing progressive candidates onto them.

President Obama will stick with the merits of the bill, not shameful fearmongering.

[lovekendyl]

35. Thank You

And thats why republicans win elections and democrats lose them, there better at the game and in the end thats all that matters. So you can complain about fearmongering while there running congress. You cant fight the dirty unless your willing to fight dirty and thats why the dems are labled wimps. We dont fight back and thats why we will lose the house today.