The Tea Party -- A Nazi Party in search of a Reichstag Fire?

[Denninmi]

I'm really having a hard time convincing myself that the sky is not falling with the election of Tea Party candidates to the U.S. Congress.

Opinions, please -- is the Tea Party a true fascist movement that ultimately seeks total control of society and to crush its political opposition and those it deems "unfit" through violent repression if given the opportunity?

To me, if feels like what I imagine Germany was like in 1932. And, I believe they are just looking for any excuse to ignore, supersede, or suspend both our laws and our society's morals and begin to act in an oppressive and violent manner. Once the genie is out of the bottle, I believe this will quickly spiral beyond the point of no return. That trigger event could be almost anything -- another 9/11 type terrorist attack, an assassination, civil unrest, whatever would make a good excuse.

One key reason I believe this is that, unlike fringe movements of the recent past, these people now have the legitimacy of election as well as the support of reasonably large numbers of society's elites, especially business elites like the Koch brothers.

I also believe that much of the Tea Party's supposed "inclusion" of certain minority members is just for show -- once in power, I believe that this movement will quickly "purge" those who do not fit the "ideal" which, IMO, is limited to white evangelicals.

Opinions, opinions, opinions. Even if you want to tell me this is the dumbest thing you've ever read and I better get myself to the shrink for some meds ASAP. I would like to know what people REALLY think about this. I see signs all over that leads me to feel that this is the path this country is following, signs such as the intense hatred of Muslims and immigrants.

[Bonhomme Richard]

1. They are not a true fascist movement but they are easily....

manipulated. All they would need is a true fascist leader.

[glinda]

2. That seems to be the purpose of Beck, Rush and O'Reilly.

[mindcough]

3. True fascist movement? no way, man.

Don't waste your time or mental energy on this, four years from now it will all be irrelevant again.

"I also believe that much of the Tea Party's supposed "inclusion" of certain minority members is just for show -- once in power, I believe that this movement will quickly "purge" those who do not fit the "ideal" which, IMO, is limited to white evangelicals."

There is no way in hell that 'white evangelicals' will ever make a difference in this society again. They can't do it themselves, just look at the numbers and you'll see that white people are quickly becoming a minority in this country and impacting these elections less and less. :9 We are seeing a large influx of minorities such as Marco Rubio and Alci Maldonado turn to the Republican side of thinking, all in all I think we just live in the land of confusion at this point.

At least Obama is still in charge and will help keep the confused TEA members put in their place. It would take a massive change, bigger than the 2010 elections, to make them legit.

[alanquatermass]

5. FOUR years from now???

Hope to hell that this kind of anxiety (shared, to some extent, by MOI!) will be irrelevant in just TWO years.

[AlinPA]

4. It looks a lot like a fascist movement to me. They have leaders in the front of media

-Palin. Beck, Hannity and a large commuication channel (Fox). Taking advantage of a poor ecomomic environment with ant-government rhetoric.

They exhibit all the things that make up a fascist movement, nationalism, patriotism, fundamentalist religion, hate for minorities (black, any other race than white, gay people, even the disabled), any religion that is not Christian, and disdain for educated people ("intellectuals).

[alanquatermass]

7. From one Alan to another...

-- I have to say that I couldn't agree with you more.

I cannot believe that the kind of racist hatemongering FILTH being spewed by the likes of Palin, Beck and Hannity is even LEGAL, let alone being tolerated by the masses.

I think Barack Obama needs to find a way to stop them -- some legal pretext (like the Fairness Doctrine?) for shutting these racists DOWN.

[treestar]

6. IMO 911 was their chance.

fortunately they blew it, or there is basic innate sense in a slight majority of voters.

If they couldn't do it then, they're screwed.

[mindcough]

8. 911 still scares the FUCK out of me

not because of oh noes, Muslim witches!, but because it truly shows what a corrupt govt is capable of doing in a time of panic. If anything I'd say Bush's regime was closer to Nazis than the TEA party will ever be. It takes some true Elites to pull off something like 911.

