Let's get fucking real.

[kentuck]

The Repubs are not going to work with Barack Obama on anything. They are going to try and beat him down on everything. Only a fool would think otherwise.

It is a fucking war! It is time we pull out the old Harry Truman gene in the Democratic Party.

Yeah, we will compromise on the Bush taxcuts. We will extend the middle-class tax cuts for two years. We will let the taxcuts for millionaires and billionaires expire. That is our compromise.

We will compromise and bring our troops home from Afghanistan in the next 6 months. We no longer can afford a war that has no meaning and no end.

We will not raise the limit on Social Security retirees. Social Security has not contributed one penny to the deficits created by the Republican Party. It is they that have passed on this huge debt to us and our children.

We have drawn a line in the sand and we will fight to the end if they cross it.

[joeybee12]

1. Repukes didn't win Tuesday by playing nice...they went for the jugular...

time to repay the favor.

[hamsterjill]

18. Here!! Here!!!

I agree! I hate that it's come to this, but if the Democrats don't learn to play the game like the Republicans, then the Democrats are going to continue to lose ground.

I understand that Obama wishes to take the high road. But that's not a possibility with Republicans who will stop at nothing to get what they want. We've got to learn to fight fire with fire!

[deacon]

38. Thing to is they haven't missed a beat either. Fox is hammering us and they are threatening us.

They haven't lost any steam.

[deacon]

39. Thing to is they haven't missed a beat either. Fox is hammering us and they are threatening us.

They haven't lost any steam.

[AlbertCat]

62. Repukes didn't win Tuesday by playing nice

They won through bigotry.

[rufus dog]

66. No way will the media allow Dems to rough up the repukes

The Repubs will play the victim and the media will lash out at the Dems at every opportunity.

That being said the Dems need to beat the living shit out of 'pubs at every opportunity and ignore the media.

[Kingofalldems]

2. You are correct sir--it's the Limbaugh way

Working with Dems would be considered a weakness.

[Dappleganger]

3. They will keep beating down the president, Congress and the American people.

Because it is working.

[moondust]

6. Exactly. They've just been rewarded handsomely for it. n/t

[Oceansaway]

4. K&R...n/t

[HereSince1628]

5. Well, if we are gonna get 'REAL' we'd better accept that Obama

is going to try to work with them. Obama hasn't hid any bit of his commitment to cooperation and the role of compromise.

Asking Obama to change his belief in working together, would be like having asked Ghandi to take up arms to expell the British from India.

[kentuck]

10. That will be his choice.

He will not have the Democratic Party behind if he does. He will be a one-termer, no doubt about it. We are trying to save him from himself.

[BrklynLiberal]

15. ...

"Bipartisanship" HAH! more like playing right into the hands of the repukes. THEY are not the ones that elected him. WE are! He is supposed to be representing those who put him in the White House. I have not seen much to indicate an awareness of that. THAT is why so many who supported him in 2008 did not even bother to go out and vote....or worse..voted for the repukes.

Many, many, many broken promises.

[HereSince1628]

20. Its no fun to watch your prom date walk away to dance with the cheerleaders.

Does Barak realize our name is Carrie?????????

[Egnever]

81. I dont think he cares much

I think his priority is getting stuff done. He has said before if he is a one term president so be it. I hope he isnt cause I am extremely happy with the progress he has made despite having the cards mostly stacked against him.

[Kajsa]

72. Love the cartoon!

It nails it in a Charlie Brown way.
:)

I'm going to borrow this.
Thanks, again.

[Individualist]

25. +1

[lumberjack_jeff]

7. Good. Now how do we get Obama onboard?

Howard Dean for President.

[pokercat999]

78. Excellent Idea how do we start a draft Dean for President

movement?

[Timbuk3]

8. Let The Tax Cuts Expire

...and filibuster them if they're passed by the house next year.

That's our ace in the hole, and we should play it if they refuse to let them expire for the wealthy/greedy.

