The breaking point

[nadinbrzezinski]

...

There is a saying is Spanish... There is no Ill that last a hundred years, not anybody that will tolerate it.

Well, we might be near, and sometimes tea leaves come from foreign trips. The US will support India's effort to join the Security Council as a permanent member. Read that again and consider the rumor that China is not lending us anymore.

Kiddies China is becoming a threat...

And the end to the permanent order is close...that also includes us as a great power and don't let the size of the military fool you. We lost a regiment of M-1 A1 Abrams it will take over a year, in present production capacities for us to replace one tank...ships? How much steel do we need to import?

[arbusto_baboso]

1. Since the Chinese are dependent on the US to BUY all the cheap crap they make...

They will suffer just as much as we do (if not more) from a total US collapse. I'm not buying this premise.

[nadinbrzezinski]

3. You sure?

You think they haven't been busy developing markets somewhere else?

We aren't the center of the world, believe it if you will but we are not... The EU comes to mind. As well as latin America and a fifty year project, Africa.

[arbusto_baboso]

7. They can't do it without us buying their stuff.

Look at the numbers. Those always give a clearer picture.

Now, we DO have to readjust and no longer attempt to be the world's policeman. We simply can't do that anymore, if we ever could.

[nadinbrzezinski]

9. Really?

We are not the center. We like to think so... as is they did stop lending to us

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSPEK16693720080925

[arbusto_baboso]

11. I'll believe this when it actually happens and not before.

They're cutting their own throats if they follow through.

[nadinbrzezinski]

14. Now that is hilarious

you are sounding like an Imperial Citizen of France and England... they could not believe it either.

The sun is setting on the American Empire.

It will not be long for it to go away... in historic terms... and like most Imperial Citizens you will be surprised by it. But it is coming... (in fact this signals that it is most likely here)

As I said they have OTHER markets...

[arbusto_baboso]

17. First, I KNOW the sun is setting on American Empire, so...

Back the fuck off with the comparisons to "Imperial Citizens of France and England".

But it ain't happening the way you describe. Just calm yourself a bit and THINK about it for a little bit instead of instantly overreacting.

[nadinbrzezinski]

24. I am not overreacting it is a marker

one more marker.

So you go ahead and calm yourself. I just HIGHLY disagree with you.

CAN I? Please, pretty please?

[CLANG]

40. When you say "look at the numbers"

one would expect you to provide the numbers and a link to their source.

[RUMMYisFROSTED]

2. Link?

:D

I hear ya.

[nadinbrzezinski]

4. Thomas Hartmann just covered the security council angle

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/president-obama-backs-india-permanent-seat-security-council/story?id=12086276

there you go

As to lending

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSPEK16693720080925

More than just a rumor it seems.

[sufrommich]

5. What rumor that China is not lending us anymore? nt

[nadinbrzezinski]

8. More than a rumor it seems

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSPEK16693720080925

Like real

[sufrommich]

13. That article is from 2008. China has issued loans since then. nt

[nadinbrzezinski]

15. You are correct, my bad for not reading the date

but the rumors that they will or have are stil there, just do a google search.

No central banks lets those rumors out just for fun... they started in 2006 and they are as recent as 2010.

We SUPPORTING India for a permanent seat is not just because we like India.

[sally cat]

23. Good catch. Didn't see a link anywhere.

[Warpy]

6. We can cede Empire or have it wrested from us

and the latter will likely destroy everything in the northern hemisphere and much in the southern.

We can beat our swords into plowshares (and looms) and survive. Or not.

The choice is going to become evermore stark as time goes on.

[nadinbrzezinski]

10. I fear the choice is here

now on the "bright side" the Republicans don't get it so they will accelerate the process.

Going to a trade war with China. please boys continue with the hilarity.

[thereismore]

12. That's exactly what I thought. Obama supports a seat for India to leverage against China,

which has indeed become a threat. I also expect more arms deals for India to come.

[nadinbrzezinski]

16. And I will add AsiaPac...

[Desertrose]

20. What's your take on a BRIC alliance?

Bolivia
Russia
India
China

Can't be too good for the US...

[nadinbrzezinski]

25. We stopped paying attention to the backyard

that is what that is about.