[alanquatermass]

9. "Pull off 9/11..."?

This is only my third day at DU so forgive me for being a bit slow on the uptake... Are you suggesting that Bush and Cheney and Co. engineered the attacks on 9/11?

[treestar]

10. Not necessarily, but it and the Reichstag fire were used

to justify policies. Get the nation in a panic and willing to have the Patriot Act. Remember it contained many provisions politically impossible before. Bushco didn't have to cause it for that. Once is happened, they used it diligently.

Though there is IIRR some information that Hitler may have caused the Reichstag fire. In order to have something to use. Out of which is born the idea 911 was something Bushco caused, because they used it to such advantage.

[riderinthestorm]

12. Oh boy....

I'll answer and hope you get to see my result because it will be moved or deleted asap. There's a sizeable contingent of DUers who believe that 9/11 was either a case of MIHOP (made it happen on purpose) or LIHOP (let it happen on purpose).

Both theories are verboten to be discussed on DU since it's considered a conspiracy theory.

But virtually everyone has a position either as a MIHOPper, or a LIHOPper.... Not too many here believe it was simply a random terrorist attack unforeseen and unknown before it happened.

[alanquatermass]

13. Wow. So "virtually everyone" here at DU believes...

-- that the Republicans either engineered the attack or allowed it to happen? Jesus. I guess I must be in the "blissfully naive" camp, as I have always taken the official story as reported in the MSM at face value, which is that Muslim radicals caught us unawares.

Maybe I was wrong. Which one do YOU believe?

[riderinthestorm]

14. MIHOP. IBTL. nt

[alanquatermass]

16. Holy crap! Well, if that's really true...

-- then that is maybe the scariest fucking thing I've ever heard in my life. (And I thought the gov't killing JFK was bad!)

I am practically speechless here. Good thing my keypad is working (LOL!)

Okay, well, first of all...who engineered the attack? Dubya? That creepizoid Dick Cheney? Both of them? Were the explosives already in the towers? And who, exactly, was flying those airplanes?

And just as importantly (and please forgive my ignorance here, Storm): Why would Osama Bin Ladin claim responsibility for something carried out by the U.S?

Forget JFK, Oliver Stone needs to make a movie about 9/11. (Oh, that's right, he already did -- sort of -- but it was crappy, gov't approved propoganda)

This shit is WILD, homes!

[riderinthestorm]

20. First off, welcome to DU

So to answer your questions:

1. Who engineered the attack? IMHO, there really is a creepy terrorist organization named "Al Qaeda". They were a CIA funded, backed, trained group in Afghanistan for decades. Osama Bin Ladin was one of our friends, allies and organizational genius' when we were fighting the Soviets by proxy in Afghanistan. They had a real grievance with the US especially, the "west" amorphously when we pulled out and left them high and dry, plus a plethora of other issues both left over from colonialism and other shit (western forces in KSA, exploitation of oil resources, cozying up to thugs in order to gain oil concessions etc.) Bottom line: the US knew about, funded and basically handled this group for many, many years so we "knew" them - especially the GW Bush group.

2. Were explosives already in the towers? A matter of dispute. I don't doubt that GW Bush and thugs knew about the 19 hijackers who actually organized and perpetrated the attack on the main towers, but how far the conspiracy goes as it extends to the other buildings - I don't know.

3. Who flew the airplanes? The people we knew about. That's not a secret.

4. Why does OBL claim responsibility? Because it makes him much more powerful as a jihadi against the "west". Originally his goals were aimed at the KSA royal family but he's branched out and his 9/11 success (and others) empower him to revolutionary exploits globally. Remember OBL was "our guy" for most of his life. Our goals were his goals.

I'm actually pretty shocked this subthread and my responses have remained up for as long as they have. Please know they will be deleted soon. This is considered conspiracy stuff but Condoleeza Rice's testimony, combined with Richard Clarke's testimony is incredibly persuasive that this government absolutely knew ahead of time that this was coming, and even more so, are complicit.