[SugarShack]

9. agree...and I saw your post while im on hold with McConnells's office..to tell him

how we feel about soc sec. he says he'll work with the pres when he does what the "people" want.

taking call now.....


ok...just told her...the entire country does not want the age limit raised on Soc Sec..nor do we want benefits cuts. I reminded her that soc sec contributes NOTHING to our deficit and obama should not EVEN have it on the table. I told her we will hold him to his word,,,,when it comes to what WE want.

im not holding my breath though....but if they just raise the amount in checks that contribute...that would work...as it IS solvent until 2039 - 2042. Done. Then american's could breathe...and stop stressing...and I reminded her, that this president has already worked mostly with the republicans, instead of the democrat mandate he DID have. If they mess with our soc sec....they will lose in 2012. I say go for it!

[dotymed]

51. I wrote the President again,

informing him of "his base" and how we want him to fight for the people not corporations. It has never made a difference before.....

[CUTTIN HEADS]

11. Fuck a bunck of Kumbaya...

Hasta la Victoria SIEMPRE, BITCH!!

[1776Forever]

12. Kentuck I applaud you - While most around you aren't listening you speak the truth!

:yourock:

Great post!

[Angry Dragon]

13. We are not the ones that do not understand this

It seems Obama has a hearing problem, he does not hear
the stampede that is racing to destroy this country.
They care not who gets crushed as long as they end up
on top.

[BrklynLiberal]

14. I am sick to my stomach with disappointment and frustration.

The next two years will probably make the last two years look like the good old days.

Obama was already mewling about compromise with the repukes at the very same time that McConnell was voicing threats about making sure that Obama would be a one term President. WTF doe Obama have to lose at this point by standing up and fighting!!??

Someone needs to wake him up to the reality of what is going on around him....and around us.

How could he have been so totally deaf and blind to what was happening?

[kentuck]

17. I am pissed as all hell at Barack Obama...

His head was in the fucking sand as the economy collapsed around us and when he went to look for someone to help him clean up the mess, he recruited Larry Summers and Tim Geithner and Rahm Emanuel- as if there was no one else. If we ever needed a progressive solution to the crisis the Repubs and the corporate Dems put us in, it was the moment Barack Obama took office. It was like he was living in another fucking universe.

:mad:

[BonnieJW]

76. Why would anyone

choose Geithner and Summers over Krugman, Stiglitz and Robert Reich?

[TexasObserver]

16. Correct. The Republicans will make sure nothing good happens.

When they are out of power, they are like native insurgents, always undermining, always counting the days until you're gone and they're in charge again. They will not be helpful on anything that makes the president more electable.

[Arkansas Granny]

19. Exactly right. I heard several campaign ads on my local stations that emphasized

the candidates determination to go to Washington and fight Obama. That was the main focus of their campaign. They have no intention of working with Democrats in general or Obama in particular.

[TheKentuckian]

21. Fuckin A right, Bubba!

[Riverman]

22. Defund War! The Sacred Cow Must be Killed, or the war making

machinery will grind us all into dust, soon. That spending cannot be sustained. That is the reason we have such colossal deficits. The Republicans and far too many democrats are willing to cut almost everything else, especially so called saftey net programs, rather than looking first at military spending. Cutting all domestic programs to zero will not cut the deficit significantly. Next would be to cut all corporate welfare. And, raise corporate and top 2-3 % of household incomes to increase revenues to address real human needs - food, shelter, medical treatment.

[treestar]

23. If the middle class tax cuts expire, the middle class gets higher taxes

We sure don't need that.

There's nothing to bargain with other than the tax cuts of the rich.

[Chan790]

55. I think we do...

do need that. It's time we embraced fiscal responsibility as a party, it was an unnecessary tax cut meant to "starve the beast" and bring government spending to its' knees when it was passed. It's been a blunt club used against us ever since.

I'm opposed to any tax cut ever, at this point. We need more government income not less. You can't pay-cut your way to solvency. You can't tax cut to prosperity either. Kill it. Kill it now. Kill it dead.

If we're going to extend it, we need to do it in a way that makes it toxic to Republicans. Go 3 years, not 2 so that they cannot use it as an issue in the next election. Make them fund it out of their sacred cows. Nothing would make me happier than to see tax-cut Republicans go to war with evangelical conservatives or defense conservatives over the tax cut going into 2014...that sort of civil war would sink them for 2016.