And Brazil is emerging as a regional power. If Mexico had not gone to war with the cartels it would be on it's well as well.

[Desertrose]

45. Yeah, that makes a sad kind of sense....

at least for current US of A.

[Duer 157099]

43. LOL, Bolivia? I think you mean Brazil

That was sort of funny

[Desertrose]

44. OMG. You are right. I thought Brazil...

but typed Bolivia?

Good grief.

[thereismore]

21. "AsiaPac provides the ultimate outsource solution..." thanks for educating me. nt

[Heidi]

18. "Kiddies"?

:puke:

[Name removed]

19. Deleted message

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[sufrommich]

22. "How much steel do we need to import?"

The answer is:none. The US chooses to import steel because it's cheaper.The truth is we have the resources and the means to provide this country with more steel than we would ever use.

[nadinbrzezinski]

26. Not anymore

you know that the Chinese bought the mills and took them lock stock and barrel?

We really don't

[sufrommich]

27. Bought what mills? nt

[nadinbrzezinski]

28. Use the google

the country has been purposely deindustrialized.

[sufrommich]

29. I did use the Google and found no such information

on China "buying up all the steel mills", so please point me in the right direction.

[TheKentuckian]

30. True but if we had the political will to re-industrialize we have the resources and capacity

Losing a whole generation and much of the skill and knowledge of critical trades from the last few is also nothing to sneeze at but if we had the will we could certainly satisfy our own needs, with what was better steel than was produced anywhere and still is in small quantity.

It is much more will not than cannot.

[Sirveri]

31. The steel mills. I actually saw a report on it a few years back.

Old German Steel Mill back in the Ruhr valley. China came in, boxed up the entire plant, took everything apart, loaded it onto container ships, and sent it back to China.

[nadinbrzezinski]

32. Yep, among others

They did that here too

[sufrommich]

34. U.S. lawmakers cheer as China steel firm backs out

Reuters) - Lawmakers from U.S. steel-producing states on Thursday cheered a decision by Chinese steel company Anshan Iron & Steel Group to back off plans to invest in a U.S. steel plant.

"Not only would this venture have set a dangerous precedent further undermining our domestic steel market, but it posed serious national security concerns," Representative Tim Murphy, a Pennsylvania Republican, said in a statement.

Anshan's decision comes at a time when China has pushed past Japan to become the world's second largest economy and high U.S. unemployment and a huge budget deficit are causing political anxiety in the United States.

Murphy and Representative Pete Visclosky, an Indiana Democrat, led a group of 50 U.S. lawmakers who had urged the Obama administration's Committee on Foreign Investment in the United States to investigate the proposed investment.

The lawmakers said they did not know whether CFIUS had any role in the Chinese company's decision.

But "it is our hope that CFIUS remains vigilant in ensuring that all investments in the United States are fully vetted for the purpose of protecting American national security and American jobs," Visclosky said

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE67I40C20100819

[sufrommich]

33. That's Germany's problem. Has it happened in the US? nt

[Sirveri]

35. Actually the Germans liked it. The plant was abandoned for years and was an eyesore.

I haven't specifically looked into anything in the US, but I wouldn't be surprised if they came in and tore up some of ours too. Probably the really old and out of date plants that have been shut down for about a decade.

[Dreamer Tatum]

36. Or maybe we want someone to help with the China/Russia bloc

not to mention that India on the Security Council essentially gelds Pakistan.

Yeah, we're going to war with China. We'll just agree to show up on neutral territory to fight.

Jesus.

:eyes:

[nadinbrzezinski]

39. Not us... by the way

[closeupready]

37. There are all kinds of reasons why India will never get a perm. Security Council seat.

I wouldn't be too concerned about this. But I understand why people would be.

[nadinbrzezinski]

38. Fully agree start with ONE veto

but we are doing this for more than just blowing smoke.

[closeupready]

41. Probably. And I can't see China ever allowing it to happen.

1) China and Pakistan have long had a military mutual defense pact; 2) China wants to be Asia's powerhouse - a perm. seat on the sec. council would cut into that; and 3) China disputes India's claims to part of Kashmir which it currently occupies.

If we are supporting the idea, it's for show only, IMO.

[TexasObserver]

42. Alarmist nonsense.