Good luck on your journey towards the light.

[alanquatermass]

25. Thanks, Storm! That was beautifully written and --

-- provides a lot for a "newbie" like me to think about! Talk soon! Alan

[tom_paine]

34. And just in case you believe something like this is unprecedented in US history

you might want to look up Operation Northwoods.

www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/news/20010430/northwoods.pdf

www.net4truthusa.com/operationnorthwoods.htm

[Angry Dragon]

27. Do a google search for missing gold in World Trade Center

[Name removed]

30. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[EC]

11. No their not (except maybe Rand) it's the regular

repubs that should scare you...

[unkachuck]

15. I agree....

....the Tea Party is a group of well-funded right-wing thugs, created for and ultimately serving the extreme corporate interest....their appearance on the American political stage burst from nowhere, championed by the media corporations for the benefit of the united corporate political agenda....

....if they should ever come to power in a big way, death camps would not be out of the question....

[Doctor_J]

17. If this were a fascist movement, what would be the difference?

:shrug:

[mmonk]

18. Yes, there is a fascist movement backed by big money

in the US right now. They do not accept election results when they lose. They will not try to govern but spend their time trying to destroy the other party. They use intimidation and eliminationist speech. They try to shut down free speech from others and sometimes are successful. I was thinking about it tonight when I learned my sister-in-law that works at a Women's Health Center said they received a bomb threat today and an arrest was made (the perpetrator got into the building and accessed the kitchen or break are refrigerator). They are classic fascists.

[defendandprotect]

19. Koch funded...but it is the GOPs/T-baggers ... and pushing violence

which gives a great connection to the Brown Shirts --

Just as we have had the GOPs/Christian Coalition --

GOP gave start up funding for it in the 1980's. Richard Scaife financed Dobson's

org -- and other wealthy right wingers financed Bauer's org.

And, GOPs/NRA -- this is an entirely different NRA than what used to exist -- ask

Michael Moore. And it was used to create an issue to target moderate and liberal

Democrats -- succeeded quite well.

After the death of Wm. Buckley/CIA we also found out that CIA had been funding right

wing politicians and their campaigns -- Sen. Strom Thurmond and Rep. Gerry Brown --

but there were others whose names haven't been revealed as yet.

Keep in mind the CIA took money from any right wing source -- including Nazis and KKK.

Jesse Helms got money from the CIA -- so did Pat buchanan.

GOP/"pro-lifers" -- I've heard that many of the demonstrators outside women's health

clinics were hired from Methadone clinics -- paid to demonstrate -- !!

The right wing can only rise via violence -- stolen elections -- and lies.

We've had more than 50+ years of in plein air right wing violence -- not only did it

knock out existing liberal leadership -- but it knocked out liberal leadership before

it got a chance to rise!


Presumably people are still sitting in front of their TV's waiting for the TV anchor

to let them know if anything is wrong!!!

[Juche]

21. I don't think you can make the comparison

Comparing tea baggers to nazis is like comparing Kucinich to Che Guevera. You can do it, but you'd really have to exaggerate.

I do agree many of the tea baggers can be a threat to democracy. So many have openly called for armed insurrection and violent overthrow of the government. And their goal seems to be to 'purify' America of 'corrupting' influences like economic and social liberalism. They don't consider their political goal bipartisan compromise, more like purification and purges. Luckily they don't have the power.

So yeah, their attitudes are a threat to democracy and they are a proto-fascist movement IMO and I'm sure they'd cheer if a Pinochet type coup happened in the US. And if they had the ability, I think many tea baggers would fundamentally change our democracy to purge leftists from positions of political and social power. But they don't have that power and I don't think they ever will.

[riderinthestorm]

22. Unfortunately, "thinking they never will have power" isn't good enough.

I can hope for a unicorn that shits gold but that won't help either.

The Tea baggers have major media, major money, major celebrities and just scored some major electoral victories with shockingly bad ideas. Their "storm troopers" have stomped, hurled and heaved a fair number of civic minded Americans to the ground with impunity. Combine this with Citizens United and I'm really concerned.