[Javaman]

24. Didn't you hear? the Harry Truman gene was removed in a secret

operation in the basement of the pentagon about 5 years ago.

The Dems agreed to this in exchange for better meals at the congress commissary.

The repukes now keep the gene in a jar which is stowed at the bottom of a well in Georgia. And to amuse themselves, all new repuke senate and house members have to piss on it.

The Dems love their new pudding privileges.

[EFerrari]

26. We need to pledge our support for the progressives in Congress.

A two year pledge to let them know we'll support them through this disaster and into the next election. If they feel supported, they can back up Obama better (or resist him better, when he's tempted to given in to the thuggery).

[donheld]

27. The only one who doesn't seem to understand this is Barack Obama.

[demwing]

28. Al right, lets DO get real

A. Let's cut off the DNC, and give $$$ directly to a list of only our most progressive candidates.

B. Let's double down - organize a rally in DC to promote a very simple 5 point plan:
     1. Fix HCR AND Medicare by opening Medicare to ALL Americans. Call it "Americare"
     2. End illegal war, redeploy those military troops into a "Domestic Corp of Engineers" to build roads, fix bridges,
         reinforce dams, build a national, public transportation infrastructure, refurbish our schools, etc...
     3. End Corporate person-hood.
     4. REAL equal protection - end DADT and Gay Marriage Bans
     5. Open the previously mentioned "Domestic Corp of Engineers" to everyone, regardless of age, gender, or orientation.
         Hire 12 million civilians in the first two years, reducing unemployment to pre-recession levels, putting earned money in the
         pockets of those who will spend it in the community, creating demand for supplies and services, thus creating new jobs in
         the private sector as well.

C. Pledge to Obama that if he fights-REALLY FIGHTS-for this 5 point plan, he'll get our support in 2012. If he doesn't, he won't.

[kentuck]

29. And since each troop in Afghanistan is costing us $1 million per year...

...that could put quite a few of them to work at good wages...It would be money better spent.

[demwing]

34. In the way "Yanks" started as an insult, we can call it

the Colt (Pony, not the Gun) Party

:rofl:

[NuttyFluffers]

47. i must say, i like the similarities between ponies and donkeys...

one could almost make a sort of correlation between democrats and unrelenting idealism just through the imagery of asses and ponies alone. could be good for some very clever grassroots marketing.

edit: heh, just thought up a good one-liner: "Want your pony? Then back my ass up!" heh, it literally writes itself! :D

[Duval]

67. I like your agenda! So glad someone's

mind is working. I believe I have about another week of vomit/purge.:hurts: :puke:

[BonnieJW]

77. Right

Businesses don't need money; they need CUSTOMERS. As soon as customers appear, hiring will begin. As soon as people get jobs, they become customers. Pass a law that any money coming from corporations equals a bribe, which is exactly what it is.

[mix]

30. The days of playing wait, see and hope for Obama are over.

This is a failed presidency and progressives must fight for what they believe in, inside and outside the party.

It's been that way since the 1980s anyways.

[kentuck]

31. I am leaning in that direction also...

But I have not yet given up on the President. I am still hoping that he has learned a lesson.

[mix]

33. I will vote for him again.

Fuck me if I'd ever vote Republican.

But he's a weak visionless leader. An inside operator, not a man of the people.

[grahamhgreen]

32. Agreed, 100%!

[bobburgster]

35. Amen....

...couldn't agree with you more.

[FrenchieCat]

36. So if it's gonna be a war,

why are all of the soldiers on our side throwing rocks at the general, along with the enemy that can't be trusted. That's not how we win a war.

Cause I'm in....
but what are WE going to do? other than to draw a line, I mean.

[Hannah Bell]

37. those are good compromises. :>)

[deacon]

40. The line in the sand is a must. Obama has the democratic party in his hand. He has to fight now for

entire party.