[Doctor_J]

29. Yes, we have made this mistake continually over the past 20 years

"Limpballs' reign will last two years at most (1994)"

"Tim McVeigh was an anomaly - most Limbeciles aren't violent" (1996)

"They won't impeach Clinton - it will kill them politically" (1998)

"They got away with stealing one election - they won't dare steal another one" (2000)

"No one could have predicted the WTC would be struck" (2002)

"The Repukes are dead" (2006, 2008)

"We are weak and stupid" - me, every year for the last 15 or so

[Alcibiades]

23. An interesting idea

There are some missing components, though:

1. The economy is bad, but it's not Germany in 1932 bad.

2. Have you looked at the teabaggers? Part of the power of the Nazi movement was its ability to marshal an army of thugs, many of whom were young, angry, unemployed veterans, to fight a similarly angry army of socialists in the streets of Germany. If the teabaggers attempted anything of the sort, they would be hampered by their hoverrounds and oxygen tanks.

3. While the tea party movement has the same attitude of rage that the Nazis had, their attitude towards the state is fundamentally different. The tea party movement's libertarian dream is truly utopian (in the original sense of the word, though it is liable to be dystopian in practice): their vision has never been tried in an advanced industrial state, and with good reason. These people cannot even agree on a leader, much less conduct a coup. The Nazis, on the other hand, systematically grew a totalitarian movement and state capable of controlling the lives of most everyone.

4. The young people who voted in this election expressed more progressive attitudes in exit polls than any cohort since 1972. The teabaggers, in contrast, are dying off. These are the George Wallace people, the very same people. They simply won't be around long enough to pull off anything.

[opihimoimoi]

24. Multiple Classic Nazi traits and signs abound,,,stunning in similarity

The difference is:::Instead of a Swatzika...they got tea bags::::

They got Music too....Nearer, My God, to Thee

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcmXgqK4klU&feature=related

But they overlook...their God, is our God too....all cultures who worship...have the same GOD....

Logic and Reason tells us this must be so...

Even Aliens share with us the Same GOD...

[BolivarianHero]

26. They had it already.

Fucking around with election results and then blaming ACORN for it.

[KeyserSoze87]

28. The Tea Party will probably cease to exist by 2014.

Despite all the coverage given to them by the "liberal" media, they represent only about 0.5% of the country. In 2012, Obama and the Democrats will be annihilating them in both the presidential and congressional elections.

GO FUCK YOURSELF, TEA PARTY!

[AnArmyVeteran]

31. Hitler would have been a nobody till one speech to the wealthiest Germans.

Hitler spoke at a tavern to the country's richest Germans and titans of industry. At the end of his speech they gave him a standing ovation and beat their glasses on their tables in support of Hitler. After that night Hitler had the rich and powerful behind him. Today we have the Rand Pauls and the Koch brothers, among millions of mutant followers ready to do their master's biddings. There are several parallels and your good OP pointed out several. We are just one huge calamity away from disaster. You can bet your life right wing leaders will use any means to achieve their goals.

[backscatter712]

32. The word is protofascist.

Not quite fully-fledged fascism, but just a few short steps away.

Give them a little political power (wait, we just did!), a few would-be-leaders to first jockey against each other, until one takes control and starts leading them by the nose, turn the violence, bigotry, authoritarianism up a few more notches...

[chillspike]

33. My opinion is

that the more power the tea party gets, the more their movement will be exposed as the vehicle of transference for their adolescent bullying.

Transference
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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This article is about a concept in psycholoanalysis. For the 2010 album by Spoon, see Transference (album).

Transference is a phenomenon in psychoanalysis characterized by unconscious redirection of feelings from one person to another. One definition of transference is "the inappropriate repetition in the present of a relationship that was important in a person's childhood."<1> Another definition is "the redirection of feelings and desires and especially of those unconsciously retained from childhood toward a new object."