[indimuse]

41. KNR! n/t

[bl968]

42. Bipartisanship

The Democrats surrendered before the fight began in the name of bipartisanship. For example on health care reform to secure Republican support the Obama Administration removed the popular single payer health option from the table to protect the interests of for-profit hospitals and private insurance companies. In the end not one single Republican crossed the aisle to vote in favor of the plan. This has been the case in policy after policy. Bipartisanship is a two edged sword, which only works when both sides come to the table in good faith; and this has not been the case from the very beginning of the Obama Administration.

[cate94]

43. I agree..

Unfortunately, I don't think Mr. Obama is onboard.

[B Calm]

44. Now that's what I want to hear from President Obama!

[customerserviceguy]

45. Harry Truman would not have been able to govern that way today

He didn't even have to deal with TV (most Americans didn't have it), much less three 24/7 news networks with a lot of loose time to fill. And he couldn't even have imagined dealing with the pernicious side effects of the Internet, which were only starting to make themselves known at the tail end of the Clinton administration.

[BumRushDaShow]

50. +1000!

The whole environment of 2010 is not the same as 1948. The existence of new media technology (beyond the newspapers, magazines, radio, Movietone news in the theaters, and fledgling (non-cable) TV of the 40s and 50s with fractional amounts of time spent reporting news - note that the 30 minute news format didn't come about until Walter Chronkite headed such a broadcast in 1963) amplifies, in a breath-taking way, the toxicity that normally comes about during elections - now all in real-time.

[Bluenorthwest]

54. So you claim that he could be stronger, except for a TV show

or two which prevents him from that? Do you also claim that he was unaware of that media that bugs him so? Did not know it existed? He and his huge, highly paid media and communications staff are utterly without ability to deal with TV personalities?
If that is the case, the 200K Gibbs gets seems excessive. The WH spends millions on 'communications' and all they manage is to insult the base, remind gay people that they see us as less than equal, and telegraph their pre-formed compromises to the GOP.
Just a load of bladerdash. Fact is, every politician on earth is dealing with the same stuff, kid. All of the winners this week, same media. All of my Democrats won, also all of them in the State to the south, and the one to the north. My entire region managed to 'message' and to win. Those who can, do, those who can't make excuses about TV shows.

[BumRushDaShow]

58. Seems you missed the point

This has nothing to do with "a TV show" or your fixation on some idiotic throwaway comment about "professional left". It has to do with the proliferation of propaganda (beyond the yellow journalism of the 40s) that has negatively impacted greater and greater swaths of people around the nation when it comes to civics and the political process. Even people here on DU don't seem to know the basics of how a bill becomes a law. :eyes:

The nation has been brainwashed to not pay attention (I work with someone who asked this past Monday if Obama was on the ballot :banghead:), and much of that thanks to the excessive proliferation of media outlets that are not progressive and that feed the masses bread and circuses (where everything is "entertainment including politics - their obsession with Caribou Barbie and Which Witch is a case in point). Unless the progressives start buying some friggin' radio stations (instead of letting Al Franken hang when it came to keeping Air America alive), then it will only get worse. Under Clinton, thousands of stations came up in bundles for buying and guess who bought them?

Where I am in the dark blue city of Philadelphia, there is NOT ONE station airing "progressive" programming outside of the small black-owned radio station (that is barely 1000 watts during the day and drops down to 105 watts at night). I worked for a college radio station 30 years ago that broadcast at 1000 watts. Why the hell is that? I have to PAY (XM radio) to hear Hartmann, Joe Madison, and other progressive programming. Meaning that progressives need to not only consolidate their message, but they need the means to DISTRIBUTE IT.

Hey "kid", you get real. "The base" is not what YOU define it as. Don't get obsessed with Gibbs. He's just a single mouthpiece. Progressives and liberals need MASSIVE numbers of mouthpieces going 24/7 and not just the tokens on RW-owned MSNBC.

The entire metro area of Philadelphia returned their Democrats and even booted a repuke who was head of the state legislature for the past 20+ years. The surrounding counties have gone from solid red to blue (in the rim) and creeping westward, are going purple. For anyone to demand for a half black man from Hawaii to somehow mimic a white midwesterner Harry Truman, is in fantasy land.

[Egnever]

84. And you don't find it the least bit odd?

That what is reported on is an offhand comment rham made instead of say details on what is in the health bill? You don't think its the fact that its a largely right wing media that has an effect on what stories about the presidency you think about? you can take anything and twist it to your agenda and the fact that you are spewing the stories they fed you as evidence of what he has done wrong instead of all the things he has done right goes directly to the point of the influence of the media.

This is probably the most media covered president ever he is out there almost every day talking about something or to some group pushing forward his agenda and tools think he has done nothing or isn't fighting. You can go to cspan and see thousands of hours of him speaking at different events working to move forward and yet people somehow have the message that he hasn't been doping anything to work for his agenda. Why do you think that is? its demonstrably false.

Since day one the media has been working to bring this president down reporting every single even remotely negative thing they could find or twisting stories so that they appeared to be negative things. If you think this has no effect on the populace who reads no further than the headline you are kidding yourself.

[BumRushDaShow]

89. And as an example

The fact that supposed "legitimate" news media reports crap about the cost of the President's trip overseas to make it seem that this was somehow egregious or not part of the duties of the Office of the President - something that has never been done against any previous President.

And now comes word that http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/40028929/ns/politics-decision_2010/">MSNBC has pulled Keith off the air "indefinitely", and so how can one stem that tide unless we own our OWN media outlets (and we literally need hundreds if not thousands of stations)?

[Egnever]

91. Perfect example

Although I think Kieth was wrong on this one, What he did I think was reckless for his employers. Had he disclosed I would be with him but he did not and I do think thats a problem.

[laughingliberal]

65. Oh, I see. As long as there's TV, the President is powerless to fight. nt

[BumRushDaShow]

80. See the response in post #58. n/t

[laughingliberal]

83. I don't do resource burn. Post a link. nt

[BumRushDaShow]

85. Wow how lazy. It was right above your own OP. nt

[laughingliberal]

86. Oh, I'm lazy? You were looking right at it and couldn't copy/paste the link?:

:rofl:

[BumRushDaShow]

87. And you managed to miss something next to your own message?

:rofl: :eyes:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=9475335&mesg_id=9485360

[laughingliberal]

90. Not even in the same subthread. Nevertheless, my question remains after reading #58.

As long as there's TV, the President is powerless to fight?

[BumRushDaShow]

93. He can "fight" all he wants

and no one will hear about it because the lunatic fringe owns the megaphone(s). What people WILL hear is a cacophony of nonsense about why Caribou Barbie's spawn is still on Dancing with the Stars and how much Michelle Obama's shoes cost. The President has been forced to run himself ragged going to rallies and "Town Halls" to get his message out yet there is barely any coverage beyond sound bites, much of which is cobbled together completely out of context.

Your fixating on "TV" is a strawman that doesn't refute this fact.

[laughingliberal]

94. So, there's no way out?

Guess we have to keep caving to the right. Why effing bother in that case?

Funny. I seem to recall that even with the press whoring for Bush 24/7, he still tanked in public opinion.

[BumRushDaShow]

95. There is a way out

but it requires $$$ and the ratcheted up use of the last of the media delivery venues not completely RW-owned - the internet (assuming the wealthy liberals continue to be averse to buying some brick and mortar media outlets). The fact is - bloggers on sites like DU, DailyKos, Huffington Post, Mudflats, Thinkprogress, Emptywheel etc., were able to (collectively) force the M$M to acknowledge their lies, their spin, and their propaganda in 2008. Because the info on those blogs went viral under the propaganda-controllers radar, the consumers of it were able to pass the truth along to their non-internet enabled friends, families, and coworkers. We need more of this and it needs to be packaged in such as away as to easily get to and be absorbed by the low information voters. Even something as innocuous as a "chain letter" type email (that so many of the superstitious masses can't resist forwarding), is something that can begin to make some inroads into the RW media wall.

[LawnKorn]

46. K&R

[cornermouse]

48. The one you have to convince to do it is Obama.

I think most of us have been ready to fight conservatives for quite some time now.

[Altoid_Cyclist]

49. I like to think of myself as being pragmatic.

However, after seeing that term used so often here to explain why President Obama has made the choices that he has made, I'm fed up with the term.

President Obama has to understand that sometimes there is a difference between being "pragmatic", and being a leader.

At some point, a person (even our president) has to take a stand and say that there will be no more capitulation. We will retreat no further because we are fighting for what the American people want and we are fighting for what is morally right.

Let's hope that he has decided to come out swinging during the next two years, because his rope-a-dope style has cost us dearly already. If not, say goodbye to the middle class that used to be.

[furgee]

52. It is great that everyone complains here

BUT are you also sending email and postcards to the White House. Complain there everyday. And those who still have a Dem Rep in the house let them know too.

[barbtries]

53. from your pen

to the lame duck congress's ears. amen

[NC_Nurse]

56. Who's going to tell Obama the plan? Last I checked he was still conciliatory.

[democrank]

57. Thank you from the bottom of my heart, Kentuck.

If I hear one more chorus of "Everything is Beautiful" I`ll vomit. There is almost nobody in the Obama administration that connects with an average person. Nobody. If they all want to pretend everyone in the country really does have equal access to arugula if they try hard enough, well....

One thing`s for sure. If Obama continues on his Detachment 2.0 Crusade, count me out. I`m tired of watching Democratic "leaders" play kiss-ass with the likes of Orange Man.

[harun]

59. I think the Dem leadership will listen to us on this as much as they have listened

to us about everything else.

[SammyWinstonJack]

60. Good Luck getting Obama on board with that.

:silly:

[bluethruandthru]

61. I'd like to rec this about a million times! n/t

[blindpig]

63. But I don't think that's the plan.

The austerity train has pulled out and all the pols are on board, their petty arguments about where to set the throttle won't change much of anything. Their allegiance is to the ruling class. You think under the bus was bad, get ready to get under the train.

[TomClash]

64. We think alike

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x9460745

[tomp]

68. mighty big talk.

who in the democratic party is saying that or who do you expect will say those things?

i mean really, you should take your own advice.

[kentuck]

69. We can curl up in a fetal position....

and let them kick the shit out of us...

[AtheistCrusader]

70. 'We' can't do shit till 2012.

We have no real representation anymore. If you can find a majority somewhere that cares about anything in your OP, feel free to point them out. I can't find them.
Not trying to be defeatist, just realistic. We're going to have to fight a defensive war now, we missed our chance. We'll be lucky if we don't lose ground.


The only way we bring our troops home from Afganistan in the next 2 years is if the country goes flat-out bankrupt.

[kentuck]

71. "We're going to have to fight a defensive war now"?

What kind of war have the Repubs been fighting?

[AtheistCrusader]

75. Offensive.

And now they are entrenched with enough power to completly derail our agenda in the house, and we can't impose Cloture in the senate, so that's effectively gridlocked.

If you see a solution, short of the next election, please share.
I've been calling and writing letters and all that crap for years, and I don't even know why I bother anymore.

[tomp]

92. i notice you didn't answer the question.

i'm not for doing nothing, i'm just against relying on getting anything accomplished through the democratic party.

[farmboxer]

73. Repubs destroyed the economy. This should be repeated

over and over again!

[Major Hogwash]

74. We will reach across the aisle until they cut both of our arms off!!

They've already cut one hand off.
The one holding the olive branch.

Come back here and fight like a man, I've got another hand!
*whack*
I've still got 2 good legs with which to kick your ass with!
*whack*
I've still got 1 good leg, that if I hop up quick enough, I can kick your ass with!
*whack*
I can still roll my torso in your way!
Come back and fight like a man!

[RoccoR5955]

79. They have to shove it up their posteriors in the lame duck session.

Pass as much stuff that's been lying in the Senate. This will just be more stuff for them to try to repeal. They will not be able to repeal anything, because they don't hold the veto pen, and they don't have 2/3 of either the House or Senate.

[ljm2002]

82. If only!

I'm with you 100%, but yours is not the message that is being delivered by the White House and the Democrats.

Sad.

[Cal33]

88. But does Obama think the way you do? It's possible that he

might either be obsessed with the idea of "bipartisanship" or might have
the "Stockholm Syndrome. It would be helpful if his right-wing leaning
cabinet members and advisers could be replaced by real Democrats.